Star Trek Online Catch-All

I've tried the 5% absorb/5% bleed through shields

There was a great post on the STO Beta forums on the differences between absorb and bleed through that appears to be lost to the aether. Basically, the gist was that the 5% absorb was better over the long term because of the damage mitigation (not factoring in resistances).

Like, let's say a phaser blast hits your shields for 300 damage but you only have 250 shield points (at 5% absorb/5% bleed) on that arc. Immediately, you would take 15 hull damage and 15 points would be absorbed. The remaining 270 damage would wipe out the 250 shield points letting an additional 20 points of hull damage through. So, your looking at only 35 damage reaching the hull, then its torpedo time.

Same scenario but with the 10% bleed. 250 points would take down the shield, 30 points of that would get through to the hull and the remaining 50 points of damage would also hit the hull. Looking at 80 damage there. There are Science consoles out there that improve your crew size and their regeneration rate to help with that extra damage getting through over the course of the shields being up... but that's the key. Once those shields go down, you can expect some torpedo volleys to start smacking on your hull and hope your crew repairs can out pace the damage.

Where things get really interesting is when you start considering special weapon effects like those that can disable weapons, shields or engines. Those require hits to the hull to be effective, in which case having your shields up even a few seconds longer can make a huge difference. And then there's resistances as well for the hull...

I miss playing this game a lot more than I thought I would... If my car hadn't died on me this morning I was seriously considering buying it. For now, I'm lurking.

Shoal07 wrote:
cube wrote:
Shoal07 wrote:

Anyone having any luck selling on the exchange?

I threw a couple of items up on it, but I have no idea where the mailbox is(either in the game world, or UI), so.... yeah...

Drop down arrow by your top right mini map.

Alternatively, you can check your mail whenever you access your bank.

I'm running right now at Lt-4 with a mkii phaser and cannon in front with a mkii mine in back. Thankfully both the cannon and mines were loot rewards! But I am thinking of switching to dual mkii phaser banks to rip down shields from most angles so that my mines can finish off that much faster. I also love the energy weapon overcharge skill.

It seems like I'm running through the levels quicker this time. It seemed like it took forever to get to Lt9 during open beta. I was so close to tier 2! I think I did a better job with my ship this time around albeit, its subtler differences over my open beta ship. I hope they release the patch with the new ship parts soon.

fangblackbone wrote:

I'm running right now at Lt-4 with a mkii phaser and cannon in front with a mkii mine in back. Thankfully both the cannon and mines were loot rewards! But I am thinking of switching to dual mkii phaser banks to rip down shields from most angles so that my mines can finish off that much faster. I also love the energy weapon overcharge skill.

It seems like I'm running through the levels quicker this time. It seemed like it took forever to get to Lt9 during open beta. I was so close to tier 2! I think I did a better job with my ship this time around albeit, its subtler differences over my open beta ship. I hope they release the patch with the new ship parts soon.

Remember, there's also a LT10

Of course! Lt 9 is still a lot closer than Lt 4 =P

fangblackbone wrote:

Of course! Lt 9 is still a lot closer than Lt 4 =P

If you forget, dinging LT10 can be very dissapointing

So are Phasers really the best at taking down shields? Someone please school me in whats best against what, whats my rock to their scissors?

So are Phasers really the best at taking down shields?

What really sets them apart is the 250 degrees firing arc. With 2 of them in my forward slots its not too difficult to have them both locked on your target at all times. Once you whittle your enemy's shields down, its also not hard to keep them down. thus making your mines that much more lethal.

Even against a much nimbler ship its not hard to keep it off your six with throttle adjustments and climbing or diving while turning. Even if the quicker ship where on your six indefinitely, you'd just be able to kite them with your mines, which do good damage to both shield and hull.

fangblackbone wrote:

I'm running right now at Lt-4 with a mkii phaser and cannon in front with a mkii mine in back.

I thought only escorts could have cannons. Is that not correct?

Tigerbill wrote:

So are Phasers really the best at taking down shields? Someone please school me in whats best against what, whats my rock to their scissors?

