Marvel Media (This is the spoiler thread, Q-Stone - You're welcome)

Hard to launch a streaming service without content and getting a bunch of shows with established "stars" and fanbase for essentially zero makes sense.

My prediction....those shows are gone. Which is sad. You won't seem them on the Disney streaming service.

But...you'll see new Marvel shows on the streaming service.

Allegedly there'll be Captain Marvel and Avengers 4 trailers this week

Tanglebones wrote:

Allegedly there'll be Captain Marvel and Avengers 4 trailers this week

The former tonight during Monday Night Football.

And the latter Wednesday morning on GMA.

I wonder if the Avengers one is just going to be a teaser.

Hm, one trailer on ESPN, the other on ABC. There's got to be a connection somewhere...

I do think the Netflix Marvel shows are done .. you may see some of the characters again but not in the same form.

astralplaydoh wrote:

My prediction....those shows are gone. Which is sad. You won't seem them on the Disney streaming service.

But...you'll see new Marvel shows on the streaming service.

They've announced Marvel shows. Specifically named already is Vision and Scarlet Witch. Talk has been made around a Falcon/Winter Soldier team up and a Loki show.

In the announcements on the cancelation of the Netflix shows, they've repeatedly said that the characters will continue on in other places, so while I agree with you that you won't have season 4 of Daredevil called "Daredevil: Season 4", I suspect they may even bring the same characters back in some of the other shows, or combined into new shows with other characters they've been building in universe.

People keep talking about Blade, and even Wesley Snipes wants to do it (shocking I know, he's been so busy that I don't know where he can work it in post prison...). Then Ghost Rider has had a version on Shield they could probably put on Disney+ if they found the right stories. They've got tons of possibilities it seems.

My concern will be if stuff goes to Disney+, we won't get the more adult versions Netflix gave us. We'll get more of the ABC versions.

I've really hated the extended universe stuff. Too many times we are staring at Netflix and wondering if we can start Z show without watching Y show, only to realize that we really need to watch X show before that. Now watching Z show means watching two other shows we are less interested in.

Big picture, it's better to just ignore the marketing BS and realize the shows largely work on their own. But in reality, the extended universe has been a drag on watching more Marvel shows, when we can just bounce to something else that isn't trying to exploit the nerd culture of completism to rope more hours of viewership out of a property than it needs or deserves.

The result is that we pretty much stopped watching Marvel stuff on Netflix, and we liked the shows we've watched. But that extra lair of complication when deciding what to watch drove us back to series that do not rely on extended universes to market themselves. We sure as hell are not subscribing to DC's new service, and won't sign up for a Marvel one, either.

Not read much with Shang-Chi in it, but looking forward to what Marvel does with this if they keep with Asian and Asian-American folks running that movie.

Marvel's Next Big Screen Superhero Is Shang-Chi:

According to Deadline, Marvel has brought Wonder Woman 1984 and Into the Spider-Verse 2 writer Dave Callaham on to pen Shang-Chi’s script and the studio is actively looking for Asian and Asian-American directors to helm the film.

I'm the opposite. I love that all this stuff is in the same world. I understand that the stories stand alone pretty well, but have nice nods and crossovers that pay off for those of us that are invested.

It's hard to argue with the success of the MCU, as everybody else is trying to mimic it. However, so far nobody's really pulled it off.

IMAGE(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a2/The_Mummy_%282017%29.jpg)

The big difference is that the MCU flagship product, the films, have been consistently in the good-great range, with a couple of glaring exceptions (Thor 2, Iron Man 2). Whereas DC, Universal, have been struggling to get past one good movie under their belt. If DC had integrated their television and film universes, I think they'd have had a lot more spare good will to burn on mediocre films.

Tanglebones wrote:

The big difference is that the MCU flagship product, the films, have been consistently in the good-great range, with a couple of glaring exceptions (Thor 2, Iron Man 2). Whereas DC, Universal, have been struggling to get past one good movie under their belt. If DC had integrated their television and film universes, I think they'd have had a lot more spare good will to burn on mediocre films.

Strangely, though, DC probably has made a movie universe trilogy that was every bit as good for their time as Marvel's films, but in a different way with the Nolan Batman movies. However, they learned all the wrong lessons from how those films worked. They thought the lesson was "BE DARK AND BROODY". That wasn't it.

Tanglebones wrote:

The big difference is that the MCU flagship product, the films, have been consistently in the good-great range, with a couple of glaring exceptions (Thor 2, Iron Man 2). Whereas DC, Universal, have been struggling to get past one good movie under their belt. If DC had integrated their television and film universes, I think they'd have had a lot more spare good will to burn on mediocre films.

[sniff] You mistyped Iron Man 3.

I'm with her.

Unless watching Guy Pearce chew scenery is your jam, Iron Man 3 is silly.

People seem to enjoy the CW DC stuff. It's not my bag, but it has been profitable and has been expanding. And I also don't think dark and broody is actually a turn off (unless you are invested in the DC vs. Marvel fanboy stuff). The Nolan movies were just better.

I don't think the IP is the difference. What I don't like is that, as a viewer that might just want to watch Daredevil, I get pushed, not just by the show, but by the Netflix platform and social media, to turn that into a dedication to multiple shows. Instead of an array of choices, it comes off as a list of obligations.

And I get why people love it. I loved it, loved the idea of it. But after several years of it, I kind of hate it now. It's not a big deal, as we just started watching other stuff. But it is also why I kind of like that this era is finally ending on Netflix. They can use the money they spent on Marvel to find better and more varied content.

Jayhawker wrote:

People seem to enjoy the CW DC stuff. It's not my bag, but it has been profitable and has been expanding. And I also don't think dark and broody is actually a turn off (unless you are invested in the DC vs. Marvel fanboy stuff). The Nolan movies were just better.

