2012/13 Soccer Thread

onewild wrote:
davet010 wrote:

Ferguson will be at United until carried out, because he's a greedy bastard. What United will need to appoint is someone to do what Clough did at Leeds following Revie, so the ideal for them would be Mourinho - 3 year purge and then gone. What they will get is anyone's guess.

City - Bert continues.

Wouldn't that be a 44 day reign of terror followed by getting sacked, replaced by a wise old man who gets you to within one bent ref of winning the European Cup? Not a 3 yeart purge

The 3 year bit refers to Mourinho's usual tenure at any club. I'm sure you know better than I how Clough's time is viewed at Leeds, and Armfield did do a good job, but at least Clough made a clean break with Revie's past, albeit in an OTT manner.

Heh, looks like Ferdinand feels exactly the same way as I do about Guardiola.

"Money to invest, history+time I'm assuming to put his stamp on the club... he obviously wasn't guaranteed all that at other clubs linked to!"

Guardiola's 'snub of the PL' seems to have set off some of the media outlets to start proclaiming the 'downfall' of the PL and its dominance as the 'greatest league'. Really? I think these people are giving Guadiola wayyy too much credit. Him snubbing projects that would have proved challenging and not ready-made for success (Chelsea, Arsenal, and maybe City/United) means nothing. I mean come on, a club that was more or less a joke during the last season of the PL won the highest european honor last year... these guys wouldn't have even qualified through our top 4 if they weren't able to stumble past the Europe's 'finest', including BM.

Yeah the Manchester Clubs didn't fare all that well last year, but you still can't count United out, and City's relatively a new-born on the European stage. And Tottenham a relative new comer to our top-tier went on a very respectable run during their first top-tier European campaign just a few seasons ago. Arsenal's been in a bit of a rough shape, but the suckers also have a tendency to always push back whenever they look close to leaving the top footballs scene.

I mean I am hardly the kind of idiot that likes to proclaim 'Barcelona and Real Madrid wouldn't survive PL if they were faced a full season of our low/mid tier,' but come on. Ah well, crap articles designed to provoke sensationalism and 'dooms day' proclamations do provide more clicks I suppose.

davet010 wrote:

The 3 year bit refers to Mourinho's usual tenure at any club. I'm sure you know better than I how Clough's time is viewed at Leeds, and Armfield did do a good job, but at least Clough made a clean break with Revie's past, albeit in an OTT manner.

Ah ok. Well I don't think Clough did make a clean break with Revie's past, instead he alienated himself by telling Leeds players that they won everything by cheating and they should throw all their medals away. Revie was like a father to those players, Clough was known not to like the way Leeds played or even like the players. I don't think any club needs that kind of manager.

The next manager of Manchester United will have one hell of a tasks, as he won't be given the same amount of time Ferguson was because they already have a reputation as winners and he also won't get the breaks that Ferguson gets by the media. If a new manager throw away that title last year, they would be calling Man United chokers, yet Ferguson has choked away 3 titles to Leeds, Arsenal and Manchester City and nobody mentions this because of the success. The next manager will need to hit the ground running.

And god I can only hope our fans and the board will be smarter than that. And if they are, who gives a crap what the media says?

ps. Then again I am pretty cynical about chances of that happening if I was to be frank. =/

Pikey26 wrote:

And god I can only hope our fans and the board will be smarter than that. And if they are, who gives a crap what the media says?

ps. Then again I am pretty cynical about chances of that happening if I was to be frank. =/

Considering a large amount of Manchester United "fans" will only be able to name Alex Ferguson and maybe Matt Busby as managers of the club, I doubt they will be that smart to not get on the back of any new manager who doesn't instantly deliever unless that manager is a) connected with the Ferguson family or b) a big name.

A? hahahahaha please tell me you dont mean Darren.

And really, they don't have to think further than Ferguson, that's the thing. It takes like 2 secs of looking at Wikipedia to discover after coming to United from Aberdeen, Ferguson couldn't didn't win jacksh*t. It wasn't until Cantona in the mid 90s that United really kicked on their winning ways.

Sure, a lot of modern 'fans' and media have little patience for top clubs that aren't winning things every other year (ffs, I see United fans calling for the end of the world any time we DONT win the title). But I think even looking at 'that lot' of fans, United fans must surely have a unique appreciation from seeing Ferguson and what a long term consistency in leadership can do for a club. And beyond that they don't have to look any further than Ferguson's own career to see what it will take to continue the United they've known. Surely, most glory hunting band wagoners must have all jumped shipped to Barcelona by now.

Ha, no I meant as in the football family not his son. Now that I would love to see

Any griping by the media about the Guardiola deal is that they were cut short of months of endless speculation... Imagine the amount of words that would of been typed if he kept this going to May until the Premiership manager landscape started to become more apparent.

and more importantly!!!!

just say tic tac toe while watching.

IMAGE(http://i.minus.com/iNwSZ0SX80lF4.gif)

Nice to see Arsenal adopting the old Spurs tactic, 'leaking' their interest in Edison Cavani. The prospect of a £30m striker should keep the Hugos happy, and the knowledge that he will never ever be seen at the Emirates in a home shirt will keep the directors happy.

