Interesting Kickstarter Catch-All

ChrisGwinn wrote:

Ogre. Oh my.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/...

This is where it gets weird to me. This was announced a long time ago and has already been in progress. Munchkin brings in tons of cash. Is Kickstarter really necessary here?

Ogre already funded. Kickstarter is quickly becoming a preorder intermediary.

SixteenBlue wrote:
ChrisGwinn wrote:

Ogre. Oh my.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/...

This is where it gets weird to me. This was announced a long time ago and has already been in progress. Munchkin brings in tons of cash. Is Kickstarter really necessary here?

He explain it in the video. From BGG:

• First, our margin on this game is low, so we had to be conservative in our plans. We couldn't put a 10-year supply in the warehouse. We were going to print only 3,000, which is the absolute minimum we were sure of selling in a year or so. There would probably not have been expansion sets, or even a reprint. Something that's expensive to do at 3,000 units is impossible at 1,000!

But with Kickstarter, we can reach a lot of people quickly, and gauge our support. If the initial print run can be bigger, fine! If the gamers show that they want an expansion set later, then I get to do it!

• Second, because I got literally hundreds of requests to pre-order the game, and we don't do pre-orders. When we get our new shopping cart set up, sure . . . but that won't be any time soon. By using Kickstarter, we get a pre-order system automatically. And, because so many people said they wanted more than one copy, we're offering options for two and even three.

• Third, because with Kickstarter we can have stretch goals, which will let us add more components and improve the ones that are already there.

Reasons 1 and 3 aren't really exclusive to Kickstarter. You're free to do those things anyway through many different means.

Reason 2 makes sense, but it's weird to use Kickstarter as essentially a pre-order store front.

I don't like this at all. It just seems lazy and it's using Kickstarter's resources for something it's not intended for. Since Kickstarter gets a cut either way I doubt they mind all that much though.

Infernarl wrote:

Ogre already funded. Kickstarter is quickly becoming a preorder intermediary.

I think Jerry Pournelle said on TWiT that is exactly what the service was intended for.

shoptroll wrote:
Infernarl wrote:

Ogre already funded. Kickstarter is quickly becoming a preorder intermediary.

I think Jerry Pournelle said on TWiT that is exactly what the service was intended for.

Well then I take back what I said and now I think the Ogre thing is awesome.

SixteenBlue wrote:

I don't like this at all. It just seems lazy and it's using Kickstarter's resources for something it's not intended for. Since Kickstarter gets a cut either way I doubt they mind all that much though.

I don't agree or disagree with him, just wanted to share the info.

Kickstarter's a way to get seed capital provided by enthusiasts or advance customers. Like the Order of the Stick reprint drive, this is a great way to handle printing a low margin, high cost enthusiast product.

Even if Kickstarter weren't made with such things in mind: It's not lazy to use something as it's not intended when it's a fitting tool for the job.

ChrisGwinn wrote:

Ogre. Oh my.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/...

I read ''Oh my'' in George Takei's voice

interstate78 wrote:
ChrisGwinn wrote:

Ogre. Oh my.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/...

I read ''Oh my'' in George Takei's voice

I think we all read "oh my" in his voice now. I know that's what I mean when I type.

interstate78 wrote:
ChrisGwinn wrote:

Ogre. Oh my.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/...

I read ''Oh my'' in George Takei's voice

It is an impressively large box.

ChrisGwinn wrote:

It is an impressively large box.

...

LouZiffer wrote:
ChrisGwinn wrote:

It is an impressively large box.

...

Nvm, it takes out my spaces

Kickstarter project guidelines don't support a lot of the claims about what Kickstarter's "intended for".

ChrisGwinn wrote:

Kickstarter project guidelines don't support a lot of the claims about what Kickstarter's "intended for".

They seem to be intentionally vague, but certainly don't indicate that Kickstarter is only for small startup/indy companies that couldn't afford to make their product otherwise.

Demyx wrote:

They seem to be intentionally vague, but certainly don't indicate that Kickstarter is only for small startup/indy companies that couldn't afford to make their product otherwise.

I really don't see a problem with established companies like SJ Games using KS as a way to take "commissions" on low-volume niche products. It's really hard for me to get my pitchfork and torch ready for a company that wants to give fans something they want and make an appropriate number of copies. Maybe we'd avoid more E.T style disasters this way?

shoptroll wrote:
Demyx wrote:

They seem to be intentionally vague, but certainly don't indicate that Kickstarter is only for small startup/indy companies that couldn't afford to make their product otherwise.

I really don't see a problem with established companies like SJ Games using KS as a way to take "commissions" on low-volume niche products. It's really hard for me to get my pitchfork and torch ready for a company that wants to give fans something they want and make an appropriate number of copies. Maybe we'd avoid more E.T style disasters this way?

Kickstarter is for raising funds. It's a funding platform. Steve Jackson is essentially using it as a web-store to facilitate pre-orders because their business currently has no infrastructure for that. They've already got funds. They've already got plenty of people willing to give their money now. That's essentially my issue but if Kickstarter is cool with that then why would I care?

