NFL 2015: Offseason: DeflateGate

Paleocon wrote:

I am in Vermont for the week for work and the feeling around here is a mix between folks who feel victimized by Goodell and folk who are sincerely disappointed in Brady. Lots are finding it impossible to escape the conclusion that he straight up lied to the league, his coach, and his fans. There is a bit of confusion with what all this means but the feeling of profound disappointment is unmistakable. It is like they are in mourning.

Nah, they're all just super stoned.

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Ouch

Lol at the idea that Bountygate was worse than cheating..since in the end deflating the football is cheating..by an organization that cheated before. One highlighted the very real day to day aspect of the actual game played pretty much the same way by all teams..a violent sport where if you can you try and take the opposing player out of the game. The other was about the integrity of competition. But I'm not surprised from a fan base that still thinks spygate wasn't a big deal. Even though it was shown that the Organization did this routinely. The frustration was that the penalty back then was a joke. Doubly frustrating when you watch the Eagles/Pats SB and at the start of the 2nd half the Patriots look like they know exactly what the Eagles are calling and now you know why.

And there it is. The "I'm bitter because of 10 years ago so that makes air pressure a bigger deal than a bounty on personal injury" defense.

Dude seriously, you need to put it to rest. The Eagles lost, they haven't been back and it looks like chip kelly is doing his best to keep them from ever going back. No penalty on the pats is going to change that or make you feel better about that super bowl so long ago.

Anyway, I listened to that wells interview and it's pretty clear that the pats are spinning words left and right. Seems like that guy tried his best and the shady shadsters got in his way and then spun to the media that they were "fully cooperating"

The whole thing is gross. I agree with the assessment that if the NFL isn't careful they risk what happened to the nhl and nba where the drama begins to overtake the actual sport and fans start bailing. You can even draw a parallel to what happened to professional boxing. Fans lost faith in the integrity and now look at it.

I am all for the iron fist punishment. I just hope its consistent. It hasn't been over the past few years

And there it is. The "I'm bitter because of 10 years ago so that makes air pressure a bigger deal than a bounty on personal injury" defense.

Dude seriously, you need to put it to rest. The Eagles lost, they haven't been back and it looks like chip kelly is doing his best to keep them from ever going back. No penalty on the pats is going to change that or make you feel better about that super bowl so long ago.

Well I'm unable to go into it any great detail but at the time of Spygate we owned the company that supplied the NFL teams with the technology at the heart of Spygate.. we were heavily involved with a certain politicians attempt to get answers from the NFL.. and some of the key people on my side were ex-Sports Executives.. So it was very personal for us as Eagles fans.

Suffice to say that we were pushing hard for stripping the Patriots of all their Super Bowl Victories...but the NFL was never going to allow that to happen so they did their best to sweep the whole thing under the rug.

Ironic since they "probably" would have won those games..but you just never know if their cheating was enough of an advantage to insure they would.. it sure seemed like it helped against the Eagles and the Rams.

Edit

One thing I'm confused about is if the Patriots are complaining that they did nothing wrong why did the club suspended indefinitely the two low ranking staffers without pay? Nothing like proclaiming your innocence and then sh*t canning the two saps who acted under Brady's direction. Classy.

These threads work way better if you stay objective. Irrational solutions like "strip all thier Super Bowls away" may fuel your fiery ball of hate in a way that makes you feel better but they don't hold any place in a real thoughtful conversation about it. This is similiar to stating that deflate gate is a worse offense than the bounty system. One is an illegal advantage which may or may not affect the game, the other is a reward for hurting people. It's not even in the same ballpark. You are just letting a deep seated hatred affect the words that are coming out of you.

Edit:

They are being shady and spinning words in a way that contradicts themselves. They did the same thing when they said "we are cooperating fully" yet didn't allow wells to re interview they equipment guy after he got the "deflator" text message. The way the pats are handling this is every bit as sh*tty as the actual infraction if not more so.

I am a passionate pats fan but objectively this whole situation is super gross. I am extremely disappointed in the team I like, but I am not rising up in defense just because they are my team and I'm passionate about it. Being reasonable is how conversations happen.

