I like Thrawn so far as a character, but I’m still not sold on him being an existential threat. He’s got one beat-up Star Destroyer and 3 witches who seem to be the last remnants of a dead civilization. I was expecting him to have some sort of interstellar dominion of his own, or to have at least one significant interstellar nation willing to follow him/lend him an expeditionary force.
He's got Amos Burton in a gold mask. That's pretty threatening.
Thrawn is a tactical genius. He could probably defeat the entire New Republic with just his busted up Star Destroyer. Well probably not but he could be what caused the first order to form.
Thrawn is a tactical genius...
Prior to Ashoka, my only experience of Thrawn has been the Rebels cartoon. However, over the years, I've listened to a number of Star Wars fans - who've encountered him in other media - banging the drum for Thrawn to be given more screen-time. Based purely on what I've seen so far, I'm not sure that I see what all the fuss was about. I don't find him that interesting or that screen-suitable.
As far as I can tell, he's basically a military Lex Luthor; a comic book villain who lacks superpowers and therefore relies on his intellect.
I'm not sure how well this will translate to film that we all expect is coming. It'll be full of characters who 'do' action, facing off against a bloke who spends his time either sitting in a wingback chair, with eyes closed and fingers steepled. Or issuing terse instructions from another chair, this time on the bridge of a Star Destroyer.
EDIT:
If I might warm to my theme a little, Thrawn isn't very compelling.
In my view, Star Wars has been struggling for villains since Vader and the Emperor... both of whom I'd argue became more compelling, sinister and frightening in the prequels. I'd argue that all the villains in the sequel trilogy were pretty limp. No small child's dreams are going to be disturbed by General Hux, for example.
I disagree. I think what makes him compelling is that he actually takes the time to understand his enemies and then plans for them accordingly. And they're good plans too, which is what makes him such a threat. He's not scary in the same way Vader and Palpetine are, true, but he's just as formidable. Vader is imposing and unrelenting, Palpetine is powerful and cruel, but Thrawn is focused and capable in a way neither of the others are. Most Rebel victories come about because the Empire underestimates them or simply doesn't understand their motivations (which is why the more they tighten their grip, the more star systems slip through their fingers). Thrawn understood though, that the Rebellion is still made up of people, and if you understand a person well enough, you can predict how they'll act, or react, and use that knowledge against them. His long-term plan for destroying the Rebellion likely would have worked if not for Governor Price getting greedy about the Ghost crew in his absence. Her causing Kanan to sacrifice himself changed Ezra in a way that Thrawn hadn't anticipated before he had left, so while he expected Ezra to choose to nobly surrender himself to save Lothal, Thrawn was unable to predict that Ezra would choose to truly sacrifice himself to remove Thrawn from the board as well.
I sorta get it about Thrawn.
I've watched all live action SW. I've never seen any of the animated series however. I consider my SW knowledge to be above par.
So far, Ahsoka has not given me any indication that Thrawn is anything special other than the characters saying so.
I hope he's going to prove it soon...
Just play TIE Fighter. The only reason the Rebels won at Endor is because Thrawn was busy.
I sorta get it about Thrawn.
I've watched all live action SW. I've never seen any of the animated series however. I consider my SW knowledge to be above par.
So far, Ahsoka has not given me any indication that Thrawn is anything special other than the characters saying so.
I hope he's going to prove it soon...
Fair. Live action Thrawn is just coasting on his Rebels reputation so far. It will take time for him to live up to it, but I expect he will.
Vargen wrote:I like Thrawn so far as a character, but I’m still not sold on him being an existential threat. He’s got one beat-up Star Destroyer and 3 witches who seem to be the last remnants of a dead civilization. I was expecting him to have some sort of interstellar dominion of his own, or to have at least one significant interstellar nation willing to follow him/lend him an expeditionary force.
He's got Amos Burton in a gold mask. That's pretty threatening.
I come from a very different place. When I was in high school I read the original Timothy Zhan trilogy about Grand Admiral Thrawn. Those books are what got me into Star Wars. Over the next 10 years I ready every Star Wars novel that was released, including some that reprised the character. He is by far my favorite Star Wars villain. Note that Han Solo is my favorite hero, so I guess I prefer people that can do amazing things without the need of the force.
