How to Be an All-Inclusive Gender Thread

dibs wrote:

My friend just called to tell me he is transitioning. I asked if he had a new name (shortlisted) and was switching pronouns (not yet). I let him know how happy i was for him and how honoured i was to be told - i was next on the list after his family and his bff! - and to let me know if/when he wants to be referred to differently. Is there anything else i can do to support him apart from just kinda be there and...support him? He lives in the US and me and his bff (we are all ffs) live in Ireland, so there isn't much day to day stuff we can do.

Anyhow, he sounded super happy so woo:)

Congrats to your friend, dibs

Just being there for moral support alone is a BIG help, I think!

Awesome!

Be there for them when they need someone to talk to. They'll almost certainly go through a period where it seems like all they have to talk about is trans-related, because that becomes kind of a big part of someone's life for a while, so have some patience with that. They'll almost certainly be happy to talk about other stuff, too, it's just a matter of the most exciting stuff going on in their life being about their transition, and wanting to share that.

Just casually being supportive can be super huge. One of my fondest memories from transition was one day when a coworker was buying me lunch because I'd helped him out with something, and when we got to the head of the line he ordered and then said "and whatever she's having". That might seem like a small thing, especially since I'd been using my proper name and pronouns for a while, but it meant a lot to me.

And of course, the standard: if you have any difficulty adopting a new name and pronouns once they ask you to, don't make a big deal about it when you mess up. Apologize briefly and then do spend some extra effort reinforcing the change in yourself. Those changes can be surprisingly hard to internalize with people you've known for a long time, but it's really heartening when someone cares enough to make a real effort to get things right even when it's not easy.

Best wishes to you and your friend!

So. My daughter is wanting to see/read everything LGBTQ++++ looking for identity.

Do ya'll have some recommendations for "11 year old friendly" websites/videos/powerpoint/anything about gender identity?

Also, sexuality would be good.

I'm so glad she's talking to us about all of this. She's also asked to see a therapist to talk about all of this (my wife and I very openly talk about going to therapists, so...).

I’m on the road today roo but I’ll have a look when I get home.

***

I had my consultation with the surgeon today to get all the details n’ stuff (I’ll spare you the grisly details )

unfortunately the timing won’t work this summer - surgery + recovery would overlap my honours degree, plus I need to take care of some laser stuff on the area which will take a bit of time. So, it’ll be NEXT summer before things happen, unfortunately.

But, at least I have all the details to hand now, so it should be relatively clear sailing to sort things out for this time next year. ( so long as brexit doesn’t turn England into a mad max wasteland in the meantime :p )

In any event, it was good to get everything spelled out in black and white, feels a lot more real now! plus it Gives me time to lose weight as well, which I really need to tackle before surgery anyway.

pyxistyx wrote:

I had my consultation with the surgeon today to get all the details n’ stuff (I’ll spare you the grisly details )

unfortunately the timing won’t work this summer - surgery + recovery would overlap my honours degree, plus I need to take care of some laser stuff on the area which will take a bit of time. So, it’ll be NEXT summer before things happen, unfortunately.

But, at least I have all the details to hand now, so it should be relatively clear sailing to sort things out for this time next year. ( so long as brexit doesn’t turn England into a mad max wasteland in the meantime :p )

In any event, it was good to get everything spelled out in black and white, feels a lot more real now! plus it Gives me time to lose weight as well, which I really need to tackle before surgery anyway.

I'm really glad you've got some concreteness to this plan. I can only imagine vagueness makes it stressful to consider. But I wish for you it could come sooner.

Yeah, it's disappointing. But, in the long run, it's probably better that I'm not dealing with it while stressing about being up and active again in time for my next semester. There was really no chance I'd be able to get an appointment without recover time bleeding over into the first month, at least, of my Hons Degree year, and I really don't need that extra stress.

This way I should hopefully just be able to take as much time as I need to recover. And I really will be more comfortable losing a bunch more weight first. So, it's fine.

Now that I'm basically in a position where I can just phone them up directly when I'm ready and just give them the go-ahead to set an appointment, it's taken a lot of the guesswork and stress out of the situation.

* * * *

Roo wrote:

So. My daughter is wanting to see/read everything LGBTQ++++ looking for identity.

Do ya'll have some recommendations for "11 year old friendly" websites/videos/powerpoint/anything about gender identity?

Also, sexuality would be good.

had a quick look around for something that might be of use for starters...

lgbtyouth.org.uk 'coming out' guide (pdf) .

Lot of useful information, "myths vs facts" and some further links in here. Most of the links are Scotland specific but there will probably still be good info in there.