Cobble wrote:

These threads work way better if you stay objective. Irrational solutions like "strip all thier Super Bowls away" may fuel your fiery ball of hate in a way that makes you feel better but they don't hold any place in a real thoughtful conversation about it. This is similiar to stating that deflate gate is a worse offense than the bounty system. One is an illegal advantage which may or may not affect the game, the other is a reward for hurting people. It's not even in the same ballpark. You are just letting a deep seated hatred affect the words that are coming out of you.

And you're being defensive to the point you aren't reading what he's saying. Guru isn't saying they should strip NE of their Super Bowls, he's saying the company he works for TRIED to get that to happen during the taping scandal since they supplied the tech to help their preferred team lose.

He uses the word "we" which implies he was on board so my response was very much on point.

Regardless, time to move on.

Yes, I know he said "we". That isn't my point. "They" wanted to have the Super Bowl wins stripped back then because the Pats got caught cheating. I'm not seeing anyone around here argue they should strip them of this past Super Bowl win because of the deflated balls. Maybe that is what Guru was intimating but I definitely didn't feel that is what he was saying and don't recall him saying that earlier though he may have.

Back during the taping scandal it wasn't an entirely irrational thing to want the Super Bowls stripped. The only irrational thing about it is that the Patriots got caught a year and a half after the Super Bowl and we'll never know what the tapes had on them, so we'll never know which teams and games were tampered with and which weren't. Without a smoking gun for a Super Bowl win it's irrational to think the NFL would ever strip a Super Bowl win from a team. They can't hurt their bottom line, right? Don't want to drop the Super Bowl ratings down. Nope, no sir. So, yeah, that bit is irrational, but from their perspective they know that they had been supplying the tech for their own team to be cheated on with.

Cobble wrote:

Regardless, time to move on. :)

Oh believe me, I want to move on. Kind of hard to do that when calm, reasonable discussions involve such things as "it looks like chip kelly is doing his best to keep them from ever going back". Cause that jab is gonna make someone realize they're being silly.

This is similiar to stating that deflate gate is a worse offense than the bounty system. One is an illegal advantage which may or may not affect the game, the other is a reward for hurting people. It's not even in the same ballpark.

You're right, not in the same ballpark. One is cheating, the other is morally wrong. Trying to compare the two is an effort in futility.

Go Fund Me Aims To Pay Patriots’ Deflategate Bill

DETROIT (CBS Detroit) Poor Tom Brady. With a superstar sports career, a net worth of barely $120 million, a Brazilian supermodel wife, and a few cute kids, the University of Michigan grad really has it rough.

Thank God for the Internet.

Brady’s fans have stepped in with a gofundme.com attempt to raise money to pay the fine the Boston Patriots incurred after Brady allegedly deflated footballs to gain an edge over his opponents. Brady was suspended four games by the NFL, the team was fined $1 million and lost two draft picks.

To help defray the fine for the team, estimated to be worth $2.6 billion, an ardent fan started a go fund me account asking people to contribute their own money to pay it on the Patriots’ behalf.
So far, they’ve raised $13, 317.

Is this real life? They have 972 donations so far.

Oh sports, how you bring out the best in people

Yes I took a jab, why not. It's what people do here. And at least it's only at the Eagles and not at a team that actually matters.......

Is fund me like kickstarter where the money goes back if they don't reach their goal? Is the guy obligated to use the money on what he says even if the pats refuse it (which I'm sure they would have to, legally)

People are weird

Now, deese are some adorable Patriot fans...

Patriots Fans Arrested At NFL Headquarters After Protesting Brady Suspension

On Tuesday, New England Patriots fans gathered at NFL headquarters in Manhattan to protest the league’s punishment of quarterback Tom Brady and the organization for their roles in the “deflategate” scandal. The protesters sought unsuccessfully to get an audience with league Commissioner Roger Goodell.
Protesters staged a sit-in inside 345 Park Avenue, handcuffing themselves, while others circled in front of the building with pro-Patriots signs. During a live stream of the action on the Periscope app, the protesters could be heard saying they were prepared to be arrested.

