RIP: Barbara Bush

While I’m not a huge fan of the Bushes, I always saw Barbara as an admirable First Lady. It makes me sad there’s so much vitriol in the wake of her death, especially by California public employees who say horrible things and then flout that they’ll never be fired.

Anyhow, RIP

Free speech is often not pretty but it is better in the long run.

Not making light of a person's death, but this news reminded me of one of my favorite conspiracy theories that made the rounds a few years ago. Barbara Bush was Aleister Crowley's daughter.

jdzappa wrote:

While I’m not a huge fan of the Bushes, I always saw Barbara as an admirable First Lady. It makes me sad there’s so much vitriol in the wake of her death, especially by California public employees who say horrible things and then flout that they’ll never be fired.

Anyhow, RIP

They are only horrible things because they are true.

jdzappa wrote:

While I’m not a huge fan of the Bushes, I always saw Barbara as an admirable First Lady. It makes me sad there’s so much vitriol in the wake of her death, especially by California public employees who say horrible things and then flout that they’ll never be fired.

Anyhow, RIP

Don't give people like that the attention they so desperately want. When they die, nobody will remember them.

absurddoctor wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

While I’m not a huge fan of the Bushes, I always saw Barbara as an admirable First Lady. It makes me sad there’s so much vitriol in the wake of her death, especially by California public employees who say horrible things and then flout that they’ll never be fired.

Anyhow, RIP

They are only horrible things because they are true.

Gawd

I'm not a fan of the Bushes at all but immediately spitting on people's graves is so uncouth.

garion333 wrote:
absurddoctor wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

While I’m not a huge fan of the Bushes, I always saw Barbara as an admirable First Lady. It makes me sad there’s so much vitriol in the wake of her death, especially by California public employees who say horrible things and then flout that they’ll never be fired.

Anyhow, RIP

They are only horrible things because they are true.

Gawd

I'm not a fan of the Bushes at all but immediately spitting on people's graves is so uncouth.

She was over privileged anyway, so this is working very well for her.

garion333 wrote:
absurddoctor wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

While I’m not a huge fan of the Bushes, I always saw Barbara as an admirable First Lady. It makes me sad there’s so much vitriol in the wake of her death, especially by California public employees who say horrible things and then flout that they’ll never be fired.

Anyhow, RIP

They are only horrible things because they are true.

Gawd

I'm not a fan of the Bushes at all but immediately spitting on people's graves is so uncouth.

Straying into P&C territory but I will say overall the length of time between a person's death and picking on how they lived their life has shrunk.

absurddoctor wrote:
garion333 wrote:
absurddoctor wrote:
jdzappa wrote:

While I’m not a huge fan of the Bushes, I always saw Barbara as an admirable First Lady. It makes me sad there’s so much vitriol in the wake of her death, especially by California public employees who say horrible things and then flout that they’ll never be fired.

Anyhow, RIP

They are only horrible things because they are true.

Gawd

I'm not a fan of the Bushes at all but immediately spitting on people's graves is so uncouth.

She was over privileged anyway, so this is working very well for her.

Because it's her fault who her parent's were?

I may post a bigger debate thread in P&C, but here’s a well written Politico obit that does a good job of looking at her achievements and failures.

I find it so odd that we and the press are so desperate for shock/news that we will make viral or national headlines of the comments of little known college professor that is on leave since before the comments from a lesser know state school from a small tucked away CA city known for its agriculture. (not english, authors or vitriolic muslims)

I also find any ensuing knee jerk reactions to the comments idiotic since this barely merits the effort to type "These comments don't represent the views of Fresno State."

garion333 wrote:

I'm not a fan of the Bushes at all but immediately spitting on people's graves is so uncouth.

Death isn't a morality get-out-of-jail-free card.

Jonman wrote:
garion333 wrote:

I'm not a fan of the Bushes at all but immediately spitting on people's graves is so uncouth.

Death isn't a morality get-out-of-jail-free card.

Never said it was, nor should it be.

Remember when she called the displaced Katrina folks refugees... like they weren't American Citizens.

Far be it from me to defend a Bush, but I always assumed a refugee just meant someone who was seeking refuge. Definition of refugee: one that flees; especially : a person who flees to a foreign country or power to escape danger or persecution

Running Man wrote:

Far be it from me to defend a Bush, but I always assumed a refugee just meant someone who was seeking refuge. Definition of refugee: one that flees; especially : a person who flees to a foreign country or power to escape danger or persecution

Exactly.. these citizens were not fleeing a foreign country.. typically what we would refer to as a refugee.. I rarely hear native citizens referred to as refugees in their own country.

Perhaps a slip of the tongue.. or a betrayal of their attitudes towards poor brown people.

garion333 wrote:
Jonman wrote:
garion333 wrote:

I'm not a fan of the Bushes at all but immediately spitting on people's graves is so uncouth.

