GAH! I Preordered SWTOR and need some form of validation!

I should preface this with the admission that I am a long time player of MMOs'. I've played Ultima Online, Everquest, DAOC, City of Heroes, DCUO, WoW, and many others.

Earlier this year I rediscovered FPS games, most specifically the L4D series and Team Fortress 2. It was like my eyes were opened again to what video games could be. I looked back at MMO's and saw them for what they (apparently to me now) were: skinner boxes with very little input from the player.

In a very real sense I started to get very disenchanted with MMO games as they all seemed to become so similar as to be indistinguishable from one another. Was I doing anything more than clicking to target and then hitting the same series of buttons over and over again? How was waiting for X's health bar to deplete before my own a GAME? Having the emperor's clothes shown to me made me suddenly decide to give up MMOs. Since then, I still dabble now and then, but it rarely takes me more than a few minutes of play to get that "oh yeah, THIS again" feeling and go off to play something requiring either thought or reflexes.

Then, suddenly my brother emails me, asking if I'm going to be playing Star Wars, the Old Republic. Initially I say "no way, those MMO games are all the same, boring and repetitive with no real game elements" but then I inexplicably cave and preorder.

So tell me, those of you who have played the beta, is there any light at the end of this tunnel? Any chance that SWTOR is actually anything other than a new coat of paint on venerable MMO "game" mechanics?

*sniff sniff* Ah, the smell of fresh paint on venerable MMO mechanics.

Sorry, but to be very cut&dry, that's what you bought. The good news is, its a very well done and entertaining set of established MMO mechanics. You still gather materials to craft, for example, but you do it in a far less tedious way. You still get 'kill ten womprats' quests, but for the most part you don't have to chase down a quest giver, the quest is automatically assigned to you when you are in the right area to find the womprats. And for the most part it automatically progresses to the next step 'kill 20 more womprats', and then maybe 'kill the big fat womprat'. At which point it mostly automatically gives you the reward for completing the quest chain.

The space ship minigames are fun enough, and utterly skipable.. The PvP wasn't enough different from most other PvP minigames to merit a mention.

But, in the end, its a MMO. With a linked overarcing storyline for each class with the traditional Bioware conversational options (which is unique, really, as far as the MMOs I've played go), so there may actually be a reason to run an alt or 7 through. Unless you don't care about the story and only want to power level to the end game.

So tell me, those of you who have played the beta, is there any light at the end of this tunnel? Any chance that SWTOR is actually anything other than a new coat of paint on venerable MMO "game" mechanics?

Think this probably belongs in the MMORPG section but oh well.

No, its the same MMO formula with a Star Wars feel to it. I will say that they actually have decent stories for the classes and the standard bioware morality choice system. So either of those things appeal to you I doubt you'll be disappointed with at least a Month of play time.

Edit: Tanhausered

Thats right. It's the MMO trinity at its core. It embellishes content through story, theme and polish, but it's an MMO. If you were burned out on FPS gaming, I'd say pass on an FPS. It's like that.

The Giant Bomb guys were pretty clear that yeah, it's World of Warcraft with a Star Wars theme. Collect six space cat teeth.

LobsterMobster wrote:
The Giant Bomb guys were pretty clear that yeah, it's World of Warcraft with a Star Wars theme. Collect six space cat teeth.

My experience with the Beta turned me off to the game for this very reason.

I have never liked the MMO formula as it is today, and this game definitely didn't change my mind.

If you're a Star Wars fan then this is definitely a must have. If you're a MMO player in search of something new... move along. Nothing new to see here.

Market forces. Let them work.

I'm afraid I can't offer you much reassurance, either, based on knowing nothing about you except what's in your post. I'm looking forward to the game -- but then, I love Bioware's story focus and I'm not burned out on MMO mechanics. I've been MMO-free for a couple of years now, having last played LOTRO and almost never played WoW. For me, I think there's quite a lot to like about SWTOR. For you? Maybe the best I can say is that perhaps playing with your brother will be enough to distract you from the mechanics you don't like?

- Ash

Try playing the Imperial Agent/Bounty Hunter. They're the most different of the starting classes for an MMO. But yeah, I'll echo what everyone else has already said that it's still pretty much a traditional MMORPG.

Don't feel too bad Val, I bought Skyrim and knew I was going to have the same issues with it that I've had with the previous 2 Arena games and both of their Fallout games. Some ideas are so amazing, whether it be a huge highly interactive world (me and Skyrim) or a Star Wars MMO (you and this), that a part of your brain kicks in and makes you support products that aim for them, even when you logically know that what you're buying isn't quite going to live up to your idea/dream.

Thanks everyone, I was afraid of that.. Ah well, at least I'll have another example of the same ol' stuff. Plus maybe I can convince my brother that TF2 is a much better game.

If it makes you feel any better, I'm the proud owner of a lifetime subscription to Hellgate: London.

SpyNavy wrote:
Market forces. Let them work.

Shouldn't take long. This game's full of the Force.

I'm in the same boat. I started with UO the day it launched -- still have my Collector's Edition box and cloth map, even -- and just pre-ordered The Old Republic. I never touched WoW, never played anything "modern" aside from a month of Fallen Earth and a week of City of Heroes, both of which I found dreadfully boring. My hope is that SWTOR will be more interesting, and that there will be enough Goodjers playing that I'll be able to find community with whom to play.

So, OP, here's the best advice I can give both of us: join up with folks like me, who are equally disinterested in the grind, and let the fun come from co-op. Community makes the difference, I think. Hope.

