JRPG Catch-All

garion333 wrote:
[size=11]Like Valkyria Chronicles, EoE is likely to be another unappreciated gem from the hedgehog-endorsing publisher, especially considering its release date. While in Japan EoE came out just in time for the late January FFXIII burnout, the March madness North American release is likely to ensure that the game is lost among the Final Fantasy / God of War kerfuffle.

I hope to be wrong about that, since it's a better game than FFXIII. Better graphics? Better music? Better story? No. But it's a better game.[/size]

Sounds like that gentleman got on The Internets' popularity backlash train.

I'm probably going to check out RoF, all the more likely if Final Fantasy XIII can manage to rekindle my interest in the genre (on non-handhelds, that is).

Final Fantasy releases are interesting to observe in my eyes. Journalists sometimes pooh-pooh it, people on forums talk loads of heated yang about it, but at the end of the month it'll have sold 1.5 million copies and all those people, when you ask them "Did you buy Final Fantasy?" have the same response.

"Well, yeah."

Kinda like a new Metallica album.

Here's his review of FFXIII. Make your own decisions about his view of the FF franchise. I happen to agree with him.

People still buy Metallica albums?

garion333 wrote:

People still buy Metallica albums?

garion333 wrote:

Apparently Nippon Ichi has a game called Last Rebellion coming out at the end of this month. I've heard nothing about. Absolutely nothing.

The reason you haven't heard anything about it is because there's nothing to hear. It's Nippon Ichi's first 3D game and so far it looks extremely generic. I haven't seen any of the flavor and style that N1 is famous for, except in little game-based "comic strips" they include in their newsletter, and even then it doesn't give me hope. I'm interested to see how it turns out but right now Last Rebellion is in my "wasted opportunity" column. The best I can hope is that the "Last" part is more accurate than the "Final" in "Final Fantasy."

I agree with you in that I'm not terribly interested in FF13. I don't know why. Maybe it's because their entire PR campaign so far has been, "it's the next Final Fantasy game. You're welcome. Now stop asking about FF7." I was interested in what they'd do with a female protagonist but then I found out she's just one of several (doing a split storyline kind of thing, which I normally don't like) and that her design document was essentially, "make Cloud but with boobs."

Meanwhile, Resonance of Fate looks pretty damn awesome.

Oh, and also...

[size=30]METALLICA! WOOOO!![/size]

LobsterMobster wrote:

that her design document was essentially, "make Cloud but with boobs."

Oh man, that's too funny. lol

LobsterMobster wrote:

Meanwhile, Resonance of Fate looks pretty damn awesome.

It's like tri-Ace lured John Woo into a dark alley, extracted his essence and then injected it into their game engine. If there ends up being a slo-motion scene where doves take flight then I might shed a tear of joy.

garion333 wrote:

Here's his review of FFXIII. Make your own decisions about his view of the FF franchise. I happen to agree with him.

People still buy Metallica albums?

Eh, their last one went platinum.

Frankly, that review is full of logical holes and a bit of misinformation. I can't help but get the feeling the guy has an agenda. I agree with him about VII and X being overrated, but I know his sort (the import master who scoffs at dubs and thinks people find him cool for it), and they are not to be relied upon for unbiased opinions.

For instance, he claims the battle system is real time. It is not. Characters and enemies are moving constantly to make it seem so, but the game does not move on without your input. At least that's what I gleaned from a giant bomb hands on video. It may seem nitpicky of me to point out such a mistake, but I feel a man in his position should be more careful.

The guy states the game's biggest flaw is replay value. Have the Final Fantasy games ever been terribly replayable? I haven't beaten one multiple times since I have been able to purchase games on my own. There's a reason we replayed FF3 for SNES 6 times, and that reason was we got 5 games a year unless we saved our lunch money and went hungry for 4th and 5th period. Dude also claims he started a new game in Star Ocean 3 as soon as he beat it, which throws his judgement into question in my eyes. If he wants 200 hours out of his JRPGs, that's his business, but I have other things to start playing. *Edit: Like Resonance of Fate, ha!*

The biggest issue I take with his review is this:

Strip away all of the amazing visuals and music and you have a 7, 7.5 game that scrapes by on the virtues of its combat.