As for this, I'm going from memory here but I think it's phasers are best against shields, disruptors/torpedoes/mines for hull.

Kehama wrote:
fangblackbone wrote:

I'm running right now at Lt-4 with a mkii phaser and cannon in front with a mkii mine in back.

I thought only escorts could have cannons. Is that not correct?

Tigerbill wrote:

So are Phasers really the best at taking down shields? Someone please school me in whats best against what, whats my rock to their scissors?

As for this, I'm going from memory here but I think it's phasers are best against shields, disruptors/torpedoes/mines for hull.

You can have Tier 1/2 cannons on anything.

As far as phasers and shields, it's really energy based vs kinetic based. Energy based weapons work on shields, kinetic weapons (torps) - hulls. Cannons actually take down shields faster because they have higher DPS, but they have much lower arc of fire (90-45 deg). Beam weapons are better for ships that broadside, like cruisers. Both are energy. I can put 3 phasers (1 forward, 2 rear) on target with my cruiser which is higher than 2 cannons (2x forward or 2x rear), but not higher than 3 cannons (like an escort with 3x front). Since I lack the maneuverability of an escort it doesn't make sense for me to, say, have 2x cannons up front and torps in the back. By the time I turned 180 he'd have shields back up. However, I can fire broadside then turn slightly to launch a torp and then turn back to broadside. I think it works out to haveing to turn 15 degrees or so, much more manageable on a cruiser.

Oh brilliant.

http://startrekonline.com/

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LockAndLoad wrote:
I've tried the 5% absorb/5% bleed through shields

There was a great post on the STO Beta forums on the differences between absorb and bleed through that appears to be lost to the aether. Basically, the gist was that the 5% absorb was better over the long term because of the damage mitigation (not factoring in resistances).

Like, let's say a phaser blast hits your shields for 300 damage but you only have 250 shield points (at 5% absorb/5% bleed) on that arc. Immediately, you would take 15 hull damage and 15 points would be absorbed. The remaining 270 damage would wipe out the 250 shield points letting an additional 20 points of hull damage through. So, your looking at only 35 damage reaching the hull, then its torpedo time.

Same scenario but with the 10% bleed. 250 points would take down the shield, 30 points of that would get through to the hull and the remaining 50 points of damage would also hit the hull. Looking at 80 damage there. There are Science consoles out there that improve your crew size and their regeneration rate to help with that extra damage getting through over the course of the shields being up... but that's the key. Once those shields go down, you can expect some torpedo volleys to start smacking on your hull and hope your crew repairs can out pace the damage.

Where things get really interesting is when you start considering special weapon effects like those that can disable weapons, shields or engines. Those require hits to the hull to be effective, in which case having your shields up even a few seconds longer can make a huge difference. And then there's resistances as well for the hull...

Your math doesn't seem to add up (or the poster's math). Taking your second example (10% bleedthrough): a 300 damage phaser blast can't do 330 damage - which would be the result of your equation, as 250 to the shields plus 80 to the hull. Unless htere's some other craziness going on, I believe the appropriate math would go like this: 300 damage phasers to a shielded area will do 30 damage directly (for 10% bleedthrough-type shields). The other 270 damage would, in this instance of shields being at 250, take out the shields, and then do 20 more damage to the hull, meaning 50 damage to the hull total, and no more shields left on that facing.

The 5% bleedthrough/5% absorb-type shields would work as you described: 15 damage absorbed, 250 damage to the shields, 35 damage to the hull (adding up to 300). Obviously, the biggest difference for the absorb comes when shields are still up, e.g. shields at 500 and a phaser blast doing 300 damage. For the 5% absorb-type, it would mean 15 damage disappears, 15 damage to the hull, and 270 damage to the shields. Same damage is done ot hte shields with the 10% absorb-type, but obviously they would take 30 damage to the hull.

peterb wrote:

Oh brilliant.

http://startrekonline.com/

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Sweet.

