[Discussion] Police, White Nationalists, and the Rise of Fascism

We know they won't be unanimous. At least Cheney and Kinzinger will vote yes. I'm sure there will be more. This Trump GOP loyalty test could further splinter their party.

I am hopeful that Bannon will face justice, but who the hell knows with this stolen SC.

Does Ron Watkins even live in Arizona? I thought he lived in the Phillipines.

It's going to do wonders for his campaign when voters learn his sites hosted child porn.

With that base, it might actually help.

Quintin_Stone wrote:

Does Ron Watkins even live in Arizona? I thought he lived in the Phillipines.

It's going to do wonders for his campaign when voters learn his sites hosted child porn.

His supporters will see that as edgy First Amendment-y

Paleocon wrote:
Quintin_Stone wrote:

Does Ron Watkins even live in Arizona? I thought he lived in the Phillipines.

It's going to do wonders for his campaign when voters learn his sites hosted child porn.

His supporters will see that as edgy First Amendment-y

More likely they'll use the opportunity to passionately discuss their views on age of consent laws.

And cryptocurrency.

Quintin_Stone wrote:

Does Ron Watkins even live in Arizona? I thought he lived in the Phillipines.

It's going to do wonders for his campaign when voters learn his sites hosted child porn.

He lived in the Philippines for awhile but he’s currently living in Japan, presumably to be closer to a source for his life-sized Rae Ayanami dolls. He went to high school in the US but he’s mostly lived outside the country it’s not clear whether he’s even a US citizen.

Paleocon wrote:
Quintin_Stone wrote:

Does Ron Watkins even live in Arizona? I thought he lived in the Phillipines.

It's going to do wonders for his campaign when voters learn his sites hosted child porn.

His supporters will see that as edgy First Amendment-y

So he'll get like 10 votes then.

OG_slinger wrote:
Paleocon wrote:
Quintin_Stone wrote:

Does Ron Watkins even live in Arizona? I thought he lived in the Phillipines.

It's going to do wonders for his campaign when voters learn his sites hosted child porn.

His supporters will see that as edgy First Amendment-y

More likely they'll use the opportunity to passionately discuss their views on age of consent laws.

Yet somehow the Dems are still the pedophiles.

ruhk wrote:
Quintin_Stone wrote:

Does Ron Watkins even live in Arizona? I thought he lived in the Phillipines.

It's going to do wonders for his campaign when voters learn his sites hosted child porn.

He lived in the Philippines for awhile but he’s currently living in Japan, presumably to be closer to a source for his life-sized Rae Ayanami dolls. He went to high school in the US but he’s mostly lived outside the country it’s not clear whether he’s even a US citizen.

His father is an American citizen, so he is too unless he's gone through the process of renouncing it.

JLS wrote:
OG_slinger wrote:
Paleocon wrote:
Quintin_Stone wrote:

Does Ron Watkins even live in Arizona? I thought he lived in the Phillipines.

It's going to do wonders for his campaign when voters learn his sites hosted child porn.

His supporters will see that as edgy First Amendment-y

More likely they'll use the opportunity to passionately discuss their views on age of consent laws.

Yet somehow the Dems are still the pedophiles.

GOP & MAGA propaganda never has to make sense. It's moment-by-moment stoking outrage, no matter how hypocritical or insane.

I was watching a ZOOM discussion of the Sondheim-Weidman musical Assassins early in the pandemic, and Sondheim said that now these crazy characters--presidential assassins, aspiring and successful--were now running the country. Absolutely spot-on.

JLS wrote:
OG_slinger wrote:
Paleocon wrote:
Quintin_Stone wrote:

Does Ron Watkins even live in Arizona? I thought he lived in the Phillipines.

It's going to do wonders for his campaign when voters learn his sites hosted child porn.

His supporters will see that as edgy First Amendment-y

More likely they'll use the opportunity to passionately discuss their views on age of consent laws.

Yet somehow the Dems are still the pedophiles.

