Marvel vs. Capcom 3 Series Catch-All

I argue that just because you can't play as the character, doesn't make the field uneven. You will still learn what the character does simply by playing against them. It's exactly the same as if you simply choose not to play a given character. I never played El Fuerte in SF4, but I still learned how to fight against him.

DrunkenSleipnir wrote:

Jill Valentine and Shuma-Gorath will be DLC characters only, it looks like. A download coupon is included with the preorder Collectors Edition, or 560 MS points after launch.

I read this, and first thought "really? How the hell did I not know this?" Then I double checked Amazon and remembered exactly why I passed on this CE. The rest of the bonus content is junk (1 free month of Marvel digital comics? Oh boy, can't contain the excitement now), and you don't get the DLC characters until a month after launch even with the CE. That and 560 MS points < $10. Perhaps the bonus comic and 1 month subscription are worth it for some, but not for me. At least they didn't go with the cheaply made statuettes like they did for SF4 CE.

ahrezmendi wrote:

I argue that just because you can't play as the character, doesn't make the field uneven. You will still learn what the character does simply by playing against them. It's exactly the same as if you simply choose not to play a given character. I never played El Fuerte in SF4, but I still learned how to fight against him.

I bolded the important part for you. There is a huge difference between you choosing not to play Fuerte and not even getting the chance to play Fuerte. Playing as a given character gives you a lot more insight into what works and does not work against that character. Seeing what others do when you do something helps immensely. If I have trouble with a certain character the biggest help to me is playing as that character and learning when they can be punished. It is significantly faster to learn them this way than it is to play against them one out of 20 times.

I'm not going to worry about it too much but it is a really crappy way for them to make additional money. Charge everyone an extra $5 and just include all characters if you have to but DLC should never give one person an advantage over another and that is exactly what this does. Yes, you can minimize it over time but there is always an advantage.

Agreed, it is a key distinction between choice and force. While it may be significantly easier and faster to get up to speed by being able to explore the character, I still don't think it makes the playing field uneven. You can still learn what they are capable of, either by playing or via the internet, and respond accordingly.

That said, it does suck that not everybody gets access to all the characters at the start. I can't quite tell if this is a new route Capcom is taking, or if this is something Marvel has pushed on them. Given that Yun, Yang, Evil Ryu, and Shin Akuma are expected to be DLC characters for Super SF4, I'm guessing this is something Capcom is wanting to do.

Good points above. This type of DLC model doesn't fly with me for fighting games, when it comes right down to it.

I might feel differently if they were released six months or more after the base game, rather then effectively being launch DLC. I might feel differently if they both weren't characters that were already in MvC2. I also might feel differently if there weren't so few characters relative to MvC2 (almost half).

As is, I feel like I'm being asked to pay $8 more for two characters that should already be in the $60 game. YMMV, but I'll happily wait a year for the 'Ultimate' edition or whatever where I get everything at once, and don't have to worry about things like not being able to pick Jill Valentine if I play at a friends house.

I don't really care for what they are doing with DLC. Reminds of the situation with Burnout Paradise where you could just buy a super car to beat all the people that didn't buy DLC. Also some of these guys if not all should have been in at the start. The roster is already cut in half from the last game.

If you think back to the other games someone is always way overpowered. I have a feeling that some of these cheap characters are going to be in the DLC. If you only play fan games where they band the cheap guys that is ok. I'll probably ignore the official ladders. I just don't think it is fair unless everyone has the same guys to pick from.

I don't see fewer characters as being a bad thing, particular taking into account all the myriad changes that are happening to movesets and the general gameplay system. I'll gladly take fewer characters with better balance (hopefully) and new things like aerial tag combos and advancing guard. Sure it sucks that two characters are day 1 DLC, but that's 2 out of a roster of 34.

I also much prefer the character distinction they're going for - Gone are the clone and pseudo clone characters like War Machine, Bone Claws Wolverine, Roll, Ken, and Charlie. Yeah, it sucks that classics like Guile, Bison, Cammy, Venom, Cable, and Rogue are gone, but I can already play them in MvC 2 or Super SF4. I would actually have been really pissed if MvC 3 were coming with all the MvC 2 characters and only a few new fighters.

