Help me build my PC 2017 Catch All

Jayavarman wrote:

I'm not made any modifications to my rig since purchasing it so it only has cooling system that came with the original Alienware setup. According to my research max dimensions for my gpu space are:
Height: 4.736 inches
Length: 9.5 inches
Width: Dual Slot

That means that the Manli GTX 1660 Ti with single blower will not fit as it is just over 10". Damn, back to the drawing board.
http://www.manli.com/en/products/NVI...

Probably just as well because I don't know if I was going to be able to locate a Manli card anyway.

Have you gone to pcpartpicker and searched for GPUs with 240mm as the max length?

Thanks. I just checked part picker and didn't see option for card size other than slots.

I keep coming back to this card: ASUS GeForce GTX 1660 Ti $285
https://www.asus.com/us/Graphics-Car...

It's a small form 2 slot card that should fit without modification to the case. It's a single fan but does not mention that's its a blower. Which probably means it isn't. Maybe that means I modify my case and add some extra cooling measures?

-Jaya

It's definitely not. Blower cards have that boxy, rectangular shape with a fan that looks vastly different. They have a large center to the fan, with small fins. This is to suck air in through the top of the fan, and then blow that air through the card and out of your case. Generally speaking if your card has long fins that sweep out like a propeller, it means it's an open air style that just moves air across the heatsink but then relies on the air flow through your case to carry that heat away.

Blowers:
IMAGE(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRo-jgJcS4fenl1xtv63hVu6VNcZh6C0IF0fFaDlVfwiA4DdHDz7w)
IMAGE(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT7LruMHuWRhzAyF_ez4Oi9diSBVK1-1Uw7YkP4GBgyKRQbgy0N1g)
IMAGE(data:image/jpeg;base64,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)

Thanks for educating me and confirming. BTW, where did you get that image of a GTX 1660Ti with a blower?
That's the unit I want but I can't find one for sale.

I know, I just pulled images from Google. I read your post in the other thread but I don't have experience with Alienware machines so I didn't respond over there... I'm not against them for other people, but I like to tinker and I'd hate being in the position you're in where you're severely limited by your case. If I were in your position, I'd be looking for an ATX case to move the components into and then invest in a better PSU to get around all the size and power requirements you're trying to juggle.

Edit: And like you mentioned in the other thread, I don't think that one's been released yet. Just a promotional picture.

LondonLoo wrote:

@Legion, thanks. You have saved me some money!

I mean, don't get me wrong. A 4th generation Core i7 is maybe starting to approach the point where people could think about upgrading, depending on their games of choice, if they're trying to run serious VR games, etc. But really, you're probably looking at 10-15% gains on average going from Haswell to Coffee Lake. Incremental, not revelatory. The gains since Haswell have been very limited.

I think Haswell chips are probably another generational jump away from being serious candidates for replacement.

I have scoured the web and I have only found one vendor in Korea that even sells Manli cards and even they don't sell the single blower fan version. And here I thought I came upon a simple card swap to upgrade my modest game box. Arghhh!

http://gsearch.gmarket.co.kr/Listvie...

I wouldn't trust a single card on that site, to be honest. With the 1660 not really having a blower option at the moment, your best bet would be something along the lines of the Asus GTX 1060 Turbo. It's the same power requirement but I'm not sure if it'd fit in your case.

On the plus side, it's still a decent leap to go from a 960 to a 1060 (71% increase), though obviously the 1660 would be better if one could be fitted into your system properly (123% increase, a little more future-proof).

Edit: I found a guide from a guy that swapped his GTX 960 blower out for a GTX 1060 air cooled card and apparently only saw a 1C increase in temps under load. There's a possibility that a decent 1660 may run OK for you, but it's just hard to say given the constraints on your system, and how new those cards are.

I found multiple videos of X51 upgrades to GTX 1060s so they can fit. The PNY in this video is bigger than I thought would fit 10.3" x 4.96" x 1.65" so that means if I can ever find the Manli 1660 Ti with a single blower fan at the MSRP price of ~285 that I will pull the plug.

I might reach out to Invidia tomorrow and see if the Manli drive is real or myth.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xdj9...

