The Federal Prop. 8 Trial / Gay Marriage Catch-All

What's really funny is that he would need every last state that hasn't approved same sex marriage to ratify the amendment.

to require that marriage or the legal incidents thereof be conferred upon any union

...wow, you specifically wrote in a legal obligation to discriminate. Congrats guys, this, even if passed, would last all of two seconds before a challenge.

Well, it's a constitutional amendment. Isn't this the only way to override the Supreme Court?

Seth wrote:

Well, it's a constitutional amendment. Isn't this the only way to override the Supreme Court?

I really thought the Supreme Court had some say in that somewhere, but apparently not? Hmmm... that's unfortunate, having been blocked at the state and federal level, the NOM-idiots are now using their only available path left. Bleh.

Demosthenes wrote:
to require that marriage or the legal incidents thereof be conferred upon any union

...wow, you specifically wrote in a legal obligation to discriminate. Congrats guys, this, even if passed, would last all of two seconds before a challenge.

For someone who is Canadian and really unfamiliar with the intricacies of the US situation on gay marriage, what is discriminating about that? ( Note: I am not saying that this proposed amendment is a good idea)

mudbunny wrote:
Demosthenes wrote:
to require that marriage or the legal incidents thereof be conferred upon any union

...wow, you specifically wrote in a legal obligation to discriminate. Congrats guys, this, even if passed, would last all of two seconds before a challenge.

For someone who is Canadian and really unfamiliar with the intricacies of the US situation on gay marriage, what is discriminating about that? ( Note: I am not saying that this proposed amendment is a good idea)

Prohibiting someone from legal benefits available to other people on the basis of something not related to the legal system = bad. It's why, like a decade ago now, in college, I liked the libertarian party as it was explained to me by my roommate... their stance on gay marriage was that a marriage is a legal contract, and by blocking gay marriage, you are stopping two people from creating a contract based on their orientation, which is illegal. All other definitions of marriage and such are considered cultural and thus not a major influence on the legal definition.

NSMike wrote:

What's really funny is that he would need every last state that hasn't approved same sex marriage to ratify the amendment.

What's really funny is that there would be a pretty decent chance that perhaps half a dozen states that have constitutional bans on gay marriage wouldn't even ratify the amendment. Those votes were close and public opinion on same-sex marriage has changed quite considerably over the past couple of years.

But even before that would happen, this amendment would need two thirds of Congress to vote for it. There's very little chance that the Republicans could scrape up the additional 55 votes they'd need to even pass this thing in the House. And there's exactly zero chance it would be passed in the Senate, making this a pathetic mixture of political grandstanding and being a sore loser.

OG_slinger wrote:
NSMike wrote:

What's really funny is that he would need every last state that hasn't approved same sex marriage to ratify the amendment.

What's really funny is that there would be a pretty decent chance that perhaps half a dozen states that have constitutional bans on gay marriage wouldn't even ratify the amendment. Those votes were close and public opinion on same-sex marriage has changed quite considerably over the past couple of years.

But even before that would happen, this amendment would need two thirds of Congress to vote for it. There's very little chance that the Republicans could scrape up the additional 55 votes they'd need to even pass this thing in the House. And there's exactly zero chance it would be passed in the Senate, making this a pathetic mixture of political grandstanding and being a sore loser.

Don't forget a waste of taxpayer money when we still have no budget.

Demosthenes wrote:

Don't forget a waste of taxpayer money when we still have no budget. :D

This is the same group of people who spent $54 million to vote 37 times to repeal Obamacare. If there's one thing they know how to do it's wasting taxpayer money to pander to their troglodyte base.

IMAGE(https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/7622694656/h3412CD28/)

KingGorilla wrote:

IMAGE(https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/7622694656/h3412CD28/)

A. I find it hard to believe that every church in America with ground level signs doesn't have them under lock and key at this point.

B. This would have been far funnier if I couldn't see who had done it. Trolling is one thing, troll facing your trolling (and documenting your crime with your faces visable), meh.

I do love the expression on the face of the guy on the right.

Is there an outlet that's listing all 29 representatives?

SpacePPoliceman wrote:

Is there an outlet that's listing all 29 representatives?

They're all listed here; HJ 51 IH.

I imagine the NJ guys will be toast. The others (all from southern states) will be alright.

Nevin73 wrote:

I imagine the NJ guys will be toast. The others (all from southern states) will be alright.

There's chunks of NJ that are as regressive as anywhere in deep red states.

krev82 wrote:
SpacePPoliceman wrote:

Is there an outlet that's listing all 29 representatives?

They're all listed here; HJ 51 IH.

Marriage in the United States shall consist only of the union of a man and a woman.

So, I'm going to guess that the marriage between a pre-op transgender woman and a cis woman would be A-Ok, right? I mean, the correct parts are there.

I assume that even a post-op transgender woman would still be considered a "man" by these bill writers, as that's the way God must have intended them to be.

Tanglebones wrote:
Nevin73 wrote:

I imagine the NJ guys will be toast. The others (all from southern states) will be alright.

There's chunks of NJ that are as regressive as anywhere in deep red states.

