The GWJ JRPG Club - Q2 2020 - Bravely Second: End Layer

Bobby.. just keep playing.. it will all come into place... or sortta lol

bobbywatson wrote:

You guys are way ahead of me, I'm still in the Prologue (and I just got a fourth party member). In the mean time, I'm still trying to develop the moon base.

This game has so many systems, it's kind of hard to wrap my head around it.

This is really fun for me to read LastSurprise, Sundown, Malkoth, etc. It's like a JRPG masterclass. I am grasshopper, not worthy.

I've played a crapton of JRPGs in my life. However, I've never been that much of a 'system' person. I usually manage to grind my way out of trouble, and never really dig deep into gameplay systems, at least never enough to figure out how to "break" a game and transform it into a cakewalk. I try to spend some time figuring out stuff here and there, and sometimes it works, most of the time it doesn't, and I revert to grinding (see Trails of Cold Steel and Persona 5 last year).

If they are masterclass and you are a grasshopper... lol well im guess in a rotten flea! but till enjoying the game

Aww, you flatter me.

I think for most of my JRPG experience, I’ve leaned more towards the grind2win model. Engaging with the systems like this is a relatively new thing for me, particularly since I now have less time for, and interest in, mindless grinding. So now I’m trying to learn the systems a bit more to reduce the time spent grinding, and since I feel like I have a better idea what I’m doing in these games than even like 5 years ago.

Bravely Second also helps by giving a lot of tools to help make the grind easier as well as more engaging (like how to chain as many battles together as possible), and it makes experimenting with new classes pretty painless. And that's why I started messing around with different classes, and went from "that's boring" to "that's really interesting" with the Patissier. Fighting Ba'als also helps reduce the grind during the game, since they're worth a ton of experience and JP. And it's much faster to get to fight Ba'als since we're all doing the club together and can wear them down with our own little fleet.

Plus starting from about the middle of Ch.2 on, the options really start to open up, so there's lots of ways to customize and combos to figure out, in a way that I just don't think was the case in Ch. 1.

Now that I think about it, I think the game that really got me engaged with complex JRPG systems the first time was Xenoblade 2, since there were SO MANY SYSTEMS, but if you didn't grasp most of them you were either going to deal with a bunch of really slow battles, or outright lose to some bosses or unique monsters.

ohhh yes Sundown.. Xenoblade 2 combat was addtictive

I think I've fallen behind a bit. I've just had to choose between Red Mage and Thief. I wanted to side with the thief, but I wanted his class! Damnit! I felt so bad!

The main thing I'm getting from this game is that it wants you to play it "your way" and I love that! It's some of the most fun I've had in a JRPG for a long time. From the job system to the encounter rate, and the build-a-special between, it feels very much like I'm crafting my own fun. Too many JRPGs have you follow a linear path of progression, and this feels like a breath of fresh air.

Despite that, I'm just not feeling the story. I've almost entirely forgotten what happened in the first game, and a lot of this game references those events...But not in an interesting way. There are some nice interactions with the villagers, but it ultimately feels a bit hollow. I don't really mind, since I'm enjoying the progression through each job so much, but it's starting to stand out to me.

I just got my third party member! A very nice scene. If I recall, she was definitely my favourite of the main 4. Also, that gave me access to the Moon Base. 9-10 lv99 Bhaals waiting for me. My party is lv 99 so no problem right? Nope, wiped in a single attack. Guess I still need to bring their levels down a bit.

I got the thief on my first play through, that motivation definitely spoke to me more than the red mage character.

Oh, and defeating the (now) lv 1 Bhaal just gave me 10000pg, 20000 exp, 999 jp. No wonder I seem to have so many jobs maxed out.

I made my first attempt at fighting Ba'als on the moon yesterday. I whittled one of them -- Neo Snowcap -- down to level 6, but couldn't put a dent in it. It had about 99,000 HP, 600+ defense and magic defense, and took 0 damage from every attack. The funny thing was, though, that it also hurt my guys a lot less than any story-line boss I've encountered. If I could have damaged it, I could have made it through.

I fought another one, something with weird test-tube legs and Freddie Kruger-like claws, which was all the way down to level 0. By the time I had reduced it so far, it only had 1,500 HP and went down in one hit. I also was not super impressed by the battle rewards. They weren't anything like what Mr GT Chris describes above. Maybe they scale with levels?

And just now, I tried Neo Snowcap again, at level 3. It now has a mere 200+ defense and magic defense, but I still can't even dent it. I tried buffing my guys but not debuffing it. I'm going to bring it down to level 2 and come back.

Also, I've been leveling up my space ship. Do you guys see that it's gone up? I'm wondering if each of us have to do an internet update for those changes to take effect.

Yeah, you have to do an update for it to level up in everyone else’s game.

The Ba’al fights are weird. I’ve tried up to level 6 or 7, and they still have no offensive capability outside of maybe counters. But unless they’re at level 1, their defenses are going to be way too high for you to do any damage whatsoever.

But once you get a hold of some defense piercing abilities or passives (Hawkeye and Black Mage are the two I’ve primarily used), then the a level 2 Ba’al goes down as easily as a level 6, the only difference is HP. I’m sure there’s a threshold where they start doing real damage to the team at higher levels, but I haven’t found when that is yet.

