System Shock 2 coming to GOG.com

I downloaded some mods, and then decided that I would rather play vanilla.

Scratched, thanks for reminding me about Black Mesa. I always intended to check it out.

I think the game from GoG already has at least one of the graphics mods installed. Were the cut scenes always a lot lower resolution than the game itself? I don't remember it that way. It's jarring, really.

tanstaafl wrote:

I think the game from GoG already has at least one of the graphics mods installed. Were the cut scenes always a lot lower resolution than the game itself? I don't remember it that way. It's jarring, really.

460x480, which to be fair was kind of the base resolution in those days. Kind of like how we've had to put up with 720p video for ages now.

we've had to put up with 720p video

Hah, that made me smile. Oh nooo, mere 720p, how will we cope?

About the only time I see much difference between 720 and higher resolutions is when there's text to be read. As long as it's just regular video, of people and scenery and stuff, I find it really difficult to see any improvement with 1080p.

It is nice for text, though. I assume other fine detail would benefit too, but I can't think of any examples offhand.

Malor wrote:
we've had to put up with 720p video

Hah, that made me smile. Oh nooo, mere 720p, how will we cope?

About the only time I see much difference between 720 and higher resolutions is when there's text to be read. As long as it's just regular video, of people and scenery and stuff, I find it really difficult to see any improvement with 1080p.

It is nice for text, though. I assume other fine detail would benefit too, but I can't think of any examples offhand.

It's the difference between being a proportion of the screen, and X pixels tall. I did play around with UI scaling in windows last year and it's much easier to read. There's a trade-off against screen 'real estate' but I managed at lower resolutions before somehow. It's a shame windows scaling (for 'primitive' pre-metro stuff) is so clunky, I'd be willing for them to break backwards compatibility if that's what it took to make the ultimate modern desktop experience, but MS (and most everyone else) doesn't seem to be interested.

I usually wait for a GOG.com sale, but not on this one. Still haven't played it, but it's still a no-brainer. I've tried getting the original running, and let's face it...it's just better to let GOG handle the scutwork.

Malor wrote:

Hah, that made me smile. Oh nooo, mere 720p, how will we cope?

About the only time I see much difference between 720 and higher resolutions is when there's text to be read. As long as it's just regular video, of people and scenery and stuff, I find it really difficult to see any improvement with 1080p.

For me, the issue is that when you're on PC, you tend to be gaming at 1080p. So it comes off as jarring when a game that goes back and forth between actual gameplay and in-engine cutscenes, and the latter looks significantly lower in quality as a result.

I know they do it for consistency (everyone sees the same even if their detail level is set to low), but I'd really prefer it if games did their cutscenes in-engine rather than going to pre-rendered. There's limits, but it just looks awkward when you switch out to video, especially on PC where you're now likely to have the game at higher quality than they'll be shipping video in.

So it comes off as jarring when a game that goes back and forth between actual gameplay and in-engine cutscenes,

Hmm, for whatever reason, that doesn't bother me. I was noticing a related issue a fair bit with my replay of Thief last year, where I'd go from my nice 1280x800 3D graphics to whatever ridiculously low video resolution they were running (320x200, maybe?) That bothered me, for sure. It looked like crap.

But I don't mind 720p video, even mixed into a 2560x1600 game, as long as I'm not expected to read text. Well, and as long as they're doing high-quality compression; they can certainly make 720p look bad if they use a low bitrate.

Thief didn't matter so much to me, because they used the drawn/animated style. Show me something I can't see in-game in a movie, I think it falls down a little when you're showing the game world, just not as well as the game itself.

Scratched wrote:

I know they do it for consistency (everyone sees the same even if their detail level is set to low), but I'd really prefer it if games did their cutscenes in-engine rather than going to pre-rendered. There's limits, but it just looks awkward when you switch out to video, especially on PC where you're now likely to have the game at higher quality than they'll be shipping video in.

I think it more has to do with the fact that the majority of people are playing the game on consoles, and on there the visual quality of the video and the actual game look identical, especially from farther away.