Combine that with his claim that the narrative may be the strongest in the series, and I can't take him seriously as a reviewer. He has a slant, clearly.

Imagine sticking that at the end of your Uncharted 2 review. "Take away the amazing visuals and the fluid, compelling combat and the epic music and the great narrative and you get a pretty standard third person shooter." It just doesn't make sense to your average player.

LarryC wrote:

JRPGs as a classification is a misnomer.

I agree entirely, but it's a misnomer that's broadly understood within this community and the Western video gaming community as a whole. It speaks as much to a style of presentation as it does to mechanics, but ultimately, like other overly-broad genre names like "first-person shooter" and "survival horror," is more useful as a jumping-off point for conversation than as a destination.

As you and others have commented on elsewhere, the GWJ community is, generally speaking, slanted in favor of Western-developed, D&D-inspired RPGs and slanted against Japanese-developed, anime-inspired RPGs. While threads about Mass Effect tend to get dozens of responses even now, threads about games like Resonance of Fate tend to get lost in the shuffle and die on the vine. My goal with this thread is to create a place on the boards where people who tend to like JRPGs (or games classified as JRPGs) can have somewhat more sustained conversations about upcoming and new titles.

Classifying Final Fantasy with Fragile is a little like classifying Mass Effect 2 with Bookworm Adventures because they're both done by Western developers.

The reason why many people like Final Fantasy isn't because they like "JRPGs." It's because they like Final Fantasy. They Specifically like Final Fantasy. Doesn't mean they'll like Arc the Lad or Chrono Trigger or Disgaea or Tales series.

That's just it: this thread is for people who do like Arc the Lad and Chrono Trigger, etc., and are looking for games in that same vein.

For my part, I'm looking forward to Fragile on the Wii. It's classed "JRPG" by some, but it's really a third person exploration game with what looks to be real-time combat and flashlight exploration mechanics. I suspect it might have more similarities to Shattered Hill than it does to Chrono Trigger..

I've waffled on listing Fragile because it doesn't look much like a JRPG to me, either. However, I've seen it classified as a JRPG on most sites like Gamefly and Amazon, so I included it.

In any case, you're obviously someone who is well-versed in the genre (such as it is), and I look forward to hearing what you have to say about some of these games as you play them. As always, if you can think of titles that I haven't included in the original post, or if you really think I've dropped the ball by including something, let me know.

garion333 wrote:

That cover is absurd.

RPG Fan did an import review of End of Eternity (aka Resonance of Fate). I think I'm fully on board. I think I may just skip FFXIII. I'm not terribly excited for FFXII anyway. FFXII killed any and all excitement I had for the series.

Want. Want now. Seriously, I've been wanting a new JRPG-style game.

BishopRS wrote:
LobsterMobster wrote:

that her design document was essentially, "make Cloud but with boobs."

Oh man, that's too funny. lol

It'd be a lot funnier if I wasn't serious. I wish I had a link but I think "feminized version of Cloud" is the quote.

I love reading this thread. I loved Arc the Lad and Chrono Trigger....and even a few Tales titles. Due to life happening (damn life) I have been knocked down in free time to be able to enjoy many long RPG's. With this, it is hard to even keep track of whats new and up and coming and something I may actually like.

This thread does all the work for me YAY!

LobsterMobster wrote:
BishopRS wrote:
LobsterMobster wrote:

that her design document was essentially, "make Cloud but with boobs."

Oh man, that's too funny. lol

It'd be a lot funnier if I wasn't serious. I wish I had a link but I think "feminized version of Cloud" is the quote.

To be fair, I think that's a much more realistic character.

All the wonderful PSP games that I don't get to play...

garion333 wrote:

Anyway, I like what Mr. Clark is saying about RoF:

[size=11]Like Valkyria Chronicles, EoE is likely to be another unappreciated gem from the hedgehog-endorsing publisher, especially considering its release date. While in Japan EoE came out just in time for the late January FFXIII burnout, the March madness North American release is likely to ensure that the game is lost among the Final Fantasy / God of War kerfuffle.