Arsene has even copied the old Twitcher line of 'triffic player, but his wages might be a problem'....ie, even if worlds collide and we do buy him, the foreign swine will actually want to be paid. So we'll need to prise the top off Gazidis's penny jar as well.

onewild wrote:

Ha, no I meant as in the football family not his son. Now that I would love to see

hahaha, i will take that to mean you will probably take pleasure in seeing us fall apart. ;p

And hey, his 'football' family might even be a sh*te sight worse.... let's see. Steve Bruce, Roy Keane, Bryan Robson, Darren Ferguson again (he was also in the club for a bit), Mark Hughes (although I do very much like what he did to City, he's still almost something you 'wouldn't wish on your worst enemy'), and I know there are some older ones I am not thinking of.. all have had far less than impressive careers.

In short.. I know when you're calling the majority of our supporters stupid! Though, I almost agree. :*(

ps. Then again what club doesn't have a horde of idiots supporting them these days?
pps. No davet.

Bah, and if it wasn't for that pesky Pikey I'd have gotten away with it...

Seriously, it's the arrogance and sense of entitlement of a lot of fans that annoys me most, and to be fair it isn't just the usual suspects but it grows among all supporters, intensifying as that team becomes successful. Sometimes it's justified (like, say Arsenal's unbeaten team, or a number of United's sides), but often it seems to persist. It also seemingly varies with distance.

And yes, City do have their share of balloons following them, primarily those of the post-Thaksin vintage...after all, it's not like they were picking up many glory-hunters before that, unless they were of my mid-70's era. And that's not even counting that horrendous 98-99 season when Stockport County were in the division above City. Boy, I enjoyed going for my usual beers in Stockport that year.

This is why I support Fulham. Because you can't feel too entitled when you're already thinking "it'll be a good season if we can just finish 13th".

Even as recently as the 06-07 season, I was looking round COMS during matchday thinking 'Christ, next year we'll be playing Sc*nthorpe here...in the League'. Of course it doesn't help when you play 18 home games and score 10 goals. TEN !!

Mate of mine missed one home game all season - and 30% of our goals

And you never heard the immortal 'too big to go down', because if there was one thing that City's history proved, it's that they patently weren't.

Luis Suárez[/url]]Let's see: they said that when we played against Stoke, for instance, and in that case they were right. I invented a foul because we were drawing 1-1 against Stoke and I wanted to win.

Brendan Rogers is reportedly not happy about Suárez diving in the box to earn a PK, though I'd expect him to be saying that publicly regardless.

Nice to know that the Uruguayan has a fallback career, in case this whole football thing doesn't pan out.

IMAGE(http://www.101greatgoals.com/wp-content/gallery/gimages/1351432060377.gif)

Bet his half-pike is a wonder to behold.

I'm guessing Rodgers is annoyed for two reasons.

1. He was so forthright in defending the little swine whenever Suarez's honesty was called into question that it now makes him (Rodgers) look like a proper tit. Either he knew Suarez was diving and was bullsh*tting (a la Ashley Young), or doesn't know enough about football to spot it.

2. He now knows that the only way Suarez will get anything but the most stonewall penalty awarded to him now is if he's trailing his innards behind him. Which might come back to haunt them...

Still, at least Rodgers must be breathing a bit easier now that Guardiola has signed with Bayern.

Can I just add that it was ever-so-slightly predictable that Pulis would be one of the first to spout off about players getting banned for diving. You know what I'd like to see - Stoke's thug players getting banned the next time they clothesline someone (yes you, Huth) or kick someone into the air. Diving might be injurious to the game, but boot-boy tactics nearly did for the game in the 70s and 80s.

davet010 wrote:

Still, at least Rodgers must be breathing a bit easier now that Guardiola has signed with Bayern.

? your deluding Liverpool fans by implying Guardiola would manage Liverpool. He might not actually prove to be an amazing manager but hes not crazy.

and.........

Arsenal sign Walcott. I don't care about the wages or length its over. My theory is Arsenal only have 1 phone line which explains why they are so sluggish to finish business so this allows them to potentially sign someone before the window closes. I'm not holding my breath tho.

It would have been a better job for him than Chelsea or City. Cash to spend, and if you even get close to winning the League you'd be a complete hero...and it's not like you'd have much trouble doing a better job than Kenny or Rodgers.

davet010 wrote:

It would have been a better job for him than Chelsea or City. Cash to spend, and if you even get close to winning the League you'd be a complete hero...and it's not like you'd have much trouble doing a better job than Kenny or Rodgers.

better =/ amazing feat of triumph

a better job is going to Bayern with an already established squad.

Going to Liverpool and expecting to win anything of substance (League, CL) in the next 5 years is delusional. They are realistically a good 100m pounds of players away from competing... with Arsenal.