As for the rewards, the first two times I beat one I got an item that raised all of one person’s stats significantly, and the third time I got an item that just raised MP significantly. Since then, just experience and JP, no more powerful items. And I’ve tried stealing as well, to no avail.

What level did the Bhagalpur start at? Those rewards were from a lv 99 one so that could have something to do with it. I think their level is the same or lower than your party’s level although I might be misremembering.

I just leveled up my ship a bit today, wonder if it will show up.

I also find the Ba'al fights confusing but oh well. For just I just lower them to level 1 and deal with it and get decent xp. I have been upgrading my ship so hopefully those of you that have me as a friend will see the benefit.

I just reached Chapter 3 and the game keeps looking good and interesting for me.

So I’m done with Ch. 4, which was the shortest of the game so far. There was one somewhat annoying boss fight, but in general the Patissier trick I mentioned in a previous post worked to exceedingly great effect. Still takes a couple of turns of set up, but battles end pretty quickly when it all comes together.

Now, time for some white hot story spoiler talk.

Spoiler:

So I beat the game, but obviously not, since the Kaiser escaped, and the only way to continue is I guess to jump to another world/timeline to continue the chase. Since the first game had all sorts of fun parallel world mechanics, plus since the “completion” of this game for the club meant going into new game plus, I guess I’m not surprised.

What’s really interesting is a couple of things; once, as soon as the moon was disappeared, the only wild encounters I could find were high level Ba’als, which makes sense since the moon people weren’t there to stop them. I was able to meet a couple of new ones this way, but they killed me way too fast for me to have a change to even damage them. Which of course means that that world is pretty much doomed now, but hey, parallel worlds, what are you going to do?

And second, the moon being removed from the first world is how I figured they would have a reason the moon would be in a future world so we could keep our progress. Handy, that.

So I started up my NG+, and easily knocked over the Kaiser, but of course he ran because it’s a JRPG.
Also, props to LastSurprise who guessed the identify of Kaiser Oblivion. When he tossed the guess out I was like “yeah, that makes sense.” And it was.

So we still have the Kaiser and the Ba’al out there needing whupping, and presumably Yoko/Demon Sword as well for personal stakes for Yew and Danys, so that has to be a big point later in the game.

And it looks like I can now do a bunch of sidequests to get the other classes now, since I see a bunch of sidequest markers on my map. I’ll probably do that for a bit and maybe grind some of them to usefulness. The real hard part is talking about where I am in the story now, since it seems like I’ve now hit -the twist- so even talking about there being a chapter 5 could be spoilers since the Skyhold is Ch. 4. Even indicating the game isn’t over after going to the Skyhold could be a spoiler for that matter, so I’ll probably wait until a couple more people hit this point before posting further story talk.

I was initially going to wait a while to open that bubble, as I'm still comfortably in Chapter 3. Then I remembered that I had been spoiled for the Chapter 4 twist quite a while back. So ... for Sundown (and anyone else done with Chapter 4):

Spoiler:

I find it interesting that if the player chooses all the sidequest factions on who you think *should* win, or your sense of morality, the player will--of course--choose the other faction the second time around. So, the final state of the world has all of the people winning who you didn't prefer. Interesting twist, that.

And, cool that I guessed right about the Kaiser!

For my part, I'm right at the end of the Sagitta Forest in Chapter 3, and I've also finished the first sidequest, opting to fight Barras for the Monk Asterisk. I didn't use the Valkyrie much in Bravely Default, plus any job class (like hers) that relies on taking a PC out of battle for a round is fundamentally incompatible with my grinding strategy. I thought the Monk was a bit underwhelming, though: most of the things he does appear to be equally well done by other classes I already have. Except for Natural Talent, the capstone skill that lets you double your physical attack power (I think) if you equip no gear, at all. That skill was in Bravely Default, too. I remember thinking that the idea of a character going buck naked was crazy -- how would he/she survive? But it worked out better than I expected, and the damage got insane damage numbers.

In BD, Natural Talent combined really well with the Vampire class. Here, I wonder if it will combine super well with the Charioteer, and maybe to a lesser extent the Ninja. Natural Talent + Quad Wield = four hits at 9,999?

Story-wise, I'm right near the place where I set down the game and then never picked it back up. I remember getting through the events at Sagitta Village ...

Spoiler:

...and facing Geist.

Godzilla Blitz wrote:
bobbywatson wrote:

You guys are way ahead of me, I'm still in the Prologue (and I just got a fourth party member). In the mean time, I'm still trying to develop the moon base.

This game has so many systems, it's kind of hard to wrap my head around it.

This is really fun for me to read LastSurprise, Sundown, Malkoth, etc. It's like a JRPG masterclass. I am grasshopper, not worthy.

Ha, thanks! I love JRPGs for the story, but the more I play them -- and play more series -- the more I realize that I'm drawn in for the story but really stay for the systems. I'm loving the trend toward flexible difficulty levels, because I really like it when a game challenges me to engage with its systems and learn how they interact.