Death isn't a morality get-out-of-jail-free card.

Never said it was, nor should it be.

Well then shouldn't one expect the eulogy that they've earned through their actions?

Which, to borrow John Oliver's phrase, might well be a f*ck-eulogy if you've been an arsehole.

garion333 wrote:
absurddoctor wrote:

She was over privileged anyway, so this is working very well for her.

Because it's her fault who her parent's were?

No, that was a snarky and uncouth play on what Barbara Bush's response to her visit to the Astrodome shelter shortly after Katrina:

Barbara Bush wrote:

Almost everyone I’ve talked to says, ‘We’re going to move to Houston.’ What I’m hearing, which is sort of scary, is they all want to stay in Texas. Everyone is so overwhelmed by the hospitality.

And so many of the people in the arena here, you know, were underprivileged anyway, so this, this is working very well for them.

Snark aside, when public figures die in the US we as a people seem to try very hard to remember only the good things about them. Which I take no issue with. But when someone who was at least indirectly effected by the wrongs of the person who died wants to point out those wrongs at the same time, I believe they should be allowed to do so. Remembering those true things is not vitriol, what that professor has received in return is.

Yeah as much as I think none of this is worth more than a blip on the evening news, people typically referred to those displaced by Katrina as victims. Which I think speaks volumes both ways: that she chose to use refugees and chose not to use victims.

But again, 92 yo former first lady with past health problems, gets health problems, goes on hospice, dies. Why are we talking about this? She wasn't exactly prominent for anything compared to: Nancy, Hillary, Michelle or even Laura.

absurddoctor wrote:
garion333 wrote:
absurddoctor wrote:

She was over privileged anyway, so this is working very well for her.

Because it's her fault who her parent's were?

No, that was a snarky and uncouth play on what Barbara Bush's response to her visit to the Astrodome shelter shortly after Katrina:

Barbara Bush wrote:

Almost everyone I’ve talked to says, ‘We’re going to move to Houston.’ What I’m hearing, which is sort of scary, is they all want to stay in Texas. Everyone is so overwhelmed by the hospitality.

And so many of the people in the arena here, you know, were underprivileged anyway, so this, this is working very well for them.

Snark aside, when public figures die in the US we as a people seem to try very hard to remember only the good things about them. Which I take no issue with. But when someone who was at least indirectly effected by the wrongs of the person who died wants to point out those wrongs at the same time, I believe they should be allowed to do so. Remembering those true things is not vitriol, what that professor has received in return is.

I appreciate your more measured response than snark. Too often I'm seeing someone die and people who don't like that person are dancing a jig and I find it appalling, Moreso around here. When it happens here I'm incredibly disappointed.

I stayed away from this thread the past couple days because I assumed it would be more snark and I didn't want to devolve this more than it was already (in my eyes).

I completely agree that we whitewash a person's history when they die (pun intended). sh*t, looks at MLK, we usually hear about how he had a dream and much less so about how that dream also included socialism.

As far as the professor is concerned, she brought some of that on herself. Without even looking I'm sure she's had death threats, etc., lobbed her way since we're still living through the Adolescence of the Internet, but how she went about "remembering those true things" is in part what drew the ire. You can still maintain some respect for someone when talking about their negative aspects. You don't have to do a dance and be glad the "witch is dead." Hence, uncouth. (And yes, I'm aware I'm tone policing.)

I'm still not on board with blaming her for raising a war criminal. Bush Jr. made his own choices. How much his ten seventy-something mother was involved in policy decisions when it came to torture and bombings I don't know, but I doubt she held much sway over him and next to no sway over the rest of his administration.

Her comments after Katrina clearly show prejudice. I'm not even going to debate that since prejudice towards minorities in America is ingrained in the culture and she was a part of administrations that did such wonderful things like incarcerating crack addicts for long periods of time unnecessarily. But calling her a racist is not something I feel comfortable with. It's entirely too strong of a word and damned if I don't know enough about her call her an "amazing racist". Just too far for me.

As an aside:

TheGameguru wrote:
Running Man wrote:

Far be it from me to defend a Bush, but I always assumed a refugee just meant someone who was seeking refuge. Definition of refugee: one that flees; especially : a person who flees to a foreign country or power to escape danger or persecution

Exactly.. these citizens were not fleeing a foreign country.. typically what we would refer to as a refugee.. I rarely hear native citizens referred to as refugees in their own country.

Perhaps a slip of the tongue.. or a betrayal of their attitudes towards poor brown people.

It's also the attitude of Texans to people outside of Texas. Not a defense of them at all but many Texans want to keep everyone else out regardless of skin color, though add in the existing skin color prejudices and yeah, you get suspicious comments.

Well Texas was its own country once... (independent republic?)