I hope to be wrong about that, since it's a better game than FFXIII. Better graphics? Better music? Better story? No. But it's a better game.[/size]

That's definitely put it on my watchlist. If reviews are good-to-middling, I'll pick it up later in the year. My knickers are already pretwisted for Final Fantasy, and it's too late to untwist them.

garion333 wrote:

And Jonman, just for you because of your clear love of Star Ocean TLH:

[size=11][RoF's] story is good enough to make you wonder if it was really developed by Tri-Ace.[/size]

Glee!

To be fair to Star Ocean, I've got no issue with it's story. Sure it was forgettable and disposable, but it didn't make me want to claw my eyes out and beat myself to death with the controller like the script and voicework did.

garion333 wrote:

People still buy Metallica albums?

Interestingly enough, the most recent Metallica album is the first one I've bought since, oooh, about 1996.

Resonance of Fate looks cool. Might grab that one.

Re: Eternal Sonata, I believe my hatred for this title is well documented. I remember flipping back and forth between the Japanese and English voiceovers because they were both equally annoying. Then I started skipping cut scenes (which I never do on my first playthrough). Then I buried the game underneath a hefty pile of plastic instruments.

Still, I recently toyed with the idea of trying it again, with some sort of game diary serving as an outlet for my rage. I believe that my problem the first time was that I had to play it like some kind of secretive pedophile, because I was embarrassed to let my girlfriend or anyone else hear the dialog. The pressure!

IGN has a preview of the PS2 version of Sakura Wars: So Long, My Love. It sounds somewhat bizarre and yet strangely compelling.

I'm not familiar with the Sakura Wars series (it hasn't been localized for North America until now), but it was developed by the same team as Valkyria Chronicles, which I understand to be awesome. The Sakura Wars games are apparently all dating sim/strategy game hybrids where you'll spend half your time romancing the ladies and the other half blowing things up with giant robots. Whether and to what extent your (all female) partners like you determines their stats in combat.

I'm curious to check this out, but I'm wary of the dating sim aspects of it. The dating portion of Rune Factory Frontier ultimately wore that game out for me (for now; I do fully intend to go back to it some day).

In a bit of retro JRPG goodness, Grandia is now available for download on PSN.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

In a bit of retro JRPG mediocrity Grandia is now available for download on PSN.

FTFY.

I beat that game on PS1 and have wondered ever since what all the hubbub was about. Almost every character was as annoying as possible.

Blind_Evil wrote:
ClockworkHouse wrote:

In a bit of retro JRPG mediocrity Grandia is now available for download on PSN.

FTFY.

I beat that game on PS1 and have wondered ever since what all the hubbub was about. Almost every character was as annoying as possible.

It definitely falls into the typical JRPG cliche of "kids going on an adventure", but the saving grace for Grandia is the battle system, I think. You would be hard-pressed to find a JRPG system that balances real-time effects of range and area of effect in a turn-based system like Grandia.

The problem with Grandia is that it just never has seemed to click in all the right areas at all the right times. If you took the plot and music from the first Grandia and slapped it onto the battle system of the second Grandia, you would have a pretty decent game. As the games stand now, though, you get something less than that - not sure if I would say mediocrity, overall, but something that really has limited appeal to fans of the genre.

OzymandiasAV wrote:

It definitely falls into the typical JRPG cliche of "kids going on an adventure", but the saving grace for Grandia is the battle system, I think. You would be hard-pressed to find a JRPG system that balances real-time effects of range and area of effect in a turn-based system like Grandia.

The battle system was good, but after a few hours I started to notice that many of those great features aren't even necessary. By which I mean, the game is way too easy; you can beat every bad guy without any kind of tactical action whatsoever. Very disillusioning.

Yeah, point taken. That issue (which is a typical failing of a LOT of JRPGs, mind you) is definitely in play for Grandia. If the enemies don't offer any incentive to dig into tactics to win, then the wider variety of tactics don't really matter as much. And Grandia should do a better job of giving players that incentive - having the enemies level up with the players (e.g. FFVIII, Oblivion), throttling experience gains once a certain power level is reached (e.g. the Suikoden series), etc.

