Gaming Confessions & Blasphemy

Scratched wrote:

"Farming" as a feature of your game is dumb.
I can appreciate doing an enjoyable activity over and over again, for instance a match of your favourite multiplayer shooter (which often can play out in a number of ways), but I'm past ever wanting to bash my head repeatedly bashing my head against one thing over and over to get something.

Yep. I agree with that completely. I'm currently maybe one-third of the way through Skyrim and I've pretty much hit the wall as farming (and other repetitious activities goes).

One day last week I finished a long day's work and thought I'd put on Skyrim to unwind. About an hour into the game I realised that I'd spent pretty much all of that time crafting and improving leather armour in order to level up my Smithing. It was then that the occasional perverseness of gaming really hit me. I was trying to unwind from a tough day's work... by working at a virtual job! Utter madness!

As someone pointed out earlier in this thread, part of the fun of gaming is the escape from drudgery, the chance - for an hour or two - to be the hero in one's own story... the chance to be a badass! But instead my game of the moment effectively requires me to carry out another sequence of repetitive tasks that no one else seems to notice and that provide me with little satisfaction and even less reward.

I think I'll pick up Black Ops II on Friday...

detroit20 wrote:

Yep. I agree with that completely. I'm currently maybe one-third of the way through Skyrim and I've pretty much hit the wall as farming (and other repetitious activities goes).

I certainly see and respect your perspective, but your whole post serves to typify why I love sandbox games so much.

When I look back on the hundreds upon hundreds of hours I've put into Skyrim, Red Dead Redemption, Minecraft, etc., I see a pattern of gameplay activities that bend to my mood and moment to moment entertainment desires. The beauty of these types of games is that I can come home from a hard day's work and choose what kind of diverse experience I want from them.

Sometimes I'm dead-tired and just want to turn my brain off so I go for the repetitive activities like collecting flowers or hides in RDR, collecting/crafting gear in Skyrim, or mining raw materials in Minecraft. It's activity that involves exploration and discovery in a low-pressure environment. Great unwinding material in many circumstances.

Conversely, I can pick up any of these games and dig into the meat of the story and gameplay mechanics, being more focused and concentrated in finishing the campaign aspects. I have to be alert and on the ball for this type of game session. It's more front-seat vs. back-seat gaming as described above.

I personally find it fascinating and valuable that I can derive either from the same title at any given moment. That a single game can instantly conform to my wants and needs given any random mood and energy level.

Aaron D. wrote:
detroit20 wrote:

Yep. I agree with that completely. I'm currently maybe one-third of the way through Skyrim and I've pretty much hit the wall as farming (and other repetitious activities goes).

I certainly see and respect your perspective, but your whole post serves to typify why I love sandbox games so much.

When I look back on the hundreds upon hundreds of hours I've put into Skyrim, Red Dead Redemption, Minecraft, etc., I see a pattern of gameplay activities that bend to my mood and moment to moment entertainment desires. The beauty of these types of games is that I can come home from a hard day's work and choose what kind of diverse experience I want from them.

Sometimes I'm dead-tired and just want to turn my brain off so I go for the repetitive activities like collecting flowers or hides in RDR, collecting/crafting gear in Skyrim, or mining raw materials in Minecraft. It's activity that involves exploration and discovery in a low-pressure environment. Great unwinding material in many circumstances.

Conversely, I can pick up any of these games and dig into the meat of the story and gameplay mechanics, being more focused and concentrated in finishing the campaign aspects. I have to be alert and on the ball for this type of game session. It's more front-seat vs. back-seat gaming as described above.

I personally find it fascinating and valuable that I can derive either from the same title at any given moment. That a single game can instantly conform to my wants and needs given any random mood and energy level.

This is exactly how I feel about things. Nicely put!

Farming can be fun, assuming it's harvest moon or rune factory. You know an actual game with farming as supposed to some damn click and wait shenanigans.

@Aaron.D and Rallick,

Yes, I see what you're saying. Perhaps I should be clearer? There is certainly something quite Zen (for want of a better word) about the collecting elements of the latest games like Red Dead Redemption and Skyrim, and I like wandering through the woods as much as the next gamer.

However, for me, there's something that makes my spirit sink about Skyrim's 'desk jobs'. Spending hours literally hunched over the Alchemy Lab really isn't very meditative or soothing. It's a job. Smithing is very similar.

Actually, that's not quite true. Smithing is very well done in Skyrim.. at least emotionally. It is one of the few trades in Skyrim that one can almost feel as a player. The roar of the smelter, the rasp of the belows, the monotonous clanging of the smith's hammer... You can almost feel the heat. However, it still feels like job.

Perhaps my views on the game are simply coloured by my day job as a bit of desk jockey.

