XCOM: Enemy Unknown - Strategy Game - Developed by Firaxis

OzymandiasAV wrote:

Even bolder-er prediction: XCOM doesn't come out in 2012 at all.

(They've already pushed the game back -- again -- so that it won't make that revised March delivery date.)

That's right. I'd forgotten that bit. However, didn't they shift it out of Q1 not because it was missing its due date but so that it would release in the company's next fiscal year?

Well I'm a happy person!
RPS has a list of 24 things they believe should be included.
I concur for the most part.

Replay as a file in 2012 makes the most sense. A single-button upload to youtube could make this game go minecraft-viral.

ClockworkHouse wrote:
OzymandiasAV wrote:

Even bolder-er prediction: XCOM doesn't come out in 2012 at all.

(They've already pushed the game back -- again -- so that it won't make that revised March delivery date.)

That's right. I'd forgotten that bit. However, didn't they shift it out of Q1 not because it was missing its due date but so that it would release in the company's next fiscal year?

That announcement came on the heels of rumors that they laid off over a dozen employees in the Australia studio that was assisting in development...so who knows.

In my eyes, 2K announcing Enemy Unknown can be read as a concession that the XCOM shooter is either going to be pushed waaaaay back, canceled altogether or retooled into a separate, standalone IP. 2K is a lot of things, but they're not stupid; launching two different titles with drastically different gameplay designs in the same year under the same IP (which is also a soft IP that hasn't seen store shelves in over 15 years) is a fantastic way to ensure market confusion.

It's all speculative, sure, but the shooter hasn't exactly had the most stable development track. They've already went back to the drawing board once before in response to public criticism/apathy.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

You're wrong, but that's sort of what you do around here: be wrong about things. ;)

I want to know what you've seen of the Xcom shooter that's got you so hot and bothered over it. You're the one and only person I've seen defend it like this. Press that have seen updated versions of the game are down to damning it with faint praise, saying things like "Well, it looks better than it did" and then you get an awkward silence and an acknowledgement that saying that doesn't actually mean much.

Thin_J wrote:

I want to know what you've seen of the Xcom shooter that's got you so hot and bothered over it. You're the one and only person I've seen defend it like this.

I haven't seen anything about it that doesn't make me interested. I like the art direction, the gameplay looks fun with the different strategic options that are available to players, and I've been pleased with that development team's previous work. But I also have absolutely no attachment to the X-Com brand. They could slap the name on any ol' thing and it wouldn't make a difference to me.

Which is why I'm honestly not that concerned about the press damning the game with faint praise: because every article I've read about the game has approached it from the angle that it's a sad thing that it's a game called "XCOM" that's not a strategy game. No matter what has been done with the game and what has been shown to the press, every article can seemingly be boiled down to, "It doesn't look as bad as it did, but it remains to be seen whether it will incorporate X, Y, and Z elements that made the original so great." That's a fine angle to take with the coverage, but it's not one that's relevant to my interests. Like I said, I don't care if this is a good X-Com game; I care if it's a good shooter, and it appears to be shaping up that way.

But I'm not sure it's a surprise at this point that I disagree with the prevailing opinion about something.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

I care if it's a good shooter, and it appears to be shaping up that way.

This is actually the part I disagree with most. It should be clear that I don't care so much about the Xcom name either since I've never played more than half an hour of the original. It's a game I want to like, but have never been able to because the interface is genuinely awful.

But I love shooters and to date I have never seen anything that makes the XCom shooter look even mediocre, much less good.

Thin_J wrote:

But I love shooters and to date I have never seen anything that makes the XCom shooter look even mediocre, much less good.

Agree to disagree?

IMAGE(http://i.imgur.com/BTnCx.gif)

I suppose since it's off-topic to begin with that's probably best.

We already agreed to disagree in the other XCOM thread, but I will say this:

I do feel like Jordan Thomas and the team at 2K Marin are getting thrown under the bus here. By announcing the Game That Everybody Wanted All Along under the XCOM IP, it reads like a surrender to public pressure, especially after they spent so much time and effort trying (and, arguably, failing) to distinguish XCOM as a shooter.

I'm not excited about the prospects for XCOM: The Shooter, but I don't want to see it buried either. 2K Marin deserves better than that, in my opinion.

I agree with that, Ozy. 2K Marin got handed a second tough project that no one wanted in a row and were doing their best. I'm not sure if Enemy Unknown is something 2K had planned from the start (it doesn't seem that way, but I don't know how long this has been in production), but this does seem like a slap in the face for Thomas and his team.

