Yup. Now that's using your head.
Yup. Now that's using your head.
It's a trick! He's using the perfect disguise!
Open fire!
Duck season!! Fire!!
I'm surprised that our police state hasn't been able to locate Dorner faster. I was promised an all-seeing, all-knowing intrusive government, and it can't manage to locate one big black guy whose face is plastered all over the media.
Christopher Dorner in gun battle with authorities, source says
Christopher Dorner was engaged in a shootout with federal authorities in the Big Bear area Tuesday, a law enforcement source told The Times.The shooting occurred after Dorner burglarized a home, tied up a couple and stole their car, the source said.
It was not immediately clear whether Dorner was in custody.
A second source said there was an active crime scene but did not have details.
Law enforcement officials were swarming the area.
I'm surprised that our police state hasn't been able to locate Dorner faster. I was promised an all-seeing, all-knowing intrusive government, and it can't manage to locate one big black guy whose face is plastered all over the media.
The problem is Dorner has not delved deep into Wikipedia and Snopes to find the truth of America, thus getting the FBI to send an electronic pulse into his hand that tracks him via GPS.
Watching the local news... Said one of the victims was able to call 911 after man left, reported the truck stolen, police chase ensured, shoot out occurred.
Officers were injured but it's unclear how many or what department they're from. Big Bear mountain is closed down with a massive group of cop cars heading up there.
Reporters don't know if they're searching for him or if the shoot out is still in progress.
EDIT:
After crashing the stolen car, he fled into the forest and barricaded himself inside a cabin. The shoot out is ongoing with gunfire exchanged on and off for 45 minutes already. Two deputies shot but paramedics are unable to reach them.
This might be the end right here.
So where are those drones with Hellfires already?
So where are those drones with Hellfires already?
Those are reserved for innocent people whose only crime is questioning authority.
I saw a report that another officer was killed before dorner got into a cabin.
The story (really more a rumor) said the cops fired tear gas into the cabin and a fire broke out. No firemen are going to go near it, so it sounds like the cabin is going to burn down around him.
Sounds like they weren't in a mood to wait him out.
I saw a report that another officer was killed before dorner got into a cabin.
The story (really more a rumor) said the cops fired tear gas into the cabin and a fire broke out. No firemen are going to go near it, so it sounds like the cabin is going to burn down around him.
Sounds like they weren't in a mood to wait him out.
Back when I lived in California I remember a shooter that killed an LAPD cop and died when, in a shootout, his house caught fire as well. Wonder if that is the unofficial way to deal with this.
Probable body of Dorner found in charred ruins of the cabin, not positively identified yet.
Back when I lived in California I remember a shooter that killed an LAPD cop and died when, in a shootout, his house caught fire as well. Wonder if that is the unofficial way to deal with this.
It's an understandable reaction. Dorner was heavily armed and had shot two more cops outside the cabin. He wasn't trying to surrender, so he was a threat to every cop in the area. It's understandable that they'd want to end any standoff as quickly as possible.
Well if the cops shot in CS gas, that makes it too dangerous for the fire-fighters to risk their health. If they breathe that in, or get it on their skin, they will be down for the count in a burning building more likely than not.
What is odd is that CS gas is also linked to the fire in Waco.
Well if the cops shot in CS gas, that makes it too dangerous for the fire-fighters to risk their health. If they breathe that in, or get it on their skin, they will be down for the count in a burning building more likely than not.
What is odd is that CS gas is also linked to the fire in Waco.
It's not like firefighters have respirators or anything.
Seriously though, firefighters routinely enter buildings in which burning substances release toxins many many times worse than teargas. Folks I know mention being on top of sagging rooftops venting shoots of purple flame.
What they were and should have been concerned about was whether or not an armed man with malicious intent was still alive in the building.
Dorner was shooting people up. Firefighters wouldn't have been let near the cabin as a matter of safety.
Here, Waco, the Symbionese Liberation Army shootout... there's a funny tendency for some of these standoffs to end in fire. Not all tear gas projectiles are equal.
Some standoffs end with sniper shots. If you are armed and a threat to other people, you are at high risk of being killed by police.
What they were and should have been concerned about was whether or not an armed man with malicious intent was still alive in the building.
Oh yeah, definitely. I don't fault the Fire Fighters for not trying to put out the blaze, I just think it's kind of odd that these buildings keep going up. (Although in WACO, at least, it seems obvious that the holdouts set that fire themselves.)
