Voting ID, the problems it purports to solve, and the problems it might create

Or this: http://boingboing.net/2012/09/24/stu...

Today, a civil rights group called Advancement Project will publish a report on the new voting laws passed in 23 Republican-led states. The report (not named in Patricia Zengerle's Reuters article and not yet up on the Advancement Project site) claims that 10,000,000 Hispanic voters will be disenfranchised by the new laws, which place hurdles between voters and the ballot box, such as presenting certain types of ID. The rubric for these laws has been that "everyone" has the types of ID specified in the statutes, and the common refrain in response to critics is "Who doesn't have a [driver's license|passport|non-driver ID|etc]?" The Advancement Project's point appears to be that these specific 10 million citizens, who are otherwise legally entitled to vote, don't have the necessary papers or can't meet the qualifiers imposed by the state governments.

But what's 10 million legitimate votes compared to a hundred fraudulent ones?

Late to the thread and this may have been brought up already, but couldn't the GOP be shooting itself in the foot here? As mentioned above, Jim Cramer's elderly father couldn't vote because he no longer had a driver's license. How many elderly, who tend to vote conservatively, will be turned away from voting because they may not have valid ID anymore?

The shame of it is that one of two things would likely happen:

The elderly are given a pass, "who would steal the nice old lady's ID?"

or

The GOP will reverse their stance when it becomes a problem and no one will remember because hypocrisy isn't called out much anymore.

The elderly don't like getting screwed out of their retirement benefits, so the GOP would love to keep them away from the ballot box.

Wisconsin's State Supreme Court today refused Attorney General Van Hollen's petition to have the two Voter ID rulings that have gone against the Walker administration (namely, Milwaukee Branch of the NAACP v. Scott Walker and League of Women Voters of Wisconsin Education Network, Inc. v.
Scott Walker
) consolidated and heard directly by the court, instead of working their way through the normal appeals process.

Judgements for NAACP and League of Women Voters cases (warning, PDFs).

Does that imply that they want to support one, and strike the other?

Malor wrote:
Does that imply that they want to support one, and strike the other?

Don't know enough about the cases to understand where they overlap and differ. It's possible that the court wants to support one and strike the other, but it's also possible that they're deciding to follow the normal process here.

Consolidating and fast-tracking these cases to reinstate Voter ID ahead of the election, in the face of our Government Accountability Board explicitly asking them not to do so, may have been a bridge too far.

Regardless of the reasoning, I'm glad to see our State Supreme Court acting a little less like a subsidiary of the Wisconsin GOP.

I applaud the VAB, which is run by a Republican. Flat out stating they question their ability to properly prepare for voter turnout, and that they cannot change procedures at this point does my heart good. They seem to at least get to the heart of the issue as Legitimate Voting. At this point ballots are being printed, many states have already had the early votes cast. Absentee ballots are being sent out. I know we are not in November, but in many ways we have started the election already. Having the VAB recognize this, shows integrity and faith in the system above party lines.

Judge blocks Pennsylvania voter ID law before election

Supporters of the measure, passed by a Republican state legislature and Republican governor, said it would help prevent electoral fraud.

However, the state government conceded that there has never been a known case of in-person voter fraud.

Read that again: there has never been a known case of fraud that this ID law would fix.

So, clearly, this law has another goal in mind. The apologists seem to have disappeared, probably into echo chambers talking about the horrible liberal media, but that, right there, upends their entire apple cart. In Pennsylvania, per the government itself, there has never been a known case of in-person voter fraud.

So then the apologists will probably start making up fantasy fraud that this would fight, while ignoring the very, very real fraud being committed by the people who register voters, and the people who count the votes, overwhelmingly Republican, at least in the last decade or so.

It just got delayed until next year though, apparently they will be implementing it.

Anyway caught a bit about it on FoxNews at lunch, and it's funny, they have an e-mail address if you want to talk to them about this and other stores... [email protected]. Voter Fraud, of which there isn't any. Why couldn't it be VoterID@? Because that wouldn't be as terrifying as fraud I guess.

Stele wrote:
It just got delayed until next year though, apparently they will be implementing it.

