Most store bought "honey" seems to be more corn syrup than actual honey these days. The real stuff is of course more expensive but so very much better in taste and texture, well worth it.
I'm not in a position to keep my own bees but I'm very glad we have a few goodjers doing their damnedest to help out the poor bees, Sooner or later the impact of CCD is going to manifest in our food supply, on top of all the other issues likely to cause problems for the food supply, it probably won't be pretty.
Most store bought "honey" seems to be more corn syrup than actual honey these days. The real stuff is of course more expensive but so very much better in taste and texture, well worth it.
Another aspect of that is "honey laundering". So honey is expensive. To capitalize on that China started shipping/selling honey here at below fair market value (FMV). Also referred to as dumping. The purpose of which is deemed to increase our reliance on import as well as to unfairly ruin domestic business interests. When a country is found to be selling below FMV and is in fact dumping. The government will institute anti-dumping tarrifs. The products that were dumped will supposedly be at FMV or even be slightly higher.
You're probably saying, but Igneus, your not taking about honey your talking about international business. And you're wrong, it is about honey. You see, we can't produce enough to meet our demands. As Americans we also want to get it cheaper. That's where the honey laundering comes in.
So China owned companies will sell their honey to shady Thailand companies. Well those companies produce their own too. They also mix it, add additional sweeteners, filter it, and re-label it as Thai produced honey. Which is not affected by the anti dumping. Because it's not illegal to sell cheap, just not so cheap it's below FMV. Honey laundering is big business.
Well that's depressing. I don't buy honey unless on a very rare occasion I can get it direct at a farmers market or something. Honestly, I can't remember the last time I bought honey. It's been awhile. Mostly I was concerned with honey producers treating the bees badly and feeding them corn syrup as a honey replacement (is that a thing or not?).
Are you planning to plant nectar-producing plants in your yard, or are you just going to rely on the bees being able to find sufficient nectar in your neighborhood? How far will bees fly in search of nectar? How much nectar is needed to sustain a hive (with a surplus), and what acreage of flowering plants is needed to produce that much?
My in-laws have a small vegetable garden, but I was thinking of throwing out some alfalfa for them. Even if I don't bees are very resourceful. They live in the boonies a bit. There are a lot of forest (which isn't great) and natural field areas within the two mile range bees usually go to forage. It is thought 1 colony of bees needs about one acre of flowering plants to live. One colony of bees can make 80+lbs of honey. I'm not sure how much nectar that is, but probably more then 80lbs worth. Now if need bee I can supplement nectar with sugar water.
I suppose it also depends on your local standards laws on marketing. It happens with honey here - one of the largest family run companies in honey sells two lines, one of which relies on blends from China and Argentina. They also have pure Australian honey, which sells at a higher price; so if that's anything to go by, the price will give you a pretty clear indication on whether you are buying pure local honey or a blend of local and international honey.
Well that's depressing. I don't buy honey unless on a very rare occasion I can get it direct at a farmers market or something. Honestly, I can't remember the last time I bought honey. It's been awhile. Mostly I was concerned with honey producers treating the bees badly and feeding them corn syrup as a honey replacement (is that a thing or not?).
Yes it is, BUT it is also done by responsible bee owners and honey producers. So when you establish a hive, you most likely need to feed them. When I get my bees from the package I will have to give them food because otherwise they will starve and not build their hive. It will be a 1:1 sugar water combination by weight. Sugar isn't to expensive but it costs more than corn syrup(CS). CS might be replaced because if you have for example 100 hives the cost of white sugar for that many would be prohibitive. Now in times of a bad nectar flow you want your bees to keep preparing for winter. So you feed them, or else they will starve. Come winter I will also use a bee candy (1/2 cup water to 4lbs dry sugar), a very sand like substance in case the bees don't have enough honey.