Thank you! *crosses arms*

In all the celebration (or condemnation) of the DOMA and Prop. 8 rulings, the effects of these rulings on the lives of people is only starting to be known, including married, gay, bi-national couples no longer being torn apart by U.S. immigration laws.

And, then, you have this gut-wrenching story that appeared yesterday:

We were completely shocked. Not that we didn't know and love gay people; my only brother had come out to us several years before, and we adored him. But Ryan? He was unafraid of anything, tough as nails and all boy. We had not seen this coming, and the emotion that overwhelmed us, kept us awake at night and, sadly, influenced all our reactions over the next six years was fear.

We said all the things that we thought loving Christian parents who believed the Bible, the Word of God, should say:

The pain and misery of people putting upon gay people the notion that God and Y'shua can only truly love them if they deny their sexual orientation.

All the DOMA and Prop. 8 rulings in the world can't change the heartache many in the gay community feel when their loved ones all but turn their backs on them.

Luke McKinney wrote:

“If two people can attack you by loving each other you’re not a “real man,” you’re a Care Bear villain.”

Tanglebones wrote:
Luke McKinney wrote:

“If two people can attack you by loving each other you’re not a “real man,” you’re a Care Bear villain.”

+12, and a re-post to the Facebook-o-sphere.

Phoenix Rev wrote:

The pain and misery of people putting upon gay people the notion that God and Y'shua can only truly love them if they deny their sexual orientation.

All the DOMA and Prop. 8 rulings in the world can't change the heartache many in the gay community feel when their loved ones all but turn their backs on them.

I've mellowed a fair bit with regards to religion, but these sorts of things remind me of why I used to have such a burning hatred of it.

Valmorian wrote:
Phoenix Rev wrote:

The pain and misery of people putting upon gay people the notion that God and Y'shua can only truly love them if they deny their sexual orientation.

All the DOMA and Prop. 8 rulings in the world can't change the heartache many in the gay community feel when their loved ones all but turn their backs on them.

I've mellowed a fair bit with regards to religion, but these sorts of things remind me of why I used to have such a burning hatred of it.

I'm fine with religion. It's assholes I can't stand.

Jonman wrote:
Valmorian wrote:
Phoenix Rev wrote:

The pain and misery of people putting upon gay people the notion that God and Y'shua can only truly love them if they deny their sexual orientation.

All the DOMA and Prop. 8 rulings in the world can't change the heartache many in the gay community feel when their loved ones all but turn their backs on them.

I've mellowed a fair bit with regards to religion, but these sorts of things remind me of why I used to have such a burning hatred of it.

I'm fine with religion. It's assholes I can't stand.

Yep. Although not in scope of this thread, but you can substitute almost any structure or institution for religion and it'd still fly.

Counter-cliche -- If you run into an asshole in the morning, then you probably just ran into an asshole. If you run into assholes all day, then you're the asshole.

Seth wrote:

Yep. Although not in scope of this thread, but you can substitute almost any structure or institution for religion and it'd still fly.

Counter-cliche -- If you run into an asshole in the morning, then you probably just ran into an asshole. If you run into assholes all day, then you're the asshole. :)

Walk a mile in my shoes. I am not arguing that I am not an asshole, just that like the Lord Dark Helmet, I am surrounded by assholes.

Seth wrote:
Jonman wrote:

I'm fine with religion. It's assholes I can't stand.

Yep. Although not in scope of this thread, but you can substitute almost any structure or institution for religion and it'd still fly.

Counter-cliche -- If you run into an asshole in the morning, then you probably just ran into an asshole. If you run into assholes all day, then you're the asshole. :)

Okay, Raylan.

Jonman wrote:

I'm fine with religion. It's assholes I can't stand.

The thing is, those people aren't assholes. They really aren't. They're good people, loving people who want to live up to their beliefs in what they think is mandated by their god. THIS is the real harm of religion, its capacity to make otherwise good people believe evil things.

Valmorian wrote:
Jonman wrote:

I'm fine with religion. It's assholes I can't stand.

The thing is, those people aren't assholes. They really aren't. They're good people, loving people who want to live up to their beliefs in what they think is mandated by their god. THIS is the real harm of religion, its capacity to make otherwise good people believe evil things.

Nah, I think there are plenty of assholes in the religious community that are asshole independent of religion.

SallyNasty wrote:

Nah, I think there are plenty of assholes in the religious community that are asshole independent of religion.

Of course there are. There's assholes everywhere. The point I'm making is that religion (or more generally speaking, faith) can cause people who are genuinely good, well-meaning people to do and believe atrocious things.

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." - Steven Weinberg.

Valmorian wrote:
Jonman wrote:

I'm fine with religion. It's assholes I can't stand.

The thing is, those people aren't assholes. They really aren't. They're good people, loving people who want to live up to their beliefs in what they think is mandated by their god. THIS is the real harm of religion, its capacity to make otherwise good people believe evil things.

To paraphrase Mr Gump, assholes are as assholes do.

If my God tells me that punching babies in the face gets me into heaven, am I a righteous man, or a child abuser?

EDIT - assuming I take His word, and go about punching babies, of course.