GQP has a real problem with projection. When they claim rigged elections so hard it makes me pretty sure some of them are doing it. Maybe Russia even explicitly helped TFG in 2016

This morning, my wife asked me why Trump supporters were so fascinated by anti-Semitic conspiracy theories even though Ivanka Trump is married to a Jewish man.

I told her that it was because what currently defines the GOP now is white identity and the preservation of white, Christian, cis, male-dominated privilege. And anything that even nibbles at the edges of that is instantly interpreted as "anti American" or "unconstitutional". It is therefore very easy for Republicans to believe that any setback that happens in their lives is the fault of some all powerful Jewish conspiracy or Jewish collusion with mongrel "darkies".

That is the current Republican party.

Stele wrote:
JLS wrote:
OG_slinger wrote:
Paleocon wrote:
Quintin_Stone wrote:

Does Ron Watkins even live in Arizona? I thought he lived in the Phillipines.

It's going to do wonders for his campaign when voters learn his sites hosted child porn.

His supporters will see that as edgy First Amendment-y

More likely they'll use the opportunity to passionately discuss their views on age of consent laws.

Yet somehow the Dems are still the pedophiles.

GQP has a real problem with projection. When they claim rigged elections so hard it makes me pretty sure some of them are doing it. Maybe Russia even explicitly helped TFG in 2016

Projection for sure. There was an issue of Epoch Times at my Sister-n-laws and it had an article titled "How Socialists have destroyed American education". I'm sitting there thinking, oh yeah it was socialists who have never held any meaningful power in the United States who did that, not you conservative, religious nut jobs.

Paleocon wrote:

I told her that it was because what currently defines the GOP now is white identity and the preservation of white, Christian, cis, male-dominated privilege.

This is also behind the GOP's shift from hating Russia as a bunch of dirty commie bastards to loving Russia as a defender of traditional (white) Christian values who's political leaders aren't afraid to openly attack LGBTQ rights, restrict abortions, and kill terrorists (who, of course are all Muslim).

I didn't know where else to put this, but it looks like a NYPD officer murdered her ex-girlfriend after she caught her with another woman.

I'll drop this here since it's related to TFG and his efforts to pressure Ukraine to announce that it was investigating Biden.

Remember Lev Parnas? He was the Ukrainian-born American "businessman" who partnered with Rudy Giuliani to form the aptly-named company Fraud Guarantee.

Parnas and his buddy Igor Fruman got arrested in October 2019 as they were getting on a plane to Vienna, Austria where they were going to arrange an interview between Fox's Sean Hannity and Ukraine's former prosecutor general Viktor Shokin. Shokin was going reiterate his false claims that Biden got him fired to protect his son Hunter, who was on the board of directors of Burisma. Parnas and Furman were functioning as handlers for their other boss--exiled Ukrainian oligarch Dmitry Firtash--who was stuck in Vienna because the US wants to extradite him on conspiracy charges. Firtash was helping Giuliani manufacture Ukrainian dirt on Biden because Giuliani promised to intervene with the DOJ and make his extradition problems go away.

The feds grabbed Parnas and Furman and indicted them on four counts for other criminal sh*t they were involved with: conspiracy to violate the ban on political donations and contributions by foreign nationals in federal and state elections; conspiring to make contributions in connection with federal elections in the names of others; and making false statements and falsifying records to obstruct the FEC. Parnas later got slapped with a superseding indictment for conspiracy to commit wire fraud.

Back in 2018 Parnas and Furman showed up on the Republican fund raising circuit and began donating large amounts of money to Republican candidates and PACs. The donations were made in the name of one of Parnas and Furman's businesses--Global Energy Producers--but it turned out they were really from foreign nationals. They donated in the name of their company because they wanted to avoid the FEC's individual donation limits and to hide the fact they were liquid from creditors. They dropped $350K on Trump's America First Action PAC, $11,000 to the Protect the House PAC run by House Majority Leader Kevin McCarthy, and other federal candidates.