Now while I would like to do this organically I cant use things like raw sugar, it has to many impurities for bees. I have to use white refined sugar. If i had bees already I could use extra honey from other hives, but I can't use honey from the store due to it being processed. Nor should I use it from other keepers as it could spread any fungi or possible disease.
The real issue with the corn syrup is when you are automatically using it because you are planning on taking to much honey. You might accidentally take to much honey because the year starts great, but ends poorly and then need to supplement. Now if you intend to take all the honey and then supplement, especially with CS then that is bad practice. But I would be hard pressed to say just because someone uses CS they are bee-ing bad to their bees.
Nectar is about 70% water, while honey is about 17% water, so it would take about 4 gallons of nectar (2 million flowers worth, or 560 bees worth lifetime production) to make one gallon of honey.
That's very enlightening on the corn syrup/sugar thing. Thanks for explaining that in detail!
That's very enlightening on the corn syrup/sugar thing. Thanks for explaining that in detail!
Sure! I am glad there are questions. It makes me do more research, which I am enjoying immensely. I feel like sometimes I give to much information, but then I think, If you dont want that much, you wont read it.
Let me also take the time to remind you that I am human and on rare occasions I am wrong. If at anytime you think something I say is suspect, research it. Tell me I am wrong, and if I really am I will reward you with a cookie. I will eat said cookie at my earliest convenience, and you will be directly responsible for me bee-coming a fat slob.
Also, you should probably take everything I say as suspect because I really have no idea what I am doing and fully plan on failing. I don't mind failing as long as I keep learning.
Their is an old beekeepers axiom that says "Ask 5 beekeepers and you'll get 6 different answers".
Bee Time Fun Time! Where you are given a random bit of information about bees! *
Our treasure lies in the beehive of our knowledge. We are perpetually on the way thither, being by nature winged insects and honey gatherers of the mind. ~ Friedrich Nietzsche
First I would like to apologize if I seem to be all over the place. I have a very stream of consciousness style to what I write, and it can be very unsettling to people. I know this cause it is unsettling to me when I go back to reread things.
One of the main reasons I am doing this experiment is that I want to keep learning. This whole process has been such an eye opening experience, that my mind has been buzzing** since I started. It is true "if you're not learning, you're dying."
Last "Bee Time Fun Time!" I wrote a lot about honey. That is because I will be working with honey bees. There is still more to go about honey, but if I continue with that topic I will do so at a later date. Today I want to talk more about the girls.
So bees.
There are many species of bees, honey bees are just a small (minority) subset. Within that subset of honey bees, there are three main in the states; Italian, Carniolan, and Russian. In my hive my starter queen will be Italian.
Italian bees tend to be the most common here. They are great producers and generally are more docile. Their look generally has bands on their abdomen of brown to yellow color. If you couldn't guess from their name, they originated in Italy. These bees have also have a propensity for mob movies, very stereotypical. With that they try to much to be a goodfella and rob their neighbors. Robbing can be a pretty bad problem, and with out a strong hive to defend italians will take all the honey they can from other hives. They also have a tendency to drift. So with multiple hive they will start winding up in their neighbor hives and start working. So while they may rob you blind, they might fix up the neighbors home too.
Carniolan (aka Carnies) bees tend to be silver grey to dark brown. They are known to heavily use propolis. They originated from Carniola which is in Solvenia. They are also a gentle bee, said to be less productive then Italians, but really I have no idea. They dont have the same robbing issues and drifting issues as the Italians, well as much. They also seem to be more adapted to change their brooding when a dearth is happening for flower pollen collection. As such they will swarm more often too because their hive will get crowded.
Russian bees are highly prized due to their natural mite resistance. Mites in the US have become a crazy bad problem in the last 20 years. Apparently they were already in issue in Russia and the bees adapted the best for it. They tend to be a little more aggressive lending to that whole stereotype thing, while they don't really sting more, they will "bump" more. Bumping (headbutting) is a defensive tactic used by bees to let you know they are there. It also marks you as a threat with a pheromone, that says "here is an intruder, if they get to close get em." It is harder/more expensive to get a Russian queen. You want to go through a reputable breeder. They are a relatively new addition to America. Introduced by the USDA. I once knew a Russian queen but that is a different story all together.