Sometimes I just like to bring chaos into a world.

My Mafia 2 demo replays resulted in me taking the part of maniac, chasing fleeing pedestrians into alleys or behind houses before killing them. It doesn't mean that I'm dissociative or violent in real life, just that I like to see how I can move things- and A) chaos is one of the easiest ways to move something B) when NPCs react to such strong gestures it's interesting to me and C) I can tie things together in my mind as a mini-narrative of sorts.

My enjoyment of bringing chaos to a world probably ties into my other confession, I played the Postal 2 single player demo a lot. I never played the game, and this was mosrly during a period in which I wasn't really playing video games in any meaningful way. I played this game a lot though- never the full game, just the demo.

I don't like League of Legends. NathanialG convinced me to check it out, but it just wasn't for me. Maybe it was the intro/rookie level, but the game just felt slow and tedious; constant right-clicks here and there until either you've died or your target has. Horrible voice acting (IMO) ruined any sense of immersion I might have gained from the otherwise colorful worlds. And despite the well-executed character models, the fact that the character designs were largely based on tired fantasy tropes and exaggerating them in less-than-meaningful ways as some sort of means to create unique silhouettes ended up simply making a character, as one example, look like a tramp in a cartoony pirate slut Halloween costume (ie, I couldn't take any of the heroes seriously).

But that's just, like... my opinion, man.

I thought Assassin's Creed 1 was really good.

With all of the podcast buzz surrounding Assassin's Creed 3, the original gets brought up frequently. Everyone and their mother like to rag on it as a "good tech demo, but a bad game". Not me. I thoroughly enjoyed it, and am quite confident I could go back to it even now and have a great time.

Nicholaas wrote:

I thought Assassin's Creed 1 was really good.

With all of the podcast buzz surrounding Assassin's Creed 3, the original gets brought up frequently. Everyone and their mother like to rag on it as a "good tech demo, but a bad game". Not me. I thoroughly enjoyed it, and am quite confident I could go back to it even now and have a great time.

AC1 is still my favorite of the series. In AC3, at least the kills started to matter like in 1. Sure, it was rough, but man, was it awesome.

Rallick wrote:
Aaron D. wrote:
detroit20 wrote:

Yep. I agree with that completely. I'm currently maybe one-third of the way through Skyrim and I've pretty much hit the wall as farming (and other repetitious activities goes).

I certainly see and respect your perspective, but your whole post serves to typify why I love sandbox games so much.

When I look back on the hundreds upon hundreds of hours I've put into Skyrim, Red Dead Redemption, Minecraft, etc., I see a pattern of gameplay activities that bend to my mood and moment to moment entertainment desires. The beauty of these types of games is that I can come home from a hard day's work and choose what kind of diverse experience I want from them.

Sometimes I'm dead-tired and just want to turn my brain off so I go for the repetitive activities like collecting flowers or hides in RDR, collecting/crafting gear in Skyrim, or mining raw materials in Minecraft. It's activity that involves exploration and discovery in a low-pressure environment. Great unwinding material in many circumstances.

Conversely, I can pick up any of these games and dig into the meat of the story and gameplay mechanics, being more focused and concentrated in finishing the campaign aspects. I have to be alert and on the ball for this type of game session. It's more front-seat vs. back-seat gaming as described above.

I personally find it fascinating and valuable that I can derive either from the same title at any given moment. That a single game can instantly conform to my wants and needs given any random mood and energy level.

This is exactly how I feel about things. Nicely put!

I would agree, and related to the Farming post above, somehow, for me, farming in Minecraft differs greatly from say farming leather in Skyrim. In MC, it's somehow like a lottery. Mining for diamonds specifically. I'm always thrilled, like I won $20 on quick pick when I come across diamonds, in a cave, or in a branch mine.

trueheart78 wrote:
Nicholaas wrote:

I thought Assassin's Creed 1 was really good.

With all of the podcast buzz surrounding Assassin's Creed 3, the original gets brought up frequently. Everyone and their mother like to rag on it as a "good tech demo, but a bad game". Not me. I thoroughly enjoyed it, and am quite confident I could go back to it even now and have a great time.

AC1 is still my favorite of the series. In AC3, at least the kills started to matter like in 1. Sure, it was rough, but man, was it awesome.

Aside from the flag collecting, I loved AC1. The sequel was better, and the two Capcom-versioned ones are still in my pile.

My first Nintendo system was the Wii - and I'm quite happy with that.
I cannot at all relate to the obsessive love over the Zelda series, and the vast majority of GameBoy stuff I've seen over the years reinforces how much I hate the JRPG style of gameplay (to the point that I haven't been able to play the Penny Arcade games for even an hour). My first gaming system was a Texas Instruments portable, followed by the Atari 2600 before moving on to PC - C64, eventually a 286. I got an original Xbox in the 2nd half of its lifecycle and still play it rarely with my son.

