*Sigh* Really guys? Here? Place and time.
Yes, exactly this place and time.
This is not his funeral. We are not talking to his family members who are grieving. No one here knew him personally, no one here needs space to process their emotions about the loss of a human being in their lives.
This is a GWJ thread being read by people who actually have to feel the impact of choices and actions he made.
Not talking about them, not acknowledging them is disrespectful to those people and many other people that you actually know and love.
So yes. This place. This time.
Yes, I have no problem with discussing his failures as well as his successes.
I didn't know about the cut to AIDS funding. That was pretty sh*tty.
Jean-Claude Juncker:
I will never forget the role he played in making Europe a safer and more united place following the fall of the Berlin Wall and the Iron Curtain. President Bush's calmness, leadership and close personal relationships with Helmut Kohl and Mikhail Gorbachev were decisive in restoring peace and freedom back to so many people across our Continent. We Europeans will forever remember this.
Angela Merkel
Germany owes a lot to George H. W. Bush. It was a stroke of luck in German history that he was at the head of the United States of America when the Cold War came to an end and Germany’s reunification became possible. The German people had in him a true friend who recognized the significance of this historic hour and gave us his trust and support…the courageous and peaceful revolution by people east of the Iron Curtain met with the courage and skill of a statesman who, together with others, led Europe and the trans-Atlantic partnership through this upheaval and ushered in a new era.
Obama:
George H.W. Bush’s life is a testament to the notion that public service is a noble, joyous calling. And he did tremendous good along the journey,
Clinton:
Few Americans have been—or will ever be—able to match President Bush’s record of service to the United States and the joy he took every day from it; from his military service in World War II, to his work in Congress, the United Nations, China, the Central Intelligence Agency, the Vice Presidency and the Presidency, where he worked to move the post Cold War world toward greater unity, peace, and freedom.
Trump:
Bush was great, except for that whole Iraq thing, which I would have done--(leans into mic and enunciates) successfully--in much less time, for a lot less money. I would have saved us an unbelievable amount of money. You'd probably look at me and say Donald, it can't be done with that much money! But it can, believe me. And no soldiers had to die, except for that one Hillary supporter, but nobody's perfect (smirk followed by canned laughter). In the end, Bush made America ok again. Not great (shrug), but not too bad. Thank you.
Imagine an alternate history where at the end of the Cold War was a Trump-Yeltsin summit.
Imagine an alternate history where at the end of the Cold War was a Trump-Yeltsin summit.
Yeltsin trying to get Trump to do a keg stand amuses me.
H.P. Lovesauce wrote:Imagine an alternate history where at the end of the Cold War was a Trump-Yeltsin summit.
Yeltsin trying to get Trump to do a keg stand amuses me.
Or trying to get him to do the Boris dance.
Anyone who has anything positive to say just because the ghoul died disgusts me, but celebrating his death doesn't feel right either; after all, he won. He never was held accountable and died at freaking 94 years old. There's nothing to celebrate.
Trump:
Bush was great, except for that whole Iraq thing, which I would have done--(leans into mic and enunciates) successfully--in much less time, for a lot less money. I would have saved us an unbelievable amount of money. You'd probably look at me and say Donald, it can't be done with that much money! But it can, believe me. And no soldiers had to die, except for that one Hillary supporter, but nobody's perfect (smirk followed by canned laughter). In the end, Bush made America ok again. Not great (shrug), but not too bad. Thank you.
Is that an actual quote or just something made up?
Summary of the Bush administration.
By the way, is that Monica Lewinsky at a Bush rally at 8:20?
I hate these threads. I truly do because it seems to bring out the worst in some people. In fact, these threads have almost single-handedly made me quit GWJ. I heavily contemplated that a few months back and instead reduced my engagement on the forums.
When the reaction to people posting positive leaning sentiment about someone is to then only post negative aspects of that person, I don't believe you are balancing out the scales. You aren't engaging with that other individual or those people who may agree with the positive leaning sentiment. You're attacking. I don't believe you're attacking their position, I believe you're attacking the person writing the post. That is my problem. Lack of respect for the person posting.
And, yes, a lack of respect for the passing of someone, but since we're all fairly well removed from most political or otherwise famous people it's a much more minor aspect. Especially when that person was responsible for unnecessarily starting wars and whatnot.
/tone police
You aren't engaging with that other individual or those people who may agree with the positive leaning sentiment. You're attacking. I don't believe you're attacking their position, I believe you're attacking the person writing the post. That is my problem. Lack of respect for the person posting.
Notice lack of mod hat here. I'd just like to check in on this sentiment because it's come up a few times before in RIP threads and I think it's worth exploring.
I'd like to point out that a vast majority of flare ups tend to happen because disagreement is conflated with personal attack. It can certainly feel like a personal attack; we've all experienced that when talking about a person or subject dear to us.
Not liking GWB or feeling that his policies or actions did a lot of harm is not an attack on someone who is mourning him. I don't think it's particularly respectful in the context of a RIP thread, but I highly doubt anyone here would be doing it at his actual funeral while his friends and family are weeping by his graveside. A forum thread is far from that, especially in a forum with a long history of political debate. We have scopes for a reason, if someone wanted to make a thread that's "not for negative views on this person out of respect for their family and supporters" they can do that and we'll enforce it. Within reason, anyway.
If the lens you're operating from is "these opinions about this politician who died are a personal attack on the people posting otherwise in this thread" then taking time away from those kind of discussions is a good idea.
*now the mod bit*
TLDR: if you don't like the tone of a thread or you are mourning the loss of someone and you won't be in the right head space for negative views, you can make a new thread with a scope and we'll do our best to enforce that. We won't be instituting a "don't speak ill of the dead" rule as a site-wide policy.
I hate these threads. I truly do because it seems to bring out the worst in some people. In fact, these threads have almost single-handedly made me quit GWJ. I heavily contemplated that a few months back and instead reduced my engagement on the forums.
Personally I like having you involved in the forums so I would prefer you just ignore threads that upset you. There are quite a few threads I just don't go into (usually because I am not really interested but sometimes because it just bothers me).
If you do the same we can find lots of stuff to talk about, argue about and generally have a good time.
Anyone who has anything positive to say just because the ghoul died disgusts me, but celebrating his death doesn't feel right either; after all, he won. He never was held accountable and died at freaking 94 years old. There's nothing to celebrate.
*mod*
Missed this in my first pass of the thread. This is one of those moments where you are personally attacking folks who disagree with you, and that's not ok. Find a way to voice your opinion without casting aspersions on anyone who isn't in line with your views.
You're completely right, I should have limited my attack to the opinion itself without extending it to the people; that's definitely taking it overboard and I would like to apologize.
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