So Long, My Wii — Now Playing: ?

This could be straying into the P&C Feminism thread territory, but I'm not sure the "Because Japan" defense really holds water. In a lot of ways that whole culture is pretty sexist in some pretty overt ways. You might expect it "because Japan", but that doesn't make it not sexist.

I would say, continue playing. I'm at Chapter 25 and things are getting interesting.

The theme of being trapped in a destiny not entirely of your own choosing seems to resonate throughout this story. I'm interested to see how it plays out in the end.

Well, I can't help you on that last part. I couldn't buy a minute of their romance, which was disappointing as Sakaguchi was on FF6 and the romance between Celes and Locke is perhaps my favorite in a video game. Hell, I'd say Yuna and Tidus feel less forced than Zael and Calista.

You'll probably like most of the side characters more than the main ones, at least, if this is your reaction to the two main protagonists.

ClockworkHouse wrote:
Spoiler:

At the very least, the scene when Zael first discovers her identity was ridiculous. She hadn't seemed quite so weak and simpering when he met her earlier in the marketplace, but suddenly she's a limp noodle of a character who stands around passively while her fiancé bullies her. Rescue, of course, comes in the form of the brave and good Zael who must step in to defend her honor.

Spoiler:

My bead on that scene was actually "because my uncle", not "because my fiancé". It's talked about more later on, but there are some very specific pressure points her uncle holds over her for which she has to be very careful in tiptoeing around him. She does have a fairly decent character arc, and Zael I believe has an excellent one (pretty sure you read my War article, so you probably already got some hints of that). I don't think that portrayal is particularly sexist, but the reason it isn't is not revealed until a bit later on. The boob jiggle, though? Yeah, that's just Japan being Japan. :rolleyes:

The combat system's clicking a little more now and feels a bit less hectic. I'm glad they've introduced abilities gradually because it's given me an opportunity to get a handle on the skills I have before being introduced to new ones.

It's interesting that they seem to have tied those ability unlocks not to the storyline but to your experience level. Typically, designers like to introduce new mechanics in very controlled situations: here is the Gale mechanic, and here is a combat encounter carefully crafted so that you must use the Gale mechanic to advance. But unless I'm mistaken, The Last Story ties your expanded command mechanics not to the storyline but to your experience level. That way, as you spend time in combat, your options in combat grow naturally rather than being arbitrarily tied down by the advancement of the plot.

It's a neat, intuitive way to side-step Final Fantasy XIII's "problem" of the endless tutorial.1 Players who do more combat encounters will unlock combat abilities sooner than those who don't rather than churning through content with perpetually limited options. Of course, The Last Story also throttles your experience gains pretty dramatically so that you can't just unlock everything right out of the gate.

Story-wise, I'm happy to say that I'm starting to get into the feeling of the game a bit more. I can't say that I've grown to really care for Zael, yet, but I'm starting to be taken in by the sadness that pervades everything. It reminds me, if I can make a bit of a leap here, of the time period between the World Wars when there was a sense that more war was coming but nearly everyone alive had been touched in some way by the previous war. It seems that the war in The Last Story is more recent—about 15 years, I'd guess, rather than the 21 years between our World Wars—but there's a similar sense of a population traumatized by one conflict finding themselves drawn into another.


  • I feel obligated to say that there's nothing wrong with tying combat mechanics to story progression provided that there's a reasonable justification for doing so. Persona 3 holds back some fairly important mechanics for controlling your AI party members until late in the game so that your growing relationship with your team can be reflected mechanically as well as textually (something that Persona 3 Portable completely undermines by allowing direct control of your party members, but I digress). It's my understanding that Final Fantasy XIII does something similar in terms of trying to reflect story progression in its mechanical growth. I'm just interested in the way that The Last Story chose to handle it because I haven't seen anything quite like that before.

The way they control your experience gain, though, pretty much guarantees that you'll be gaining those abilities roughly when they want you to be. Still, it feels more like actually unlocking a new skill rather than "here's a tutorial".

Haven't read through most of the thread, but I didn't see Final Fantasy Chronicles: Crystal bearers on your list anywhere. While it's not a Top 10 by any stretch of the imagination, it makes pretty decent use of the old motion-controller, and the story is entirely passable.

I'm still making progress in The Last Story, but it's slow going. The combat system is fantastic, and the storyline is picking up steam, but I just haven't had as much interest in it lately. However, I did take time to beat Art Style: Rotozoa and play through the first thirty minutes or so of Muramasa.

I've heard a lot about Muramasa over the years. It's one of those Wii games that always gets mentioned right off the hop whenever the "hardcore games for the Wii" conversation comes up. It usually gets praised for its art style, its novelty, and its gameplay, in that order.