More money for Kickstarter, frankly, so in the end Steve Jackson Games is supporting the Kickstarter movement by "using" them.

SixteenBlue wrote:
shoptroll wrote:
Demyx wrote:

They seem to be intentionally vague, but certainly don't indicate that Kickstarter is only for small startup/indy companies that couldn't afford to make their product otherwise.

I really don't see a problem with established companies like SJ Games using KS as a way to take "commissions" on low-volume niche products. It's really hard for me to get my pitchfork and torch ready for a company that wants to give fans something they want and make an appropriate number of copies. Maybe we'd avoid more E.T style disasters this way?

Kickstarter is for raising funds. It's a funding platform. Steve Jackson is essentially using it as a web-store to facilitate pre-orders because their business currently has no infrastructure for that. They've already got funds. They've already got plenty of people willing to give their money now. That's essentially my issue but if Kickstarter is cool with that then why would I care?

Not really. There's an enormously high up-front cost in what they're doing here.

SJ Games had enough capital to feel like they could invest in about 3000 copies of Ogre. They anticipated they could sell that many, or at least sell enough that they wouldn't lose their shirts. Too high? They lose a bunch of money. Too low? People who want it miss out. Kickstarter lets them raise additional capital for a larger print run if they can find the demand, mitigates the amount of capital they have to sink into an expensive print run, and lets people who want the game reserve a copy without going through at least two intermediaries (game store, distributor).

Conceptually, the way to think of Kickstarter isn't as a way to "raise funds". Kickstarter's a way for people who are working on a project to gather capital from patrons or customers, while mitigating the risk of being an early first patron/customer to enter a project. By providing capital, the project is either enabled (for creators who don't have any money) or substantially reduced in risk (by not requiring a large initial investment for the project by the creator).

Saw this on Jalopnik today:

Easier Said Than Done, a documentary on Rally America, specifically following Chris Duplessis and Ken Block.

The goal of this film is to show the personal challenges and stories of each driver as they each try their hardest to compete in such a challenging sport. As well as showcase both the front, and behind the scenes action that makes the motorsport world turn.
I've already put a few bucks of my own money, about $10,000 into the film. Mostly in travel and ancillaries. . . .

This isn't a "Hey, give me money so we can do this thing!" It's a "Hey, I'm already doing this awesome thing, help me make it even better". I think that's an important distinction.

He's asking for $47,630, which is a pretty specific amount: there's a breakdown of what it will go towards—travel, helo rentals, super slo-mo camera rental. Anything above the target just makes a snazzier film!

Bill Harris has talked about Match and Magic in the past and the game now has a Kickstarter. They're only looking for $15,000 in order to finish the art for the game.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/...

Crockpot wrote:

Watch using ereader tech and syncs with iOS and android devices.
http://t.co/ADYjC5G0

I just peeked back in on this one, and was shocked to see that they've raised over $2 million already (goal is $100,000). I think it's a great product and would love to get in on it, just don't have it in the budget right now.

For all you tabletop gamers out there here's a full length Call of Cthulhu campaign set in Lovecraft's Dreamlands

The Sense of the Sleight of Hand Man

Written by Dennis Detwiller, one of the designers on Prototype and co-creator of the Delta Green setting for CoC. Everything I've read of his, be it novels or gaming suppliments, has been superb. Well worth $10 for the PDF version.

soonerjudd wrote:
Crockpot wrote:

Watch using ereader tech and syncs with iOS and android devices.
http://t.co/ADYjC5G0

I just peeked back in on this one, and was shocked to see that they've raised over $2 million already (goal is $100,000). I think it's a great product and would love to get in on it, just don't have it in the budget right now.

Now over 3 million.

demonbox wrote:
soonerjudd wrote:
Crockpot wrote:

Watch using ereader tech and syncs with iOS and android devices.
http://t.co/ADYjC5G0

I just peeked back in on this one, and was shocked to see that they've raised over $2 million already (goal is $100,000). I think it's a great product and would love to get in on it, just don't have it in the budget right now.

Now over 3 million.

Looks crappy and I can't imagine having to charge up my watch every week

interstate78 wrote:

Looks crappy and I can't imagine having to charge up my watch every week

What the hell... watches are relics of a bygone era....

interstate78 wrote:

Looks crappy and I can't imagine having to charge up my watch every week

I'm skeptical over how necessary it is (couldn't I just pull out my phone if it vibrates telling me i have a call?), but it is a step in the right direction for "wearable" computing. So if you're into futuristic stuff this looks like a dream gadget.

shoptroll wrote:
interstate78 wrote:

Looks crappy and I can't imagine having to charge up my watch every week

I'm skeptical over how necessary it is (couldn't I just pull out my phone if it vibrates telling me i have a call?), but it is a step in the right direction for "wearable" computing. So if you're into futuristic stuff this looks like a dream gadget.

I can actually see that use - when I'm out walking in city noise, I tend to miss a lot of calls/vibrations since I can't hear or notice it.