DC Catch-All [Spoiler Zone]

I liked the scene in the mall. It embraced the camp inherent in the character and had a sense of fun that made the bad weightless wire-fu special effects work despite their badness. I was ready for a movie like that scene promised.

Then the rest of the movie happened.

Very old people like me might remember a wonder woman tv series where she was secret government spy. This was in the 70s. Instead of her spartan or flag like outfit she wore a more normal outfit. It would have been cool if she wore that in the mall scene.

hbi2k wrote:

I liked the scene in the mall. It embraced the camp inherent in the character and had a sense of fun that made the bad weightless wire-fu special effects work despite their badness. I was ready for a movie like that scene promised.

Then the rest of the movie happened.

And I hated that scene. It conflicted tonally with every other scene (in other movies) that we had seen WW in, which played her as a serious character.

Nevin73 wrote:
hbi2k wrote:

I liked the scene in the mall. It embraced the camp inherent in the character and had a sense of fun that made the bad weightless wire-fu special effects work despite their badness. I was ready for a movie like that scene promised.

Then the rest of the movie happened.

And I hated that scene. It conflicted tonally with every other scene (in other movies) that we had seen WW in, which played her as a serious character.

I mean, you're not wrong. And I wouldn't have minded a tone shift to a more serious story if it had been done well, instead of, y'know... what we got.

hbi2k wrote:
Nevin73 wrote:
hbi2k wrote:

I liked the scene in the mall. It embraced the camp inherent in the character and had a sense of fun that made the bad weightless wire-fu special effects work despite their badness. I was ready for a movie like that scene promised.

Then the rest of the movie happened.

And I hated that scene. It conflicted tonally with every other scene (in other movies) that we had seen WW in, which played her as a serious character.

I mean, you're not wrong. And I wouldn't have minded a tone shift to a more serious story if it had been done well, instead of, y'know... what we got.

I'm not opposed to a tone shift in a character if it makes them better or more interesting. Thor Ragnarok took Thor and made him much more fun and interesting to me. DC having a more fun character isn't a bad thing in general. But it just wasn't handled well.

I didn't hate the movie. It just was a step back from what I thought was a decent (not great) first film in the franchise.

MannishBoy wrote:

I'm not opposed to a tone shift in a character if it makes them better or more interesting. Thor Ragnarok took Thor and made him much more fun and interesting to me. DC having a more fun character isn't a bad thing in general. But it just wasn't handled well.

I didn't hate the movie. It just was a step back from what I thought was a decent (not great) first film in the franchise.

Yeah, I pretty much agree with all this. I didn't hate it either, except for making Wonder Woman a literal rapist. That was such an egregious and obvious blunder and so easily avoided. I really don't understand how nobody involved-- not Patty Jenkins, not any of the producers or executive producers, not any of the actors-- apparently thought to say, "Hey, wait! This is not okay!" The film got all the way through scripting and pre-production and production and post-production and marketing and release without that happening.

Batwoman, Season 2, Episode 1:

I think they handled the changeover to Javicia Leslie as well they could, and if this the closest we're ever get to a live-action Batman Beyond, I'm here for it, though...

Spoiler:

... Batmobile made out of a Camaro, not so much.

Superman & Lois | Season Trailer

farley3k wrote:

Superman & Lois | Season Trailer

What is this? This flew under my radar... I was kinda hoping to see Dean Cain and Teri Hatcher when I saw that title. And what’s up with that tone? I thought people have learned by now that nobody wants to see a dark Superman...

The only time I'd like to see Dean Cain again is getting arrested on drug charges.

I'd have hoped for a lighter tone in this, but I guess being post-Crisis that wasn't going to happen, at least not initially.

Watched the first episode of Batwoman because I was curious to see how they parachute Javicia Leslie into the role. She has a lot of potential, and I'm hoping that they move away from the family drama stuff that dragged the first season down, but I think I may be done with the Arrowverse stuff.

As an aside, Ruby Rose must have left on really bad terms. She didn't even do the voice over for the letter Kate wrote.

