NHL 2012-2013: Tentative deal early Sunday January 6

More games cancelled. http://www.canada.com/sports/More+games+cancelled+include+star+bout/7606233/story.html

In other news an AHL record, that has held since 1957, was broken last night. http://www.theprovince.com/sports/hockey/canucks-hockey/Abbotsford+Heat+goalie+Brust+breaks+Bower/7606755/story.html#axzz2DFg5QgPI
The author failed to mention that the shoot-out went 11 rounds!

All this talk of money. According to the news on Tuesday the Maple Leafs are valued at $1 billion. The healthy stay, the unhealthy go.

MaxShrek wrote:

All this talk of money. According to the news on Tuesday the Maple Leafs are valued at $1 billion. The healthy stay, the unhealthy go.

Theres enough money to go around its just the league flexing its monopoly. Thats why I can't side with the owners at all pretty much.

Yeah, can't argue with that. This is why the players are pushing revenue sharing so hard. Love the timing of this report, when they've brought in Federal Negotiators to try to get the two sides to concede issues to each other. I'm pretty much convinced this season is beyond saving.

jowner wrote:
MaxShrek wrote:

All this talk of money. According to the news on Tuesday the Maple Leafs are valued at $1 billion. The healthy stay, the unhealthy go.

Theres enough money to go around its just the league flexing its monopoly. Thats why I can't side with the owners at all pretty much.

If you did deeper into the numbers, it looks like 14/30 teams are losing money. I'm not saying that's the players fault, but there is more to the story than just the pure "value" of the team.

Dysplastic wrote:
jowner wrote:
MaxShrek wrote:

All this talk of money. According to the news on Tuesday the Maple Leafs are valued at $1 billion. The healthy stay, the unhealthy go.

Theres enough money to go around its just the league flexing its monopoly. Thats why I can't side with the owners at all pretty much.

If you did deeper into the numbers, it looks like 14/30 teams are losing money. I'm not saying that's the players fault, but there is more to the story than just the pure "value" of the team.

Of course tons of teams are losing money. Their TV deal is sh*t and a bunch of teams are in markets that even if they have 'ok' attendance its because they are border line bribing people to attend.

But like you pointed out thats not the players fault. They aren't supposed to be the business men.

My opinion which I honestly think is hard to argue against is the owners are punishing the players for their own incompetence. They have the real power in the situation so why not?

My problem with this is it doesn't cure any of the retardation in the future. The owners remain stupid and where do we end up at the next CBA? them locking the players out.

edit: So yea from the players position: stop trying to make every team profitable from our pockets and share between yourselves.

Yea right. Its easier to just lock the players out when your in the dominant position. Less thinking.

Mediation didn't help the past couple of days. The NHL is a joke.

MaxShrek wrote:

Mediation didn't help the past couple of days. The NHL is a joke.

I don't want to defend the NHL or NHLPA but, as far as I know, all of the leagues have tried mediation and it has never helped the process.

From Twitter:

@cotsonika wrote:

Wonder how these are selling.

IMAGE(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A894-j6CQAEhAQH.jpg:large)

My response:

@RangerRick wrote:

@cotsonika I fixed that team calendar image for you:

IMAGE(http://s3.amazonaws.com/imgly_production/6278487/original.jpg)

I shared that second image on Facebook. Hilarious.

http://www.economist.com/node/21563293

Interesting article about the business of sports I missed. Starts by mentioning the NHL and quickly moves to where the real money is.

Gaald wrote:
goman wrote:

They are very close. All you are hearing in the media is posturing for that last part.

They agree with 50-50 with making the contracts whole.

So what is going on now?

They are arguing who is paying for this year loss of revenue and future contract issues.

Players hate the 5 years 5% rule. They think they are punishing the players for cap circumventing moves by the GMs.

The owners will give in on this then they will talk about how to split this years revenue. I predict they will start training camp the week after Thanksgiving.

I have a much more pessimistic view at this point. One where they are close to making the deal but neither side at this point is willing to budge, and the idiot players will follow Donal Fehr right off the edge of the cliff and waste a year or more of their careers to prove a point, which they will ultimately fail to do, and really screw those players near the end of their careers.

I was a bit too optimistic. But it is looking like the deal will happen this week.

goman wrote:
Gaald wrote:
goman wrote:

They are very close. All you are hearing in the media is posturing for that last part.

They agree with 50-50 with making the contracts whole.

So what is going on now?

They are arguing who is paying for this year loss of revenue and future contract issues.

Players hate the 5 years 5% rule. They think they are punishing the players for cap circumventing moves by the GMs.

The owners will give in on this then they will talk about how to split this years revenue. I predict they will start training camp the week after Thanksgiving.

I have a much more pessimistic view at this point. One where they are close to making the deal but neither side at this point is willing to budge, and the idiot players will follow Donal Fehr right off the edge of the cliff and waste a year or more of their careers to prove a point, which they will ultimately fail to do, and really screw those players near the end of their careers.

I was a bit too optimistic. But it is looking like the deal will happen this week.

As long as Bettman and Fehr stay out of the picture.

http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey/nhl/article/1298066--nhl-lockout-gary-bettman-didn-t-have-much-to-say-which-may-be-a-good-sign-cox

Lets send some good vibes at 2:15. Ever bit helps. right?

I'll believe it when I see it. And I'll still be pissed off about the whole thing.

The owners involved makes me optimistic.

, Larry Tanenbaum (Leafs), Mark Chipman (Jets), Murray Edwards (Flames), Jeff Vinik (Tampa) and Jeremy Jacobs (Bruins)—are again involved.

