NBA Season 2015-2016

It's kind of a bummer that the old Warriors are effectively broken up in terms of their 10 man rotation. We'll see if the new team has as much chemistry.

I'm having trouble feeling sorry for OKC, writ large. Maybe the team will go back to Seattle and this will all just be a weird footnote.

GSW now just needs to pick up a DeAndre Jordan clone and the perfect team will be complete.

DSGamer wrote:

I'm having trouble feeling sorry for OKC, writ large. Maybe the team will go back to Seattle and this will all just be a weird footnote.

Don't feel sorry for OKC. OKC got to watch 8 years of Westbrook and Durant, the laurel and hardy of scoring buckets.
Take this move the team crap back with ya tho.

boogle wrote:
DSGamer wrote:

I'm having trouble feeling sorry for OKC, writ large. Maybe the team will go back to Seattle and this will all just be a weird footnote.

Don't feel sorry for OKC. OKC got to watch 8 years of Westbrook and Durant, the laurel and hardy of scoring buckets.
Take this move the team crap back with ya tho.

As a fan of the Blazers I will always miss the rivalry with the Sonics.

Oh, and as a Westbrook fan I'd be into this.

IMAGE(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-7k5rR4pC8ak/VSmOTryETiI/AAAAAAAAAEY/XCuGRzqhQ0Q/w506-h343/sonics.jpg)

But don't get me wrong, I'll root for him wherever he plays.

DSGamer wrote:

Oh, and as a Westbrook fan I'd be into this.

IMAGE(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-7k5rR4pC8ak/VSmOTryETiI/AAAAAAAAAEY/XCuGRzqhQ0Q/w506-h343/sonics.jpg)

But don't get me wrong, I'll root for him wherever he plays.

we spent the oil money fair and not square at all.
wait.

That will make them a more top heavy team.

Again on Durant, I'm genuinely disappointed in the signing. Disappointed because there's nobility in serving the same city through all of one's career, but that is outweighed by other factors in Durant's mind. He may win a few championships with Golden State, but those records will always come with an asterisk.

Nobility. Lol.

I don't get the expectations fans put on players. Teams cut and trade players all the time, when it is in their best interest. But the moment a player uses his leverage to change his place of employment, it's all about his loyalty.

And yeah, "Nobility." Whatever that means.

Top_Shelf wrote:

Nobility. Lol.

Sir Durant of house Oklahoma he will not be!

I'm warming to the move as I want to see what Westbrook can evolve into now that OKC is his.

Still preferred if Durant staked his own claim in the East to challenge Lebrons march to the finals every year. Looks like we will have to rely on Porzingis!

jowner wrote:

I'm warming to the move as I want to see what Westbrook can evolve into now that OKC is his.

I expect full Allen Iverson mode. Shots shots shots, terrible %, 30+ ppg. Maybe MVP candidate on a team that barely makes the playoffs (6-8 spot).

jowner wrote:

I'm warming to the move as I want to see what Westbrook can evolve into now that OKC is his.

This combined with how Adams and Kanter did in the playoffs.
I have a small amount of trust in Presti.

jowner wrote:
Top_Shelf wrote:

Nobility. Lol.

Sir Durant of house Oklahoma he will not be!

I'm warming to the move as I want to see what Westbrook can evolve into now that OKC is his.

Still preferred if Durant staked his own claim in the East to challenge Lebrons march to the finals every year. Looks like we will have to rely on Porzingis!

Ugh, I meant "nobleness."

I knew what you meant.

Nothing noble in doing anything but what works for you/your fam.

Hrm. Maybe I should stay at Company X BC they've employed me all these years. Haha. Nope.

That's strawmam. A basketball player, prominent figureand, multi millionaire is not comparable to the average salaryman.

Of course it is noble to abandon the lure of an easy championship to continue your service for the local community, just like it's noble to provide volunteer service and help out others without expecting a reward.