My current plan is to grow my hive through July, then pinch my queen. That is a nice way of saying kill her off. I will do this if i can get a newly mated Russian, or Northern raised queen. This will improve my hives winter survivability. Especially since most queen package breeders are southern.
There is a pretty extensive bee lab run by the USDA in Louisiana.
*Remember all information given is at best well sourced, at worse pulled out of thin air because I thought I remembered hearing it from somewhere. Citations may bee needed, but will rarely bee given. I will never try to actively deceive you about bees.
**Basically it has become mandatory for me to make at least one bad bee pun every post.
Also I got some of my starter gear at a nice workshop this weekend.
So lets look at a hypothetical situation. You know I am into the whole bee thing so one day you come up to me to ask me a couple questions about it. Below is a long conversation between imaginary you and real me.
You: Hey Iggy how you doing? Mind If I call you Iggy? I want to ask you a question about bees.
Me: No, leave me alone, and don't call me Iggy. Do I look like a glam rock super star? Cause if so I really need to redo my makeup.
You: Al right Iggzzz, I want bees, but beekeeping seems like there is a lot to it. Isn't there an easier way?
Me: Its Igneus, Now don't talk to me I am late for something, I dont know what, just that I am late.
You: Ok I get it Ig to the Neus your late, but really quick.
Me: Fine just stop with the names. No there isn't anything easier. Beekeeping is a lot of work, even before you actually have bees.
You: Come one there has to be a way to do it easier, right?
Me: Sure, just dont do it. Tell me what do you want to get out of it?
You: I want to help the bees man!!!
Me: Thats it? Cause sure there are some much easier way to help the bees.
You: Well i also want honey...
Me: oh ok, I see, you could just buy from a local beekeeper. Or is it that you want honey but without actually working for any of it or buying it? It's not about the bees.
You: yeah exactly...
Me: I am not giving you honey. But if you really want to help the bees, and legit do something to help them. Plus get honey without actually doing the beekeeping. Then sponsor a hive.
You: Sponsor a hive? I can do that?
Me: Yeah man, here let me google that for you. There are a decent number of places that will let you pay for their bees and give you a little of the proceeds. If you have good property for bees some will set up a hive out there and work it with giving you some of the honey. Now if you really want to do something to help the bees you can also install mason bees. Or plant a garden. Or you can just give me money, I swear I will put it to good use. So yeah that answers your questions now leave me alone.
You: Thanks I.G. you're my best friend.
Me: I swear if I see you again I am calling the cops.
You: Classic, that is so you.
If you don't want to read all that then just go to below.
Do you want to help bees without doing the actual work? Then sponsor a hive (let me google that for you, or adopt a hive). If you want to do a little work but not all the management needed. Build a small mason bee hive, they don't make honey but they are super pollinators.
Completed the hive. I used several applications of "Tung Oil" of varying consistencies. First coat was 1:1 tung to citrus solvent. Second was 2:1, final coat was mostly all tung oil. In between coats I would rub it all down with steel wool.
That's really cool!
Really nice work!
Bee Keeping is a very weather specific hobby, as in if the weather sucks then you really cant have any positive interaction with the bees. Tomorrow I get my bees and tomorrow it is supposed to rain all day. That is very bad thing for getting your bees and trying to install them. Which means I will have to put them someplace safe to store them for an extra day. So how do you store a package of bees?
Very carefully.
I guess since I am learning this, I will learn the hard way. From what I have been reading I will need to make sure certain conditions are met.
1: Keep them dry,,, mostly.
2: cool but not cold. Think around 55 degrees plus or minus a few degrees
3: Feed 3 times a day with a light misting of 1:1 sugar water. Hence the mostly dry.
