New WH40K MMOG

Odds on this making it to market??

http://kotaku.com/theres-a-new-warha...

TotalBiscuit mentioned this on Twitter the other day. Isn't the studio doing this a shovelware producer?

AnimeJ wrote:

TotalBiscuit mentioned this on Twitter the other day. Isn't the studio doing this a shovelware producer?

They did the HALO:Waypoint app is all i know them from.

Maybe they're wanting to dip their toes in the big boy pool?

New WH40K MMOG

Same as the old WH40K MMOG.

Okay, okay I will give this a fair shot because this mmo needs to be made. But it sure is sounding like it is starting off the same way as "Dark Prophesy" I think it was dubbed. And perhaps even worse footing since Vigil at least had Darkstalkers under its belt.

Looking at Behavior's wiki, they've got a few notables on there(Mercenaries 2 anyone?), but 90% of it is shovelware crap. Here's hoping they're taking this seriously and are putting forth effort; that's a pretty big stigma to overcome. I'll put myself down as optimistic, but only because I really want to see another good, well done 40k game, MMO or otherwise.

AnimeJ wrote:

Looking at Behavior's wiki, they've got a few notables on there(Mercenaries 2 anyone?), but 90% of it is shovelware crap. Here's hoping they're taking this seriously and are putting forth effort; that's a pretty big stigma to overcome. I'll put myself down as optimistic, but only because I really want to see another good, well done 40k game, MMO or otherwise.

Mercenaries 2 was universally reviled as a buggy mess. Some might even call it an insult to its namesake.

Just sayin.

To their credit, they only did the PS2 version. So they didn't make the buggy mess, they just ported it.

LobsterMobster wrote:
AnimeJ wrote:

Looking at Behavior's wiki, they've got a few notables on there(Mercenaries 2 anyone?), but 90% of it is shovelware crap. Here's hoping they're taking this seriously and are putting forth effort; that's a pretty big stigma to overcome. I'll put myself down as optimistic, but only because I really want to see another good, well done 40k game, MMO or otherwise.

Mercenaries 2 was universally reviled as a buggy mess. Some might even call it an insult to its namesake.

Just sayin.

To their credit, they only did the PS2 version. So they didn't make the buggy mess, they just ported it.

Fair enough. I didn't play it all that much and skimmed the thread around here. So, we'll strike that off as being something that's credit to team.

Doritos Crash Course wasn't terrible.

This is so the best part...

Miguel told us straight away that the game will be available on PC, Xbox One, and PS4 as a premium Free-to-Play MMORPG. The free race available to everyone will be the Orks. But free players will only be able to progress through the game’s content Ork Boyz: five of which are needed to take down one Space Marine. Behaviour expects that F2P members will always outnumber paid players and the Ork Boyz are their way of balancing F2P with paid members. Once someone becomes invested in the game, they can purchase the other races and open up the full progression paths for each (including the Orks).

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/g...

Umm... so as a free player I'm supposed to be a whipping boy for pay-to-win people? I got better things to do with my time. Like play games that don't discriminate against me because I didn't pay.

MoonDragon wrote:

Umm... so as a free player I'm supposed to be a whipping boy for pay-to-win people? I got better things to do with my time. Like play games that don't discriminate against me because I didn't pay.

Nailed it. I expected to be disappointed by this game, but I didn't expect it to be like this.

Soooo, these devs, they ever actually play these games? I'm seeing one hell of a disconnect there. On the other hand, that's pretty close to the way it should be, many orkz needed to take on a single marine.

Looking over that interview, well, ambitious comes to mind.

I love this idea lol! Though I really do not need to "compete" to have fun. I want an experience in the 40k universe that sorta fits and is a fun+different ride than is currently out.

But.. I think this ork only thing is a mistake. Could go with .....

Imperial = Imp Guard
Chaos = Chaos Cultists
Eldar = i guess some sort of Guardian non aspect sorta guys could work er change wraithguards to suit.. something.........

I say take this idea a just go! Use FTP people as ammo for Shock Attack guns!, Squig catapults or make them follow a ptp "commander type" like a turret for 5 mins cool down an hour to form an optional type of mob,squad whatever. Seems to fit in the 40k theme to me. Specially for Commissars, Ork Nobz, Chaos Champions etc.. reeeeeally fits. Different skill/command tree options to spec into for these sorta deals for ptp I spose.