EDIT: just saw your edit after my above post:
I've had this very thought with respect to just rolling the dice and getting the ASUS 1660 TI
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...

hoping that I get enough air circulation around the card with the extra space.
My conversation with Nvidia tomorrow might go along way to influence this decision branch point.

*Legion* wrote:
LondonLoo wrote:

@Legion, thanks. You have saved me some money!

I mean, don't get me wrong. A 4th generation Core i7 is maybe starting to approach the point where people could think about upgrading, depending on their games of choice, if they're trying to run serious VR games, etc. But really, you're probably looking at 10-15% gains on average going from Haswell to Coffee Lake. Incremental, not revelatory. The gains since Haswell have been very limited.

I think Haswell chips are probably another generational jump away from being serious candidates for replacement.

There's one area where they really got nailed, though, with the Spectre and Meltdown fixes: I/O speed. Anything Haswell and older has taken a beating to its transfer speed with almost any I/O device. Ryzen and Threadripper avoid Meltdown completely, and aren't affected quite as badly by the various Spectre-class fixes. I'd probably avoid upgrading to a new Intel chip on this basis until a Meltdown-resistant architecture ships from them.

My personal network has several older machines in it, and their network transfer speeds have dropped by half. This is mostly caused by Meltdown, which is Intel-specific.

Jayavarman wrote:

hoping that I get enough air circulation around the card with the extra space.

You could always move the entire system into a slightly larger mini-ITX case.

Just buy the 1660 card, try it and see if the temps are crazy. If they are then return it.

Interesting review of card cooling systems. With the tight space of the Alienware 51 I will hold out a bit longer for a single blower fan 1660 but if none come to market, I will probably grab the ASUS Phoenix and roll the dice.

Pretty much sums up our discussion but gives some good data:
https://techbuyersguru.com/founders-...

Yeah that sounds like a plan. That was an interesting read, sounds like an open air card may throttle itself down but I'd imagine a 1660 Ti would probably throttle down to 1060 speeds at worst.

Honeslty, next month I'm planning to replace my GPU as well. At the moment I'm teetering between the Asus ROG Strix 1660 Ti (~$330) or grabbing an MSI RTX 2060 Gaming Z (~390) with a bundled Anthem key. I'm actually leaning towards the 2060 at the moment.

From my 970 to a 1660 Ti it's about a 49% increase, and to a 2060 it's about a 79% increase. Normally not what I'd jump on for an upgrade, but I also want to drop this 970 into my son's computer and replace his ancient Radeon HD 6670 so it's effectively two computers upgraded for that cost. Coldstream offered up his old CPU/MB/RAM on the trade thread for the cost of shipping, so my son's PC went from a Core 2 Quad Q9450 with 8GB of DDR2 to an i7-2900k with 16GB of DDR3... which was a massive upgrade for $25. But it's severely bottlenecked by that old graphics card. The 970 in my rig would be a 788% performance increase for him (per userbenchmarks) and should put him running the games he plays pretty much at all high settings (Minecraft, Subnautica, Roblox, Portal Knights, and a few others).

Jayavarman wrote:

Thanks. I just checked part picker and didn't see option for card size other than slots.
-Jaya

Whaa? What's this then? It's right under the slot size.

IMAGE(https://i.imgur.com/iElMjOw.jpg)

So I think building a PC would be frustrating for me so looking at prebuilts. Any thoughts on this one? Price looks decent and on sale.

https://www.ibuypower.com/Store/Gami...

Docjoe wrote:

So I think building a PC would be frustrating for me so looking at prebuilts. Any thoughts on this one? Price looks decent and on sale.

https://www.ibuypower.com/Store/Gami...

This is a thing I keep seeing on prebuilts, but Ryzen thrives to some degree on RAM speed. The connection between the two separate groups of 4 cores on the processor is linked to the RAM. The faster the RAM, the faster that connection is. The 2700X will show visible increases in some instances moving up to at least 3000mhz or slightly more for 3200mhz RAM.

By far the weakest spot in an otherwise kinda solid build.

And looking at their system configuring tool where you build your own they seriously don't even offer RAM faster than 2666 in their Ryzen builder. That's... not great.