Besides TB theres no outright 'omg the league is dying we need that 7%' franchises that are in horrendous locations.

I don't know much about the actual owners so they might be bloodsuckers and I thought Bell/Rogers owned the Leafs so isn't Tanenbaum just a figurehead then?

I think an informal agreement will get done tonight. It will be ratified by Friday.

I just hope when the league starts up again we don't see all the holding and non calls like we did in the latter half of last season. If they want to slow the game down to prevent concussions then come out and say so, but don't flip flop on calls from game to game.

The buzz is we'll have hockey around Christmas.

FSeven wrote:

The buzz is we'll have hockey around Christmas.

Bees have their own issues right now with mass colonies dying off, so I am suprised to hear they are keeping up to date on hockey. Hopefully a more reliable source can confirm hockey by Christmas.

Over/Under on Bettman walking out by his own volition by, at the most, the end of 2013?

Bonnonon wrote:
FSeven wrote:

The buzz is we'll have hockey around Christmas.

Bees have their own issues right now with mass colonies dying off, so I am suprised to hear they are keeping up to date on hockey. Hopefully a more reliable source can confirm hockey by Christmas.

Confirmed.
http://www.tsn.ca/world_jrs/

And...we're nowhere again.

Latest NHLPA proposal rejected by the NHL this evening via voicemail. Deemed "unacceptable."

Don Fehr: "It looks like this is not going to be resolved in the immediate future."

Dysplastic wrote:
Bonnonon wrote:
FSeven wrote:

The buzz is we'll have hockey around Christmas.

Bees have their own issues right now with mass colonies dying off, so I am suprised to hear they are keeping up to date on hockey. Hopefully a more reliable source can confirm hockey by Christmas.

Confirmed.
http://www.tsn.ca/world_jrs/

Sorry I should have been specific. "Hopefully a more reliable source can confirm NHL hockey by Christmas" I have been watching AHL and it has been enjoyable.

B Dog wrote:

And...we're nowhere again.

Latest NHLPA proposal rejected by the NHL this evening via voicemail. Deemed "unacceptable."

Don Fehr: "It looks like this is not going to be resolved in the immediate future."

grrrr....

I have pretty much given up hope of seeing hockey this season. What a shame. Of all the major sports, this is the one that can least afford something like this.

Yeah, the personalities of the men making the deal is the problem here. The deal isn't that far from reach, but I'm of the opinion that Bettman and Fehr hate each other and are just not willing to 'lose' to each other.

I pretty much agree with the sentiments of Dan Oldfield on CBC.

Other than the fact there is an expired collective agreement in need of renewal, there is nothing typical about these negotiations between the NHL and its Players’ Association. In the coming years, for labour geeks like me, this will make a fascinating case study about how not to negotiate a deal.

The angry drum beats and declarations of shock and disappointment are already flying, along with finger pointing. Commissioner Gary Bettman is going scorched earth, announcing all offers are off the table. Bill Daly claims player contract lengths are “the hill we are going to die on.”

Is he kidding? Really? More than $3 billion in revenue is being chucked over whether players have contracts that run more than five years?

My previous question still stands, it being even more relevant now that our glimmer of hockey hope has yet again been crushed.

I think we might see peace in the middle east first.

I wasn't aware that the players were actually a barbarian horde who have pillaged bettmans village multiple times.

His demeanor in the press conference last night was the opposite of positive by like a million times.

Thank you NHL and NHLPA for reminding me that as much as I love watching your brand if hockey, I don't need it in my life. Thank you owners for needlessly canceling a season when there was a valid CBA and time to negotiate. Thank you NHLPA for being stubborn and manipulative towards the fans. Thank you NHLPA for losing the perspective that the fans were behind you and now see you as greedy as the owners. Thank you NHL for being greedy pricks. Thank you Jeremy Jacobs for being the oldest and greediest prick. Thank you NHLPA for not realizing that the Eurooean leagues will eventually kick the NA players out in favor if locals. Thank you Gary Bettman for living up to your reputation. Thank you. Truly thank you for this. I don't need NHL hockey. I'm sure the majority of the USA will agree with me.

I have been paying way to much attention to this lock out, and the whole thing is super frustrating.

Thank you owners for needlessly canceling a season when there was a valid CBA and time to negotiate.

Still I just don't understand the perception that it was a needless lockout. Even with the leverage of the lockout, the owners have had to negotiate against themselves to move things forward. If the lockout hadn't happened, I bet we would still be waiting for the NHLPA to deliver their first CBA proposal.

The reason this whole thing has been dragging out as long as it has is because they players have been trying to call the Owners bluff thinking if they just wait them out the owners will finally give in. The horrible part is that it seems everyone but the players know that will never happen. Idiots!

Gaald wrote:

I bet we would still be waiting for the NHLPA to deliver their first CBA proposal.

Obviously, the players are fine with the old deal so why would they offer up a deal.

Pretty sure we had hockey last year and the world didn't explode.

Were only here because the owners think its their right to leverage the sh*t out of the players.

I still find it hilarious that people are fine with this happening in sports. Why do the owners need salary caps and contract caps? All the stuff they feed us about competitive balance etc is just a charade. They don't give a f*ck about that stuff. They care about keeping a wide fat margin between costs and revenues so their asset pays them out every year.

Its fair to be critical of the players for not taking a deal because they honestly don't have much leverage in this negotiation. Otherwise I don't see how they are in the wrong at all.

Strike =/= Lockout. The bottom line is we don't have hockey because the owners initiated that.