Factorio

So they just quietly made a major change in the game: basic oil processing now makes petroleum only. And the refineries only 'light up' the one input and the one output, both the same as they are in advanced processing. (Means you won't have to rip out piping when you switch to Advanced mode.)

I think this will be a major improvement; the hill to getting your oil industry running was incredibly steep. You could be building infrastructure for, like, two or three hours before *any* of it worked, and if you got any part of it wrong, the rest of it would grind to a halt. I've done it several times, but I've frequently thought that Factorio must lose most of its players at that stage of the game. Once you had oil running, things started to get really interesting, but damn, that part was a long trudge.

Well, they fixed it. No more heavy and light oil in the early game, those show up later. They also changed blue (chemical) science packs to use sulfur instead of solid fuel. (this played hell on my current factory, and it took me quite awhile to get the sulfur routed properly and to get the old solid fuel flushed out, not least because my petroleum base was feeding gigantically long conveyors, due to very inconvenient resource placement.)

With no more need for solid fuel, my major use for light oil also disappeared. I've always built oil crackers to break down excess light and heavy oils into the next stage, but now almost all of my light oil ends up being cracked to petroleum. It's to the point that they could probably tweak one or two recipes and remove it completely. (I think it's still used a little bit, but I can't even think where.) I imagine they're probably going to add it as a requirement for other things, though I have no insight as to what or when.

They're steadily improving the graphic assets as well. The thing that struck me most is that, sometime in the last ten or so beta builds, they redid stone. I'm actually not sure I like the redo as well... it's very attractive, but I have a hard time telling whether a belt is fully packed. Maybe I'll get used to it. It does look great, much more like actual stone. I just wish I had an easier time reading it.

I think my favorite part of the game remains the nuclear power cycle. That whole setup is very satisfying. It's a tough hill to climb, much like oil production was... I'd call it quite a bit harder, even. But it's optional, you don't have to use it.... it's like a challenge mode, kind of. It's worth putting in the effort, and when the amount of effort is that high, that's an indirect way of saying that it's a very cool feature. It is really fun watching a well-designed reactor tick over, incidentally lighting up enough machines to run Massachusetts.

That sounds promising. I’m one of those players who has never made it past the oil stage for exactly the reasons you mention.

I agree that this is going to make the oil phase much more pleasant. In my last game as soon as I got basic oil I put together a hackish process to manually make just enough science to get advanced oil, just so I didn't have to deal. I am making an attempt to run trains with solid fuel, but this factory doesn't have a lot of them so it's not that big a deal. My last game had LTN trains everywhere so speeding them up would have been helpful.

I don't think I'm going to rewire my current base for the new setup; it's at the point I usually reach where I can launch multiple rockets but need to do a lot of reworking to get more resources in, and I've kind of lost interest in that. Probably I'll start a new game at the next non-beta release unless I get a particularly clever idea before that. Although... I do have a nuclear plant that's about 10x what it needs to be and all that power shouldn't just go to waste...

absurddoctor wrote:

That sounds promising. I’m one of those players who has never made it past the oil stage for exactly the reasons you mention.

Me too.

absurddoctor wrote:

That sounds promising. I’m one of those players who has never made it past the oil stage for exactly the reasons you mention.

I don't blame you. I think it was worth climbing the hill, but I could easily imagine deciding the other way. This new petroleum-only setup will be much better. You'll still have to extract crude, refine it to petroleum, and then use that petroleum to make stuff. You're handling most of that in liquid form, so it's slightly more complex than the earlier supply chains, but it's still basically one chain, oil -> petroleum -> goods.

The old system was three chains, and two of which were incomplete, meaning you ended up with a bunch of spare heavy and light oil you couldn't directly use; you basically had to stick them in tanks while you researched how to crack them down to the useful petroleum. (or, in the case of heavy oil, start making and tanking lubricant for later use.)

It really wasn't a reasonable ask, in the old version. It's only the fact that the game is unreasonably fun that made it worthwhile.

Oh, I discovered, somewhat painfully, that they added a light oil component to making rocket fuel. This caused me a little grief. It's not much, only ten units of light oil per rocket fuel (plus the existing ten solid fuels), but you do have to run the additional piping.

Moggy wrote:
absurddoctor wrote:

That sounds promising. I’m one of those players who has never made it past the oil stage for exactly the reasons you mention.

Me too.

Same here; I stalled out on oil in v0.15, although it also didn't help that work got really busy around that time.

I'm looking forward to the day when I'll have enough cycles to get back into it and stick with it; such a brilliant game.

From time to time, you may think that you're finally making enough green circuits.

This would be incorrect.

It's potentially worth noting that you need the experimental branch to get the oil production changes.

It's been a bit since I've played; I think the last time they were just starting to upgrade a bunch of the visuals. It looks pretty nice these days!

I'm working through the introduction ... definitely a vast improvement over the old very out-dated tutorial, and finally worth new players looking at again.

Game back to the game on an old save with a space exploration mod. We were so lost in the weeds of our base we stopped playing and loaded satisfactory. Funny moment. Still love the game.