Thin_J wrote:

I always find the interface and gameplay in the original to be the exact opposite of intuitive and completely impenetrable. I love all the core ideas of the game, and I want to like it, but I've never been able to actually play it. It always puts me off within half an hour.

This is a completely fair criticism of the original, by the way. It's a realllly old game, and they hadn't nailed down mouse interfaces yet. It's quite strange and annoying to modern computer users.

It would be absolutely wonderful if they could get something of the same depth and strategy, but with a modern, polished GUI. I'm not overwhelmingly fond of the game itself, but I think Civ5 has an excellent GUI, and I can't imagine anyone I'd trust more with the X-Com franchise, both in terms of accessibility and depth.

I wonder if they'll go for the same level of punishing difficulty? You could expect to lose troopers, even very senior ones you were very attached to, on almost every mission. Would that kind of savage punishment fly with modern gamers?

ClockworkHouse wrote:

I'm not sure if Enemy Unknown is something 2K had planned from the start (it doesn't seem that way, but I don't know how long this has been in production)

It's something that's been rumored for years, but it's hard to tell how much of that was coming from collective wishcasting.

I seem to remember rumblings that a Firaxis XCOM project was showing up on some LinkedIn profiles a while back, but I can't find the articles that originally cited them...so maybe I just imagined them.

At any rate, I'm very happy to see this announcement. I never (eeeeeeeeeever) pre-order games, but this will be my 2nd pre-order in as many years. (Last year's release of Tactics Ogre was the other.)

Irongut wrote:

Awesome. I like that Firaxis is doing it too. Although its different developers, the original XCOM and Civlization titles were both published under Microprose. It's kinda like keeping it in an extended family. (in a nice way.)

I used to love those Microprose game boxes, with their chunky manuals etc.

Anyways, I'll be very excited about this one.

This!

And:

Robear wrote:

Now if they'd start looking at other parts of their back catalog - Covert Action, or the aforementioned and excellent Alpha Centauri, or even - dare I suggest it - a remake of Darklands with a modern GUI?

Well, anyway - SQUEEEEEEEEE!

I would LOVE some Darklands! I feel like you could get close with an Elder Scrolls or Mount & Blade mod.

On the other hand this is the craziest nonsense I have ever read:

ClockworkHouse wrote:

You know, I'm a little disappointed by this but only because it's not coming to 3DS. Turn-based strategy games like this work better (for me) on a handheld than a console. (Blah blah, PC gaming master race, blah blah.)

Is he even writing in American? Crazy talk!

ClockworkHouse wrote:

It still makes me sad that the universal assumption is that the XCOM shooter will be a generic suck fest. Did not a one of you play Bioshock 2? [sigh]

I did. It was a generic suck fest.

To qualify that, BioShock 1 was really the story of Rapture, which also happened to be the story of Andrew Ryan since he created Rapture. So in revisiting the same time period of Rapture relegated BioShock 2 to what really should have been an expansion pack--there was simply nothing new there. The story of the new main character and the few antagonists didn't matter because it wasn't their story anyway.

For BioShock 2 to really work it would have to have been framed in a way that told a completely different story about Rapture in addition to something new from a character perspective. As an off the wall idea, I'd have liked to see all that Adam ooze into the bowels of Rapture and spawn a new society of advanced nonhumans, Rats of NIMH-style. It's that kind of story change I think would be needed to make BioShock 2 a game worth playing.

Now in the case of XCOM the story is somewhat new since in the original it was basically "aliens attack for some reason and it's you'd job to kill them," so if the writing is good that may be enough of a reason to play it right there. But I also don't think it's possible to pretend that XCOM isn't a tactical setting, so if the game doesn't hold up from a tactical perspective I don't think it will be terribly fantastic. From what I've seen in preview footage so far, the aliens are basically there to be shot, not to provide a tactical challenge. I do hope this changes with the latest redesign though, since I'd love XCOM to be a game worth playing.

XCOM: Enemy Unknown will be a day 0 purchase for me though, for sure.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

You're wrong, but that's sort of what you do around here: be wrong about things. ;)

NathanialG wrote:

[On the other hand this is the craziest nonsense I have ever read:

ClockworkHouse wrote:

You know, I'm a little disappointed by this but only because it's not coming to 3DS. Turn-based strategy games like this work better (for me) on a handheld than a console. (Blah blah, PC gaming master race, blah blah.)