It's that DC seems to think why the Nolan movies were well regarded was that they were serious and dark. Zack Snyder tried the dark and grim style, and just couldn't pull it off and made some messes of movies.

I think Marvel does dark, but they lighten things up with humor so that it's still fun and there's lots of fun even in movies like Winter Soldier, Civil War, or Infinity War.

I don't think the IP is the difference. What I don't like is that, as a viewer that might just want to watch Daredevil, I get pushed, not just by the show, but by the Netflix platform and social media, to turn that into a dedication to multiple shows. Instead of an array of choices, it comes off as a list of obligations.

I think that's some completionist in you But totally not necessary if you could let go of that, as you've said above. I know several people that just watched one or two of the series and were happy with what they got. Jessica Jones season 1 requires no knowledge of Daredevil, even though there are occasional nods. Even Luke Cage season 1 is fine even if you didn't know he was with Jessica and about her history with his dead wife. Yeah, they're marketed that way, but if you just watch what you want, you'll be perfectly fine. Heck, try the first episode of a show, and if you hate it, move on. Like you said, there's plenty of TV these days.

And I get why people love it. I loved it, loved the idea of it. But after several years of it, I kind of hate it now. It's not a big deal, as we just started watching other stuff. But it is also why I kind of like that this era is finally ending on Netflix. They can use the money they spent on Marvel to find better and more varied content.

I don't know that the content will be better necessarily, but it will be their own content and cheaper to make. The Marvel shows were attempts to bring people in as new subscribers as Netflix transitioned from being a movie platform to a self produced content platform. And it probably worked. There was the Marvel name and some recognizable characters that they could advertise and use as attractions, and people would also watch other content and buy into the service long term once they understood Netflix was no longer just a movie streamer for stuff that had already gone through the cable pay networks first.

Netflix no longer really needs this type of stuff, because people now know what the service is about. Now they're producing a lot of cheaper content. Reality shows, shows that they fund from the get go, etc. A Millarworld comic show will be a lot cheaper to produce than a Marvel show, even if the action production costs are the same, just because they don't owe Marvel a large overhead just for the character IP.

I hate that something I liked and was in a pretty good state died because of business, but it's not like I don't have stuff to watch. And I'll hope that these same worlds and characters get used other ways by Disney/Marvel/Hulu.

Just saw this as another take and some supposed insider info:

I forgot there was a potential show about Rocket and Groot being looked at for Disney+ that I left off my list above.

ClockworkHouse wrote:
Tanglebones wrote:

The big difference is that the MCU flagship product, the films, have been consistently in the good-great range, with a couple of glaring exceptions (Thor 2, Iron Man 2). Whereas DC, Universal, have been struggling to get past one good movie under their belt. If DC had integrated their television and film universes, I think they'd have had a lot more spare good will to burn on mediocre films.

[sniff] You mistyped Iron Man 3.

...iron man 3 is one of my favorite MCU movies. It is really complex and nuanced. I love it.

MannishBoy wrote:
Jayhawker wrote:

People seem to enjoy the CW DC stuff. It's not my bag, but it has been profitable and has been expanding. And I also don't think dark and broody is actually a turn off (unless you are invested in the DC vs. Marvel fanboy stuff). The Nolan movies were just better.

It's that DC seems to think why the Nolan movies were well regarded was that they were serious and dark. Zack Snyder tried the dark and grim style, and just couldn't pull it off and made some messes of movies.

Batman fits dark and broody. Superman is a beacon of light and hope. Trying to do Superman dark is just dumb.

See DC Supergirl show on CW for the right tone.

MannishBoy wrote:

Just saw this as another take and some supposed insider info:

I forgot there was a potential show about Rocket and Groot being looked at for Disney+ that I left off my list above.

Yeah, those tweets sound rather definitive if they're accurate. Maybe they might change their minds with enough fan commentary.

SallyNasty wrote:
ClockworkHouse wrote:
Tanglebones wrote:

The big difference is that the MCU flagship product, the films, have been consistently in the good-great range, with a couple of glaring exceptions (Thor 2, Iron Man 2).

[sniff] You mistyped Iron Man 3.

...iron man 3 is one of my favorite MCU movies. It is really complex and nuanced. I love it.

IM3 often seems to me as the most polarizing of the MCU films. And often I find the divide to be between those that mostly know the characters through the movies and those with more knowledge of the comics.

As part of the latter, having he promise of an incredibly acted Mandarin yanked away... it hurt me. I also felt the Extremis storyline wasn’t well handled, leading to a disappointing, even if it was visually impressive, conclusion.

Debate settled. Nick Fury is a cat person.

Magnifique. *chef's kiss*

NO ONE PANIC, BUT THERE'S A FLERKIN IN THE TRAILER. I REPEAT, WE HAVE A FLERKIN IN THE TRAILER.

We're all going to die.

oilypenguin wrote:

NO ONE PANIC, BUT THERE'S A FLERKIN IN THE TRAILER. I REPEAT, WE HAVE A FLERKIN IN THE TRAILER.

We're all going to die.

Based on what I just read, wouldn't that be "the" Flerkin? Since there's only one left. For now.

So the cat takes Nick's eye right? Trailer looks very nice but I have not been to a Marvel film I did not enjoy. I need to see more of this mohawk helmet.

MannishBoy wrote:

Just saw this as another take and some supposed insider info:

I forgot there was a potential show about Rocket and Groot being looked at for Disney+ that I left off my list above.

All of the shows they listed sound awful, Why in the world would you trade Daredevil or Punisher for Bucky and Falcon?

Falcon and Bucky show sounds fantastic to me. I think it does for the majority of people that were into the movies and liked their interactions. I could be wrong though, not like I took a poll.