OR yeah we could get the same_old_ftp_is_just_afew_less_options_than_ptp.zzzz we always get. Really this sort of totally free willed kinda typical FPS crap is ooooold and does not fit so well in 40k. Unless like everyone's ass is a command type.. zzzzzz..

Still sounds interesting to me and more so on the FTP side really. XD..

Lttp here, but that ftp option sounds potentially pretty cool. It probably won't work in practice, but the idea is novel and in keeping with the setting.

It feels like GW and Behavoir are taking a big risk that newcomers to WH40K will enjoy being a whipping post so much that they turn premium. Or is this the theory that it will infuriate people so much that they go premium to abuse others, instead of just doing a ragequit? Very bad feeling about this.

Still, if I can get a half decent way to play as an Eldar, I'll probably be there doing it. Cursed thematic addictions!

But the thing is, if the ftp population is way higher you won't be a whipping boy. Well, if you play solo you're toast, but being way less powerful will force grouping. And huge groups of rampaging orks will trouble premium players who are careless. It could actually encourage group play.

Theoretically at least.

As I said, the chances of it working well are slim, but I'm a bit surprised that people are immediately and completely dismissing a really creative idea.

MrDeVil909 wrote:

But the thing is, if the ftp population is way higher you won't be a whipping boy. Well, if you play solo you're toast, but being way less powerful will force grouping. And huge groups of rampaging orks will trouble premium players who are careless. It could actually encourage group play.

Theoretically at least.

As I said, the chances of it working well are slim, but I'm a bit surprised that people are immediately and completely dismissing a really creative idea.

I agree that it's an interesting and creative approach to a F2P game. I also think that it's a really bad approach to the same, doubly so given the way that a majority of players play MMOs these days. The way I'd see this working out is that you'll have a lot of folks who are going to pony up to play Marines, especially if it's anything approaching reasonable. What you'll be left with on the free races will be a largely unorganized, solo playing mess of individuals, some of whom will be the loud, obnoxious, vocal minority complaining nigh endlessly about how broken the game is and that it's doomed to fail.

TL;DR: Fantastic idea, but not one that will likely thrive in the current market.

It could hypothetically work. One of the key components to why nobody complains about dying in FPS's since Quake is that it is easy to regroup. The main griefing complaints are spawn camping and sniper exploits that can be fixed with rotating spawn points and better map design.

It would actually be awesome if there was something like warhammer fantasy's ork launching catapults. So that paid ork players can boost the free players or use them in more tactical ways.

The whole idea is just wrong to me... having a playing field where those with the advantage are there just because they spent money.

fangblackbone wrote:

It could hypothetically work. One of the key components to why nobody complains about dying in FPS's since Quake is that it is easy to regroup. The main griefing complaints are spawn camping and sniper exploits that can be fixed with rotating spawn points and better map design.

It would actually be awesome if there was something like warhammer fantasy's ork launching catapults. So that paid ork players can boost the free players or use them in more tactical ways.

Yea, I just don't see it working real well in anything like an MMO though. Like ranalin points out, something like this would be a true pay to win game.

MrDeVil909 wrote:

...

As I said, the chances of it working well are slim, but I'm a bit surprised that people are immediately and completely dismissing a really creative idea.

Actually, if they were pushing the Imperial Guard as the FTP faction (props to Greenbeandemon), the concept might stand a reasonable chance. People would identify well with underdog humans.

Instead people will be asked to identify with an outclassed member of the marauding goofball race of WH40K as an intro to the game. I just don't see this winning many new people over.

It could be worse, f2p could be limited to gretchin.

As long as we are thinking creative though, how about we make the tactical space/chaos marines the f2p character and anything other than them pay classes. The tacticals have access to special weapons/armor/outfits using in-game currency. Then make cannon fodder races (orks, tyrannids, IG) p2p to buy a squad commander that you play personally. As a commander they give you a whole squad of bots to run around with you, supporting and assaulting with you. Give me a Nob with 10 Sluggaboyz, please. Now THAT would be WAAAAAAGH!

Aeyr wrote:
MrDeVil909 wrote:

...

As I said, the chances of it working well are slim, but I'm a bit surprised that people are immediately and completely dismissing a really creative idea.

Actually, if they were pushing the Imperial Guard as the FTP faction (props to Greenbeandemon), the concept might stand a reasonable chance. People would identify well with underdog humans.

Instead people will be asked to identify with an outclassed member of the marauding goofball race of WH40K as an intro to the game. I just don't see this winning many new people over.

It could be worse, f2p could be limited to gretchin.

