Marvel's Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D (No Spoilers Beyond What's Aired)

My god this show is borderline painful. The acting is so bad, the pacing is terrible and it's just flat out corny at times.

I really wanted to like this show but I think we are going to stop watching.

I want very much to like this show, and I'd love the lore behind it to develop a thick, well-realized world that would support the movies. Besides, I'm catching the episodes commercial free on ABC.com, so it's go that going for it.

But it's so bleh. The pretty people argue with flat dialogue and pose for the camera. The events are just bleh. Hopefully this is just growing pains, and it will find legs soon.

Yeah this one was hard to watch. Still got it on the DVR and I'll give it some more time, but damn, Whedon, where's your magic?

AnimeJ wrote:

Like I said, the plane was impossible before you even start talking about any of that. I can't even imagine how the rear two engines could possibly function with the amount of turbulence around the intakes, or how that giant-ass rear wing structure wouldn't cause massive amounts of turbulence without engines bolted on, so the fact that it's flying at all means that clearly it's a product of super advanced technology. From there, it's a tiny step to incredibly strong, nigh indestructible life rafts or HVAC that can pump tons of atmosphere, or that the plane is not skinned with aircraft grade aluminum.

Well, this is a world with flying, invisible aircraft carriers, so I guess I shouldn't expect too much. Awkward plane design, while a problem, is at least a somewhat forgivable problem. But if basic physics don't apply at all, even when there's no explanation for why they don't, then we're watching Star Trek again, just dressed up in Earth clothes.

edit:

But it's so bleh. The pretty people argue with flat dialogue and pose for the camera.

Ooh, yeah, I was thinking exactly that, and forgot to mention it. Lots and lots of posing in this episode, very awkward and obvious posing. "Ok, you're looking at something really interesting outside the plane window".... and it's not even vaguely interesting. Stuff like that.

Malor wrote:
AnimeJ wrote:

Like I said, the plane was impossible before you even start talking about any of that. I can't even imagine how the rear two engines could possibly function with the amount of turbulence around the intakes, or how that giant-ass rear wing structure wouldn't cause massive amounts of turbulence without engines bolted on, so the fact that it's flying at all means that clearly it's a product of super advanced technology. From there, it's a tiny step to incredibly strong, nigh indestructible life rafts or HVAC that can pump tons of atmosphere, or that the plane is not skinned with aircraft grade aluminum.

Well, this is a world with flying, invisible aircraft carriers, so I guess I shouldn't expect too much. Awkward plane design, while a problem, is at least a somewhat forgivable problem. But if basic physics don't apply at all, even when there's no explanation for why they don't, then we're watching Star Trek again, just dressed up in Earth clothes.

Sir, you answered your own question.

Sir, you answered your own question.

But you omitted the key phrase there: even when there's no explanation for why they don't.

Without that, you have Star Trek, and technobabble.

Malor wrote:
Sir, you answered your own question.

But you omitted the key phrase there: even when there's no explanation for why they don't.

Without that, you have Star Trek, and technobabble.

As opposed to that brilliant discussion of the plausibility of a flying, invisible aircraft carrier?

Exactly what was the explanation for that, again?

Just watched the first two episodes on abc.com. I didn't catch the Nick Fury scene though. It was a decent enough beginning. The effects are kinda bad in places, but some of that was probably due to the crappy video stream. And they do add to the comic book feel of things.

I so hope Coulson is counting on Skye being an infiltrator and is using her to reel in the rest of Rising Tide. That seems like it'll be more fun to watch than the straightforward take on things.

I just keep telling myself "Think how bad the first season of The Next Generation was!"

I don't know if this is like, Episodes I - III level disappointment, but it's been pretty disappointing so far. I'm saying the same thing to myself that I kept saying during Episode I: "Where's the magic?"

I finally watched the first two episodes and my first thought was that the production values on this show are really low. You'd think that Disney could throw some more cash at this show since the Marvel stuff is one of their major moneymaking franchises now. Maybe they blew their budget on Sam Jackson.

Most of the cast is terrible (except for Gregg and Ming-Na Wen) and the roles seem kind of trite. (A tough loner! Geeky scientists spouting nonsense! A magical computer hacker!) It was great to see Ron Glass but if we see him more than a couple of times in the season I'll be really surprised.

Some of the dialogue is good but some of the lines ("Technobabble technobabble" "IN ENGLISH!") were just cringe-inducing. I'd rate the writing as ranging between "decent Whedon" to "a bunch of cheap writers were told to write like Whedon"

I'll keep watching for a while but my hopes aren't very high.

Fedaykin98 wrote:

I just keep telling myself "Think how bad the first season of The Next Generation was!"

This is a Whedon show. He isn't going to get seven seasons to work stuff out. Two, tops.

TempestBlayze wrote:

My god this show is borderline painful. The acting is so bad, the pacing is terrible and it's just flat out corny at times.