Where the hell is Mega Man? There's no way he's not in there, right? Am I just illiterate and I've missed him?

How would Phoenix Wright work if he was in the game? Would he just loudly object to every special move the enemies throw at him and then present evidence as to why it isn't a fair fight?

My girlfriend and I are pretty excited for this game. So many Amaterasu Vs. M.O.D.O.K. fights in our future.

Mega Man was ousted in favor of Zero, who was in Tatsunoko vs. Capcom.

I still find it odd that there isn't any incarnation of Mega Man in there. It's an interesting cast choice. Zero doesn't count, obviously.

Zero's cool. He's like a robot Jedi.

I can understand why they'd go with Zero, since he's just Mega Man with a sword, but it still seems strange. There are so many different powers in the Mega Man universe that it would be pretty easy to make Zero and Mega Man distinct from each other. Oh well, I guess I'll just have to live without Mega Man, because I'm sure as hell not going to be paying for him two weeks after the game comes out.

I suspect that this and the upcoming Super SF4 Arcade characters are going to be a test bed for whether or not future DLC characters happen. As much as I'd prefer to have all the characters on the disc, something tells me that Jill Valentine, Yun, Yang, Evil Ryu, and Shin Akuma are going to sell like hot cakes, and we'll just start seeing more and more of this. Shuma Gorath... eh, nobody cares about him.

ahrezmendi wrote:

I suspect that this and the upcoming Super SF4 Arcade characters are going to be a test bed for whether or not future DLC characters happen. As much as I'd prefer to have all the characters on the disc, something tells me that Jill Valentine, Yun, Yang, Evil Ryu, and Shin Akuma are going to sell like hot cakes, and we'll just start seeing more and more of this. Shuma Gorath... eh, nobody cares about him. ;)

And that truly worries me. I don't care about the different costumes. I'm not willing to shell out extra money for them. Others are and that's fine. But removing characters entirely affects gameplay and gives anyone not willing to pay extra a partial game. I don't care for it in TF2 or Call of Duty but at least those games allow you to earn the weapon through playing the game. I view that like unlocking characters. I don't like it but if I want that stuff I'll put the time in. That said, if the characters are cheap I will probably buy them (complaining the entire time).

If they follow the same path they did for the SF4 costumes, and release a complete pack later on, then at least those who are patient (i.e. not me) can get a discount.

At this point I think it's pretty safe to assume that DLC is the way everything is going to go. It makes gobs and gobs of money, but more importantly it's money that bypasses the retail chains. Personally I'm OK with it as long as I still get a significant chunk of content for my initial payment, and what I've seen of MvC 3 looks like more than enough for $60. There are so many characters in the core game that I'm interested in, I don't really care if more come only via DLC, since I'll be spending my time with Phoenix, Zero, Amaterasu, Trish, Dante, and Viewtiful Joe.

EDIT: The significant upside to DLC characters is the potential to breathe life back into games we've already bought. I'm really hoping that the Super SF4 Arcade characters come as DLC to consoles, because that will probably reignite my interest a game I already got hundreds of hours out of for only $40.

Sentinel and Hsien-Ko have been added to the rosters.

1 week to go!

Capcom also just announced Shadow Mode, where you'll be able to download ghost data of expert players (possibly even players like Justin Wong or Daigo) and Capcom staff. I like the idea, but not if Capcom charges for it. Given that they gave away Tournament Mode for free, I'm hopeful that we'll only see costumes/new characters as paid DLC, and get ghost data for free.

I plan to be rocking Dante, Trish, and Amaterasu as my first team. That should hold me over until I can launch the RE5 Trio of Doom when Jill releases next month.

I'm likely to buy the game, but I have a policy of not buying on-disc content. That means I won't be playing those characters. I think it's a cheap and nasty decision by Capcom and betrays the fact that anything claims they have about trying to foster a sense of community and competition is bullsh*t.

1Dgaf wrote:

I'm likely to buy the game, but I have a policy of not buying on-disc content. That means I won't be playing those characters. I think it's a cheap and nasty decision by Capcom and betrays the fact that anything claims they have about trying to foster a sense of community and competition is bullsh*t.