Anyway caught a bit about it on FoxNews at lunch, and it's funny, they have an e-mail address if you want to talk to them about this and other stores... [email protected]. Voter Fraud, of which there isn't any. Why couldn't it be VoterID@? Because that wouldn't be as terrifying as fraud I guess. :lol:

Dear [email protected]: There isn't any. At least, none worth speaking of. Thanks.

Well I just found out that because my soon-to-be (and already in my heart) grandmother-in-law who lives in the bottom half of the house cannot vote in Ohio now. She has mobility problems so if she needs to leave the house, it is with her daughter driving (thus no driver's license or state ID). We take care of the bills so she can spend her retirement money on whatever she wants (thus no bills to her at this address), etc... awesome. I get that Ohio is a battleground state... but man if that doesn't really piss me off

Demosthenes wrote:
Well I just found out that because my soon-to-be (and already in my heart) grandmother-in-law who lives in the bottom half of the house cannot vote in Ohio now. She has mobility problems so if she needs to leave the house, it is with her daughter driving (thus no driver's license or state ID). We take care of the bills so she can spend her retirement money on whatever she wants (thus no bills to her at this address), etc... awesome. I get that Ohio is a battleground state... but man if that doesn't really piss me off :(

She doesn't have a government check (from retirement/refund check), bank statement, or any other government documentation that has her name and address? It was my understanding that Ohio is still pretty lenient(thankfully) in regards to the whole voter id issue.

Meanwhile, thousands of Democrats in California were re-registered as Republicans without their permission:

Strange Surge In California Points To More GOP Voter Fraud

Vote fraud found in Virginia:
http://notlarrysabato.typepad.com/do...

By the people complaining about the voter fraud, natch.

Make up nonexistent voter fraud, and then use that as an excuse to commit real voter fraud. Only the GOP could think this way.

From their deluded perspective they think they're being patriotic heroes, saving the country from Obama.

More (probable) vote fraud:
http://www.abc15.com//dpp/news/regio...

Tanglebones wrote:
More (probable) vote fraud:
http://www.abc15.com//dpp/news/regio...

It only happened to the ones printed in Spanish. Who could possibly read anything into that?

Surprised no one is talking about this...

http://chronicle.northcoastnow.com/2...

LORAIN — Billboards erected in Elyria and off West 21st Street in Lorain have residents talking, and Lorain and Elyria city leaders said the signs were placed to scare minorities from voting this November.

The billboards, which read, “Voter Fraud is a Felony! Up to 3 ½ YRS & $10,000 fine,” were placed near the corner of Lexington Avenue and West 21st Street in Lorain and off East Broad Street in Elyria, areas that have traditionally been occupied by a higher number of minorities.

Lorain Councilman Eddie Edwards called the billboards “scare tactics” to discourage minority voters from going to the polls.

ranalin wrote:
Surprised no one is talking about this...

I had to stop talking about it ever since I was informed that the republicans don't engage in racist politics and that anything they do that seems racist is at most done by a few bad apples in the party.

Those aren't really apples.

ranalin wrote:
Surprised no one is talking about this...

http://chronicle.northcoastnow.com/2...

LORAIN — Billboards erected in Elyria and off West 21st Street in Lorain have residents talking, and Lorain and Elyria city leaders said the signs were placed to scare minorities from voting this November.

The billboards, which read, “Voter Fraud is a Felony! Up to 3 ½ YRS & $10,000 fine,” were placed near the corner of Lexington Avenue and West 21st Street in Lorain and off East Broad Street in Elyria, areas that have traditionally been occupied by a higher number of minorities.

Lorain Councilman Eddie Edwards called the billboards “scare tactics” to discourage minority voters from going to the polls.

On the one hand, sure, this is just more of the same from the GOP. But on the other ... if you're so stupid that you think you might be committing voter fraud by legally voting, perhaps we're better off with you staying away from the polls.

The cases where they're throwing out voter registrations are a much bigger deal.

billt721 wrote:
ranalin wrote:
Surprised no one is talking about this...

http://chronicle.northcoastnow.com/2...

LORAIN — Billboards erected in Elyria and off West 21st Street in Lorain have residents talking, and Lorain and Elyria city leaders said the signs were placed to scare minorities from voting this November.