As with many others - never finished Bioshock...., but I will.

I have accepted completely missing out on Team Fortress 2 - for ever, at this point.
I'll never be able to play it anymore, given my lack of experience and skill. My first foray into Steam was the Orange Box, but I only got it for Half-Life 2. Portal came eventually.

I tried TF2 a couple of times a year or more ago, but it was exactly what I always thought multiplayer was: everyone has every map memorized and can play every class to within an inch of its life. It may be amazing to play, but I'll never know.

and possibly most embarrassing of all,
I'm still playing Star Wars: The Old Republic and enjoying it.
It was a Christmas gift last year, and although I only play in spurts (and have yet to hit 50 with any char) I still like it. I joined the GWJ guilds but played so sporadically that I couldn't contribute or benefit. Mostly solo, occasional random PUG's for group quests. With the move to free-to-play, I can finally play WITH my young son without financial guilt. We've barely scratched the surface of that experience, but I've been waiting to do this for a while now.
Never got into WOW, Guild Wars, or City of Heroes. Played lots of Everquest I back when it was the main name in town but broke free many years ago. SWTOR is really MMORPG-light which is exactly what my old-man-with-precious-little-playing-time needs (even though I keep buying other games. Damn you/Thank you, Steam).

Nicholaas wrote:

I thought Assassin's Creed 1 was really good.

With all of the podcast buzz surrounding Assassin's Creed 3, the original gets brought up frequently. Everyone and their mother like to rag on it as a "good tech demo, but a bad game". Not me. I thoroughly enjoyed it, and am quite confident I could go back to it even now and have a great time.

Yes. I cringe every time someone on the pod cast uses the "tech demo" analogy. It was a great game and stood head and shoulders above many others.

AC1 is really the kind of game someone should shamelessly rip-off and fix it's flaws, especially with the new Hitman getting mixed reviews.

Scratched wrote:

AC1 is really the kind of game someone should shamelessly rip-off and fix it's flaws, especially with the new Hitman getting mixed reviews.

What would you say were it's flaws?

I think the usual one is the missions to get intel for the assassinations.

The assassin guy commits a localized genocide, yet his vests remain white instead of drenched with the blood of the fathers/sons/brothers/friends he slayed.

Just because they were guards, guarding.

Gesh, been trying to come up with some... the only one I can come up with for me is...

I have never beated the original Super Mario Bros.

Gesh. I know there should be more... ummm...

I actually like the Super Mario Bros. movie.

Does that count?

Mantid wrote:

Gesh, been trying to come up with some... the only one I can come up with for me is...

I have never beated the original Super Mario Bros.

Gesh. I know there should be more... ummm...

I actually like the Super Mario Bros. movie.

Does that count?

I'm more curious if anyone here has actually managed to beat the original Mario Bros. I've gotten to world 8, but don't know if I've even managed World 8-2.

As for the Mario Bros. movie, I like it because it's kind of funny, but nothing tops the Street Fighter movie (the House of the Dead movie is also hilarious, but at some point reaches a "Dear God why did they write this?" moment, whereas the Street Fighter movie never stops being ridiculous).

Scratched wrote:

I think the usual one is the missions to get intel for the assassinations.

I kind of enjoyed those. A subjective opinion of course. But still that hardly makes it a tech demo.

Calling a game a tech demo suggests unfinished graphics, unfinished levels....basically an unfinished game. AC1 looked stunning and was complete.

strangederby wrote:

Calling a game a tech demo suggests unfinished graphics, unfinished levels....basically an unfinished game. AC1 looked stunning and was complete.

I don't see that implication at all when people call games tech demos. To me it implies that the graphics/physics/whatever are spectacular, but the game design is lacking.

That was my problem with the first Assassin's Creed, anyway. It was a beautiful world, but the intelligence gathering was a bunch of tedious, uninspired minigames that felt like complete filler. That, plus the turgid writing and Desmond insisting on interrupting the my jaunts into that pretty world made me give up on it after a couple of assassinations.

ccesarano wrote:
Mantid wrote:

Gesh, been trying to come up with some... the only one I can come up with for me is...

I have never beated the original Super Mario Bros.

Gesh. I know there should be more... ummm...

I actually like the Super Mario Bros. movie.

Does that count?

I'm more curious if anyone here has actually managed to beat the original Mario Bros. I've gotten to world 8, but don't know if I've even managed World 8-2.

Yes, I did, countless times in my childhood. My friends and I used to log every world and variables like end with 0 coins or 100 coins etc as we hunted for secrets.