The latest post on the dev blog has announced the 1.0 release date: September 25, 2020. The attitude seems to be that they could work on the game forever, and given that the game is already incredibly polished, it just makes sense to pick a date and declare it done. They can always continue to fix bugs after that point.

If you're looking for a game that scratches a similar itch to Factorio, you might enjoy Mindustry. Factorio is a building game with an external threat as a secondary impetus to advance; it has some elements of tower defense, but that's not the main goal. Mindustry is the other way around; it's a tower-defense game where you're building up an economy to serve your towers.

Any given level usually lasts maybe a couple of hours, wall-clock time. The basic goal is to collect resources into your central building, the core, and then launch back to wherever you came from, keeping whatever you mined and/or constructed. Then you spend the resources you gathered to climb the tech tree, learning new goods, new systems, and gaining access to new areas.

Enemies are, of course, trying to kill you: this is a tower defense game. They appear, path to your core, and kill it if they can. You're supposed to build obstacles and weapons to stop them. This is absolutely routine in this genre. What isn't routine is that you have to keep your turrets supplied; early turrets take copper, but can optionally take better ammo and give you better results. Mid-tier turrets run well on 'pyratite', which is a combination of coal, sand, and lead. I just unlocked what I think are late-game turrets for the harder levels, but I haven't tried them yet.

You can't just fling the better towers out there, you have to build up an economy to do it. You'll need a steady supply of copper first, and then lead. Then you'll need graphite, which is processed from coal. This is your first manufactured good. All of these buildings run on their own, without electricity. You'll probably then bring up power, because more advanced buildings need electricity. You'll start mining titanium and shipping in into your core, and then start making silicon and metaglass, which are critical building components for advanced buildings and liquid handling, respectively.

Meanwhile, the enemies are trying to kill you, so you're having to manage your defenses, replacing damaged walls, turrets, and conveyors as they break. The game doesn't flash alerts at you if your core is being attacked, so you can have a very sudden Game Over if you're not careful. This is very annoying, so set up some last-ditch defenses around your core in case an enemy makes it past the front line. If you do lose the core, the overall game isn't lost, you're just sent back to the launch screen with nothing to show for your time except slightly better skills.

The programming is nowhere near as slick as Factorio's. It's interesting watching their conveyor system, because it works, but it's really primitive in comparison. Factorio is, in a sense, about its conveyors, and Mindustry isn't as much. The poorer code quality makes good overall engineering sense, but it's still interesting seeing another implementation and how it doesn't quite measure up.

Liquids are similarly simplified, in that pipes are directional. However, they do one clever bit: if you leave a pipe uncapped, it leaks! Any attached tanks will steadily empty themselves into a big puddle on the ground. If an enemy blows up a pipe segment, which definitely happens, your storage will give you some leeway, but you're actively losing that buffer as it pours uselessly onto the ground. That pointed out to me how silly it is that Factorio's pipes *don't* leak. Mindustry's make more sense, even if liquids can only flow one way.

Anyway, I just finished a five-hour session, and realized that I really needed to mention this game in this thread, because it scratches the same itches. Factorio is way better as a builder, not least because you abandon your base every few hours in Mindustry, but the upstart is a much tenser game. Time flies by with this thing.

Lemme tell you, for six lousy dollars, you could do a LOT worse. A lot a lot. I'd call it a $20 game, but they've priced it to move.

Oh, one final thought: in Mindustry, always pause when you're thinking and when you're building. You can move the camera around freely and queue buildings anywhere on the map; your little robot will auto-build them very quickly when it gets close. Most of the time, don't build with the clock ticking, you're wasting daylight. This is tower defense, and time is limited.

If you're younger and faster than I am, you may not need the pause button as badly as I do.

My son and I played this around Christmas/New Years and had a blast playing some comp-stomp in Mindustry! Great little game for sure!

Just noticed it was on iOS as well. Not sure how the touch interface would feel, but tempted to double-dip.

Katherine of Sky, my favorite Factorio youtuber, has scheduled a 1.0 launch party and co-stream in 2 days and has been making new tutorial videos again. Super looking forward to it.

https://www.timeanddate.com/countdow...

KoS is the best.

She's got such positive energy.

Aaron D. wrote:

KoS is the best.

She's got such positive energy.

Indeed!

She's also how I stumbled on shapez.io, and I only found out later that you mentioned it in the games-without-threads catch-all.

Version 1.0 has been released. It's been a very long road, but even in early access, Factorio has been a more stable and complete game than many full releases. 1.0 doesn't represent the end, either, but what the future holds is still unclear.

Also they added a giant robot spider, so that's fun.

Its not every day some indies make/popularize a new genre but Factorio sure did. There are dozens of Factorio-likes now.

And despite the fact that every programmer loves this game, no AAA studio will likely touch the genre, maybe ever, because designers don't 'get it', and producers and executives don't play games (but they played Quake or Doom back in the day and their kids sure play games)

That trailer looks like a remake of their original with their all new high rez graphics. It looks great and tells the story of Factorio pretty darn well... except for the part where you're messing with belts for hours, and dreaming about problems with belt loops.