I understand where your coming from but until I see proof the characters are on Disc I'm gonna give them the benefit of the doubt, either way I'm day one on this and I have the collectors edition preordered. I can't wait

Just one week to go!

I'm not a big fan of the DLC characters, especially if they're on disc, but as long as they're reasonably balanced I can live with it.

I take it you guys are getting the 360 version for the most part? I pre-ordered, which means that you'll all get a few weeks of beating the crap out of me before my lack of skill leads me to quit.

The game is $60 and they're expecting you to pay more for DLC characters that are on the disc? Capcom is really doing everything it can to cash in on SF's popularity.

What platform are you guys picking this up on?

And where's your curleh mustache at?

I think the majority of GWJ people will be getting it on 360. That's how SFIV panned out.

Incidentally we don't have a CE here in the UK, so no DLC codes included in any packages for us.

1Dgaf wrote:

I'm likely to buy the game, but I have a policy of not buying on-disc content. That means I won't be playing those characters. I think it's a cheap and nasty decision by Capcom and betrays the fact that anything claims they have about trying to foster a sense of community and competition is bullsh*t.

I don't buy this argument, though I did used to think it myself. It presumes that the characters are even on the disc (as Lothar mentioned), and it presumes that if they weren't DLC we would have gotten them, which is a logical fallacy. These characters have never been offered as anything but DLC, and it makes no sense to claim that they would be available for free if they weren't DLC. But I'm not saying that you can't be pissed about this, just that you shouldn't assume the characters would have been anything other than DLC. I've waited 11 years for this game, so I'm not about to let 2 DLC characters ruin it for me. We still get ~35 characters, which is a ton for $60 (far more than we got in vanilla SF4 which most of us also paid $60 for).

BNice - I just beat Mag-freaking-neto!

360 for me.

ahrezmendi wrote:

BNice - I just beat Mag-freaking-neto!

IMAGE(http://i651.photobucket.com/albums/uu231/BNoice/Reactions/wow.gif)

Damn, I may have to get a fight stick for 360 now so I can join you guys.

It's especially great because Deadpool is voiced by Nolan North. Bet you didn't think you'd ever hear Nathan Drake saying that.

Well, I also have a policy of not supporting bullsh*t content. The fact they're trumpeted as DLC before launch - without even a cursory attempt to make it look like they've been worked as a separate project - is what also annoys me. At least have the common sense to realise sh*t like this is bad customer service. I've not yet been able to bring myself to buy stuff like this. I got SSFIV for free and wanted the Adon costume, but couldn't do it. Even though I could have justified it by saying I didn't pay for the game to begin with.

Also, I've not been waiting any time for this game. I barely played MvC on the Dreamcast; my interest in this is new and based purely on what I've heard of the mechanics and gameplay videos.

Poorly handled it may be, I don't deny that by all appearances this is content Capcom held back to make a few extra bucks on. I also know that you and I live in notably different consumer cultures - crap like this is so commonplace in the US market that it's not even funny. Cars, television, hell even basic flipping phone service here in the US (at least here in California) has gotchas like this or worse. I find it difficult to get upset over Capcom charging extra for 2 characters when AT&T literally doubles my phone bill every month with after-the-fact charges. I suppose that's really what it comes down to. I, as a US consumer, have become so used to this kind of crap that it's normal day to day for me. How depressing is that?

Yes, that's pretty sh*tty.

1Dgaf wrote:

Yes, that's pretty sh*tty.

You're telling me.

In other bad news, apparently the game will launch without spectator support (and I couldn't find confirmation of lobbies even). This blows my mind after what happened with SF4/Super SF4. My head is too foggy to really think much more about it, but this could turn out badly. I hope it doesn't.

EDIT: Apparently the achievements confirm 8 player lobbies, but no spectator support. That bums me out, but at the same time I can understand why it went away. I recall us having some 8 player Super SF4 matches where it was pretty laggy, and the game had to shut off spectators anyway. Still, I think this is reason enough to limit lobby size with the games we get going - I suggest 4 players max per lobby.