I just finished Chapter 3. Did some grinding and Ba'al fighting. All my characters are level 42 and my jobs are level 8. Will update on the story and some questions in a while

LastSurprise, I find it interesting that you didn't get much use out of Valkyrie in BD. That is the class I used to cruise through Chapter 6 and 7 of the first game.

Spoiler:

Turn all four characters into Valkyrie, equip everyone with Pierce Default, and one with Hasten World. You then just queue up High Jump on everyone. All your characters are untargetable for the rest of the fight and deal 9999 damage when they land. Set combat speed to 4X, turn on auto, and watch videos while the bosses die.

Hope to get some more play time in soon, been busy the past week.

Made it through the first Side Story today and sided with DeRosa (and feel terrible about it). I would have been happy never seeing this guy again or getting the Red Mage asterisk ever if it meant kicking his butt. But I really wanted the Thief asterisk so I had to side with him even though I think his views are incorrect and his methods are morally reprehensible.

Anyway, I am now finally on my way to the Ba'al Crater and my Moon Fortress is almost completely rebuilt...

I'm a bit past there. I never liked DeRosa's plan, sided against him the first time round. Just collected the Swordsman asterisk.

Wow, you are all flying through.

I'm working my way through the Geyser Grotto although I'm maybe enjoying the combat a little too much as all my characters are at level 43 already. Geyser Grotto has been a great excuse to try out different roles for party members and have a go at some of the classes I haven't really tried yet.

I just git level 44 with all my characters and I am in Florem doing some grinding! Soon to choose between 2 asteriks.. which do you guys suggest

Spoiler:

Do I want Monk or Valkyrie?

Darkhaund wrote:

I just git level 44 with all my characters and I am in Florem doing some grinding! Soon to choose between 2 asteriks.. which do you guys suggest

Spoiler:

Do I want Monk or Valkyrie?

Spoiler:

I picked Monk and haven't touched him since. Saw no reason to use him over Hawkeye/Ninja. I'd probably recommend Valkyrie, since I think it's more of a multi-target physical attack class, whereas Monk is another single target physical class, which you probably don't need at this point.

Thanks for the Tip Sundown... btw... while i was charging my 3DS i went ahead and finished the Bravely Default II demo.... amazing how that games promises to be.

I will pick up the job you suggest!
Also, if you have me on your friend list, can you tell me how weak or powerful my attack is... and my ship

Sure, and I updated data to get the latest and greatest. Your ship is at level 37, but your attack power is 13. It shows Yew as being Level 3 as well, and I'm guessing that's not up to date. I'm not sure what the attack power is based on......Maybe the Summon Friend > Send thing in the battle menu?

Yes, the power is the power of the attack that was last sent through the Summon Friend > Send command in battle. It's there to give you an idea of how powerful the attack is so you know whether you want to use it or not (too weak to be of any use or powerful enough you want to save it for a boss, stuff like that).

Just got the catmancer asterisk and I'm having a lot of fun collecting all the abilities and talking to all the cats!

Thief + charioteer is treating me really well. I have 2 characters set up with that combo, carrying mythril bows in their 2-hand slot and zweihanders on their head (it only needs one slot! ha!). That setup got me through the last 2 bosses in one turn, provided I used the astrologian job to boos their attack beforehand. So much damage!

Just at the start of chapter 2. Upgraded my ship to lv 99 so that should help you with Bhaals. Also, tried sending a new special attack for the first time, wonder if any of you will see it?

I'm on my way to the next side quest, for either the Pirate or Performer asterisk. The Pirate is yet another single-target physical damage class, although it combines powerful attacks with debuffs, so its utility -- right now -- seems to be replacing the Patissier. I think the Performer, if it's anything like what I remember, woudl be an Astrologian replacement, but it also might synergize well with some of the Astrologian's passives. I think I'll go for the Performer just to get the BP-boosting skills.

Malkroth wrote:

LastSurprise, I find it interesting that you didn't get much use out of Valkyrie in BD. That is the class I used to cruise through Chapter 6 and 7 of the first game.

Spoiler:

Turn all four characters into Valkyrie, equip everyone with Pierce Default, and one with Hasten World. You then just queue up High Jump on everyone. All your characters are untargetable for the rest of the fight and deal 9999 damage when they land. Set combat speed to 4X, turn on auto, and watch videos while the bosses die.

Hope to get some more play time in soon, been busy the past week.

I didn't even think of that! I tried the Valkyrie in the mid-game, didn't find it super-useful then, and never really went back to it. I found other combinations that worked well but yours seems pretty elegant and simple!

Spoiler:

For the endgame, I more often used Slow World instead of Hasten, then supplied myself with BP through a combination of the Performer's songs and Mimic.

I think I'm going to be slowing down on Bravely Second a little bit, because today is my birthday and I treated myself to FF VII Remake! But I'll try to chip away a little bit at a time. I have plenty of time now, after all.

Quote is not edit!

LastSurprise wrote:

I think I'm going to be slowing down on Bravely Second a little bit, because today is my birthday and I treated myself to FF VII Remake! But I'll try to chip away a little bit at a time. I have plenty of time now, after all.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY! Enjoy FF VII and have a great day!