It's kind of depressing to see Brandon Routh has moved on to playing a racist asshole cop in The Rookie.

Yeah. I think between the Rookie and Legends of Tomorrow Routh has demonstrated that he has range. It's a shame that his best known role will be from Scott Pilgrim.

Nevin73 wrote:

Yeah. I think between the Rookie and Legends of Tomorrow Routh has demonstrated that he has range. It's a shame that his best known role will be from Scott Pilgrim.

I dunno I thought he did a great Christopher Reeve impression in a (mediocre?) Superman movie.

Brainsmith wrote:

And what’s up with that tone? I thought people have learned by now that nobody wants to see a dark Superman...

I thought it looked about like how DC does things.

I remember very clearly as a child of 10-12 (so 30 years ago!) noticing that DC comics were darker and Marvel was happier (broadly speaking)

Nimcosi wrote:
Nevin73 wrote:

Yeah. I think between the Rookie and Legends of Tomorrow Routh has demonstrated that he has range. It's a shame that his best known role will be from Scott Pilgrim.

I dunno I thought he did a great Christopher Reeve impression in a (mediocre?) Superman movie. ;)

Oh he did. I just think that the Scott Pilgrim movie will be more remembered than Superman Returns.

Nimcosi wrote:
Nevin73 wrote:

Yeah. I think between the Rookie and Legends of Tomorrow Routh has demonstrated that he has range. It's a shame that his best known role will be from Scott Pilgrim.

I dunno I thought he did a great Christopher Reeve impression in a (mediocre?) Superman movie. ;)

He is the best Superman since Christopher Reeve. Admittedly, that bar is buried in the floor at this point, but it still counts!

I was hoping Superman and Lois would keep the positivity from Supergirl. Definitely the lightest of the arrowverse shows.

MrDeVil909 wrote:

As an aside, Ruby Rose must have left on really bad terms. She didn't even do the voice over for the letter Kate wrote.

Well, she was hospitalized with a spinal injury that very easily could have paralyzed or killed her. I can't say I blame her for never wanting to talk to anyone related to that show again.

p.s. CAVILL SUPERMAN 4EVER

What "shame" is there in being best known for Scott Pilgrim? That film rules, Routh is hilarious in it (real talk, his shrugging "It's no big deal..." response to the reveal his is vegan is the best encapsulation of the more tedious side of the lifestyle than...any other cheap joke attempt, straight up), and in an eminently rewatchable movie, his entrance to exit may be the most rewatchable section.

farley3k wrote:
Brainsmith wrote:

And what’s up with that tone? I thought people have learned by now that nobody wants to see a dark Superman...

I thought it looked about like how DC does things.

I remember very clearly as a child of 10-12 (so 30 years ago!) noticing that DC comics were darker and Marvel was happier (broadly speaking)

I am not ashamed to admit that I know Superman mostly from the first two movies, Louis & Clark and that Superboy TV show from the nineties. That’s why I found the last couple of movie depictions of him rather off-putting. But perhaps I am the only one who hoped for a Louis & Clark continuation.

BadKen wrote:
MrDeVil909 wrote:

As an aside, Ruby Rose must have left on really bad terms. She didn't even do the voice over for the letter Kate wrote.

Well, she was hospitalized with a spinal injury that very easily could have paralyzed or killed her. I can't say I blame her for never wanting to talk to anyone related to that show again.

Yeah, true. But it seems to me that not even getting on a mic to record a couple of minutes of VO speaks to a serious bitterness. I think there's more to it. Or I could be reading too much into it. *shrugs*

As for great Supermans, Supersman, Supermen?

Tyler Hoechlin was generally pretty good as the traditional All-American Superman in Supergirl, to the point that him being a sh*thead in Another Life was deeply disconcerting.

And Brandon Routh as Kingdom Come Superman was very fun in Crisis.

farley3k wrote:

Superman & Lois | Season Trailer

What is it with the CW Arrowverse and women's eyebrows? I know its my glitch, but I can't look at this Lois actress without wondering why she, like every actress they employ, has had eyebrows painted on like a cartoon. Its such a weird aesthetic.

kazooka wrote:

He is the best Superman since Christopher Reeve. Admittedly, that bar is buried in the floor at this point, but it still counts!