I also came across this, but I would suggest you check it out and vet it properly first, just in case, because it's not something I've ever looked at before. But it might be good for her to have sympathetic peers to talk to about this online?

Trevorspace - Online safe space for LGBT youth aged 13-24

Some insight from inside my house/family, we're at fairly early stages with our 14 year old:
- Make sure you frequently remind your questioning child that your love is unconditional.
- If you are looking at therapists, consider one who specializes in gender identity.
- I've been reading/watching http://darahoffmanfox.com/ she's very positive on what defines gender and defining it for yourself.
- "As far as gender decisions go, follow their (your kid's) lead where the consequences won't harm them." - direct quote from our therapist.
- Realize that if your child discovers that their gender doesn't match their plumbing, you are going to have a lot more talks around the topic related to sex than you were expecting. Regardless of their gender, the plumbing will need to be maintained.
- Some trans-boys are under the mistaken impression that being trans means that they won't menstruate.
- Our therapist shared with us that her observation is that in general tween & teens are more apt to question their birth gender.
- How a person expresses their gender is a choice. Gender itself is inherit to a person, but may need some work to make a determination - caution, this determination may change as an individual learns more about themself.

Good luck, if you want to chat with someone going through a similar situation, I'm a PM away.

RedJen wrote:

- How a person expresses their gender is a choice. Gender itself is inherit to a person, but may need some work to make a determination - caution, this determination may change as an individual learns more about themself.

It's almost weird how prepared Keaton was for this chat.

We've always been up front with our kids about what they're going through developmentally, so they can understand as well as possible what they're going through and that it's okay. Part of our puberty chat was about how the brain stays pretty darn malleable until they're in their mid-20's. Some fairly basic things can change even as they want to become more independent and figure themselves out in their teens. This can make it a frustrating, awkward time.

By the time Keaton decided to come out to us the above was already well known to him. He's always known he was different gender-wise so this isn't likely to change at all. However, he doesn't consider any of his choices of expression to be "locked in", and is thankfully very level headed about it.

potentially TMI but, having slept on it I think I've come to a decision I'm more comfortable with...

So when I had the consultation yesterday they basically gave me the option of getting the full-blown vaginoplasty surgery which is what I was expecting, BUT they also gave me the option for a cosmetic version, which is basically just rearranging the...er...'raw materials' on the surface without actually getting invasive. It's a lighter, safer surgery and takes less time to heal (but obviously doesn't go for the full opening).

I don't think this was ever presented to me as an option previously, so i kinda automatically dismissed it out of hand and said I'd go for the full blown version, but after sleeping on it it really just occurred to me that i don't think I would even need anything more than the cosmetic version, since I'm not exactly interested in men / penetrative sex anyway.

On top of that, the...er... 'state' of my bits would mean the full surgery would not necessarily have the best results possible and I feel like going all out will be taking a lot of risks, pain and inconvenience for something which - for me at least - would be just as satisfying with the cosmetic option.

I did a bit of research and found a really good walkthrough of the surgery and experience and...yeah. I feel much more comfortable with this idea I think.

I think I'm going to phone them up on monday and see if I can't sort that out but I'd be interested in any other feedback (good/bad) about the 'cosmetic' alternative in the meantime.
My gut is telling me this feels like the right decision though.

pyxistyx wrote:

My gut is telling me this feels like the right decision though.

Sometimes these are the best feels, the ones that feel right at a very "core" level.

Would this option also mean less recovery time, so you could look at the procedure being brought forward, or would it still be a mess of scheduling around your studies?

yeah, significantly less/easier recovery time, so it might be possible. I'm going to assume the same timeline for now though and any advance on that is a bonus! I'll find out what they say come Monday, hopefully.

That's awesome! I'm glad to hear that procedure is available to you. It's definitely something that I know people who've been interested in.

Called them up this afternoon and got them to sort all that out. Soon as they send me out the paperwork I'll get that all filled out and then it's just a matter of twiddling my thumbs for another year. But it's a relief at least to have all of that setup and ready to go, finally.

And I don't need to get hair removal done for this procedure, which is a bonus, because that crap is expensive!

That's great news, Pyxi. Happy to hear it.

So my name change is official. I got the court order and SS card. However I wanted to save celebrations until I got the my DMV ID card.

So a little background: I am going through a seizure diagnosis and SOP is to tell DMV and to suspend my license. Cool! I dont need to drive with my seizure episodes anyway.

Well I show up with my documents in hand including my court order. The clerk starts to squeem after the manager informed me that they wouldn't have the authority to update my name and gender. The manager explains that their safety dept put a hold on my record until they are able to confirm if my seizures are under control or I revoke my driving privilege. I refused such non-sense and informed the manager that not pursuing a good faith effort that he would be disobeying a state sanctioned order. He started making calls and I was out of there within 45 mins.