Also, a lot of times the video cutscenes of stuff they could easily do in-game is actually hiding background loading, so while I agree with you, it's probably easier said than done.

tuffalobuffalo wrote:

That's pretty much why I gave up on the mods when it took more than 5 minutes to figure out.

You're probably overthinking things, because it's almost stupid simple.

Here's what I did:
1. Run SSTool_v50.exe for latest patching
2. Extract each mod into System Shock 2/DataPermMods folder
3. There is no Step 3. Play game.

One mod had a single line of text that needed to be added to a config file to enable it.

And that was it. That process got me Rebirth, SHTUP, SHMUP, Four Hundred, Virt's Space, and Earth Dynamic Sky. The only things I didn't install yet from the GOG forum FAQ thread on SS2 mods was the ADaoB and related stuff.

I realize that it's not difficult. I had one mod installed but then noticed they had a mod manager thing mentioned in the read me. So, I removed it to go hunt for that thinking that it would make the second mod easier to deal with. However, the link to the second mod recommended by PC Gamer didn't have the actual download, so I just gave up to play the game at that point.

What I played looked fine, so I'll probably just stick with the vanilla version. That being said, the quick process you laid out will make it even easier for me should I decide I need it to look better. I'm just happy that there is 16:9 even if there isn't 2560x1440. 1080p is just fine for the game.

Scratched wrote:

That's how I feel when there's the option of mods. Short of doing something like Black Mesa, it just feels weird and inconsistent. I can easily 'believe' or get immersed in a game if it's coherent, but when you start having a mix of quality in there it breaks the illusion. There's a certain 'right' level of detail for certain eras of games that you need to really push hard to move it into another era.

I have to say, judging from an hour of play, with the mods I installed mentioned a couple of posts back, the game does not look inconsistent at all.

What it looks is crisp. It looks like what my memory says SS2 looked like, upres'd to 1080p. Like some of those "HD remakes" of games in this past console generation, where they would simply polish up the textures and models for viewing at HD resolutions.

So far, I'm super impressed. This set of mods are not one of those attempts to make SS2 look like a new/different game, but rather make SS2 look like 1080p SS2.

Maybe I'll see some seams once I play some more, but so far, it's pretty sharp.

*Legion* wrote:
Scratched wrote:

That's how I feel when there's the option of mods. Short of doing something like Black Mesa, it just feels weird and inconsistent. I can easily 'believe' or get immersed in a game if it's coherent, but when you start having a mix of quality in there it breaks the illusion. There's a certain 'right' level of detail for certain eras of games that you need to really push hard to move it into another era.

I have to say, judging from an hour of play, with the mods I installed mentioned a couple of posts back, the game does not look inconsistent at all.

What it looks is crisp. It looks like what my memory says SS2 looked like, upres'd to 1080p. Like some of those "HD remakes" of games in this past console generation, where they would simply polish up the textures and models for viewing at HD resolutions.

So far, I'm super impressed. This set of mods are not one of those attempts to make SS2 look like a new/different game, but rather make SS2 look like 1080p SS2.

Maybe I'll see some seams once I play some more, but so far, it's pretty sharp.

+1 to all of this. SS2 should look crisp and clean. I fired up my shiny new GoG install and it did not - everything was fuzzy. Installed the mods and it looks more like I remember it instead of how it actually was.

Played through decks 2 and 1 yesterday. Fun and tense. But the cargo bays can kiss my ass. Hearing scary stuff that is above you was fun the first 3-4 times. Too bad there were 8 sections.

This game is balls hard.

I burned a lot of psi taking out some turrets and monkeys and couldn't get past a bunch of bad guys in the med section.

Grumble.

mudbunny wrote:

This game is balls hard.

I burned a lot of psi taking out some turrets and monkeys and couldn't get past a bunch of bad guys in the med section.

Grumble.

Less fighting, more running. That's the ticket.

Psi is the hardest of the paths, by far. Can be totally worth it by deck three, however.

Demiurge wrote:
mudbunny wrote:

This game is balls hard.

I burned a lot of psi taking out some turrets and monkeys and couldn't get past a bunch of bad guys in the med section.

