XCOM 2 Catch-All

Character pool updated. Sorry for the delay, I was waiting on someone to get their character to me but they haven't sent it yet.

Added:
badken
Roughneck Geek

Updated:
Maq

https://github.com/markbrereton/gwj-...

Thanks, Maq! I've been looking to update my pool for an Ironman run.

The pool browser really needs "next/previous" navigation.

It appears bluescreen rounds do extra damage to Chosen sarcophagi. Good to know.

It is - my last Chosen mission involved my crew running around like their hair was on fire (Commander difficulty) so any little bit helps!

Presumably that also means EMP grenades would work too?

I had two oddities crop up in the last couple of sessions, both on missions, that pretty much made it impossible to win.

The first was a "get to device and protect it" type mission, except the SitRep to start was that I had satellite coverage, so all of the aliens would be revealed. Sounds great, right? I started the mission and sure enough, all of the alien pods all over the map were visible, with surrounding detection grids. I figured this would be fantastic - I can just work my way through the map and try to get where I'm going without triggering most of the enemies along the way. Great! Except for some reason, not only were the enemies revealed, several of the pods on the other side of the map were also immediately activated. Which meant that after Turn 1, a bunch of aliens ran over to the thing I was trying to protect and started shooting it. By the time I got there, it was surrounded by a dozen or so enemies all blasting away. They immediately turned their attention to me and the odds were overwhelming.

The second was a mission where I had to get to an alien device and download some data before it self-destructed. Nothing but Lost and I had 9 turns to get there, which should have been no problem. Except the device I was trying to hack was put in a truck that was on fire. So it exploded on Turn 3 and destroyed the device, failing the mission. There was literally no way I could get there in time.

And this is why I don't play Ironman.

This game needs rocket jumping.

Wasn't feeling Destiny 2. Traded it in yesterday for the base game and a chunk of psn credit towards WotC. Fired up that version, a few hours in and no regrets on the trade. Few graphical glitches on PS4 but knew that was a possibility and not spoiling enjoyment so far.

I've no idea how that double posted with one tap...

Bubblefuzz wrote:

I've no idea how that double posted with one tap...

Vibrating fingers?

Localgod54 wrote:
Bubblefuzz wrote:

I've no idea how that double posted with one tap...

Vibrating fingers?

A hit with the ladies?

Wink_and_the_Gun wrote:
Localgod54 wrote:
Bubblefuzz wrote:

I've no idea how that double posted with one tap...

Vibrating fingers?

A hit with the ladies? :P

I sent that message and was like, ...ooohhhh. Ah well, I hit send.

New page, new posters!

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I'm sure there's a post in this thread about it but I can't find a decent use for Skirmishers. Reapers I love, Templars are situationally useful, but in most cases I'd rather take a ranger than a Skirmisher.

LarryC wrote:

It's Skirmishers that can leave some players puzzled because they don't occupy a obvious niche that wasn't already occupied by the base classes. For me, Mox was my Specialist/Ranger. Equipped with a lucky Advanced Stock early on, he was 2 attacks of 2 assured damage every turn - like having unlimited Combat Protocol. Marauder also allows shoot-and-reposition shenanigans. The two-attacks per round are held back because they're lower damage than an Assault Rifle, but you can really play around with that stuff not only with Stocks but with Viper Rounds and Dragon Rounds. His Combat Presence is a worthy Captain skill against Retribution. Retribution allows you to lock down a ranged enemy Ranger style, but Combat Presence allows him to boost any squadmate with an extra action! Rapid Fire + Chain Shot for the win.

Skirmishers to me feel like what the combat-focused Specialist should have been, with a side of Ranger.

That's the best explanation I've seen yet, Maq.

I like using Skirmishers (and Templars, once I get the right ability) to drag powerful enemies out of cover. My last two Chosen fights I've used my first action to drag them out into a completely open position where I can then unload on them with everything I've got.

Kid Charlemagne wrote:

I like using Skirmishers (and Templars, once I get the right ability) to drag powerful enemies out of cover. My last two Chosen fights I've used my first action to drag them out into a completely open position where I can then unload on them with everything I've got.

That's a pretty good use of Justice right there.

WOTC is 30% off on GMG today only.

Umm as for Skirmishers. Combat Presence is amazing when used on a Ranger - Reaper around the battlefield, drop a Dead Eye then follow up with Rapid Fire. The Skirmisher's Ionic melee weapon is 100% stun if it hits. Two-turn stun from what I've seen on Veteran mode - once he gets the equivalent of Bladestorm you can run him into the middle of a pod and laugh at triggered damage and stun. For pure DPS, you have whiplash, Wrath, plus the extra action. He's never going to be as awesome at DPS as a tricked out Ranger/Grenadier/Sharpshooter/Specialist but he'll plug the gaps in your squad's deficiencies.