I really wanted to like this show but I think we are going to stop watching.

This. I'm not liking it much. It doesn't know if it wants to be Alphas or Warehouse 13. It's as good as neither.

Let's talk about what's really important as far as longevity is concerned.

Agents of SHIELD still won its 8pm slot handily, though its ratings slipped quite a bit from its record-setting opener. People are still liking what they're seeing, but we'll see how long that lasts.

I'm still in wait and see mode. The show has its moments, but I have not been wowed by the first 2 eps.

Miashara wrote:

Exactly what was the explanation for that, again?

We've had this discussion before (not you and I, GWJ in general), but it boils down to this: if you have access to huge amounts of power, you can do things like that. See: Tony Stark chest reactor.

A flying aircraft carrier isn't inherently impossible. With enough juice, you can make anything hover. True, it would be wasteful on a colossal scale, and probably could light up a good chunk of the Eastern Seaboard just hovering in place. And you could argue that energy tech like that would have a much more visible impact on the broad society. But, in a world with Arc Reactors, a flying carrier is almost reasonable.

But they don't make air at 40K breathable.

Ok. Whatever you say.

Ming Na was so much better in Stargate. She has a terrible roll in this. My wife and I burst out laughing with the whole wrist de-relocation. That being said, the acting in every Stargate series is 100% better than this. I will take McKay over those two babbling scientists any day.

I think most of you are giving this show too much slack simply because it's Joss. If it wasn't I'm sure most of you would have already stopped watching.

Malor wrote:
Miashara wrote:

Exactly what was the explanation for that, again?

We've had this discussion before (not you and I, GWJ in general), but it boils down to this: if you have access to huge amounts of power, you can do things like that. See: Tony Stark chest reactor.

A flying aircraft carrier isn't inherently impossible. With enough juice, you can make anything hover. True, it would be wasteful on a colossal scale, and probably could light up a good chunk of the Eastern Seaboard just hovering in place. And you could argue that energy tech like that would have a much more visible impact on the broad society. But, in a world with Arc Reactors, a flying carrier is almost reasonable.

But they don't make air at 40K breathable.

I think you're missing the point. That plane should not be able to fly at all. The extra two engines wouldn't work, and that giant structure would disrupt the airflow over the actual C-17 wing enough that by rights, it shouldn't fly. So we're already at the "let's ignore basic physics", because at its core, there is nothing overly complex or advanced about Bernoulli.

I dunno... I'm enjoying it, I really like the cast thus far. Yeah, Fitz-Simmons are a little hard to understand, but I think that actually comes down more to sound editting... which always seems to have more music in the background than it needs for their conversations (which are generally low key moments anyway when they are going nuts with technobabble)... but I like them because they kind of remind me of Kinzie talking to the Boss with "Finally, something you said made sense!" "It did the first time, too!"

I dunno, it's a little predictable, but I like it.

My gripe for episode 2 was pretty minor... I wish shows would stop trying to be Breaking Bad with some totally bizarre starting scene that has no context, no explanation, blah blah blah... and then we flash back X number of hours, days, whatever to get to the start and work our way back to that scene. Seriously, I saw a hole in a plane, someone flying out of it, and then we were 19 hours earlier. It worked for Breaking Bad because they were mysteries to figure out... I knew no one on the team was going out that hole, so that left us with, who is getting on the plane this episode... and oh look, some generic dudes, one of you is going to die soon!

Otherwise, I'm enjoying it. Is it Firefly? No. But it's still pretty good, though it seems like, minus the special effects in some areas, that I would have guessed SHIELD was a first show, and Firefly the show where everything learned from the first comes into play.

Goddamn, you people are hard to please.

I think I'm just becoming grumpy middle-aged guy. After the 2nd episode, I'm still into the premise. Given that it is a major network show in the 8pm slot, it is doing a good job of bringing geek genre stuff to prime time. Most of the shows it is compared to were aired on minor networks or later than primetime. This has to appeal to kids and families as well as the geek demographic.

With all that in mind, I'm ok with it. It's not great TV, but it isn't really screwing up yet. Where the grumpy middle-aged guy comes in is that I'm only interested in the older characters. Colson and Ming-na are anchoring the show. I care about what happens to them and they do interesting stuff. The kids, on the other hand, are kind of annoying. Spy-bro is a bro. The hacker from Urban Outfitters is a social media manager. The UK nerds are the whitest attempt at diversity ever. But, you know, it is a network show.

If nothing else, I think it will have an appeal like the Muppets. While you are watching songs for the kids, eventually they throw in an inside joke for the parents.

I'm definitely grumpy middle-aged dude.

Given that not many of us have come out and said "This show is crap", I think it's less that we're hard to please and more that the nature of this show, given the name attached and the premise itself set itself some high standards. Many of us loved Wheedon's older shows, and in that frame, it's not hitting the same benchmarks that have come before.