Yeah the trailer Mooquack posted was an updated version of the original trailer.

kovarex wrote:

Since the main Trailer is kind of timeless, we updated it to the 1.0 state of the game.

Here's the official 1.0 launch trailer:

Personally, I like the original one better

Edit: Wanted to add a big thank you to Mooquack for updating his Factorio calculator to 1.0

Oh man, that calculator is such an absolute beast of usefulness. Had no idea the author was here.

Wonderful work mooquack!

I've owned Factorio for a long time, and dabbled with it years ago. With 1.0 out I decided to fire it up. I'm definitely a newbie. I did the first several tutorial missions then jumped into sandbox, all default settings.

I’m glad enemy aggression is based on pollution because I’m pretty sure I play very slowly, so it takes me a while to generate pollution. At this point I’ve been playing for hours and only have had a couple small attacks. Early days, I’m enjoying building up my settlement so far.

Then, I think I’m missing something. I’ve got more researched - automobile, train, oil, plastics, concrete, but I don’t really have a use for it. I just keep my research humming along. I did recently research the black potion. As new things open up I research them, but I just haven’t seen the need to use them. I feel like I'm missing something. I still enjoy building my area so far and upgrading things as I get replacements - like faster manufacturing but I haven’t done much of substance for a while.

I keep playing and I can see my sprawling mish-mash of a base is going to get out of hand

I’ve got two radars going and it looks like they are uncovering more map. I’m guessing an oil deposit will be revealed at some point.

Holy crap I had no idea how huge the world is!

I took my car for a spin and kept uncovering more and more land. I still haven't found oil, which I need for plastic stuff - like modular armor. Anywho, I'm uncovering all sorts of enemies and they chase me for a while. My car isn't powerful enough to take out anything but a modest hive, so I'm avoiding confrontation. A large group starts chasing me and I crash into a lone rock and they surround me. I can't shoot them fast enough and they destroy my car. So, I drop a hand grenade, hoping it doesn't kill me. They all drop and I live. Then I had to hoof it back to base, avoiding hives. Made it.

I researched the black potions (now have red, green, black and light blue), but haven't built anything using it yet. I'm afraid what that is going to do to my existing research area. I've got all the things I need to construct the black potion, but doing it and delivering it to my research buildings is going to be problematic.

The game is cool and I've had a bunch of fun so far, but I think I'm about to get in over my head.

I've started a new game with 1.0

I've never managed to "win" the game, nor come close to building a "Megafactory", either.

So this time I'm following Katherine-of-Sky's Entry-to-Megafactory 3.0 Youtube series. I'm stopping myself from building beyond the latest video of her's I've watched (watched E5 last night). Learnt about the "Mall" concept and downloaded her blueprint to study. So while I could go further - about ready to start us serious red/green research - I want to see how she sets up her research array before building mine (as an example).

I'm determined to finish this time...

I am roughly planning to do something similar, albeit much more slowly due to time and toddler.

Are you using the same mods? I am skipping them for now because I would like to get the achievement for the rocket someday before I die.

Yes. I didn't bother with the todo model but did add "squeak through".

It's nuts to me to think I can't pass between factories or under/over pipes.

For better or worse, I just tore everything down - except my walls. My base was such a sprawling mess I decided to just redesign everything. I had conveyor belts doing all sorts of crazy things to try and distribute materials.

Should I be learning how to create and use blueprints? I haven’t even looked at them.

Blueprints and a bus are a huge help! Along with bots when you get there.

Another thing to keep in mind is that a lot of players use their first base to build their second, bigger, better base, and then use that base to build an even bigger, better base, etc.

A Rail World setting can help create some mid game 'tasks' as you start to run out of the initial resources and need to decide between extending your base REALLY far or setting up some remote bases with train stations. The setting adjusts resource locations to make them further apart but longer lasting, to encourage exploration and building outside your base.

Trains are maybe my favorite part of the game, a sort of zen feeling of accomplishing discrete bits of automation and upgrading the efficiency of train stations. I find Rail Worlds fun even on Peaceful mode.

My last big world was a rail world, with the Logistics Train Network (LTN) mod for auto-dispatching trains. Once you figure out how to wire the stations properly so they work with the mod, it saves you a lot of busywork. It works particularly well with the Whistlestop mod that scatters huge assemblers around the world that you can run trains to. The 'downside' is that if you have any signaling problems or imperfect rail setups, it will find them, usually by stacking a massive train pileup outside a depot.

Blueprints are pretty critical to keep you from going click-happy once you're starting to set up a dozen or so smelting arrays. I also like the nanobots mod to keep the busywork down.

Any idea whether I can add and turn on nanobots to an existing save? Cause I might not get to rockets without it at the rate I play.

I don't know for sure, but from what I've seen anything that doesn't modify the map is going to add just fine. Nanobots just adds a couple of items and recipes so ought to be safe.

Even if the mod changes the map it just means you won't see the changes on explored territory.