Grumble.

Less fighting, more running. That's the ticket.

Psi is the hardest of the paths, by far. Can be totally worth it by deck three, however.

Yeah, use Psy Armour and run past turrets. Taking them out is too expensive.

Or save your armor piercing rounds for them.

Scratched wrote:

Or save your armor piercing rounds for them.

Waste of ammo and perfectly good turrets. Hacker would simply reprogram and put them to good use.

Most wrote:
Scratched wrote:

Or save your armor piercing rounds for them.

Waste of ammo and perfectly good turrets. Hacker would simply reprogram and put them to good use.

If either of those options are available to you.

It's almost like there are choices to be made that might exclude other options. It's such a bad thing that seems like such a novelty now, and any game trying it would be taking a daring risk. Even in Deus EX:HR you could almost have it all.

Scratched wrote:

It's almost like there are choices to be made that might exclude other options. It's such a bad thing that seems like such a novelty now, and any game trying it would be taking a daring risk. Even in Deus EX:HR you could almost have it all.

Yeah, modern games, and Bioshock was a major offender here, give the player choice, but without any consequences. System Shock 2 does not baby you.

I'm playing a Psi character for the first time and the Med bay has been a challenge because I can't use a gun or do any hacking at all. It's either ping away at turrets with my weak Psi powers, and waste Psi, or shield up and run past them. So far I'm making with the running.

My playthrough last year I did joint gun/psi, and a little into heavy at the end. (later on you can use either psi or nanites to duplicate ammo/hypos) That's a fairly straight forward approach to it. One build I've wanted to try would be melee/exotic, but never got around to it.

A couple of tips:

- Don't forget to grab the basketball from the street level outside the recruitment center! It'll be obvious what to do with it later.
- When going through the tours of duty following basic training, after you come out of tour 2, rather than running straight on to tour 3, turn to your left and look through the window at the protocol droid. Interesting things will happen after a couple of seconds.
- If you're looking for a straight run through the game, the Assault Rifle is by far the most powerful and versatile weapon in the entire game. Save all regular bullets you find until you get one - use the wrench and shotgun instead. Once you drop two French-Epstein devices on an AR you're pretty much covered, provided you stay stocked up on bullets.
- Energy weapons tend to be weak, and not really worth it. The exception is if you spec melee, in which case the Laser Rapier can be worth it.
- Maintenance is useful, Repair is not. Don't waste your cyber modules on it. Any gun you value enough to keep in good repair (HINT: see above) you should never run down to the point of breaking. If you do accidentally break it, there are plenty of AutoRepair units lying around.
- Get your Hacking skill up at least high enough to hack Replicators (level 4 I believe). The increased selection and decreased prices you get from doing this become important later.

Last but not least, two quasi-spoilers:

Spoiler:

- Pay close attention to the audio log about Nikki, and make sure you can hack replicators by the time you hit the Mall. The investment will be worth it.
- If you want a real early leg up, the doorlock code to the MedSci Sub-Armory is 98383.

It took me a while to realize that System Shock 2 was about avoiding combat, except for the parts where you can't avoid it. Uh, you'll know it when you get there. Yup, that's why you've been hoarding ammo.

Ah, the stories I could tell. One of them involves hacked turrets, farming respawns, and justified use of console commands. The other story involves rumblers (plural). Also, monkeys.

I think there's a cheat code to give psi hypos. I went psi in my original playthrough and felt pretty starved for hypos early in the game, and recall finding out about something like that.

complexmath wrote:

I think there's a cheat code to give psi hypos. I went psi in my original playthrough and felt pretty starved for hypos early in the game, and recall finding out about something like that.

So yeah, that's right on the edge of what I consider to be "fair" when playing the game. That is, I remember there being a thing about psi-hypos not being replicator compatible, due to the in-game fiction's version of DRM to prevent counterfeiting. Then again, those things were accessible via vendors, so it's an edge case. I don't remember them being farmable though. That reminds me, I have a half-written article about the line between grinding and cheat codes.

Has anyone tried multiplayer yet? Any stability improvements there?