Parnas and Furman also set out to interfere in state elections, getting two $500K wire donations from Russian tycoon Andrey Muraviev that were used to grease the wheels in Nevada politics to get Muraviev the licenses needed to run weed dispensaries. Reportedly Parnas and Furman only used $100K to buy off politicians and used the rest to pay off creditors and maintain the lifestyles they had become accustomed to.

Parnas was convicted on every count this afternoon (Furman plead guilty last month).

OG_slinger wrote:
Paleocon wrote:

I told her that it was because what currently defines the GOP now is white identity and the preservation of white, Christian, cis, male-dominated privilege.

This is also behind the GOP's shift from hating Russia as a bunch of dirty commie bastards to loving Russia as a defender of traditional (white) Christian values who's political leaders aren't afraid to openly attack LGBTQ rights, restrict abortions, and kill terrorists (who, of course are all Muslim).

And Hungary. Supposedly the next CPAC is going to be held in Hungary, though there hasn't been any solid confirmation on that. But Tucker Carlson and all his sh*tgibbon buddies have been going on and on about how awesome Hungary is. They can all stay there as far as I'm concerned.

One way ticket on the slow boat...

Paleocon wrote:

I didn't know where else to put this, but it looks like a NYPD officer murdered her ex-girlfriend after she caught her with another woman.

Actually, she shot her ex-GF, but she survived. It's the woman she caught her with who was killed.

Not that it really makes too much of a difference at this point exactly who she murdered.

Don't worry, I'm sure she's covered by qualified immunity.

Robear wrote:

Don't worry, I'm sure she's covered by qualified immunity.

Or would be if she was a man.

Paleocon wrote:
Robear wrote:

Don't worry, I'm sure she's covered by qualified immunity.

Or would be if she was a man.

Other way around. Men are disproportionately found guilty of crimes and sentenced more severely for the same crimes as women.

Male cops getting away with murder has nothing to do with their maleness and everything to do with their copness.

hbi2k wrote:
Paleocon wrote:
Robear wrote:

Don't worry, I'm sure she's covered by qualified immunity.

Or would be if she was a man.

Other way around. Men are disproportionately found guilty of crimes and sentenced more severely for the same crimes as women.

Male cops getting away with murder has nothing to do with their maleness and everything to do with their copness.

I suspect that her lesbian-ness likely makes her a lower priority to the police union.

Paleocon wrote:
hbi2k wrote:
Paleocon wrote:
Robear wrote:

Don't worry, I'm sure she's covered by qualified immunity.

Or would be if she was a man.

Other way around. Men are disproportionately found guilty of crimes and sentenced more severely for the same crimes as women.

Male cops getting away with murder has nothing to do with their maleness and everything to do with their copness.

I suspect that her lesbian-ness likely makes her a lower priority to the police union.

Fair point.

Jan. 6 Protest Organizers Say They Participated in ‘Dozens’ of Planning Meetings With Members of Congress and White House Staff

Rolling Stone wrote:

As the House investigation into the Jan. 6 attack heats up, some of the planners of the pro-Trump rallies that took place in Washington, D.C., have begun communicating with congressional investigators and sharing new information about what happened when the former president’s supporters stormed the U.S. Capitol. Two of these people have spoken to Rolling Stone extensively in recent weeks and detailed explosive allegations that multiple members of Congress were intimately involved in planning both Trump’s efforts to overturn his election loss and the Jan. 6 events that turned violent.

Rolling Stone separately confirmed a third person involved in the main Jan. 6 rally in D.C. has communicated with the committee. This is the first report that the committee is hearing major new allegations from potential cooperating witnesses. While there have been prior indications that members of Congress were involved, this is also the first account detailing their purported role and its scope. The two sources also claim they interacted with members of Trump’s team, including former White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows, who they describe as having had an opportunity to prevent the violence.

The two sources, both of whom have been granted anonymity due to the ongoing investigation, describe participating in “dozens” of planning briefings ahead of that day when Trump supporters broke into the Capitol as his election loss to President Joe Biden was being certified.