Works fine for me.

peterb wrote:

Oh brilliant.

http://startrekonline.com/

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Works for me, as well...but, the servers are down, again...

I really hate to complain, as they have been in beta, and technically, the game isn't launched yet, but it's really starting to irritate me that all of the times where it's convenient for me to play, the servers go down, or the queue isn't working, or the login server isn't working, and so on and so forth. It was one thing for the beta product to be having issues, but when they are a single day away from a wide release, you'd think that the system would work as perfectly as possible for the relatively few people that are using it in the Head Start.

It really concerns me about the launch tomorrow. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad I bought the game and I plan on playing it on and off until the servers go down permanently years from now, but if they're having problems like this the day before launch, it just seems like they're writing the blogosphere headlines themselves.

Please tell me I'm over-reacting and that WoW, Conan, Warhammer, etc. all had server outages the 2-3 days before they released!

I have the same concerns. Great game, but wow...do they have the infrastructure to handle the load come launch tomorrow?

On another note...I'm having a really hard time deciding between cruiser and escort.

I really like the looks of the cruiser...heck, who wouldn't, but I'm concerned about their damage output since I'm a more traditional DPS dealer, hence why escort looks good. Honestly though, I don't really like the look or feel of the escort in beta. Any suggestions on thoughts on how you guys are deciding which "class" of ship you're going with?

Your math doesn't seem to add up (or the poster's math). Taking your second example (10% bleedthrough): a 300 damage phaser blast can't do 330 damage - which would be the result of your equation, as 250 to the shields plus 80 to the hull. Unless htere's some other craziness going on, I believe the appropriate math would go like this: 300 damage phasers to a shielded area will do 30 damage directly (for 10% bleedthrough-type shields). The other 270 damage would, in this instance of shields being at 250, take out the shields, and then do 20 more damage to the hull, meaning 50 damage to the hull total, and no more shields left on that facing.

I very likely screwed up the math. I had a 4 year old & a 2 year old attacking me while I was typing.

Ok, let me double-check this... 300 points of damage. The shields immediately bleed 30 damage to the hull leaving 270 points. Yeah, I screwed up there. Shields would absorb 250 of the remaining 270 leaving 20 to get through when they fail. 50 damage total.

The big take away from the post was that the absorb/bleed benefits take first and then the remaining damage is applied to the shields and hull and that the absorb ability would protect a ship longer from weapons fire that debuffs or hinders you.

darrenl wrote:

On another note...I'm having a really hard time deciding between cruiser and escort.

I really like the looks of the cruiser...heck, who wouldn't, but I'm concerned about their damage output since I'm a more traditional DPS dealer, hence why escort looks good. Honestly though, I don't really like the look or feel of the escort in beta. Any suggestions on thoughts on how you guys are deciding which "class" of ship you're going with?

While escorts are the DPS dealers, cruisers can certainly put a hurting on something, especially with quantum torps.

darrenl wrote:

I have the same concerns. Great game, but wow...do they have the infrastructure to handle the load come launch tomorrow?

I really don't think they do. From what I've seen so far, either they've far exceeded projections on orders and concurrent active accounts, or real world scaling has been much worse than their in house tests (or both). I think it's going to be a rough couple weeks while they scale out additional hardware. Brace for impact!

StaggerLee wrote:

So I know someone here mentioned going to DS9 for a Bat'leth, but all I can find there are MK5+ weapons. Is there anywhere (not on the overpriced exchange) where I can get LtComm melee weapons?

Oh noes did they take it out? That would suck...

Tamren wrote:
StaggerLee wrote:

So I know someone here mentioned going to DS9 for a Bat'leth, but all I can find there are MK5+ weapons. Is there anywhere (not on the overpriced exchange) where I can get LtComm melee weapons?

Oh noes did they take it out? That would suck...

I can't find it. But someone's getting them somewhere, as there's a bunch on the Exchange - for ludicrous prices. I could buy a second Tier2 ship for the price these monkeys want for a stinking Bat'leth!