Boudreaux wrote:

[snip...] And this is why I don't play Ironman.

Amen. Which is why I wish that there was a solid Bronzeman option. Successful mission? Save. For safety reasons, it keeps one prior save or every other mission as a backup (whatevs Firaxis thinks would work). Admittedly, and if it reliably worked, I'd pay five bucks just for that. Heck, I'd be inclined to pay way more but... 'principles'. Hrm, wasn't it a second wave option in the last XCOM after an expansion? Maybe LW1...

Localgod54 wrote:
LarryC wrote:

It's Skirmishers that can leave some players puzzled because they don't occupy a obvious niche that wasn't already occupied by the base classes. For me, Mox was my Specialist/Ranger. Equipped with a lucky Advanced Stock early on, he was 2 attacks of 2 assured damage every turn - like having unlimited Combat Protocol. Marauder also allows shoot-and-reposition shenanigans. The two-attacks per round are held back because they're lower damage than an Assault Rifle, but you can really play around with that stuff not only with Stocks but with Viper Rounds and Dragon Rounds. His Combat Presence is a worthy Captain skill against Retribution. Retribution allows you to lock down a ranged enemy Ranger style, but Combat Presence allows him to boost any squadmate with an extra action! Rapid Fire + Chain Shot for the win.

Skirmishers to me feel like what the combat-focused Specialist should have been, with a side of Ranger.

That's the best explanation I've seen yet, Maq.

Yeah, Stocks, Repeaters, Dragon rounds and Retribution is how I use them. Justice has too low a success rate and at the kind of range I can justify using it I'd rather flank with a Ranger or Templar and pop an extra move to get them back out of trouble. I mean I'll use them if better troops are unavailable but they never make the A or even the B team.

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It can be hard to figure out how to use the Skirmisher. I won't claim to have deep insight into it or anything, but I do find the Skirmisher a useful unit to have around. First off, stocks go on the Skirmisher ASAP. This is because Mox has Marauder, which means two instances of guaranteed damage every round. But the key to using this advantage is to NOT move Mox around very much. Maximizing the Skirmisher revolves around maximizing his action mechanic and his melee support abilities.

The key to Mox is that he's supposed to put damage where you need it when you need it. That's what Combat Presence is for. If only one soldier has the damage or the gun you need to keep things under control, Mox can make that happen. Or he can yank the enemy in range and out of cover, allowing you to concentrate damage right there. Combat Presence isn't just for stacking damage using Rapid Fire + Chain Shot. It can function as a squad-wide Run and Gun, allowing his allies to move their full movement and then attack. It can keep Serial or Death from Above going. It can get a squadmate out from certain death. Aside from Marauder, I consider Combat Presence one of the Skirmisher's key powers.

Combat Presence is duplicated in PsiOps (who have greater overall utility) and via the Bonds system. I never hurt for extra actions without a Skirmisher.
Stocks are handy but I can get the effect of guaranteed extra damage with anyone. A Reaper is much more useful at finishing off wounded enemies as she can stay in cover while doing it at a relatively low level.
Justice is a handy skill when you hit with it but the success rate is so low I can't rely on it when it's actually really useful. If I wanted to expose a tough enemy to my entire squad I'd rather just pop their cover with a grenade and take the shots at them in the open – that way I don't have to risk having them behind my lines if I can't drop them in one turn.
Whiplash is nice against robotics but I almost always have someone loaded with Bluescreen rounds. Besides which the Ability point system makes running a Specialist with both Revival and Haywire protocols trivial so your combat hacker is also a medic. Couple that with the multiple options to increase the Hack stat via Covert Ops and dealing with robotic units is no problem at all.

Basically I find skirmishers to be okay at a lot of stuff but they never really give me something I don't have elsewhere, unlike Templars and especially Reapers.

Agreed with Maq. In my modded 10-unit squad, there's no room for a Skirmisher.

Boudreaux wrote:

The second was a mission where I had to get to an alien device and download some data before it self-destructed. Nothing but Lost and I had 9 turns to get there, which should have been no problem. Except the device I was trying to hack was put in a truck that was on fire. So it exploded on Turn 3 and destroyed the device, failing the mission. There was literally no way I could get there in time.

I had this exact one, too. For me, though, it's part of what makes Ironman great... very Kobayashi Maru.