As long as we are thinking creative though, how about we make the tactical space/chaos marines the f2p character and anything other than them pay classes. The tacticals have access to special weapons/armor/outfits using in-game currency. Then make cannon fodder races (orks, tyrannids, IG) p2p to buy a squad commander that you play personally. As a commander they give you a whole squad of bots to run around with you, supporting and assaulting with you. Give me a Nob with 10 Sluggaboyz, please. Now THAT would be WAAAAAAGH!

Whole heartedly agree - a RTS/MMO that actually plays like 40K would be awesome. As far as pay to win goes, my experience is its disastrous. Maybe if a popular race was FTP (Chaos cultists might actually work), then it would have a chance. As it stands now, orks are one of the least popular choices both in tabletop and other MMOs like WOW and Warhammer Online.

What I really don't understand is how easy it would be to make money selling cosmetic upgrades in an item store. Anyone who has played 40K immediately understand fans of the franchise want to customize the heck out of their characters. You could make a bundle offering little tweaks like purity seals or skulls, or by offering certain army designs just for paying customers.

They should at least do the tiered starter packs seen in recent f2p mmos.

Whenever I think WH40k, Space Marine is what comes to mind above all else. To be forced to play the Orcs is like being forced to play the Wonder Twins in a f2p DC Universe MMO.

At the very least they should allow players to play as entry level characters in whatever factions they have represented. Allow advancement but allowing people to sped it up through paying would be acceptable. For example, start me off as an initiate Space Marine.

Nevin73 wrote:

To be forced to play the Orcs is like being forced to play the Wonder Twins in a f2p DC Universe MMO.

Or starting as an Ewok in a Star Wars MMO with the option to play a Jedi for only $25.00. I'm definitely not keen on the idea that WH40K seems to be going with here but I'm not going to scream about it and demand that heads roll before I see something.

I'll definitely be waiting on impressions before hopping in on day one, unlike what I tend to do with almost every other free MMO that comes across my screen. I've just had bad experiences with FTP games that lock away what I consider core game mechanics behind a pay wall.

Kehama wrote:
Nevin73 wrote:

To be forced to play the Orcs is like being forced to play the Wonder Twins in a f2p DC Universe MMO.

Or starting as an Ewok in a Star Wars MMO with the option to play a Jedi for only $25.00. I'm definitely not keen on the idea that WH40K seems to be going with here but I'm not going to scream about it and demand that heads roll before I see something.

I'll definitely be waiting on impressions before hopping in on day one, unlike what I tend to do with almost every other free MMO that comes across my screen. I've just had bad experiences with FTP games that lock away what I consider core game mechanics behind a pay wall.

I'm just surprised GW is ok with this. They tend to be a bit more protective of their IPs and this has dead in the water written all over it...

40K has some good properties - I am looking at you Dawn of War. But this Ork f2p versus supermanly pay to win Space Marine idea sounds ill-conceived. No way that is going to fly well.

ranalin wrote:
Kehama wrote:
Nevin73 wrote:

To be forced to play the Orcs is like being forced to play the Wonder Twins in a f2p DC Universe MMO.

Or starting as an Ewok in a Star Wars MMO with the option to play a Jedi for only $25.00. I'm definitely not keen on the idea that WH40K seems to be going with here but I'm not going to scream about it and demand that heads roll before I see something.

I'll definitely be waiting on impressions before hopping in on day one, unlike what I tend to do with almost every other free MMO that comes across my screen. I've just had bad experiences with FTP games that lock away what I consider core game mechanics behind a pay wall.

I'm just surprised GW is ok with this. They tend to be a bit more protective of their IPs and this has dead in the water written all over it...

Honestly, when it comes to video games, GW has shown that they are far more able to launch crap than they are to launch something awesome. Up until Dawn of War launched, pretty much every game they'd ever published was crap. And since DoW, they've managed to gack things up a few times as well; look at some of the DLC for DoW and DoW2. Mostly good, but a couple of them got hard panned pretty bad.

AnimeJ wrote:

Honestly, when it comes to video games, GW has shown that they are far more able to launch crap than they are to launch something awesome. Up until Dawn of War launched, pretty much every game they'd ever published was crap. And since DoW, they've managed to gack things up a few times as well; look at some of the DLC for DoW and DoW2. Mostly good, but a couple of them got hard panned pretty bad.

GW has had a lot of misses, but pre DoW there were still some good ones. The Space Hulk game was exceptional, a very good solo computer game that was also very true to the board game. Final Liberation, the Epic based game was good, or at least I enjoyed it.