The billboards, which read, “Voter Fraud is a Felony! Up to 3 ½ YRS & $10,000 fine,” were placed near the corner of Lexington Avenue and West 21st Street in Lorain and off East Broad Street in Elyria, areas that have traditionally been occupied by a higher number of minorities.

Lorain Councilman Eddie Edwards called the billboards “scare tactics” to discourage minority voters from going to the polls.

On the one hand, sure, this is just more of the same from the GOP. But on the other ... if you're so stupid that you think you might be committing voter fraud by legally voting, perhaps we're better off with you staying away from the polls.

There's a huge difference in my mind between "stupid" and "ignorant of the mechanics behind committing an obscure crime that barely exists," and neither are reasons to treasonously undermine the founding principles of this nation.

Per NPR and others, Clear Channel, which owns the billboards, isn't disclosing the anonymous group who bought the ad space, even though their company policy doesn't allow for anonymous ads. It was a contract signed "by mistake." But, they aren't taking them down. Oh, and guess who owns Clear Channel? A little company whose name is a homophone with a notorious Batman villain.

And if you're discouraged from voting because you're intimidated by believing you might be hassled while voting, or that someone might come nosing around your home looking for excuses, etc.?

What if you know you're legally registered and go to the poll but they don't have you on file (perhaps because someone "registered" you and then dumped the paperwork)? Might you be discouraged from pressing the issue because of vague threats of legal action if someone doesn't believe you? What if you belong to some group (like "women", say) where you're used to having your concerns and arguments dismissed? What if you belong to a group that's used to being dismissed *and* to a group that's used to being hassled by the authorities for no good reason? (Perhaps "women with an obviously latino or African ethnic background".)

Since there's practically no measurable voter fraud, it's difficult to believe that these signs could be put up for any effect [em]but[/em] to make legal voters who are otherwise vulnerable think twice about voting. They're certainly not aimed at the people who are dumping registrations.

Hypatian wrote:

Since there's practically no measurable voter fraud, it's difficult to believe that these signs could be put up for any effect [em]but[/em] to make legal voters who are otherwise vulnerable think twice about voting. They're certainly not aimed at the people who are dumping registrations.

Exactly! Why warn folks of the penalties of something that really isnt happening?

SpacePPoliceman wrote:
billt721 wrote:
ranalin wrote:
Surprised no one is talking about this...

http://chronicle.northcoastnow.com/2...

LORAIN — Billboards erected in Elyria and off West 21st Street in Lorain have residents talking, and Lorain and Elyria city leaders said the signs were placed to scare minorities from voting this November.

The billboards, which read, “Voter Fraud is a Felony! Up to 3 ½ YRS & $10,000 fine,” were placed near the corner of Lexington Avenue and West 21st Street in Lorain and off East Broad Street in Elyria, areas that have traditionally been occupied by a higher number of minorities.

Lorain Councilman Eddie Edwards called the billboards “scare tactics” to discourage minority voters from going to the polls.

On the one hand, sure, this is just more of the same from the GOP. But on the other ... if you're so stupid that you think you might be committing voter fraud by legally voting, perhaps we're better off with you staying away from the polls.

There's a huge difference in my mind between "stupid" and "ignorant of the mechanics behind committing an obscure crime that barely exists," and neither are reasons to treasonously undermine the founding principles of this nation.

Per NPR and others, Clear Channel, which owns the billboards, isn't disclosing the anonymous group who bought the ad space, even though their company policy doesn't allow for anonymous ads. It was a contract signed "by mistake." But, they aren't taking them down. Oh, and guess who owns Clear Channel? A little company whose name is a homophone with a notorious Batman villain.

Man, Penguin Publishing is awfully dastardly!

SpacePPoliceman wrote:
Tanglebones wrote:
A little company whose name is a homophone with a notorious Batman villain.

Man, Penguin Publishing is awfully dastardly!

Not a homophone!

I know, but the joke..

Tanglebones wrote:
A little company whose name is a homophone with a notorious Batman villain.

Man, Penguin Publishing is awfully dastardly!

Not a homophone!

Tanglebones wrote:
SpacePPoliceman wrote:
Tanglebones wrote:
A little company whose name is a homophone with a notorious Batman villain.

Man, Penguin Publishing is awfully dastardly!

Not a homophone!

I know, but the joke..

Penngwynne Publishing.

But, no, wrong villain.