[Discussion] Mass Shootings - Yeah, we need a thread just for this...

This year is the deadliest year ever in terms of mass shootings. In a political climate of polarization, it becomes harder to suss out legitimate information from the misinformation propagated by those with political agendas. Complicating this more is the continual resistance of 2nd amendment advocates to allow for political talk surrounding these massacres. This will involve political discussion to see if there are ways we can all agree might be good ways to prevent mass shootings.

This discussion should involve the details of any current, or future mass shooting, and how they compare to past mass shootings. How are they the same? How are they different? Do gun laws have an impact? Does the race of the shooter affect how we treat them? What makes one a hate crime and one an act or terrorism? Are these shootings the price of freedom?

Prederick wrote:

Placing $20 on "assholes with guns got into a fight, decided to solve it with gunfire in a crowded area" as the reasoning.

I have that parlayed with "white man."

UpToIsomorphism wrote:
Prederick wrote:

Placing $20 on "assholes with guns got into a fight, decided to solve it with gunfire in a crowded area" as the reasoning.

I have that parlayed with "white man."

Probably. My first thought though was that this was another pizzagate. You've got nutters convinced there is some giant conspiracy with Kelce and Swift to take over the government and this was a logical conclusion to that fiasco.

My first thought was also that it's some Q-adjacent nonsense as well. Honestly still sort of suspect it was but I've not checked the news this morning yet.

Also just so everyone knows I'm also in KC and no one I know was effected so all good here.

My brother lives in KC (or close enough if you don't consider Shawnee Mission KC) and we were concerned until we remembered that a Chiefs victory parade would make him literally physically ill.

Honestly couldn't have paid me I have better ways to get covid than a racist football teams parade. Which, not really the time for that discussion but it sure saved a lot of family members some concern on rather I was there or not.

Kansas City Mayor Says 800 Officers Were At Parade, But With Guns ‘Almost Nothing Is Safe’

The mayor of Kansas City said Wednesday the city was deeply prepared for the parade celebrating the Chief’s Super Bowl win before at least one person was killed in a shooting near the event, but detailed the struggle authorities have protecting the public when gunmen can “disrupt anything” in a matter of seconds.

by design to keep people scared, to keep them accepting of whatever measures the government says the simply must do to keep them safe.

Update - the woman killed was friends with 2 of my friends. Very small world and a very sad community here.

I'm sorry to hear that I can only imagine the pain they feel

My deepest condolences to you and your Sally.

That tree of liberty has to get watered somehow. Sucks that it impacted someone you know.

More hand-waving and rationalizing... "It was just a personal dispute"

FFS... This personal dispute killed 1 and injured 22. Get rid of the @#$#@$ guns.

JC wrote:
UpToIsomorphism wrote:
Prederick wrote:

Placing $20 on "assholes with guns got into a fight, decided to solve it with gunfire in a crowded area" as the reasoning.

I have that parlayed with "white man."

Probably. My first thought though was that this was another pizzagate. You've got nutters convinced there is some giant conspiracy with Kelce and Swift to take over the government and this was a logical conclusion to that fiasco.

I know, as quippy progressives, we'd like to blame this on some white Qanon guy, but from the description I've read of the shooting and from the clip I saw of one of the suspects when he got taken down, the shooter(s) appears to be black.

Police in Kansas City say an argument between several people that escalated led to a shooting that killed one and injured 22 others after a Super Bowl victory parade.

The deceased victim was identified as Lisa Lopez-Galvan, 43, a local DJ.

Police said the injured victims ranged in age from eight to 47 years old and that at least half are under 16.

Three suspects were taken into custody shortly after the shootings. Two of them are aged under 18.

"This appeared to be a dispute between several people that ended in gunfire," Kansas City Police Chief Stacey Graves told reporters on Thursday.

Chief Graves said firearms had been recovered, but did not give further details on the type of guns used in the shooting. She said no arrests had yet been made or charges laid and that the investigation is ongoing.
There was no link to terrorism, police said.