I have to say, I don't think Dorner lived up to his own hype. From reading his manifesto he made himself sound like an evil Batman or Rambo who could evade and outfight the authorities without breaking a sweat. Instead we get a crazy guy who gets busted after tying up a couple of cleaning ladies and taking a car from some guy at gunpoint (from an USA today article I read earlier today, can't find it now). Not exactly low profile super-ninja-commando behavior. This story just went from being a future blockbuster summer movie to being an hour special on Tru TV.
Kehama wrote:I have to say, I don't think Dorner lived up to his own hype. From reading his manifesto he made himself sound like an evil Batman or Rambo who could evade and outfight the authorities without breaking a sweat. Instead we get a crazy guy who gets busted after tying up a couple of cleaning ladies and taking a car from some guy at gunpoint (from an USA today article I read earlier today, can't find it now). Not exactly low profile super-ninja-commando behavior. This story just went from being a future blockbuster summer movie to being an hour special on Tru TV.
I think you are forgetting that he killed at least 4 people. Things change when you take a life. I'm sure over the last few days of this ordeal he saw the faces of the young woman and her fiance thousands of times in his head. When he wrote his manifesto he had the moral high ground in his head. After murdering those people that moral high ground was gone.
Worse than TruTV, it'll be a made-for-TV movie on Trinity Broadcasting Network in which Dorner finds a copy of The Purpose-Driven Life and undergoes a tearful conversion as the flames rise up around him.
I'd better start writing my own manifesto for if that ever comes to pass.
Kehama wrote:I have to say, I don't think Dorner lived up to his own hype. From reading his manifesto he made himself sound like an evil Batman or Rambo who could evade and outfight the authorities without breaking a sweat. Instead we get a crazy guy who gets busted after tying up a couple of cleaning ladies and taking a car from some guy at gunpoint (from an USA today article I read earlier today, can't find it now). Not exactly low profile super-ninja-commando behavior. This story just went from being a future blockbuster summer movie to being an hour special on Tru TV.
I think you are forgetting that he killed at least 4 people. Things change when you take a life. I'm sure over the last few days of this ordeal he saw the faces of the young woman and her fiance thousands of times in his head. When he wrote his manifesto he had the moral high ground in his head. After murdering those people that moral high ground was gone.
Not only that, it's entirely possible that he expected a groundswelling of popular support and vindication. When he was instead decried and reviled as a murderer (although a teens bit of a sympathetic one) that may have shaken him up too.
He was lucky to get the small amount of sympathy he did, if the LAPD hadn't started shooting innocent civilians he wouldn't have gotten a care from anyone.
On the other hand, if he had only killed cops, he may have come out of this looking like the good guy, which is disgusting on many levels.
Kehama wrote:I have to say, I don't think Dorner lived up to his own hype. From reading his manifesto he made himself sound like an evil Batman or Rambo who could evade and outfight the authorities without breaking a sweat. Instead we get a crazy guy who gets busted after tying up a couple of cleaning ladies and taking a car from some guy at gunpoint (from an USA today article I read earlier today, can't find it now). Not exactly low profile super-ninja-commando behavior. This story just went from being a future blockbuster summer movie to being an hour special on Tru TV.
I think you are forgetting that he killed at least 4 people. Things change when you take a life. I'm sure over the last few days of this ordeal he saw the faces of the young woman and her fiance thousands of times in his head. When he wrote his manifesto he had the moral high ground in his head. After murdering those people that moral high ground was gone.
Nope, I'm pretty sure the only thing he was thinking about was not being able to see the new star trek movie.
Nomad wrote:Kehama wrote:I have to say, I don't think Dorner lived up to his own hype. From reading his manifesto he made himself sound like an evil Batman or Rambo who could evade and outfight the authorities without breaking a sweat. Instead we get a crazy guy who gets busted after tying up a couple of cleaning ladies and taking a car from some guy at gunpoint (from an USA today article I read earlier today, can't find it now). Not exactly low profile super-ninja-commando behavior. This story just went from being a future blockbuster summer movie to being an hour special on Tru TV.
I think you are forgetting that he killed at least 4 people. Things change when you take a life. I'm sure over the last few days of this ordeal he saw the faces of the young woman and her fiance thousands of times in his head. When he wrote his manifesto he had the moral high ground in his head. After murdering those people that moral high ground was gone.
Nope, I'm pretty sure the only thing he was thinking about was not being able to see the new star trek movie.
In fairness, that would really ruin my day too.
Baron Of Hell wrote:Nomad wrote:Kehama wrote:I have to say, I don't think Dorner lived up to his own hype. From reading his manifesto he made himself sound like an evil Batman or Rambo who could evade and outfight the authorities without breaking a sweat. Instead we get a crazy guy who gets busted after tying up a couple of cleaning ladies and taking a car from some guy at gunpoint (from an USA today article I read earlier today, can't find it now). Not exactly low profile super-ninja-commando behavior. This story just went from being a future blockbuster summer movie to being an hour special on Tru TV.
