Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword Catch-All

So I went back and fought the boss again last night. I almost died, until I accidentally struck at him as he charged Link in that ridiculous painful swing that I press A to dodge and Link doesn't f*cking dodge. Turns out, you can just wail on him then.

Also turns out that, after following the "swing with your whole arm and not just your wrist" is certainly more accurate, but also makes my arm hurt like a son of a bitch.

This is going to be a love/hate relationship, because I love this game...and hate it so much.

I was just about to ask the people who like flailing at the enemies if they get a tired arm after a little while. I try to play it like I am actually sword fighting someone, looking for openings and moving when they appear, and I have been able to avoid the "it's too hard to hit" and the "my arm is tired" effect. I think the motion control works exceedingly well, and I am having a bit of a hard time understanding where people are having a hard time with it.

I've played for maybe ten hours now. Plot-wise, here's where I am:

Spoiler:

Headed back to Skyloft after the temple in Eldin Volcano where you get the bomb bag. I have the third stone tablet to unlock the third area on the surface.

I really love this game, but I also feel like it's a big missed opportunity in some important ways. Before I get into all of that, let me just say where I'm coming from here: I love Ocarina of Time, think it's a fantastic game, and totally understand all the adulation heaped on it. However, the Zelda series has stagnated a bit in its shadow. I enjoyed Majora's Mask, Wind Waker, and Twilight Princess, but their best parts were the ones least like Ocarina, and their least interesting parts were the bits that felt like rehashes of that game.

Skyward Sword has a lot of potential in its setting and design to break away from Ocarina of Time and, so far at least, it simply hasn't done that. The idea of islands in the sky certainly isn't a new one, but it opens up all kinds of interesting and original possibilities for gameplay. It broadens the design space for every area outward in every direction: whereas with something like Twilight Princess the designers were limited to, say, a temple and the ground around it, moving that temple into the sky and giving players the ability to move around it in the air opens up every side and surface of the temple for potential use, including the underside of the island itself. (In fact, the temple in the sky in Twilight Princess, with its dual hookshots, could be a great starting point for just such a sky-based space.)

And the initial exploration of Skyloft actually touches on some of that potential. Link not only climbs over but through and around the island. It's thrilling to navigate the rickety walkways along the island's underside, to look out over the edge and see nothing buy sky. It really drives home that Link is on a floating island and that there's something really special about that.

Unfortunately, the game quickly sends Link below the cloud cover and reveals what's down there: the goddamn Ocarina of Time. Again. They've broadened Link's moveset and given him some fun ways of interacting with the environment, but it all feels like another paddle through the design pool that Ocarina already mostly exhausted. Even the level progression and item path is largely identical. But most frustrating of all is that the enormous potential of flight, ostensibly one of the big themes of the game, gets shunted aside in favor of land and temple designs entirely like everything we've seen before.

Surely I can't be the only Zelda fan who is tired of The Ocarina of Time. I hope that Skyward Sword, like Twilight Princess, has a back end heavy with inventive, clever gadgets and temples and that these first few areas are primarily there to tickle nostalgia and ease reactive players into some more radical ideas. However, I'd love for Nintendo to try putting those radical ideas (the twin hookshots, the spinning gear you ride, etc.) at the beginning of the game instead of at the very end.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

Surely I can't be the only Zelda fan who is tired of The Ocarina of Time. I hope that Skyward Sword, like Twilight Princess, has a back end heavy with inventive, clever gadgets and temples and that these first few areas are primarily there to tickle nostalgia and ease reactive players into some more radical ideas. However, I'd love for Nintendo to try putting those radical ideas (the twin hookshots, the spinning gear you ride, etc.) at the beginning of the game instead of at the very end.

The new gadgets ARE at the beginning of this game.

Spoiler:

The Beetle, which can be upgraded twice. It's pretty good, especially once you get the speed upgrade.
The Wind Blower thingy - it's ok, but it is mostly a tool of wii-motion.
The Whip - I like it bunches and bunches.