Then there were the others, Shadow of the Horned Rat, Chaos Gate, Fire Warrior. Those were pretty bad. Can't say anything about the others (the other four Warhammer titles, the Heroquest stuff, etc), don't know anything about them, but their rep is pretty bad.

This was not the one I was looking for. This is the team talking about the game and answering question about various things. Like the game engine they have not decided on yet.

http://www.twitch.tv/40kcrusade/b/42...

Going to see if I can get the link for the one Brizahd told me about. They were talking about why the Ork Boyz are ftp. Something about things like the sorta trolling, t-bagging, don't wanna follow orders, crude behavior etc would actually fit the Ork Mob and be more concentrated in the FTP crowd. Sorta made me think they foresee a notable amount less of this from the ptp people and yeah that has this wrong smell to it, like old burritos. XD.

Sounds like in a ork boyz mob maybe I could get me a nice keg of shear dumbassery and I wantz a drank!
Do stuff like make OBO, Ork Boy Oppertations .. have a banner with some scrappy looking gretchin with some junk yard looking, extra pipey bit having, just plain stupid looking Oboe with a beret and a kilt, riding some half assed smacked together rocketlike thing. If there was a Mek Boy attachment they could go with some giant over heat sinked electric oboe, insane amp having, giant speaker toting, metal helmetafied beret and matching kilt having, same scrappy gretchin + moar techy bits added to rocketlike thing. Eh maybe get some nice twisted evil grinz on their mugs.

Here it is.
WH40K Interview.

G: Did you choose the business model you’ll use with Eternal Crusade? Pay to Play of Free to Play?
M: That’s a very important point. One of the things I don’t like in the industry is that I feel that there’s always conflict between free players and committed players. These two types of players are both important to the industry, but they’re always conflicting with each other. Those that spend money feel that they’re being screwed over by the company because free players are able to play without having to pay a penny. They also feel that free players are disrespectful of other players and of the rules of the game, creating noise in the game. Do you see this?

G: I see, you expect many free players to be undisciplined like Orks.
M: Exactly! You expect them to be less disciplined. You expect them to be rude. You expect them to defy orders. You expect them to ignore objectives, and to insult you all the time, exactly like Orks would do. We’re taking something that is seen as bad, and we’re transforming it into something true to the IP.
On top of that, just imagine that you love Orks, and you bought the Ork Nob premium option, so now you’re an Ork general and you’re preparing to attack an objective. You’re going to have five times as many soldiers as the other races under your command, but once you give the order 30-40% of them might obey, while 60-70% will tell you “fu*k you!” and they’ll start running left and right and do whatever they want. And that’s exactly what true Orks would do. 
When you die on the battlefield, you don’t really die immediately. You’re hurt on the ground and cannot move until one of your friends comes and heals you. Though, like in a real battlefield, you have a chance to be executed by the enemy as well. We have that feature and we’re going to provide players with a lot of lore-friendly race-specific executions for free, but we’ll also have hundreds of different microtransaction-based executions.
Just imagine: you spent two hundred dollars on the game. You won four campaigns, and you’re one of the top Space Marine players in your chapter in a huge battle, and suddenly you fail to pay attention and you end up wounded on the ground, and then you see a puny free to play Ork that just started playing the game running towards you and he executes you in a very humiliating way (because Orks are like that), for instance by choking you by sitting with his butt in your face with the teabagging execution he purchased for $1.
He also records it, because we have an API to post things like these on Facebook and Youtube, humiliating you in front of everyone. So all the free players that see that video will want to buy all kinds of humiliating executions to troll the space marines as much as they can. With this we’ll even be able to monetize trolling.
In response you’ll be so pissed, and I promise you, you’ll remember that Ork’s name and you’ll make it one of the next objectives of your chapter to obliterate that guy. He’s going to hide, because your whole squad is going to run all over the place to find him. Those free players that like to piss off other players and grief their gameplay will be trying to avoid contact and just wait for someone else to fall on the ground in order to run to them and execute them with another humiliating animation. And that’s what Orks would do in the Warhammer 40k universe. They would kill you while you’re defenseless, and then sit on your face and dance around you. This will be our approach to monetization.

Doubtful it will work the way they want but I have to say it does sound like orks. I am one who will pay to play a spacemarine but I can also see myself playing a ork when I want to have fun and be stupid. Also a little surprised they seem to have a real lax attitude with griefing?