Unfortunately, this sounds pretty identical to something that happened here in NYC this week. Two groups of young men armed got into a dispute on a subway train, opened fire, hit a bunch of innocent bystanders and killed a guy.

An investigation is underway after a shooting at a subway station in the Bronx left multiple people wounded and one dead.

Six people were shot at around 4:30 p.m. on Monday while waiting on the northbound platform for the No. 4 train at the Mount Eden train station.

Among the victims, ranging in age from 14 to 71, one was pronounced dead at St Barnabas Hospital. He was 34-years-old.

The injuries to the other five -- a 14-year-old girl, 15-year-old boy, 28-year-old man, 29-year-old woman, and 71-year-old man -- are not believed to be life threatening.

During a briefing Tuesday evening, NYPD Chief of Transit Michael Kemper said the incident was "not a random shooting" and noted that it involved two groups of teenagers that were engaged in a dispute while riding a northbound No. 4 train.

Officials say as the train pulled into the station, the doors opened and at least one person displayed a firearm and fired shots.

This particular kind of mass shooting feels less "Man angry that Biden and Taylor Swift are trying to subvert the election" and more "kid from impoverished community gets into argument and, thanks to the proliferation of firearms in this country, decides to and repair his bruised male ego by making incredibly dipsh*t decision because he has a gun that makes him feel like a big tough man."

Kansas City shooting survivor Jacob Gooch, Sr., who was shot in the ankle, told "CBS Mornings" on Thursday that he overheard an altercation prior to the mass shooting following a parade and rally for the Super Bowl champions Kansas City Chiefs on Wednesday.

Gooch told CBS' Gayle King that before gunfire started, he heard a woman tell a presumed shooter, "don’t do it, not here; this is stupid."

Gooch said his wife and daughter then saw a gun being drawn.

“My daughter said that some lady was like holding him back, and people had started backing up, and then he pulled it out and just started shooting and spinning in a circle,” he told King.

I know I've read quite a few stories similar to this in my career in news. The difference is they usually don't happen in huge crowds.

Prederick wrote:
JC wrote:
UpToIsomorphism wrote:
Prederick wrote:

Placing $20 on "assholes with guns got into a fight, decided to solve it with gunfire in a crowded area" as the reasoning.

I have that parlayed with "white man."

Probably. My first thought though was that this was another pizzagate. You've got nutters convinced there is some giant conspiracy with Kelce and Swift to take over the government and this was a logical conclusion to that fiasco.

I know, as quippy progressives, we'd like to blame this on some white Qanon guy, but from the description I've read of the shooting and from the clip I saw of one of the suspects when he got taken down, the shooter(s) appears to be black.

Police in Kansas City say an argument between several people that escalated led to a shooting that killed one and injured 22 others after a Super Bowl victory parade.

The deceased victim was identified as Lisa Lopez-Galvan, 43, a local DJ.

Police said the injured victims ranged in age from eight to 47 years old and that at least half are under 16.

Three suspects were taken into custody shortly after the shootings. Two of them are aged under 18.

"This appeared to be a dispute between several people that ended in gunfire," Kansas City Police Chief Stacey Graves told reporters on Thursday.

Chief Graves said firearms had been recovered, but did not give further details on the type of guns used in the shooting. She said no arrests had yet been made or charges laid and that the investigation is ongoing.
There was no link to terrorism, police said.

Unfortunately, this sounds pretty identical to something that happened here in NYC this week. Two groups of young men armed got into a dispute on a subway train, opened fire, hit a bunch of innocent bystanders and killed a guy.

An investigation is underway after a shooting at a subway station in the Bronx left multiple people wounded and one dead.

Six people were shot at around 4:30 p.m. on Monday while waiting on the northbound platform for the No. 4 train at the Mount Eden train station.