AnimeJ wrote:

Given that not many of us have come out and said "This show is crap", I think it's less that we're hard to please and more that the nature of this show, given the name attached and the premise itself set itself some high standards. Many of us loved Whedon's older shows, and in that frame, it's not hitting the same benchmarks that have come before.

I'm not going to lie, I think that's everyone's problem in the dislike. You need to separate this show from Joss. Yes, you have very high expectations from him due to past projects, but he's not the show runner. He's the creator, and he's a busy guy that has a lot of other projects right now. And like Oso said, it has to appeal to a wide market. 8 pm on a Tuesday is a prime slot for kids/family and basically anyone that isn't as involved in the MCU.

I know I had to separate the show from his past projects, and that was hard because there are a lot of expectations in his writing and what I'm looking for. But going into it with an open mind as a "New Show" and less of a "Whedon Show," it still has it's faults, but there's less of a letdown about the lack of Whedonverse things I'm looking for. The show will find it's legs. If by the sixth episode it really hasn't, or even midway through the first season it's still this lost puppy, then perhaps I'll change my stance. I'm still going to enjoy it for it's campy ways and lack of physics because this show is part of the escape I need from classes, work and my roommates.

I didn't know (or forgot) that this was Joss Whedon.

I almost switched it off after one of Skye's lines in the restaurant. I guess something inside my head was screaming, "Behave like real people!" during some scenes.

I loved the simple non-explanation of Coulson's reappearance. I don't think you need anything more than that, though "Tahiti" seems to have become a code for something.

Dominic Knight wrote:

I'm not going to lie, I think that's everyone's problem in the dislike. You need to separate this show from Joss. Yes, you have very high expectations from him due to past projects, but he's not the show runner. He's the creator, and he's a busy guy that has a lot of other projects right now. And like Oso said, it has to appeal to a wide market. 8 pm on a Tuesday is a prime slot for kids/family and basically anyone that isn't as involved in the MCU.

I totally agree, which is precisely why I bring up the point. I think a lot of folks get it too, which is why a lot of people are saying "it just needs to find its' legs".

The world and premise of the show give it tremendous potential, and attaching Wheedon's name doesn't hurt either. But I think for this show to really get rolling and be the awesome show it can, a lot of things need to happen, particularly when it comes to how the writers are handling things. I for one can forgive impossible physics, a cast that is far too pretty, and anything else I've forgotten if the writing is good. But the hamfisted nature of the first two episodes makes it hard to like a show that I really, really want to like.

H.P. Lovesauce wrote:

I didn't know (or forgot) that this was Joss Whedon.

I almost switched it off after one of Skye's lines in the restaurant. I guess something inside my head was screaming, "Behave like real people!" during some scenes.

I loved the simple non-explanation of Coulson's reappearance. I don't think you need anything more than that, though "Tahiti" seems to have become a code for something.

The thing is, this isn't Joss Whedon like say Firefly/Serenity was, or Buffy/Angel was. He may be the guy in charge, but my understanding is that he is not active at the writing level like he was for those shows.

I loved the simple non-explanation of Coulson's reappearance. I don't think you need anything more than that, though "Tahiti" seems to have become a code for something.

It's just a magical place.

I still didn't particularly enjoy episode 2. However, I'm still seeing a lot of potential -- enough is there that I'll even give it a full season's worth of character development before writing it off. It was very fun to see the show slip into a stand-alone episode form in just the 2nd episode.

edosan wrote:

Most of the cast is terrible (except for Gregg and Ming-Na Wen)

I love Ming-Na, like literally, but I think her character's awful so far and she's not been able to do anything to make her interesting. I mean she's just this 1-dimensional "gruff, bad-ass" character. Knock someone out, pose, say one-liner, repeat.

cheeba wrote:
edosan wrote:

Most of the cast is terrible (except for Gregg and Ming-Na Wen)

I love Ming-Na, like literally, but I think her character's awful so far and she's not been able to do anything to make her interesting. I mean she's just this 1-dimensional "gruff, bad-ass" character. Knock someone out, pose, say one-liner, repeat.

Except she clearly hates doing that, and I find the idea intriguing that she was such a badass and took a desk job and was (and remains) resistant to using her old skills. Would be great to find out some tidbits as to why.

Demosthenes wrote:

The thing is, this isn't Joss Whedon like say Firefly/Serenity was, or Buffy/Angel was. He may be the guy in charge, but my understanding is that he is not active at the writing level like he was for those shows.

Yeah this is much more like JJ Abrams with LOST, Fringe, and other shows. He does the pilot, creates the series, and then hands it off to other people to run the day-to-day.

When they were watching the Slingshot, all I could think was that I hope Doctor Doom has set up a space station and is collecting all the dangerous items they thought they were sending into the sun to be destroyed. :p

Well, it would probably be H.A.M.M.E.R., but you know...