“I remember Marjorie Taylor Greene specifically,” the organizer says. “I remember talking to probably close to a dozen other members at one point or another or their staffs.”

For the sake of clarity, we will refer to one of the sources as a rally organizer and the other as a planner. Rolling Stone has confirmed that both sources were involved in organizing the main event aimed at objecting to the electoral certification, which took place at the White House Ellipse on Jan. 6. Trump spoke at that rally and encouraged his supporters to march to the Capitol. Some members of the audience at the Ellipse began walking the mile and a half to the Capitol as Trump gave his speech. The barricades were stormed minutes before the former president concluded his remarks.

These two sources also helped plan a series of demonstrations that took place in multiple states around the country in the weeks between the election and the storming of the Capitol. According to these sources, multiple people associated with the March for Trump and Stop the Steal events that took place during this period communicated with members of Congress throughout this process.

Along with Greene, the conspiratorial pro-Trump Republican from Georgia who took office earlier this year, the pair both say the members who participated in these conversations or had top staffers join in included Rep. Paul Gosar (R-Ariz.), Rep. Lauren Boebert (R-Colo.), Rep. Mo Brooks (R-Ala.), Rep. Madison Cawthorn (R-N.C.), Rep. Andy Biggs (R-Ariz.), and Rep. Louie Gohmert (R-Texas).

“We would talk to Boebert’s team, Cawthorn’s team, Gosar’s team like back to back to back to back,” says the organizer.

And Gosar, who has been one of the most prominent defenders of the Jan. 6 rioters, allegedly took things a step further. Both sources say he dangled the possibility of a “blanket pardon” in an unrelated ongoing investigation to encourage them to plan the protests.

“Our impression was that it was a done deal,” the organizer says, “that he’d spoken to the president about it in the Oval … in a meeting about pardons and that our names came up. They were working on submitting the paperwork and getting members of the House Freedom Caucus to sign on as a show of support.”

The organizer claims the pair received “several assurances” about the “blanket pardon” from Gosar.

“I was just going over the list of pardons and we just wanted to tell you guys how much we appreciate all the hard work you’ve been doing,” Gosar said, according to the organizer.

The rally planner describes the pardon as being offered while “encouraging” the staging of protests against the election. While the organizer says they did not get involved in planning the rallies solely due to the pardon, they were upset that it ultimately did not materialize.

“I would have done it either way with or without the pardon,” the organizer says. “I do truly believe in this country, but to use something like that and put that out on the table when someone is so desperate, it’s really not good business.”

Gosar’s office did not respond to requests for comment on this story.

...

In another indication members of Congress may have been involved in planning the protests against the election, Ali Alexander, who helped organize the “Wild Protest,” declared in a since-deleted livestream broadcast that Gosar, Brooks, and Biggs helped him formulate the strategy for that event.

“I was the person who came up with the Jan. 6 idea with Congressman Gosar, Congressman Mo Brooks, and Congressman Andy Biggs,” Alexander said at the time. “We four schemed up on putting maximum pressure on Congress while they were voting so that — who we couldn’t lobby — we could change the hearts and the minds of Republicans who were in that body hearing our loud roar from outside.”

Alexander led Stop the Steal, which was one of the main groups promoting efforts to dispute Trump’s loss. In December, he organized a Stop the Steal event in Phoenix, where Gosar was one the main speakers. At that demonstration, Alexander referred to Gosar as “my captain” and declared “one of the other heroes has been Congressman Andy Biggs.”

Alexander did not respond to requests for comment. The rally planner, who accused Alexander of ratcheting up the potential for violence that day while taking advantage of funds from donors and others who helped finance the events, confirmed that he was in contact with those three members of Congress.

“He just couldn’t help himself but go on his live and just talk about everything that he did and who he talked to,” the planner says of Alexander. “So, he, like, really told on himself.”