Docjoe wrote:

So I think building a PC would be frustrating for me so looking at prebuilts. Any thoughts on this one? Price looks decent and on sale.

https://www.ibuypower.com/Store/Gami...

Bah. Do what I did. Get all the exact parts you want then pay someone else to build it.

Veloxi wrote:
Docjoe wrote:

So I think building a PC would be frustrating for me so looking at prebuilts. Any thoughts on this one? Price looks decent and on sale.

https://www.ibuypower.com/Store/Gami...

Bah. Do what I did. Get all the exact parts you want then pay someone else to build it.

And get tortured by us as we throw the assembler's competence into question and stoke anxieties!

You end up with a PC full of Noctua fans in the end though, so it's worth it.

I'm tempted to build my next PC in a large beige box fan with the blades painted brown.

So, for you folks with your ears to the ground on such matters, how close are we to meaningful technology updates on the higher end in both the worlds of CPUs and GPUs? From what I can see it sounds like we're looking at early next year for Nvidia's next big revision, late fall for Intel, and maybe mid to late summer for AMD, but I really don't pay enough attention to know where expectations are for any of the big player's coming offerings.

I'm starting to get itchy about doing a full new build, but the top of my priority list is building a machine that's solid and future proof, able to comfortably last another four to six years (the same as I've gotten out of my current machine) with maybe a single graphics card upgrade somewhere in the middle.

As such, I'm especially interested in being sure I'm building when CPU and motherboard technology is as fresh as possible, which certainly would suggest that I at least wait until late summer and build with a top end next gen Ryzen chip. At the same time though it sounds like that might still be a rotten time to be looking for a high end GPU, unless 2080/2080ti prices drop precipitously in response to the new mid-tier offerings from AMD. Anyway, just curious if my only barely informed read of the landscape right now lines up with that of folks who are more tuned in.

*Legion* wrote:

And get tortured by us as we throw the assembler's competence into question and stoke anxieties!

You end up with a PC full of Noctua fans in the end though, so it's worth it.

SO WORTH IT. Wouldn't have changed a thing.

zeroKFE wrote:

So, for you folks with your ears to the ground on such matters, how close are we to meaningful technology updates on the higher end in both the worlds of CPUs and GPUs? From what I can see it sounds like we're looking at early next year for Nvidia's next big revision, late fall for Intel, and maybe mid to late summer for AMD, but I really don't pay enough attention to know where expectations are for any of the big player's coming offerings.

I'm starting to get itchy about doing a full new build, but the top of my priority list is building a machine that's solid and future proof, able to comfortably last another four to six years (the same as I've gotten out of my current machine) with maybe a single graphics card upgrade somewhere in the middle.

As such, I'm especially interested in being sure I'm building when CPU and motherboard technology is as fresh as possible, which certainly would suggest that I at least wait until late summer and build with a top end next gen Ryzen chip. At the same time though it sounds like that might still be a rotten time to be looking for a high end GPU, unless 2080/2080ti prices drop precipitously in response to the new mid-tier offerings from AMD. Anyway, just curious if my only barely informed read of the landscape right now lines up with that of folks who are more tuned in.

3rd Gen Ryzen is coming in 2019 for sure.. remains to be seen the exact timing (July? Aug? Oct?) and should be very competitive with anything Intel has this year.

On the GPU front I wouldnt hold my breath for anything major happening in 2019.. AMD is still all rumors and I would be skeptical of any rumors around a major new GPU from AMD this year.. at best we may finally see a high end/mid range GPU from AMD in Q2-Q3 2020. Nvidia has lost their f*cking minds so honestly I have no cares in the world with what they are doing.. Their prices are absurd and if I HAD to buy a new GPU right now I'd buy the overpriced (but only by $100 vs $500) AMD Radeon VII which is very strong at 1440P and can handle 4K reasonably well.

Ugh, yeah, rotten indeed.

So you don’t put much stock in the idea that a new mid tier GPU from AMD could trigger a bit of price correction at the high end?

zeroKFE wrote:

Ugh, yeah, rotten indeed.

So you don’t put much stock in the idea that a new mid tier GPU from AMD could trigger a bit of price correction at the high end?