I know it's his choice. He can do what he wants, just like you can spend your free time not helping others. I, in the mean time, can be disappointed that he doesn't value commitment to a city as much as winning, and that you're not donating food to the starving children. Like, WTF man? Have you seen the pictures?

Commitment to a city? Which city? The city that drafted him or the one that hijacked the team? He's from Texas. He summers in LA. At this point where Durant truly feels at home is really only known to him. Who he feels loyalty to is really only up to him. I would respect the accomplishment more if he lifted up OKC, but that's just because it's harder.

These narratives about loyalty to fans and a community are tired and old fashioned. Fans would do well to distance themselves from that level of emotion and investment, IMO.

The city only commits to a basketball player when the basketball player can give the city something. If Durant wasn't an All Star, the OKC fans would have discarded him long ago.

I mean he's in the Oklahoma hall of fame.

boogle wrote:

I mean he's in the Oklahoma hall of fame.

....

IMAGE(http://memesvault.com/wp-content/uploads/Laugh-Out-Loud-Gif-15.gif)

I find the backlash more and more intolerable the more I hear about it. I can understand fans of the team being disappointed. People that have been cheering for OKC since the team moved there, or since 2012, or whatever. But fans of everyone else? Can it. Guys are allowed to leave the team that drafts them. Think his legacy will be tarnished? Eh. I don't care to amass a list of guys who are considered all time greats despite doing something similar, but it exists.

I like Charles Barkley, generally. But he can go f*ck himself with this talk that stars are "cheating" for championships by teaming up, that he's disappointed with KD. He has apparently forgotten how he joined a great Phoenix team in 92, then joined the back to back champs in Houston after striking out in PHX. If that isn't ring chasing...

Not only did he go to Houston, but that Houston team had Clyde Drexler and Hakeem Olajuwon!

fangblackbone wrote:

Not only did he go to Houston, but that Houston team had Clyde Drexler and Hakeem Olajuwon!

It's also weird that guys are dinged for chasing rings as opposed to just cashing checks (see Joe Johnson in Utah).

DSGamer wrote:

Commitment to a city? Which city? The city that drafted him or the one that hijacked the team? He's from Texas. He summers in LA. At this point where Durant truly feels at home is really only known to him. Who he feels loyalty to is really only up to him. I would respect the accomplishment more if he lifted up OKC, but that's just because it's harder.

These narratives about loyalty to fans and a community are tired and old fashioned. Fans would do well to distance themselves from that level of emotion and investment, IMO.

I thought hard about putting in a lot of grandstanding-ish arguments here but this response is better: I like romance in sports and I like players to try to be good guys, be right by their team and community, be "old fashioned," if you will. Taking all that away and evaluating these events from a purely money ball standpoint takes the romance away, and that's no fun.

Durant made the choice, I'm sure, after some serious thoughts. He's smart and ably assisted by experienced advisers, so this choice is probably the right one for him. I'm not going to start an angry mob or lead a jersey burning party. Just disappointed that his values are so conventional.

What do you say about Dwyane Wade? A guy who showed a massive amount of loyalty and left money on the table (a total of 25m apparently) on his last 2-3 contracts with the Heat. Came around and asked to be compensated fairly and they professed that he's too old to be worth it. Now he's signed with the Bulls.

Vector wrote:

What do you say about Dwyane Wade? A guy who showed a massive amount of loyalty and left money on the table (a total of 25m apparently) on his last 2-3 contracts with the Heat. Came around and asked to be compensated fairly and they professed that he's too old to be worth it. Now he's signed with the Bulls.

This is the best counter. Kobe's last two seasons (boring and a bit of a disgrace competitively) are also good examples of loyalty gone wrong.

Thirteenth wrote:

I thought hard about putting in a lot of grandstanding-ish arguments here but this response is better: I like romance in sports and I like players to try to be good guys, be right by their team and community, be "old fashioned," if you will. Taking all that away and evaluating these events from a purely money ball standpoint takes the romance away, and that's no fun.