Taking LarryC's advice, I started the game up in the more difficult shura mode. I couldn't remember which character was supposed to offer more interesting gameplay, so I went with Momohime because I always default to female characters. I played up through the first boss (the Blue Monk, I think he was called) and really enjoyed it. The combat is satisfying and has some interesting mechanics with draw strikes, soul power, and the like. They found a nice way of getting you to mix up your weapons so that you're not always using the same ones while still making the weapons feel unique.

And in the context of combat, pressing up on the left stick to jump actually makes sense. That's one of the key complaints about the game, but I actually liked it in the combat encounters because it creates a fairly intuitive interaction between the direction you're pressing the left stick and the direction you're attacking. I ended up pressing the direction I wanted to attack while hammering away at the B button and ended up doing most of what I wanted to do. I even got into juggling enemies in the air, which I never do in action games.

The flipside of that is that pressing up to jump is a little weird and counter-intuitive for the platforming portions of the game. I didn't see a whole lot of that. What was there so far was pretty rote and uninteresting, but I'll give that time to develop.

I'm impressed so far, even if it's not the hardcore game to rule all hardcore games on the Wii.

About an hour or so more of Muramasa, and I'm starting to feel it's a bit like Dairy Queen ice cream: flavorful, but mostly empty space. There are a lot of identical, empty screens to run through.

In that sense, it reminds me a bit of the original Metroid. That game had a large world to explore, but a lot of it was identical corridors strung end to end. Muramasa has you running through a lot of spaces that are nearly identical; here's four or five forest screens with slightly different branch configurations; here's four or five city streets with slightly different silhouettes dancing behind the shoji screens.

This wouldn't be that big of a deal except that combat encounters seem somewhat rare. Making my way through the game's second major area, I seemed to run through two or three large, empty areas for each combat encounter. Given that combat lasts under a minute per encounter, that's a lot of dead air punctuated by fleeting moments of excitement.

I like the game's combat, and I love the game's art, but it's going to need a little bit more meat for me to stick with it much longer.

Clocky, did you just have a backlog of these games? Did you pick up games late in the life of the system? I'm considering going on a bit of a spending binge on the Wii, but hopefully doing so on the cheap. I'd like to do my own mini-tour of games I always wanted to play on the Wii and never finished. These include.

Mario Galaxy
Mario Galaxy 2
The Last Story
Xenoblade Chronicles
Little King's Story
Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn
Kirby's Epic Yarn

Do you already have Xenoblade? If not, good luck trying to get it on the cheap....

DSGamer wrote:

Clocky, did you just have a backlog of these games? Did you pick up games late in the life of the system? I'm considering going on a bit of a spending binge on the Wii, but hopefully doing so on the cheap. I'd like to do my own mini-tour of games I always wanted to play on the Wii and never finished. These include.

Mario Galaxy
Mario Galaxy 2
The Last Story
Xenoblade Chronicles
Little King's Story
Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn
Kirby's Epic Yarn

I had a backlog of some of them but have also purchased some. Thankfully, I already owned a good handful of the more expensive ones.

Looking at your list, you should be able to get the Mario Galaxy games fairly easily without shelling out too much for them. Likewise, The Last Story and Kirby's Epic Yarn are still in print and easy to find. I think Little King's Story is out of print but can still be had for $40 or so. Xenoblade Chronicles and Fire Emblem are a different story. They both had really small print runs and are highly valued by collectors. Xenoblade goes for about $100 used (and rising); Fire Emblem was $80 or so used the last time I looked.

However, I haven't played Radiant Dawn, but I can tell you that Xenoblade, while incredibly impressive technically, isn't a must-own game for the system. It also has a sequel in the works for the Wii U that would be a better value proposition if you're looking to get that console.

I need to update my list up there, but anything I marked with a in the original post gets a recommendation. Thankfully, because the Wii is a baby console without games for real grownups, lots of those games can be found for $20 or less, and there are lots of people here who are pretty generous about lending games out, as well.

I believe Gamefly is selling The Last Story for $20 right now.

SixteenBlue wrote:

I believe Gamefly is selling The Last Story for $20 right now.

$30 gets it new and sends some money to XSEED.

Radiant Dawn was the direct sequel to the Gamecube FE game and is quite good, but only if you played Path of Radiance. Really, Radiant Dawn should've been on the Gamecube because I'm pretty sure it's the exact same engine.

Anyway, what matters is that it plays like a FE and looks nice and pretty during cutscenes, which was a huge plus to someone who was use to playing GBA versions of the games (me). Would I pay $80 for it? Eh, not really.

Play Path of Radiance first, then move onto it. The story and everything work better that way imho.

Have you played the 3DS Fire Emblem? How does it compare to the GC/Wii ones?