I personally never looked for more screen time with Thrawn. I welcome it, but he won't translate as well to the screen since most of the interesting Thrawn pieces in the novels was him analyzing a situation, sometimes just in his head. We only just got to see him in Ahsoka, and I suspect the next two episodes will show us more about what makes him such a threat. I also suspect that all this will be culminating into the live action movie that will tie together the Mandalorian and Ahsoka with Grand Admiral Thrawn as the main villain.
Hrdina wrote:He's got Amos Burton in a gold mask. That's pretty threatening.
True, just ask the Tenth and Fourteenth Doctor and/or Crowley.
Thrawn was unable to predict that Ezra would choose to truly sacrifice himself to remove Thrawn from the board as well.
Having re-read the original books a few years ago, this is Thrawn's entire thing. He's a very competent commander with an eye for both grand strategy and tactics who has a blindspot when it comes to humans being irrational that always allows the heroes to escape/win/whatever. All of which fits with Zahn's very OT view of SW being a kids serialized adventure story.
Wait… Captain Enoch is Amos? And the main villain is Blue. Best crossover EVAR!!!
Threepio!
Pretty fun, but mostly moving pieces on the board. Someone besides a stormtrooper needs to die already.
Is there only 8 episodes or 9?
To be fair though, "really good at moving pieces around the board" is kind of (a snarky, reductionist description of) Thrawn's whole shtick.
I'm really digging Eman Esfandi's performance as Ezra. Everyone involved has done a good job of making him older and more mature, but still Ezra.
Pretty fun, but mostly moving pieces on the board. Someone besides a stormtrooper needs to die already.
Is there only 8 episodes or 9?
8, so no idea how they are going to end it. I suspect we're going to get an ESB style ending, finding small victories and hope in a larger defeat.
I really thought someone would die in the penultimate episode then. Stuffing way too much into a final episode I'm afraid.
I mean, aren't they setting up Thrawn as the main villain in the Filloni-verse movie? I am going to say that whatever that movie is will serve as Episode 9.
Do we know what else is coming from Star Wars television between now and when Filoni's movie comes out? I wouldn't be surprised to see a second Ahsoka season that's focused on getting the heroes home, and also whatever it is that Lord Baylen is sensing out there.
I mean, aren't they setting up Thrawn as the main villain in the Filloni-verse movie? I am going to say that whatever that movie is will serve as Episode 9.
I know Rise of Skywalker was forgettable, but I didn't realize it was so forgettable that they could just make another Episode 9. (:
UpToIsomorphism wrote:I mean, aren't they setting up Thrawn as the main villain in the Filloni-verse movie? I am going to say that whatever that movie is will serve as Episode 9.
I know Rise of Skywalker was forgettable, but I didn't realize it was so forgettable that they could just make another Episode 9. (:
I know what you did, but you are right. I refuse to acknowledge the existence of that movie and anxiously await news from Disney when they will start production on the propper follow-up to The Last Jedi.
The McGuffin in that movie was a Sith dagger with...dark energy. REY IS WIELDING THE YOUNGLING KILLER 3000! And that's not the worst part of that movie!
Wielding? I must have blacked out more of that movie than I realized.
Wielding? I must have blacked out more of that movie than I realized.
Lucky.
C3PO had to much respect given to him. Makes me think it was really Ezra in a gold metal costume. I know we see a guy claiming to be Ezra but that is clearly some pervert that is having a perverted relationship with crabs. I think all those crabs were Not Ezra's kids.
Why are those witch ladies helping Thrawn? Why do they care about the empire. Could Thrawn be dating all three of them and they are his sugar mamas? Some people like blue people and some people like crab people. There is truly someone for everyone in this universe.
I was left a little bemused by this episode.
It felt like the Team Good had members of Team Evil at their mercy a number of times... and simply let them flee the battlefield. Not even injure them a bit, and let them retreat to lick their wounds. Nope; just straight up leave.