Nope, NVIDIA has repeatedly shown us how they deal with AMD competing at a particular price point: by attacking them at that price point only.

Vega 56 was making the 1070 look bad, so did they price drop the 1080? Nope, they made the 1070ti.

The RX 590 comes out and becomes the best buy at the sub-$300 price point. Does the RTX 2060 come down to compete? Nope, NVIDIA cooks up the 1660ti to stick in there instead.

Heck, before that, the RX 470 and 480 undercut the GTX 1060, so NVIDIA makes the mutant 3GB version of the 1060.

NVIDIA will make the least amount of moves possible to deal with AMD competition. They will cook up an entirely new in-between product to stick into any niche AMD worms into, so that they don't have to budge anywhere else in their product lineup.

The only way a high end price will come down is if AMD directly competes with that product.

Honestly, what I really ought to do is just make myself be okay with either lower detail or lower FPS for about a year — and if I was running a 1080p monitor or maybe even a standard aspect ratio 1440p monitor, my current setup (a five year old i7 4790k and a three year old GTX 1080) would probably more than suffice until then.

Annoyingly, though, I’ve grown very attached to the 3440x1440 monitor that I bought for a steal back when I upgraded to the 1080, and at that resolution my current setup is starting to show cracks. (More and more new games are requiring distasteful compromises to stick at or near 60 fps, and some larger open world games have started to get spiky CPU bound hiccups here and there.) Additionally, this might finally be the summer I bite on a VR kit if one of the new options delivers, and I’d love to pair that with a new PC to get the most of it. And on top of all that, I’ve got a friend who could make very good use of a hand—me-down to replace his five year old laptop for playing games.

So, now I’m kind of looking at three real options, and none the them seem super appealing:

1. Just deal with it and wait another year.
2. Build a new computer when the next gen Ryzen options are available later this year, and pair it with a budget GPU for a year or so.
3. Same as option 2, but pay through the nose for a current high end Nvidia card like a sucker.

Granted, I nearly bought the high end Nvidia card as an upgrade for my current computer when they were new, so it’s not too crazy to imagine me going with option 3 — but it would have been a bad buy then, and it will be an even worse one later this year if you’re correct and Nvidia doesn’t blink a little bit.

Ah well — a bit more waiting and seeing on all fronts won’t be the end of the world, I suppose.

Thanks for your input though!

1440 and 4K are future technologies which do not exist in my universe. I can't miss what I don't ever see.

zero, for how much Elite you play, I'm surprised VR didn't come up more. Elite is good on the current headsets, but if one of the next ones cranks up the visibility, it's going to be mind blowing.

And can you write up that Elite e-book I made a joke about long ago? I've been out of the game and want to get back in, and there's so damn much to catch up on.

Heh, I've been pretty casual on Elite for a while too. I'm doing Distant Worlds again right now, but I didn't really keep up with all the stuff they rolled out with the Thargoids and anti-Thargoid combat stuff. So, I'm afraid you might have to put feelers out for another author for your Git Gud Guide.

And yeah, I was very close to buying a VR set several times (significantly driven by Elite), but I put off the purchase long enough that I found myself in the zone where it felt like I ought to wait for the next generation of technology... and then that next generation kept not showing up. I did pick up a PSVR last fall to, uh, play Tetris I guess? Pale shadow that the PSVR might be, it definitely relit the fire for me. So even if the Rift S and/or whatever Valve's new thing are only end up being more like half generational leaps, I'm going to have a hard time putting it off again. I guess we'll see how my current system works with whatever I might end up buying, but I've got a hunch I'm going to find myself wanting more performance to really do it right, you know?

I constantly think about how much I'd like to get back into this game but I haven't really dedicated much time since... the Engineers were introduced, I think? And I have since tried to get back into it and upgrade my ships, but I either don't have the time/desire to dedicate to it, or I can't find a decent engineer guide so I end up wasting a ton of time doing menial tasks that turn out to be worthless due to out-of-date info. If I had an up-to-date Git Gud Guide I'd totally jump back in.

I keep thinking about how much I want a Vive for this game, too, but can't really justify the cost at the moment....