I think you are forgetting that he killed at least 4 people. Things change when you take a life. I'm sure over the last few days of this ordeal he saw the faces of the young woman and her fiance thousands of times in his head. When he wrote his manifesto he had the moral high ground in his head. After murdering those people that moral high ground was gone.
Nope, I'm pretty sure the only thing he was thinking about was not being able to see the new star trek movie.
In fairness, that would really ruin my day too.
Then again, knowing there'll be another Star Wars movie in 2015 might mean you might not want to live to be around then.
Not only that, it's entirely possible that he expected a groundswelling of popular support and vindication. When he was instead decried and reviled as a murderer (although a teens bit of a sympathetic one) that may have shaken him up too.
He was lucky to get the small amount of sympathy he did, if the LAPD hadn't started shooting innocent civilians he wouldn't have gotten a care from anyone.
On the other hand, if he had only killed cops, he may have come out of this looking like the good guy, which is disgusting on many levels.
Good point. It does seem like he went into this with an idea that he was going to be the hero who cleansed the LAPD of the corrupt cops like a real-life Punisher but instead he started out his "targeted killings" by taking out family members and loved ones of police officers. If he had only shot at "bad cops" then I'm sure there would have been some whacko subset that would've begun idolizing him as some kind of folk hero but instead he murders people who had nothing to do with the problems he claimed to be targeting.
I am actually more than a little surprised that a bigger deal is not being made over this.
In hunting down Christopher J. Dorner, hell-bent on murderous revenge over being fired from the Los Angeles Police Department, officers twice fired without warning on three innocent civilians, wounding two of them.That innocent people get shot by cops who think their own safety is paramount, whose actions show they value their own lives more than those of people they are sworn to protect, is part of a major problem in America that has not abated much despite decades of efforts to make policing more professional and less brutish. It is the policy of police departments that police cannot kill innocents to save themselves, in effect, that sometimes your sworn duty is to die. But, on the streets, it is far too often another story entirely.
The victims of this Feb. 7 police violence bore no resemblance to Dorner or his vehicle. The deranged Dorner drove a gray Nissan Titan pickup, while LAPD fired a fusillade into a bright blue Toyota Tacoma pickup from behind, while minutes later Torrance, Calif., police rammed a black Honda Ridgeline pickup and then fired three shots.
Dorner was a large, even hulking, black man. In the blue truck were two Hispanic women. Torrance police shot at a surfer, a white male slight in stature.
Luckily none of these innocents died, though one of the women was shot in the back.
Both LAPD Chief Charlie Beck and the Torrance police quickly issued statements excusing this murderous conduct, a rush to judgment that shows how “to protect and serve” sometimes means “to protect our own.” But valuing police lives more than those of others has a long history in policing and especially in Los Angeles and its surrounding communities. So does a long history of racism in police departments that many officers of all colors have fought with limited success.
Perhaps I am thinking this way because I have never been in this precise kind of stressful situation, but I am having tremendous difficulty getting my brain around the mindset that allows someone to shoot a couple dozen rounds into the back of a slow moving vehicle that looks nothing like the suspects vehicle and is operated by individuals that look nothing like the suspect. It is, to me at least, a visual non-sequitor akin to invading Iraq because Osama bin Laden destroyed the WTC.
Interesting OpEd regarding abolishing IAD's and instituting civilian oversight.
As long as police have existed, officers have been accused of racism, brutality and covering up for their friends. In the past, a lack of accountability often meant that police organizations did not pay serious attention to or even record citizen complaints. As a result, many citizens still don’t trust police departments to investigate their own. Similarly, officers do not trust internal affairs investigators or disciplinary processes.I worked as an internal affairs investigator in the LAPD for about three years. When I visited police divisions to look into complaints against officers, I was usually greeted by the same question: “Who are you going to burn today?” Officers often believed that internal affairs was out to get them on flimsy charges.
At the same time, when I interviewed community members who had filed complaints against officers, I was disappointed to learn that, despite my reassurances and best efforts to conduct impartial inquiries, many complainants believed that a fair investigation was simply not possible. Nor do misconduct investigations satisfy a skeptical public. If an officer is exonerated, the community often believes that malfeasance is being covered up.
Police serve the community — any concerns about their integrity must be transparently, expeditiously and judiciously resolved. Relying on cops to police cops is neither efficient nor confidence-inspiring.
The solution? Abolish internal affairs units and outsource their work to external civilian agencies.
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