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The fine is a joke. The only way you make a fine meaningful is if it is attached to a cap reduction.

People should stop using words like "haters" so much. I don't hate the Patriots. I dislike cheating and think it should be punished and discouraged. Whether it's filming practices or deflating footballs.

Jayhawker wrote:

Now, deese are some adorable Patriot fans...

Patriots Fans Arrested At NFL Headquarters After Protesting Brady Suspension

On Tuesday, New England Patriots fans gathered at NFL headquarters in Manhattan to protest the league’s punishment of quarterback Tom Brady and the organization for their roles in the “deflategate” scandal. The protesters sought unsuccessfully to get an audience with league Commissioner Roger Goodell.

Truly something worth getting arrested over.

What it feels like to a be a Patriots fan these days:

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DSGamer wrote:

People should stop using words like "haters" so much. I don't hate the Patriots. I dislike cheating and think it should be punished and discouraged. Whether it's filming practices or deflating footballs.

You just hate Lance Armstrong because he can't unscrew Sheryl Crowe.

Paleocon wrote:
DSGamer wrote:

People should stop using words like "haters" so much. I don't hate the Patriots. I dislike cheating and think it should be punished and discouraged. Whether it's filming practices or deflating footballs.

You just hate Lance Armstrong because he can't unscrew Sheryl Crowe.

Not true. In that case I'm bitter. Or "butthurt". One of those words overused to shout down people who dislike cheating and people getting away with cheating.

I think the word you guys are looking for is "jealous."

Jayhawker wrote:

I think the word you guys are looking for is "jealous."

True. I'm "jelly".

DSGamer wrote:
Jayhawker wrote:

I think the word you guys are looking for is "jealous."

True. I'm "jelly".

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Leave the Patriots alone!

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Jayhawker wrote:

Leave the Patriots alone!

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I am sure Lance feels exactly the same way.

garion333 wrote:

I'm not seeing anyone around here argue they should strip them of this past Super Bowl win because of the deflated balls.

I didn't say it, but I would definitely support it. Think of it this way...

If a team was given a nefarious offer by the Devil: $1mil, plus first round pick, plus second round pick next year, plus suspended QB for 4 games, for a SB appearance. How many teams would take the offer? If that's the price you pay for ensuring you're in the SB, what's to prevent all the other teams for wanting in on that deal? In other words, what's to stop other teams from starting to more blatantly cheat their way into SB, if that's the price they pay?

IM(not so)HO, I think that if you're caught cheating your way to the top, you should be stripped of any titles that may have resulted directly or indirectly from that cheating. No exceptions. No excuses. Just like Lance Armstrong got stripped of ALL his titles. Not just the ones that he got caught cheating for. Now I wouldn't advocate stripping an NFL team of all their previous titles, but the one that they were caught cheating for? Absolutely. Make it so that no price is worth the cheating. That's the only thing that stops people from cheating (most of the time).

Holding is cheating too. Possibly we should take championships away from every team who held without getting caught and penalized by the refs.

I think that unfairly puts a level of accountability on an organization as large as an NFL team that is simply impossible to meet. They'd have to account for a water boy stealing signs or a coach walking on the field and tripping a player. Oh ... wait....

At the end of the day Lance was still riding that cycle alone* while there are players on a football team who don't even touch a ball. Granted that teammate still benefits from the deflated ball in a more general sense, but taking a Super Bowl away because Brady wanted his balls shrunk a little is a bit excessive.

Lance had his titles stripped and people still cheat. Constantly. No penalty will ever stop cheating.

[size=7]*Yes, yes, as a part of a team, I get that but not in the same way as football. I'm sure a cycling fan will show me I'm wrong.[/size]

EvilDead wrote:

I wonder if there is a modern era football team that has won a championship that hasn't had at least one player being busted for Steroids during the season.

That's where I was headed next. The worst kind of cheating since it's directly related to not just performance, but also the rates of head injuries and other things more serious than winning.

I wonder if there is a modern era football team, that has won a championship, that hasn't had at least one player being busted for PEDs* during the season.

You could probably even take the middle part of that sentence out.

*or Adderall :LOL:

Dammit, you got me before my grammar edit!