So pretty much thats a job for someone who wants to prove themselves (Rogers type guy). Guardiola has already 'proved' to be A list just the question is can he actually do it elsewhere.

Vilanova might stand to look even more amazing than he already does if Pep falters at Bayern.

davet010 wrote:

Diving might be injurious to the game, but boot-boy tactics nearly did for the game in the 70s and 80s.

I'd love to see more of a crackdown (including post-match review and penalties imposed) on diving and dangerous challenges.

Those, and the continued blind eye towards racist behavior by fans, are my biggest issues with football right now (though, I suppose if we're asking for the moon, I would want some mechanisms to share the wealth a little between EPL teams - something like MLB's profit-sharing for gear sold outside the immediate area of a club, possibly other mechanisms. FFP is deeply flawed and I'm not a fan, but I don't think the goal of bringing some kind of financial sanity into the picture is inherently bad).

Dimmerswitch wrote:

Those, and the continued blind eye towards racist behavior by fans, are my biggest issues with football right now (though, I suppose if we're asking for the moon, I would want some mechanisms to share the wealth a little between EPL teams - something like MLB's profit-sharing for gear sold outside the immediate area of a club, possibly other mechanisms. FFP is deeply flawed and I'm not a fan, but I don't think the goal of bringing some kind of financial sanity into the picture is inherently bad).

The Premier League TV contract base is split equally between clubs, with extra bonus payments for games which are shown live and league positions on top - and this revenue stream is by far the largest for all but the top 6 or so clubs...and will triple in 2014 when the new contract goes in. This contrasts with Spain and Italy at least, where there is no collective bargaining - from memory Spanish clubs negotiate their own deals, and about 60% of TV revenue goes to RM and Barca, and the rest end up with sh*tty contracts that have them kicking off matches at 10pm on a Monday night (seriously). In Italy, many clubs outside the big 6 end up struggling to sell their TV rights at all, ending up with deals at the last minute. But then when your average home attendance is under 10k, what TV network is going to be bidding big dollars for your rights anyway ?

Unsurprising, but still, ugh. Completely outclassed from beginning to end.

The good news is, despite this crap run, we're still six points above relegation, and just four points back from the top half.

Fulham played OK for much of the game, and Berbatov in particular was excellent, although isolated in a 9-1-1 formation. City could have scored potloads (Dzeko in particular was extremely wasteful), but Fulham shouldn't have any trouble finishing in midtable.

One thing though - the travelling support was woeful. Five hundred ? Come on lads and lasses. Still, it was better than the 2009 League Cup match, when Fulham's travelling 'army' was more like a platoon, just 78 hardy souls.

Hope Giroud was taking notes on that Mata goal...

I have to say, as bad as Arsenal is playing, it's really more because of how well Chelsea is playing. I haven't seen a recent Chelsea match but this is an impressive showing.

It actually looks like a Premiership side against a Championship one. Chelsea (Mata and Ramires aside) aren't playing great, but Arsenal's midfield is doing nothing and the defence is a joke. I'd love City to bid for Wilshere and bang the final nail into Wenger's coffin.

And I'd also love to know who managed to persuade Chelsea to pay £50m for something from Invasion of the Body Snatchers - because the only explanation for how poor Torres has been is that the thing in the no 9 shirt is a pod duplicate.

Is Rosicky injured? There's no reason to ever put Arshavin on the wing with a healthy Rosicky on the bench, but he's not even on the bench.

bigred wrote:

Is Rosicky injured? There's no reason to ever put Arshavin on the wing with a healthy Rosicky on the bench, but he's not even on the bench.

Pretty sure he is...

Didn't 'see' the game. Had a wedding the night before and managed to 'wake up' during the second half and stream a choppy stream on my phone. I had 0 motivation to actually catch the game in its entirety because I expected 0.

Spurs drawing United was a good thing. Might force Wenger to spend as its now 7 points back with a game in hand. Also tightens the top up so we might actually get a race.

Hmm, reading that Valencia are so brassic that they are about to be taken over by the local government.

This would be the Valencia council who are billions of euros in debt, haven't paid their workers for months, and built a new airport at horrendous cost which turned out to be too narrow ?

I would say that it'd be a good chance to get out there and pick up some bargains, but having watched them get slaughtered at home by RM at the weekend (fans were leaving at 44 minutes...well, Valencia were 0-5 down at that point), I'm not sure who those bargains might be. Certainly not Gago, who City were linked with a couple of years ago - by George, he was poor.

Sigh. Credit to Southampton, who simply outplayed us for most of the game.

Having Naismith on the pitch really feels like conceding a one-man advantage, much of the time.

At least Mirallas was able to get a run on, and is looking healthy.

We need a signing to give the midfield more of a spark, but since it looks like we'll hang on to Fellaini (I hope) I'm not sure where any money would come from. Heitinga is definitely surplus right now, but can't imagine us getting enough for him to make a difference.

I'm also really concerned that we're heading for a serious fall in another season or two, as the current squad is getting long in the tooth.

Oh, right, Mirallas. How is he doing? Haven't heard about him since beginning of the season.