Anyhow so good news my ID came in the mail!

nice! congrats

Persevere!

Congrats, Althea! BTW, if you ever want to stop being referred to as a “boi,” send Certis a PM.

In (considerably) less momentous news, it was gloriously sunny yesterday and I wore cute cuttoff jeans, exposing my pale, ghostly Scottish legs to the elements outside for literally the first time in my adult life, as far as I can remember.

I SHALL be repeating the experience! (assuming we even get more sunny days... it IS Scotland).

pyxistyx wrote:

In (considerably) less momentous news, it was gloriously sunny yesterday and I wore cute cuttoff jeans, exposing my pale, ghostly Scottish legs to the elements outside for literally the first time in my adult life, as far as I can remember.

I SHALL be repeating the experience! (assuming we even get more sunny days... it IS Scotland).

Congrats!
IMAGE(https://i.imgur.com/QE2jlw9_d.jpg)

I resemble that cartoon!

sometimesdee wrote:

Congrats, Althea! BTW, if you ever want to stop being referred to as a “boi,” send Certis a PM.

Go, Sku Grl!

Non-Binary seems right up my alley. I don't feel right as either pink or blue, honestly. I didn't know you could transition to be non-binary. I thought it was all or nothing. /galaxybrain

Amoebic wrote:

Non-Binary seems right up my alley. I don't feel right as either pink or blue, honestly. I didn't know you could transition to be non-binary. I thought it was all or nothing. /galaxybrain

In doing research for my gender-non-conforming teen, I found Dara Hoffman-Fox out of Colorado. They self describe as "My pronouns are Dara/they/them.

I’m a queer-identified mental health counselor whose passion for working with gender-questioning, transgender, and nonbinary clients goes far beyond the four walls of my private practice.

My goal is to get as much education, resources, and support out there as possible to the trans and gender-questioning persons of the world."

Their website - http://darahoffmanfox.com/about-dara...

One of the things I keep encountering with other adults is the fact that my son doesn't fit all of the male stereotypes since he came out to everyone as male. His friends and other kids of his generation don't appear to give a damn, but I find certain adults need to take some time to wrap their brain around the fact that there is no binary, and identifying as male is merely one data point in an entire universe of self.

LouZiffer wrote:

One of the things I keep encountering with other adults is the fact that my son doesn't fit all of the male stereotypes since he came out to everyone as male. His friends and other kids of his generation don't appear to give a damn, but I find other adults need to take some time to wrap their brain around the fact that there is no binary, and identifying as male is merely one data point in an entire universe of self.

Which all ties in to toxic masculinity limiting what expressions are considered ok if you identify as male. I'm so happy your son isn't running into those kinds of walls from his peers.

Tanglebones wrote:
LouZiffer wrote:

One of the things I keep encountering with other adults is the fact that my son doesn't fit all of the male stereotypes since he came out to everyone as male. His friends and other kids of his generation don't appear to give a damn, but I find other adults need to take some time to wrap their brain around the fact that there is no binary, and identifying as male is merely one data point in an entire universe of self.

Which all ties in to toxic masculinity limiting what expressions are considered ok if you identify as male. I'm so happy your son isn't running into those kinds of walls from his peers.

I was chatting with someone and trying to express something along these lines. I identify as female, but I also have traits that on a male are seen as positive, but on a woman are often viewed as negative. After review, I think the double behavior standard within toxic masculinity may be where I was getting stuck.

I have a SUPER random question for this group. Is there anyone who has transitioned and is legally listed to become a guardian in the event of parental death, or knows a friend in that situation.

We had been planning to file my best friend and her spouse as our child's guardians in our will/estate paperwork. Her spouse just came out as trans, and I want to be sure that we anticipate any legal barriers that might arise in the process, and are proactive about anything we can put in writing. Since obviously if this happens we won't be around to deal with it, I want to be certain we cover everything necessary to be sure their guardianship couldn't be contested.

Just wondering if anyone has experience with this and could give me tips on what to search for while exploring state laws or any additional paperwork it may be helpful to file. One thing I've found so far is a simple MOU designed for a marriage that basically says both parties know about an individual's status at the time of agreement. We're in Michigan if that helps at all!

I also need to post something,
> Buys new bra
> Just the one of two different models to see how they go for a while, these things are expensive and I'm not well off
> Remembers a few weeks later to pick up more because the ones I bought have been alright
> Gets to the right rack, can't remember the right size. Do remember that the one that was one size off wasn't good.
> There was none left of the right size after I checked anyway
> Cries.

Wait 6mths+ and repeat.