Is he even writing in American? Crazy talk!

I could easily see XCOM as a good option for a tablet. But never a 3DS.

Nevin73 wrote:

I could easily see XCOM as a good option for a tablet. But never a 3DS.

Ghost Recon: Shadow Wars has a combat system almost exactly like X-Com's (which isn't surprising, since they were designed by the same guy). It's scaled-down (for reasons, I should note, that have nothing to do with the technical limitations of the platform), but it certainly demonstrates that X-Com could work just fine on the 3DS.

Nevin73 wrote:

I could easily see XCOM as a good option for a tablet. But never a 3DS.

I don't see why. The DS and the PSP have been havens for turn-based strategy titles already.

Game Informer is posting new material throughout the month on their XCOM hub page. Here's a link to their post for today.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/featur...

OzymandiasAV wrote:

I do feel like Jordan Thomas and the team at 2K Marin are getting thrown under the bus here.
...
I'm not excited about the prospects for XCOM: The Shooter, but I don't want to see it buried either. 2K Marin deserves better than that, in my opinion.

I never played Bioshock 2, but it's an important point being made here: don't count out the guy behind Shalebridge Cradle.

Ok, consider me enabled. where do I fork over my monies for a collector's copy.

Mission packs and DLC ahoy? we should mod in a scenario where the greys come to help rid the
earth from the sparkling vampires.....

juv3nal wrote:
OzymandiasAV wrote:

I do feel like Jordan Thomas and the team at 2K Marin are getting thrown under the bus here.
...
I'm not excited about the prospects for XCOM: The Shooter, but I don't want to see it buried either. 2K Marin deserves better than that, in my opinion.

I never played Bioshock 2, but it's an important point being made here: don't count out the guy behind Shalebridge Cradle.

There's plenty of examples the other way too. Just saying.

NathanialG wrote:

On the other hand this is the craziest nonsense I have ever read:

ClockworkHouse wrote:

You know, I'm a little disappointed by this but only because it's not coming to 3DS. Turn-based strategy games like this work better (for me) on a handheld than a console. (Blah blah, PC gaming master race, blah blah.)

Is he even writing in American? Crazy talk!

I can respect his opinion. Strategy games, if designed specifically for handhelds, work very well. Especially with a touchscreen. I'd love to have Xcom on my iphone.

juv3nal wrote:

I never played Bioshock 2, but it's an important point being made here: don't count out the guy behind Shalebridge Cradle.

The Cradle is an interesting example. It was a fantastic level for a horror game or whatever, but it wasn't really a Thief level. Its presence in Thief was pretty incongruous. So I'm not entirely sure whether to consider it a compliment or a criticism of their skill.

Tkyl wrote:

Game Informer is posting new material throughout the month on their XCOM hub page. Here's a link to their post for today.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/featur...

That interview video is a great sign. They're talking about exactly the right sorts of things.

There's also different skills being brought into play, I'd say there's a lot of ground between being a level designer (T3:Shalebridge Cradle, BS1:Fort Frolic) and the overall design for a whole game(Bioshock2, Xcom). I forget what the actual role titles were.

Tamren wrote:

My nerd boner just flipped the table.

The shorter the statement it is the funnier it gets.

Spoiler:

That's what she said. Whooooooo!

I also can't wait for the XCOM shooter-thing-whatever. It looks creepy, reminds me of good X-File episodes and I don't care if it doesn't play like an MP FPS. Just because it's in the first-person doesn't mean it NEEDS to be a shooter. Look at Amnesia (the PC horror game). First-person view = more scares and not a gun to be seen (I think - I don't know. I've only played two hours before my heart gave out)

That said I hope the XCOM shooter dev team does not treat this game like the kitchen sink. They should do or hopefully have already did what the Firefall dev team did - they stripped everything away and focused on one feature (in this case being a good shooter). Once the shooter aspect was locked down they added the MMO elements and all the other stuff that makes Firefall look like one of my wet dreams.

Be interesting to see how many of the improvements made by Xenonauts to the genre end up appearing in this.

If someone makes an XCOM mod for Men of War my head will explode.

Tamren wrote:

Be interesting to see how many of the improvements made by Xenonauts to the genre end up appearing in this.

If someone makes an XCOM mod for Men of War my head will explode.

I'm still waiting on someone to make a L4D-Starcraft mod....