Although I sense this may be meant to be throwing down the gauntlet, I'll bite.

I think Cavill is fantastic in the role. He just has been following scripts that don't fit Superman very well at all. We didn't get to see him doing much saving, only carnage, self-recrimination, and, well, execution. But when he wasn't being some Snyder-written maniac, Cavill brings all the charm and humanity the character is supposed to have.

Routh was hamstrung by a film that tried to be a sequel, so he wasn't given much of a chance. I thought he was great, but didn't have a chance to make it his own.

Let's be honest, Superman isn't a terribly interesting character. He is so over-powered that to find opponents that stand a chance you have to get to ridiculous levels of god-like power.

That said, Cavill is my favorite.

Jakobedlam wrote:

I think Cavill is fantastic in the role. He just has been following scripts that don't fit Superman very well at all. We didn't get to see him doing much saving, only carnage, self-recrimination, and, well, execution. But when he wasn't being some Snyder-written maniac, Cavill brings all the charm and humanity the character is supposed to have.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Cavill is the only thing that makes Snyderman even mildly watchable, and makes me wish for him to play the part in the hands of a writer and/or director that actually gets the character.

hbi2k wrote:
Jakobedlam wrote:

I think Cavill is fantastic in the role. He just has been following scripts that don't fit Superman very well at all. We didn't get to see him doing much saving, only carnage, self-recrimination, and, well, execution. But when he wasn't being some Snyder-written maniac, Cavill brings all the charm and humanity the character is supposed to have.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Cavill is the only thing that makes Snyderman even mildly watchable, and makes me wish for him to play the part in the hands of a writer and/or director that actually gets the character.

He was great in Shazam. Really kept the charisma without going all grimdark.

lunchbox12682 wrote:
hbi2k wrote:
Jakobedlam wrote:

I think Cavill is fantastic in the role. He just has been following scripts that don't fit Superman very well at all. We didn't get to see him doing much saving, only carnage, self-recrimination, and, well, execution. But when he wasn't being some Snyder-written maniac, Cavill brings all the charm and humanity the character is supposed to have.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Cavill is the only thing that makes Snyderman even mildly watchable, and makes me wish for him to play the part in the hands of a writer and/or director that actually gets the character.

He was great in Shazam. Really kept the charisma without going all grimdark.

And they found a less distracting way of dealing with the mustache.

SpacePProtean wrote:

in an eminently rewatchable movie, his entrance to exit may be the most rewatchable section.

Including one of my favorite lines of dialogue:

HE PUNCHED THE HIGHLIGHTS OUT OF HER HAIR!

Another highlight of that section to me is Thomas Jane the Vegan Policeman. Thomas Jane is about as non-vegan as you can get. I remember an interview with him where he talked about the diet and workout required to get in Punisher shape. It was not a vegan diet.

We should have a Scott Pilgrim thread. And I just saw the game is getting re-released on Switch.

hbi2k wrote:
Jakobedlam wrote:

I think Cavill is fantastic in the role. He just has been following scripts that don't fit Superman very well at all. We didn't get to see him doing much saving, only carnage, self-recrimination, and, well, execution. But when he wasn't being some Snyder-written maniac, Cavill brings all the charm and humanity the character is supposed to have.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Cavill is the only thing that makes Snyderman even mildly watchable, and makes me wish for him to play the part in the hands of a writer and/or director that actually gets the character.

Yes, he's a beacon of light and was made to lift people up, but that has never stopped the world he came to from being filled with evil and he'd be very one note and forgettable if he was written to ignore all of that. He wasn't.

While Wonder Woman and Batman have killed in the past I do agree that him having Superman break the no kill rule as over the top. It's inconsistent with everything else.

Maybe things have changed the past decade or so since I last read the title, but the previous 60 years were dark AF with splashes of light to break things up. The idea that Snyder's writing doesn't fit Superman is just silly.

It may not be the sides of Superman some folks like, but it's definitely the Superman that has been shown countless of times before.