As for the servers: Yes, every game has these issues at release. The first few weeks are always hell. I wasn't around for WoW launch, but I've heard it wasn't much better - we've just all got rose-colored glasses now.

I was at DS9 tonight, and didnt see any LT CMND weapons (at least not melee).

What is the range on Mines, far as I can tell around 4-5 km's. Thnaks for the tip on using those as missiles whoever suggested it.

darrenl wrote:

On another note...I'm having a really hard time deciding between cruiser and escort.

I really like the looks of the cruiser...heck, who wouldn't, but I'm concerned about their damage output since I'm a more traditional DPS dealer, hence why escort looks good. Honestly though, I don't really like the look or feel of the escort in beta. Any suggestions on thoughts on how you guys are deciding which "class" of ship you're going with?

I am in the same boat - actually I like the higher tier escorts. My son is pushing me towards cruisers...

ilduce620 wrote:

Please tell me I'm over-reacting and that WoW, Conan, Warhammer, etc. all had server outages the 2-3 days before they released! :-)

Yes, yes, yes, and yes... They all had there up's and down's. Hell the first server I was on in WoW (cannot even remember) could not stay up for nothing - moved to Bloodscalp...

I haven't seen a Queue since Sat when they apprently "fixed" the issue. If they can get hardware that fast on a weekend then they should be ready to add more on Tues. If it was a code problem, then they fixed it. Either way, I think they have a chance to be only struggling for days, not weeks. We'll see tonight.

I bought an Escort (20k) in addition to my cruiser. They definately play differently. I loaded it out with 3x dual cannons and mines. It can tear ships up much faster, but it definately requires more attention and skill to pilot effectively. The tough part is going to be skills. My cruiser uses Cruiser, Phaser, and Torp skills and the Escort uses Escort, Cannons, and Mines. This means I'll be speccing 3 extra skills I wouldn't normally in order to effectively use the cruiser. As far as I can tell it is the biggest problem in Tier 2. In the later tiers it's like only 1-2 extra skills. I used the skill planner and I was looking for skills to spend points on in Tier 3 anyway, so if I do it again it shouldn't be much of an issue. So I think it's possible to effectively pilot 2 ships, the only twist is the diverging bridge officer skills, but that just means you need more bridge officers on-hand. The Tac Officers are the primary problem (since their skills tend to be weapon specific).

Has anyone played around with bridge officer training? I recruited a 5th officer last night and when trying to commission her I got the message that my crew was full but that if I chose she could train an existing officer before leaving. Since I wanted her skills I just sacked the existing science officer and replaced her with the new gal. Has anyone chosen to have the new officer train an old one? I'm wondering how that works.

When you choose to train, a menu will appear listing the candidate's skills in each rank. You can then choose a skill to train (only one) and a drop-down list of officers will appear showing who can train in that skill and who cannot (grayed out.)

Once you choose, your officer will gain that skill immediately.

Hope that helps.

IMAGE(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v357/Shoal07/screenshot_2010-02-02-09-58-12.jpg)
IMAGE(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v357/Shoal07/screenshot_2010-02-02-09-54-41.jpg)
IMAGE(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v357/Shoal07/screenshot_2010-02-01-23-12-30.jpg)

Hmmm, I can login and fly around, but for some reason I cannot load into a system right now, it times out and drops me. It was working fine.

EDIT

Must of just been a temp issue.

Nice ship Shoal!

I had a great time grouping with Breander last night. The great spaceship combat only gets better with more people. Most of the battles we were in we were added to at least 2 others in the open instance. We each had a close call were we got hammered but survived. I hope someone has found a "attack my target button" on the team UI. I think that is the only minor annoyance is trying to find what Breander was targetting. Its easy at the start of the fight but any time after that its hard with a swarm of ships all around you. We each did a decent job but those extra 2 phaser volleys before we focus on one target can make a difference.

Either knowing what quests to do makes a huge difference in leveling time or they have dialed down the xp required to level. I am almost at the same place I was in open beta in what feels like a fraction of the time. Anyways, can't wait for tier 2!