While it was already clear members of Congress played some role in the Jan. 6 events and similar rallies that occurred in the lead-up to that day, the two sources say they can provide new details about the members’ specific roles in these efforts. The sources plan to share that information with congressional investigators right away. While both sources say their communications with the House’s Jan. 6 committee thus far have been informal, they are expecting to testify publicly.

“I have no problem openly testifying,” the planner says.

A representative for the committee declined to comment. In the past month, the committee has issued subpoenas to top Trump allies, government agencies, and activists who were involved in the planning of events and rallies that took place on that day and in the prior weeks. Multiple sources familiar with the committee’s investigation have confirmed to Rolling Stone that, thus far, it seems to be heavily focused on the financing for the Ellipse rally and similar previous events.

Both of the sources made clear that they still believe in Trump’s agenda. They also have questions about how his election loss occurred. The two sources say they do not necessarily believe there were issues with the actual vote count. However, they are concerned that Democrats gained an unfair advantage in the race due to perceived social media censorship of Trump allies and the voting rules that were implemented as a result of the coronavirus pandemic.

“Democrats used tactics to disrupt their political opposition in ways that frankly were completely unacceptable,” the organizer says.

Despite their remaining affinity for Trump and their questions about the vote, both sources say they were motivated to come forward because of their concerns about how the pro-Trump protests against the election ultimately resulted in the violent attack on the Capitol. Of course, with their other legal issues and the House investigation, both of these sources have clear motivation to cooperate with investigators and turn on their former allies. And both of their accounts paint them in a decidedly favorable light compared with their former allies.

“The reason I’m talking to the committee and the reason it’s so important is that — despite Republicans refusing to participate … this commission’s all we got as far as being able to uncover the truth about what happened at the Capitol that day,” the organizer says. “It’s clear that a lot of bad actors set out to cause chaos. … They made us all look like sh*t.”

And Trump, they admit, was one of those bad actors. A representative for Trump did not respond to a request for comment.

“The breaking point for me [on Jan. 6 was when] Trump starts talking about walking to the Capitol,” the organizer says. “I was like. ‘Let’s get the f*ck out of here.’ ”

“I do kind of feel abandoned by Trump,” says the planner. “I’m actually pretty pissed about it and I’m pissed at him.”

The organizer offers an even more succinct assessment when asked what they would say to Trump.

“What the f*ck?” the organizer says.

The two potential witnesses plan to present to the committee allegations about how these demonstrations were funded and to detail communications between organizers and the White House. According to both sources, members of Trump’s administration and former members of his campaign team were involved in the planning. Both describe Katrina Pierson, who worked for Trump’s campaign in 2016 and 2020, as a key liaison between the organizers of protests against the election and the White House.

“Katrina was like our go-to girl,” the organizer says. “She was like our primary advocate.”

Pierson spoke at the Ellipse rally on Jan. 6. She did not respond to requests for comment.

Both sources also describe Trump’s White House chief of staff, Mark Meadows, as someone who played a major role in the conversations surrounding the protests on Jan. 6. Among other things, they both say concerns were raised to Meadows about Alexander’s protest at the Capitol and the potential that it could spark violence. Meadows was subpoenaed by the committee last month as part of a group of four people “with close ties to the former President who were working in or had communications with the White House on or in the days leading up to the January 6th insurrection.”

“Meadows was 100 percent made aware of what was going on,” says the organizer. “He’s also like a regular figure in these really tiny groups of national organizers.”

Sounds like we need to be adding a special wing on to Gitmo to handle all these traitors.

Even though the list of conspirators is a who’s who of GOP trash, every single one of them will get away with it. No Republican will ever vote in favor of punishing these asshats. Ok, maybe the walking dead ones in the select committee….

Does anyone else occasionally have the extremely bleak thought that we’d be better off if the mob had gotten a hold of Pence or a Democratic target on January 6th? Maybe that would have shocked the country out of its complacent slide toward authoritarianism and even worse violence to come. Maybe there’d be some consequences. Although I’m not sure even then.

At the very least, if they had gotten ahold of Pence, GOP politicians would have seen that the mob is uncontrollable and that they could be next.