I'm in a similar boat as far as MMOs go, except I burned out on the Everquest/DikuMUD formula in the EQ beta. I later learned to appreciate the genre with WoW, but at this point I'm burned out again. I'm approaching Old Republic differently though.

Old Republic is going to be a co-op multiplayer Bioware rpg. My goal is to see as much of the other classes' stories as I can without re-rolling.

Once that's over with, I'll do the casual raiding with friends thing that I did in WoW.

Pretty much all of the MMORPGs follow the same mechanics. Nature of the beast. They need to figure out some way to move your character, the story, and their access to your wallet along, so no one is going to deviate much from the established formula.

I've been wondering if TOR will last long in light of so many F2P options that offer the same mechanics.

You have to really LOVE Star Wars to pay for, and play, more of the same with so many viable F2P options available.

Vargen wrote:
I'm in a similar boat as far as MMOs go, except I burned out on the Everquest/DikuMUD formula in the EQ beta. I later learned to appreciate the genre with WoW, but at this point I'm burned out again. I'm approaching Old Republic differently though.

Old Republic is going to be a co-op multiplayer Bioware rpg. My goal is to see as much of the other classes' stories as I can without re-rolling.

Once that's over with, I'll do the casual raiding with friends thing that I did in WoW.

Are you part of one of the GWJ guilds? This is exactly the wavelength I'm on.

mateo wrote:
Pretty much all of the MMORPGs follow the same mechanics. Nature of the beast. They need to figure out some way to move your character, the story, and their access to your wallet along, so no one is going to deviate much from the established formula.

I've been wondering if TOR will last long in light of so many F2P options that offer the same mechanics.

You have to really LOVE Star Wars to pay for, and play, more of the same with so many viable F2P options available

Except that 95% of F2P options suck so it's much easier to skip them.

My question would be "how much is it like Knights of the Old Republic"? KOTR had very MMO-like controls so if I loved KOTR, will TOR feel like the continuation of the series?

Nevin73 wrote:
My question would be "how much is it like Knights of the Old Republic"? KOTR had very MMO-like controls so if I loved KOTR, will TOR feel like the continuation of the series?

Yes and no. Mechanically things will feel very familiar and they're trying to emulate the KOTOR story telling. We're stuck pretty deep in YMMV territory though, as who can say if it will bring back the same feelings you had play KOTOR?

I found it to be very similar I just hope that the stories are as compelling.

Nevin73 wrote:
My question would be "how much is it like Knights of the Old Republic"? KOTR had very MMO-like controls so if I loved KOTR, will TOR feel like the continuation of the series?

It does to me.

Reaper81 wrote:
Nevin73 wrote:
My question would be "how much is it like Knights of the Old Republic"? KOTR had very MMO-like controls so if I loved KOTR, will TOR feel like the continuation of the series?

It does to me.

Does to me as well. Granted it is prequel story going on, but it feels like KOTOR.

LobsterMobster wrote:
If it makes you feel any better, I'm the proud owner of a lifetime subscription to Hellgate: London.

SpyNavy wrote:
Market forces. Let them work.

Shouldn't take long. This game's full of the Force. :D


Fist Bump, to my wasted $150 on what seemed like a good idea at the time, brother!

ranalin wrote:
If you're a Star Wars fan then this is definitely a must have. If you're a MMO player in search of something new... move along. Nothing new to see here.

luckily for me I love MMOs but hate all things Space (yes i can hear the gasping from here), so i get to skip this one. Seeing as there are only a handful of MMOs since EQ that I didn't buy a collectors edition on launch, my wallet thanks space for once.

What I do love about this, one is you have a nice mix of Star Wars fanboys* and MMO fanboys* colliding on other forums and the fires are amazing to watch.

*yes ranalin is both

Please gather 20 Corellian Boar Tusks. Also, of course I preordered it.

Are you feeling validated, Valmorian? Having put a few hours in so far, I certainly feel like it was an intelligent purchasing decision.

The stories are good, but the game mechanics are as bad as any other MMO. If it wasn't for the fact that I find the different characters and storylines somewhat interesting, I would hate this "game" just like every other MMO even if I do play them for some bizarre reason.

I just find that even 30 minutes in Team Fortress 2 gives me more fun than several evenings of an MMO.

Valmorian wrote:
I just find that even 30 minutes in Team Fortress 2 gives me more fun than several evenings of an MMO.

Life's too short to spend it on a game you're not even really enjoying.

I hope this doesn't get moved to the MMO sub-forum, because - can we get some opinions about this game from people who generally don't play MMOs?

Thinking about jumping in, but I feel like MMO veterans might be jaded about the genre...

Mex wrote:
I hope this doesn't get moved to the MMO sub-forum, because - can we get some opinions about this game from people who generally don't play MMOs?

Thinking about jumping in, but I feel like MMO veterans might be jaded about the genre...

We haven't heard anything from ukick and his crew yet either.

Mex wrote:
I hope this doesn't get moved to the MMO sub-forum, because - can we get some opinions about this game from people who generally don't play MMOs?

Thinking about jumping in, but I feel like MMO veterans might be jaded about the genre...

I'm not an MMO veteran, unless playing UO with a Charter Edition back in 1997 counts. It's a solid game; the story is good, the world is interesting, and the plots are fun. The game mechanics can grate a bit, and the difficultly just isn't there in comparison to a SP experience.

Play with friends, and it's fun, even you're largely spending time solo; much of the deep character involvement and enjoyment comes from sharing role-playing experiences ("flashpoints", etc.) with other folks.

I think I'm going to try to remember to PM the OP about every MMO FPS in the world.
Can't wait for some of them to come out.