It felt like a clumsy way of providing some action, while ensuring that every major character makes it to the final reel (or the forthcoming film).
For me, it feels like different tv series and films are being made for very different audiences. Andor and Rogue One feel darker and grittier, with characters that are more desperate. It skews more adult in my view. Right now, Ashoka frankly feels like a kids show.
A couple of other thoughts:
Sabine continues to be strangely (and irritatingly) reluctant to explain anything to Ezra in anything like a timely fashion. Does she now trust him? Is there an Ezra 'heel turn' in the offing?
To be honest, that would make the show much more interesting that it is now. We are still hemmed in by the fact that none of these characters appears, or is referenced in, 'The Force 'Awakens' and the other sequels.
I'm with Baron of Hell on the three witches. They are potentially the most interesting characters in the show.
What's their motivation? And what is their relationship with Thrawn? Are they his servants? Or is there something more nuanced going on (as there is with the three witches in Macbeth, that I assume serve as an influence)?
Thrawn really is a poor villain for the screen. Watching someone give orders really isn't that interesting to watch. It needs a bit more 'Minority Report'-style shuffling things around in virtual reality, more pictures and notes connected by red string. I now understand why most Bond films give their less-actiony villains to little screen time.
C3PO had to much respect given to him.
We just sh*t on Episode IX again, and you're going to complain about them using a living actor instead of some kind of simulacrum of Carrie Fisher?
Hmm... given how holograms look in Star Wars, they could probably have made a remote message work. I absolutely do not fault them for not trying that with Carrie Fisher though, given the franchise's recent history with her.
And if Leah was there in person then she could be debated with, which would slow things down. Her involvement had to come as a one-way message of some sort.
Sabine continues to be strangely (and irritatingly) reluctant to explain anything to Ezra in anything like a timely fashion. Does she now trust him? Is there an Ezra 'heel turn' in the offing?
I think it's pretty obvious that she feels guilty about the deal she made to get there. He is all that she has left. She doesn't want to risk pushing Ezra away when she just got him back. Sabine is not in a good place, mentally. She hasn't been for the entire series. She isn't making good decisions right now. (Yes, I defended her decision to hitch a ride with the Imperials, but at this point I think it's obvious that she wouldn't agree with me and feels she made a selfish choice rather than the best of a bad situation.)
Help me Hera Syndulla, you're my only hope.
Easy peasy
I think it's pretty obvious that she feels guilty about the deal she made to get there. He is all that she has left. She doesn't want to risk pushing Ezra away when she just got him back. Sabine is not in a good place, mentally. She hasn't been for the entire series. She isn't making good decisions right now. (Yes, I defended her decision to hitch a ride with the Imperials, but at this point I think it's obvious that she wouldn't agree with me and feels she made a selfish choice rather than the best of a bad situation.)
You may be right about her feeling guilty. However, her motivation for not telling Ezra anything at all - not least about the potentially imminent threat from one or all of: two rogue Jedi; three witches; Thrawn; a bunch of local bandits - is far from clear to me.
All may well be made clear in the final episode. However, just now, it feels only like a plot device designed to keep our heroes in mild peril for another episode. Otherwise, Ezra forms a plan, no?
In many ways, what Ashoka resembles most is one of the old Republic serials that so influenced George Lucas. Every episode ends, if not on a cliff-hanger, then without even temporary resolution.
I wonder whether the next episode will be much longer...
Help me Hera Syndulla, you're my only hope.
Easy peasy
Tell me you've never dealt with depression without telling me you've never dealt with depression...
If it were that easy she'd've been out doing something, either with the Republic military or with her own agenda, rather than moping around Lothal being lonely and dysfunctional.
Stele wrote:Help me Hera Syndulla, you're my only hope.
Easy peasy
Tell me you've never dealt with depression without telling me you've never dealt with depression...
If it were that easy she'd've been out doing something, either with the Republic military or with her own agenda, rather than moping around Lothal being lonely and dysfunctional.
What? Did you quote the wrong person?
I'm talking about hologram Leia that 3PO should have delivered to the council.
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