Among the victims, ranging in age from 14 to 71, one was pronounced dead at St Barnabas Hospital. He was 34-years-old.

The injuries to the other five -- a 14-year-old girl, 15-year-old boy, 28-year-old man, 29-year-old woman, and 71-year-old man -- are not believed to be life threatening.

During a briefing Tuesday evening, NYPD Chief of Transit Michael Kemper said the incident was "not a random shooting" and noted that it involved two groups of teenagers that were engaged in a dispute while riding a northbound No. 4 train.

Officials say as the train pulled into the station, the doors opened and at least one person displayed a firearm and fired shots.

This particular kind of mass shooting feels less "Man angry that Biden and Taylor Swift are trying to subvert the election" and more "kid from impoverished community gets into argument and, thanks to the proliferation of firearms in this country, decides to and repair his bruised male ego by making incredibly dipsh*t decision because he has a gun that makes him feel like a big tough man."

Kansas City shooting survivor Jacob Gooch, Sr., who was shot in the ankle, told "CBS Mornings" on Thursday that he overheard an altercation prior to the mass shooting following a parade and rally for the Super Bowl champions Kansas City Chiefs on Wednesday.

Gooch told CBS' Gayle King that before gunfire started, he heard a woman tell a presumed shooter, "don’t do it, not here; this is stupid."

Gooch said his wife and daughter then saw a gun being drawn.

“My daughter said that some lady was like holding him back, and people had started backing up, and then he pulled it out and just started shooting and spinning in a circle,” he told King.

I know I've read quite a few stories similar to this in my career in news. The difference is they usually don't happen in huge crowds.

We wouldn't want to get in the way of people's self-righteousness.

I would love for this to lead to a meaningful conversation about gun culture and even sports culture and masculinity write large. I suspect the fact that it wasn't part of some q-anon bullsh*t means we will have just written it off by monday

It’ll be replaced by the next mass shooting by Monday, only to be met with more thoughts and prayers.

KANSAS CITY SHOOTING - NEW VIDEO SHOWS INJURED KIDS FLEE ... 40 Shots Fired, AR-Style Pistol

I know TMZ is not the place to go for accuracy in firearms discussion (or, frankly, most of the media), but fer chrissakes "AR-style Pistol" is not a thing.

Remember, cops have come out and said this didn't appear to be a terroristic act, but rather, a possible dispute between parties ... which killed at least one person.

As for the investigation ... cops have only said they have 3 persons of interest in custody, and 2 of them are juveniles -- but our sources, with direct knowledge of the investigation, say cops also know there were an estimated 40 shots discharged on the scene.

We're also told cops recovered at least 3 weapons -- one of them is an AR-style pistol, and 2 others are handguns with extended magazines. It's unclear if all those weapons were fired during the shooting.

Our sources say cops believe the violence was set off by a confrontation between 2 males and one female -- and it's possible there was more than one person who opened fire in the dense crowd.

Some teenage moron with a gun with an extended clip and probably one of the easily-acquired gun conversion devices decided this was the appropriate method of conflict resolution.

He's a kid. He made a terrible, terrible mistake. And I hope he doesn't see daylight until he's 60. At a minimum.

Wow. I just finished watching the bodycam footage of Acorn Cop and... wow. I don't know what that jurisdiction's protocol is, but I honestly think that there should be a mandatory blood and urine draw for any cop involved in an incident involving force.

Cops are just trained to be paranoid babies now. I forget the guy’s name but there’s an ex-military motivational speaker that gets consulted for a lot of modern police training and his whole schtick is that cops are constantly on the verge of being murdered by the lawless hordes and that an officer’s willingness to immediately resort to deadly force is the only thing maintaining western civilization, nevermind the fact that police aren’t even in the top twenty for dangerous jobs in this country, and that pizza delivery ranks higher.

I believe you're referring to Dave Grossman and his WarriorCop mentality or "Killology" as he likes to call it.