ClockworkHouse wrote:

Have you played the 3DS Fire Emblem? How does it compare to the GC/Wii ones?

Nope, no 3DS. I'm not sure why it's so much better scored than the other games. I much preferred the GC/Wii games to the DS game though. That one didn't click with me even though it's, well, a Fire Emblem game. Really they're practically the same exact games with a new twist thrown in every now and again.

The 3DS version is leaps ahead of the DS version, if I understand correctly. The DS version was a remake of the very first game.

To me the 3DS Fire Emblem is worth GOTY consideration, while the rest of the series is just quite good. I recommend checking out the 3DS one, and then the others if you find yourself wanting more.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

Looking at your list, you should be able to get the Mario Galaxy games fairly easily without shelling out too much for them. Likewise, The Last Story and Kirby's Epic Yarn are still in print and easy to find. I think Little King's Story is out of print but can still be had for $40 or so. Xenoblade Chronicles and Fire Emblem are a different story. They both had really small print runs and are highly valued by collectors. Xenoblade goes for about $100 used (and rising); Fire Emblem was $80 or so used the last time I looked.

So maybe I'll try to find Kirby, the Mario games and Last Story on the cheap right now and keep an eye out for the others.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

However, I haven't played Radiant Dawn, but I can tell you that Xenoblade, while incredibly impressive technically, isn't a must-own game for the system. It also has a sequel in the works for the Wii U that would be a better value proposition if you're looking to get that console.

Sweet. Thanks for the advice. I'll hold off on that, then.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

I need to update my list up there, but anything I marked with a in the original post gets a recommendation. Thankfully, because the Wii is a baby console without games for real grownups, lots of those games can be found for $20 or less, and there are lots of people here who are pretty generous about lending games out, as well.

To the baby console part.

Funny thing is that I'd be more than happy to just play these on a cheap Wii. Which are abundant since people are always selling them due to lack of hardcore games.

But I'm still thinking of playing these on a Wii U for the sake of any kind of graphical improvement the Wii U provides.

This is going to sound dumb but I had no idea Mario Galaxy 2 was so good.

So it's been over a year since I started this little project, and while my Wii has had some fallow periods while I got really involved with my 3DS, I've played a lot of great stuff. Of course, with no Wii U for me in the near future, I'll keep plugging away at the Wii's library for awhile yet. I've had to give up on a few games because they've gotten too expensive, but I'll keep getting things as I can.

Does anyone have a copy of Arc Rise Fantasia I could borrow?

Some conversation over in the Wii U thread about Wii games got me thinking about the Wii and its library. It's weird to recommend Wii games, because most of my favorites come with some kind of caveat. Fragile Dreams is really good and does some neat things with environmental storytelling and atmosphere, but the combat kinda stinks. Pandora's Tower is an amazing take on the Zelda genre with really engaging boss fights and cool temple designs, but it has a saggy middle and one real stinker of a level.

There are very few expensive, polished games on the Wii, but there are a lot of really interesting games that are a big rough around the edges. It's like an entire console dedicated to that sliver of experimental console games you really only see on the 360/PS3 side with games like Deadly Premonition and Nier. They're not as pretty; they're a little clunky; but they're just bursting with ideas.

So my barely played wii is having disc read errors on a brand new game. f*ck you wii.

Any Canadians have thoughts on the mini?

JohnKillo wrote:

So my barely played wii is having disc read errors on a brand new game. f*ck you wii.

Any Canadians have thoughts on the mini?

I have thoughts. It's $99 for a Wii game player. It doesn't have any internet connectivity at all, so basically it will play the games, but nothing that's online will work or be available. It's a nice red colour, so if you want a red wii-mote...

Or you could channel that $99 into a Wii U and play your old Wii games plus everything that's new.

Not to be terribly cynical, but is there really anything interesting going on with the Wii's online functionality anymore? Unless you're playing Mario Kart mp or something, but otherwise I don't see much of a draw.

Also, strange thread to be having this discussion in.

Nah they shut down everything. Mii channel, votes, weather, I think almost all of it. I got on there a couple weeks ago to import some Miis to my 3DS when I got it, and couldn't download any more.

I guess the 3DS has the QR code Mii sharing now, but there were some nice Wii ones out there. Plus importing from the Wii lets you edit them. Oh well.

There are some good WiiWare games, and the Virtual Console has a lot of good stuff in it, and those both require internet access. However, I wouldn't rule out a Wii mini as a way of playing Wii games.

(And this is a fine thread for this discussion.)

Gosh, I totally blanked about Wiiware and VC games. *facepalm*

You could always go with Dolphin and make the Wii game actually look decent. I'm playing my copy of Skyward Sword that way. It's pretty great if you can put up with a few wonky aspects now and again. Completely worth it in my opinion.