The main idea is to try and just keep them going long enough to get to a nice day to install. If the weathermen can be believed that should be Sunday.
Wish me luck cause if this doesnt work, I am unsure what I will be able to do.
So I installed my bees into their new home on Saturday. Fortunately the weather ended up not being ideal, but usable for putting the bees in their new home.
Now I was able to do a slight check on them yesterday, but didnt take off the top bars. After putting them in there you want to leave them alone for 3 days. They were active, coming in and out of the hive. I did notice some ants though too. So I need to nip that in the bud before it becomes a real problem real fast. I will open them up either tomorrow or Wednesday depending on the weather. Things I will be looking for on my first open, other then do I still have bees:
1: Queen release. - When the queen comes in the package, she is not yet these bees Queen. She is in a cage and is trying to win the bees over with her pheromones. Upon installation you hang her from a top bar and remove an entrance cover. That cover is covering a sugar block, after a while the attendant bees will chew her loose from that block. If she has not been released yet I will help that process along.
2: Comb - I am making sure that comb is started to be built. If it isnt, there may be a problem with the strength of my hive. If there is comb, is it going the right way, if its not going along the groove line is it going across multiple bars. If it is across multiple bars, cut it out or try to gently reform it the right way.
3: Food level - If its low, add more.
4: Ants - How bad are they? I have some tree tanglefoot on order to put on my leg posts.
5: Does anything look odd*
I am very happy though with how this is all working out.
*To be honest, everything about the bees is odd to me right now.
Awesome! Rooting for you and the bees.
Congratulations and good luck!
Every year, my wife and I talk about putting in a hive (actually, we'll probably start with two hives, each in two-story boxes) and each year we put it off for another year.
Congratulations and good luck!
Every year, my wife and I talk about putting in a hive (actually, we'll probably start with two hives, each in two-story boxes) and each year we put it off for another year.
Yes start with two hives if you do. If you end up taking the plunge next year and are in need of any advice/help let me know.
This thread has become one of my favorites. I suggested to my wife and daughters that we get a beehive. They told me that if I chose to do so, it would henceforth be the bee's house, as they would no longer live here. Please continue to allow me to explore this hobby vicariously through your adventures.
This thread has become one of my favorites. I suggested to my wife and daughters that we get a beehive. They told me that if I chose to do so, it would henceforth be the bee's house, as they would no longer live here. Please continue to allow me to explore this hobby vicariously through your adventures.
Thanks, that means a lot to me as I don't know if what I have to say about all of this is worth it. I am really hoping that this thread will also bring me to the "Choose My Tag" eventually, cause I mostly lurk on all the others.
I was very fortunate my wife said, "sure you can have bees as long as I dont have to do the work." It was a pretty easy deal to reach. My daughter, 2-1/2yrs, when I got bees said "BEEEEEESS! BUZZ BUZZ, DONT STING ME BEES" for at least 10 min straight.
Beads?
Beads?
Now that is a good question. Frankly I am ill equipped to answer it at this time. I will do my best to find out that info and get back an answer.
But really? Beads? am I missing something?
I get this song stuck in my head every time I check this thread, and it makes me happy.
We read/watch a lot of Pooh bear in our household.
Awesome! Rooting for you and the bees.
Bees.gif
Finally. Been waiting for this since page 1.
Sorry for going off topic 
Bought a basic keeper kit and hive today and ordered some bees. The bees should arrive in a month.
Awesome! Looking forward to seeing pics and reading more stories.
Bought a basic keeper kit and hive today and ordered some bees. The bees should arrive in a month.
Awesome! Glad I am not alone. Please post pics, advice, and things you are learning. If there is anything I can do to help let me know.
Are you getting a nuc or a package? I take it with a basic kit that the hive is a langstroth?
My first piece of advice if you want it, get involved in a local keepers association.
Pages