RoyalApe wrote:
ClockworkHouse wrote:

Surely I can't be the only Zelda fan who is tired of The Ocarina of Time. I hope that Skyward Sword, like Twilight Princess, has a back end heavy with inventive, clever gadgets and temples and that these first few areas are primarily there to tickle nostalgia and ease reactive players into some more radical ideas. However, I'd love for Nintendo to try putting those radical ideas (the twin hookshots, the spinning gear you ride, etc.) at the beginning of the game instead of at the very end.

The new gadgets ARE at the beginning of this game.

Spoiler:

The Beetle, which can be upgraded twice. It's pretty good, especially once you get the speed upgrade.
The Wind Blower thingy - it's ok, but it is mostly a tool of wii-motion.
The Whip - I like it bunches and bunches.

I haven't seen the later two of those, however:

Spoiler:

The Beetle would be a more impressive new tool if it weren't just a remote-controlled boomerang. That's not entirely fair, I know, but that's been pretty much its only use to where I am in the game.

Looking forward to the new gadgets.

ClockworkHouse wrote:
RoyalApe wrote:

The new gadgets ARE at the beginning of this game.

Spoiler:

The Beetle, which can be upgraded twice. It's pretty good, especially once you get the speed upgrade.
The Wind Blower thingy - it's ok, but it is mostly a tool of wii-motion.
The Whip - I like it bunches and bunches.

I haven't seen the later two of those, however:

Spoiler:

The Beetle would be a more impressive new tool if it weren't just a remote-controlled boomerang. That's not entirely fair, I know, but that's been pretty much its only use to where I am in the game.

Looking forward to the new gadgets.

Spoiler:

You'll get them in Dungeons 3 & 4 respectively.

The first upgrade on the beetle (gotten before Dungeon 3) will make it feel like something different than the boomerang.

Yeah I really like the beetle, and the first upgrade.

Entering 3rd temple finally. It really does feel like the areas outside the temples are a temple in their own right.

Stele wrote:

Yeah I really like the beetle, and the first upgrade.

Entering 3rd temple finally. It really does feel like the areas outside the temples are a temple in their own right. :D

Spoiler:

I think I am in the 3rd dungeon? I guess the area outside it. I did not get a beetle upgrade!

Cheeto1016 wrote:
Stele wrote:

Entering 3rd temple finally. It really does feel like the areas outside the temples are a temple in their own right. :D

Spoiler:

I think I am in the 3rd dungeon? I guess the area outside it. I did not get a beetle upgrade!

Spoiler:

Well, just "being" there doesn't grant you an upgrade, you have to earn it.

You will get it as you are exploring the wide open desert section. NOT the cave section that you end up at when you land from the sky.

I suppose that it is possible to make it to the temple without the 2nd beetle upgrade, but I would think it would be pretty frustrating to do so.

I purchased it today at lunch and there was actually a Nintendo employee at the Gamestop!
I have no idea what she was doing, but it was part of her work. She was nice. I was so excited to be near her because she works for Nintendo (yes, I am a grown man). As I was driving away, I even thought to myself I should try to work at Nintendo.
I was in Lynchburg, VA at Gamestop #4828 on Wards Rd and today's date is the 29th of November (in case the universe allows for really odd coincidences).

I got it new instead of used or waiting because I wanted the symphony CD that came with the game.
Track 5 made me cry (to reiterate: yes, I am a grown man).

Zelda: Certified by Nintendo to make grown men cry.

4xis.black wrote:

Zelda: Certified by Nintendo to make grown men cry.

I also cried at the end of Terminator 2.

I see.

Finished 3rd temple! Beat the boss

Spoiler:

Molderach?

on the first try! For that fight, the swinging controls seemed much more precise than the first temple boss. But then again maybe it was just more clear to me which direction to swing. I didn't think the first boss really gave good clues on which direction he was vulnerable from.

Anyway... awesome story scene again. Link and Zelda really have it in this game, whatever it is. Magic. Or something. Loving the story.