At "first contact", though, when you're hitting enemy groups for the first couple of times, the Grandia system does give you different alternatives that have value. And, given that a lot of "dead weight" in JRPGs typically comes in the lower-level "creep" encounters, I feel like that helps out Grandia a lot. Not enough to make it the runaway success that some people will call it - as down as I am on something like Final Fantasy VII, my mind boggles whenever anybody puts Grandia above that one - but enough to make it worth attention, especially as a $10 download that you can potentially take with you on the go.

OzymandiasAV wrote:

If the enemies don't offer any incentive to dig into tactics to win, then the wider variety of tactics don't really matter as much.

I've patented a term for that phenomenon: "The Mass Effect 2 Effect."

But that's a whole different axe-grind.

I do remember initially being intrigued by the game's combat and that big wall deal, but that's about it.

An amazing guitarist on YouTube, lonlonjp, has a channel full of JRPG songs he has arranged for classical/acoustic. There are songs from series such as Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Chrono ___, Zelda, Castlevania and even some anime.

Check him out here: http://www.youtube.com/lonlonjp

Today's the day for Lunar: Silver Star Harmony. As I was saying in the March 1 - March 5 thread, this game might not be Chrono Trigger but it certainly competes in the charm department. If you have a PSP and have not played an earlier incarnation of the game, you owe it to yourself to give it a try.

There is a downloadable demo for it available, and finishing the demo gives you some "bonus starting equipment"... I don't know what yet. I ran through it and it looks quite nice. The old turn-based battles (which are not random, you see foes on-screen) are made less tedious by one-button-press "tactics" and "party AI" for the times you just need everybody to attack until your weak foes are dead.

beeporama wrote:

Today's the day for Lunar: Silver Star Harmony. As I was saying in the March 1 - March 5 thread, this game might not be Chrono Trigger but it certainly competes in the charm department. If you have a PSP and have not played an earlier incarnation of the game, you owe it to yourself to give it a try.

To this day, my pal and I still find reason to use The Big Boss' Zinger: "We will see who is fit to be supreme ruler, and who....is dead!"

I second this emotion. If you haven't played Lunar you really should, it's a hoot.

I was interested in Infinite Space and now after going through this thread Resonance of Fate also. Valkyria Chronicles was indeed underappreciated which i have not finished it yet.

EDIT

I am actually torn between starting over or trying to continue. I think i am quite far in but i don't remember much of how the game is played.....Any suggestions?

Zolos wrote:

I was interested in Infinite Space and now after going through this thread Resonance of Fate also. Valkyria Chronicles was indeed underappreciated which i have not finished it yet.

EDIT

I am actually torn between starting over or trying to continue. I think i am quite far in but i don't remember much of how the game is played.....Any suggestions?

Redo some of the skirmishes to refamiliarize yourself.

Also, a couple people just started playing the game recently so we gave a bunch of tips in the catchall thread.

garion333 wrote:
Zolos wrote:

I was interested in Infinite Space and now after going through this thread Resonance of Fate also. Valkyria Chronicles was indeed underappreciated which i have not finished it yet.

EDIT

I am actually torn between starting over or trying to continue. I think i am quite far in but i don't remember much of how the game is played.....Any suggestions?

Redo some of the skirmishes to refamiliarize yourself.

Also, a couple people just started playing the game recently so we gave a bunch of tips in the catchall thread.

[quote]

Thx garrion333. I will try getting some practice with skirmishes first.

Just a heads-up for everyone: if you were wanting to get the Wii version of Phantom Brave (Phantom Brave: We Meet Again), you might want to do so soon. I've noticed it being listed as unavailable through a few different online retailers (Amazon included), so I think it might be going out of print. I was able to pick up a copy tonight from Best Buy, though, so it's hardly a rare gem, yet.

Golden Sun is to me what Chrono Trigger is for many people, I'll pick it up if it's an improvement on the GBA version. I hope they release the sequel too as I never got into it.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

Just a heads-up for everyone: if you were wanting to get the Wii version of Phantom Brave (Phantom Brave: We Meet Again), you might want to do so soon. I've noticed it being listed as unavailable through a few different online retailers (Amazon included), so I think it might be going out of print. I was able to pick up a copy tonight from Best Buy, though, so it's hardly a rare gem, yet.

Mostly because I'm a lazy bastard... is this just a port of the PS2 game or a spinoff/sequel? The Wii library + VC stuff is building to a point I might need to pick one up again.