Don't get me wrong, I want to believe in those romantic notions of loyalty to a community, "growing up" in the community, etc. But as someone who lived in a small market forever I have long been disabused of any notion that players who grew up around the country (or world) have a specific attachment to a place like Portland or Milwaukee. Some may fall in love and feel loyalty, but I wouldn't expect it.

DSGamer wrote:
boogle wrote:

I mean he's in the Oklahoma hall of fame.

....

IMAGE(http://memesvault.com/wp-content/uploads/Laugh-Out-Loud-Gif-15.gif)

Not a joke, I think Russ is in there too.
Oklahoma City really loves the thunder (WHO WOULD HAVE GUESSED).

DSGamer wrote:
Vector wrote:

What do you say about Dwyane Wade? A guy who showed a massive amount of loyalty and left money on the table (a total of 25m apparently) on his last 2-3 contracts with the Heat. Came around and asked to be compensated fairly and they professed that he's too old to be worth it. Now he's signed with the Bulls.

This is the best counter. Kobe's last two seasons (boring and a bit of a disgrace competitively) are also good examples of loyalty gone wrong.

Is the exchange less money now for more money later or is it less money now for rings?
Feel like Riley would say the latter and DW the former.

Vector wrote:

What do you say about Dwyane Wade? A guy who showed a massive amount of loyalty and left money on the table (a total of 25m apparently) on his last 2-3 contracts with the Heat. Came around and asked to be compensated fairly and they professed that he's too old to be worth it. Now he's signed with the Bulls.

I say that the Heat did him wrong, and they're the "bad guys" in this story. Many fans' feelings were hurt as well, just going by what I've read so far. That's, of course, alongside comments from the more coldblooded fans who are only thinking about future success.

To Wade's example, I'd counter with Tim Duncan and the Spurs. Has there ever been any doubt, since Duncan chose to stay with the Spurs however many years ago, that he would retire in San Antonio? Was there any instance when Spurs management threatened to rock the boat by dragging contract talk with Duncan into the ground? Not that I recall. San Antonio is similar to OKC in a lot of ways. It's the only major league team in a small market with a strong and dedicated fan base. I'd argue if one is going to gauge the final outcome had Durant chose to stay, Duncan and the Spurs are the better predictor.

DS, Kobe's last years were kind of an eyesore, and I remember you're not a big fan of his last game. It's a great story though, possible because the Lakers management showed appreciation to their aging star. Even when he could no longer carry the team, I don't recall too many Lakers fans calling for him to be traded, early retirement at most.

Kobe sticking with the Lakers is exactly what killed the Lakers.

Thirteenth wrote:

DS, Kobe's last years were kind of an eyesore, and I remember you're not a big fan of his last game.

Yes. And that's being generous. I felt like that game was everything wrong with the late 90s / early 00s NBA in a nutshell.

Thirteenth wrote:

It's a great story though, possible because the Lakers management showed appreciation to their aging star. Even when he could no longer carry the team, I don't recall too many Lakers fans calling for him to be traded, early retirement at most.

I largely agree with this, actually. I'm all for rewarding players for their long service. My issue with Kobe's last two years was that they didn't really try to compete. It felt like a simultaneous tank job / Kobe long service award. I can get with the long service award, but not the tank job.

And all of this conversation is in the context of "ring chasing". I think it would have been more fun to watch Kobe Bryant coming off the bench or starting for a playoff team. Paul Pierce had a much more interesting end of career. Even with only 1 ring.

Jayhawker wrote:

Kobe sticking with the Lakers is exactly what killed the Lakers.

Kobe killed the Lakers by playing a disproportionately large role when he should be relegated to a smaller role in his later years like DS is saying. I'm not a fan of that either. As much as I appreciate him and the team staying together, his ego and the management's willingness to defer to his ego hurt the team. But I don't think this example should be an argument for parting ways, if that's what you're getting at. As with all relationships, we want the ones between players and teams to be healthy, with fair dealings and good faith etc. They could've managed better.