IMAGE(http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/113/674/BisonOfCourse.jpg)

strangederby wrote:

Calling a game a tech demo suggests unfinished graphics, unfinished levels....basically an unfinished game. AC1 looked stunning and was complete.

It was a complete game, but after the opening sequences it was one fairly short game on repeat. Every "sequence" played out the same way - run out of fortress, ride out into kingdom, sneak into city, gather intel, assassinate, escape, receive lecture and item/weapon/skill upgrade. I played the game when AC2 came out so I was aware of this and it didn't bother me too much, but it really grated on a lot of people.

Oh, and Desmond couldn't run.

Redherring wrote:

sneak into city, gather intel, assassinate, escape

These things were the majority of the game experience for me and, ultimately, what made it fun. Exploring the city, getting all the viewpoints, gathering all the intels (as in more than you're required, but actually gathering all of them) and saving all of the citizens and doing all the things, and doing actual assassinations...that was a lot of fun.

Assassin's Creed 2 threw in a bunch of stuff that was less fun and then made it more a pain in the ass to climb on rooftops. You spent more time on the ground. Why would they make you do that in their own game about parkour?

detroit20 wrote:
Scratched wrote:

"Farming" as a feature of your game is dumb.
I can appreciate doing an enjoyable activity over and over again, for instance a match of your favourite multiplayer shooter (which often can play out in a number of ways), but I'm past ever wanting to bash my head repeatedly bashing my head against one thing over and over to get something.

Yep. I agree with that completely. I'm currently maybe one-third of the way through Skyrim and I've pretty much hit the wall as farming (and other repetitious activities goes).

At first I was confused, Farming in Skyrim?? then I remembered that you need to gather all sorts of materials to level the smithing/alchemy and then I recalled that I have another confession to make.

I console cheated the farming in Skyrim. Life is too short, to mine iron in a video game.

-player.additem "ironbar 1zillion"
-player.additem "leatherstips 1zillion"
-spammed daggers till 100
-than I took my bounty of daggers and dropped them "below the world" via the TCL command so as not to upset the economy with all these daggers.

why wouldn't I just use the "advskill" command? Well, that would be cheating!

ccesarano wrote:

Assassin's Creed 2 threw in a bunch of stuff that was less fun and then made it more a pain in the ass to climb on rooftops. You spent more time on the ground. Why would they make you do that in their own game about parkour?

Depends what you want out of the game - to me, AC (any) is a game about stabbing as many people as possible with hidden blades, preferably two at a time. The parkour is just a method of travelling between stabbings

Redherring wrote:
strangederby wrote:

Calling a game a tech demo suggests unfinished graphics, unfinished levels....basically an unfinished game. AC1 looked stunning and was complete.

It was a complete game, but after the opening sequences it was one fairly short game on repeat. Every "sequence" played out the same way - run out of fortress, ride out into kingdom, sneak into city, gather intel, assassinate, escape, receive lecture and item/weapon/skill upgrade. I played the game when AC2 came out so I was aware of this and it didn't bother me too much, but it really grated on a lot of people.

Oh, and Desmond couldn't run.

Horses for courses I guess. While Ive enjoyed all the AC games one was the most immersive for me for those very reasons. Later games mostly deal with intelligence gathering via cut scene.

strangederby wrote:
Redherring wrote:
strangederby wrote:

Calling a game a tech demo suggests unfinished graphics, unfinished levels....basically an unfinished game. AC1 looked stunning and was complete.

It was a complete game, but after the opening sequences it was one fairly short game on repeat. Every "sequence" played out the same way - run out of fortress, ride out into kingdom, sneak into city, gather intel, assassinate, escape, receive lecture and item/weapon/skill upgrade. I played the game when AC2 came out so I was aware of this and it didn't bother me too much, but it really grated on a lot of people.

Oh, and Desmond couldn't run.

Horses for courses I guess. While Ive enjoyed all the AC games one was the most immersive for me for those very reasons. Later games mostly deal with intelligence gathering via cut scene.

I'm really with Scratched and ccesarano, and liked the structure of AC1 and feel they lost things in AC2 through AC3.

I also agree with RedHerring, but while AC1 was a bit of a treadmill, each sequence felt like it had a much tighter narrative. Gathering intel, if you read through it, also helped you plan out your assault/escape on the "fortress" at the end of the sequence - while tedious, they did serve a purpose.

In AC2+, you still have missions that lead up to the capstone of a sequence, but those missions start to feel more and more like a railroad. Especially in AC3, where each sequence is SUCH a railroad that its sometimes nearly impossible to do anything BUT the next sequence mission (I'm looking at you, AC3 Sequence 8).

What's with the word 'sequence' being used with AC? We usually just call them levels, chapters, dungeons, areas....