The man and his ideas are a menace to society. Literally and figuratively.

Yeah and the most likely on the job cause of death was car accidents... but it's been covid for 2020-2022... haven't seen the '23 totals yet.

2 adults charged with murder in Chiefs parade mass shooting

The argument began when two groups of people grew agitated over the belief that people in the other group were staring at them, according to affidavits from police. Surveillance video shows Mays and someone with him aggressively approached the other group, police say.

The video showed Mays was the first to begin shooting despite being surrounded by crowds of people, including children, according to one of the affidavits.

Mays told detectives that "he hesitated shooting because he knew there were kids there," according to the affidavit. He told investigators he began firing after someone in the other group said, "I'm going to get you," which he took to mean they would try to kill him. He said he chose a random person from the other group to shoot at as that person was running away, the affidavit says.

Miller initially told investigators that he and his friends began running after hearing gunfire and that he was shot in the back, one affidavit says. When investigators told Miller they had video of him chasing someone in Mays' group and shooting, Miller admitted to firing four to five shots, the affidavit said.

A bullet from Miller's gun killed Lisa Lopez-Galvan, officials said Tuesday. Lopez-Galvan was in a nearby crowd of people watching the Chiefs rally, according to one of the affidavits.

Incomprehensibly f*cking stupid.

Cool. Love this and what it says about society

The Supreme Court appears torn about a Trump-era ban on a gun accessory known as bump stocks

I feel like, in a sane country, there wouldn't be much debate over what to do about a gun modification that had specifically enabled one of the most deadly massacres in the nation's history.

......but y'know, 'murica.

Bump stocks are accessories that replace a rifle’s stock, the part that rests against the shoulder. They harness the gun’s recoil energy so that the trigger bumps against the shooter’s stationary finger, allowing the gun to fire rapidly.

They were invented in the early 2000s. Under Republican President George W. Bush and Democrat Barack Obama, the ATF decided that bump stocks didn’t transform semi-automatic weapons into machine guns. The agency reversed that decision at Trump’s urging after the shooting in Las Vegas and another mass shooting at a Parkland, Florida high school that left 17 dead.

The plaintiffs argue that rifles with bump stocks are different from machine guns because the trigger keeps moving and the shooter must continue to exert pressure on the weapon.

“It’s still one shot per function of the trigger, even though the shots are coming out of the barrel a lot faster than they were before,” said attorney Jonathan F. Mitchell, who argued on behalf of Texas gun shop owner and Army veteran Michael Cargill.

Government lawyers pointed out that traditional machine guns also require pressure from the shooter. They argued bump stocks fall under the legal definition of machine guns because the shooter’s finger stays still while the gun fires hundreds of rounds per minute.

/gestures in genuine dismay
//sighs
///starts to say something
////sighs

I mean, we all know that the most important part of the gun control debate is semantics. /s

Close. The most important part is the thoughts and prayers.

Someone just drove up to my team’s office in Wichita and lit up the parking lot and front of the building with a gun. Thankfully no one was hurt.

Paleocon wrote:

Someone just drove up to my team’s office in Wichita and lit up the parking lot and front of the building with a gun. Thankfully no one was hurt.

I'm so sorry that happened and I'm glad you're ok.

NathanialG wrote:
Paleocon wrote:

Someone just drove up to my team’s office in Wichita and lit up the parking lot and front of the building with a gun. Thankfully no one was hurt.

I'm so sorry that happened and I'm glad you're ok.

I work from home in Baltimore, so I wasn't in any danger. That said, four employees were in the building at the time and a bunch of cars were shot up.

Americans have a very dysfunctional relationship with guns.

Paleocon wrote:

Americans have a very dysfunctional relationship with guns.

Also a knack for understatement.

Jonman wrote:
Paleocon wrote:

Americans have a very dysfunctional relationship with guns.

Also a knack for understatement.

The police are investigating it as an "act of vandalism".