Combat Presence is Inspire, but with a two-turn timer that can be reduced once per mission to 1 using Manual Override. It's basically at least twice as powerful. You don't have to use a Skirmisher, or a PsiOperative or a Reaper, even. Comparatively speaking, a Reaper has less firepower than a Skirmisher. She's useful at scouting, but I contend that a Skirmisher is much more efficient at finishing off enemies. Marauder ensures he can finish off at least two weakened enemies in one turn, possibly three with Whiplash.

I will agree that Skirmishers do not expand the game the way Templar and Reapers do. And I don't really care that much whether anyone uses a Skirmisher or not. Everyone plays the way they prefer. But it is also true that I've found them quite useful as a unit.

For that matter, Reapers are very, very convenient, but it's not like you couldn't scout before with Rangers and Scouting Protocol. Those things weren't very sexy but they did get the job done. And with the Ability Point system, you could easily get a Specialist that's a Field Medic but with Scouting Protocol.

ChristopherOdd has the same complaint about Skirmishers, and I notice that he never really takes advantage of Marauder. Perhaps you're doing the same thing? Marauder allows you to get two attacks per turn, and it has no cooldown. All you need is to position your Skirmisher aggressively enough that he doesn't need to move once the action starts. Or has sight of a ledge he can use to get somewhere advantageous with a free action. Unlimited two attacks per turn is very strong. In addition, he can also attack, and THEN Combat Presence to give away an attack action. Inspire ends the Psionic's turn, as does an attack. Basically, Skirmishers give you a lot more attack actions. If you think Rapid Fire is good, then you must appreciate the power of all these extra attacks.

Rapid fire uses big guns. The bullpup isn't all that. Plus if you're just perching Mox on a ledge somewhere to lay down fire you're giving up the Marauder advantage. I'm sure some folk find a use for them, it's just in my squad of 6 I'm going to want a Grenadier, Ranger, Sniper, Specialist, Reaper, and PsyOp in pretty much most cases I can field them. Skirmisher fits in as a substitute okay but I'm not giving up any of those 6 for one.

Aretz wrote:
Boudreaux wrote:

The second was a mission where I had to get to an alien device and download some data before it self-destructed. Nothing but Lost and I had 9 turns to get there, which should have been no problem. Except the device I was trying to hack was put in a truck that was on fire. So it exploded on Turn 3 and destroyed the device, failing the mission. There was literally no way I could get there in time.

I had this exact one, too. For me, though, it's part of what makes Ironman great... very Kobayashi Maru.

It's not autofailing the mission, it's the disappointed scolding I get from Backlit Baldguy after the fact that gets me. If it gave me the option to tell him to $#@% right off, maybe I could deal with it. Alas.

His grapple hook is a free action, so you don't give up Marauder to get up to a nice position if you do it that way. The Ranger is the only class with Rapid Fire as standard. It's a close up ability, in general, and you can waste the damage if you need damage in two places or if it's just too great. And it's got a cool down. And it lowers hit percentage.

I don't field a standard squad because I feel like it makes the game a little too rote from mission to mission. Sometimes I use a Reaper. Sometimes I use a Phantom Ranger and Scouting Protocol. Sometimes I field two Grenadiers. Sometimes I field two Snipers. They're not all the same anyways. One of my Snipers has Rapid Fire. She's extremely deadly. So I use the Skirmisher sometimes. Sometimes the Reaper. Sometimes the Templar. It's all good.

You can do a lot of attack action shenanigans with Teamwork. Provided you're not moving a squaddie, you can attack, then Teamwork an extra attack action in, and still attack with the other unit. That's better than Rapid Fire because it doesn't take away to-hit, and you can distribute the damage around if you like. Combat Presence is like that except you can use it on anyone and you can use it again and again. It's nothing like Inspire. To even think they're in the same ballpark is a mistake.

Offhand, I'd say that a Skirmisher should have about the same overall damage output as a melee Ranger, usually more and usually in better places.

Sure I'll mix up my squad all the time. I just won't mix it up with a Skirmisher in there

Mox is amazing if you consider he can stun 2 units in a round plus grant a free action to someone with more damage outout or critical positioning AND whiplash an enemy (Wrath > Combat Protocol/Whiplash > Justice). Battlelord on clearing your first pod means you can squeeze two uses of Kill Zone and any other long cooldown every mission. Plus he will have Bladestorm which increases his value wherever the Lost appears, or a reinforcement flare is in movement range, or just parking him adjacent to something that won't be dead that round which you need a little extra damage or the stun on. Consider also the benefit of Combat Protocol when dealing with Alien Rulers.

He cannot be played like a standard squaddie to get the best out of his abilities.