Also, loving the dialog choices. Kinda freeing that there isn't any morality system or I won't be locked out of content or whatever by not following a pattern. So when I want to be a jerk I can, when I want to be a hero I can. Mostly I am playing the straight hero. But sometimes, when something interesting is given I might stray a bit, and there's no penalty for it. I got to deliver come witty action movie dialog in that last cutscene and it was awesome.

+1 for the story.

post dungeon #2 story spoilers...

Spoiler:

I finished the second dungeon and was bowled over by that tall gal telling me that my efforts were too little, too late and if I wanted to help Zelda, I would have to start bringing it. Quite a departure from Link being the celebrated hero.

Are there any hints in-game about where to find the different ingredients for upgrading? I've been playing for quite a while now and still don't have enough ingredients to do anything with.

nivek wrote:

Are there any hints in-game about where to find the different ingredients for upgrading? I've been playing for quite a while now and still don't have enough ingredients to do anything with.

I haven't seen any yet, but I know Beedle's sells an expensive item that should help track down insects... Might be a good idea to jot down where you've found stuff or look it up online?

shoptroll wrote:
nivek wrote:

Are there any hints in-game about where to find the different ingredients for upgrading? I've been playing for quite a while now and still don't have enough ingredients to do anything with.

I haven't seen any yet, but I know Beedle's sells an expensive item that should help track down insects... Might be a good idea to jot down where you've found stuff or look it up online?

I saw that item. It might be time to do some rupee farming. I'm trying not to look anything up online - trying to play this one as a purist. I think I may start taking notes, though, that's a good idea.

I was able to upgrade both shields one rank after the 2nd dungeon.

After the 3rd dungeon I was able to upgrade my metal shield fully, but not my wooden one.

Also after the 3rd dungeon, I still have 2-3 insects I haven't found and 2-3 upgrade materials I have yet to find.

Granted, I may not have found everything, but I think I'm doing a decent job of scouring the maps. But there's a comparison for you.

So anybody else past the 3rd dungeon?

Spoiler:

Loved the boss fight back at Sealed Temple. Seeing the thing from Link's nightmares come alive was pretty fun. Not a difficult fight, but there was implied time pressure, that if you didn't stop it before it reached the top you would lose. Didn't let it get anywhere close, so I'm not sure.

Silly Groose... and Grooseland.

Finally a few more sidequests opened up in Skyloft.

Also, when they showed the green portal for the missing windmill piece I assumed I was going there. But now that I'm on the ground, dowsing is not showing the part. I guess I should have checked with that fortune teller, but I'm a cheap ass gamer dammit.

While I was poking around the forest though, I did find a couple of bomb spots I had remembered from before and got a couple heart pieces. So it wasn't a totally wasted trip.

Stele wrote:

I was able to upgrade both shields one rank after the 2nd dungeon.

After the 3rd dungeon I was able to upgrade my metal shield fully, but not my wooden one.

Also after the 3rd dungeon, I still have 2-3 insects I haven't found and 2-3 upgrade materials I have yet to find.

Granted, I may not have found everything, but I think I'm doing a decent job of scouring the maps. But there's a comparison for you.

You, sir, are an expert treasure hunter. I am very close to being able to upgrade a few things. I need to go back and explore the area before the first dungeon and see what I missed.

I must have been lucky, because I have never had to farm, and have upgraded everything as I went along. I do a lot of wandering around, though.

I don't mind Fi so much, but the woman who sells potions is driving me mental. I know what a red potion does, and even if I didn't, I would after the first time she told me. Buying several before a dungeon is a painful experience. It really is time Zelda games let us skip text; this has been irritating me since OoT.

Stele wrote:

Finished 3rd temple! Beat the boss

Spoiler:

Molderach?

on the first try! For that fight, the swinging controls seemed much more precise than the first temple boss. But then again maybe it was just more clear to me which direction to swing. I didn't think the first boss really gave good clues on which direction he was vulnerable from.

I think the key to the first boss is to do circular motions (like you did to get past the eyeball locks). He tracks your sword with his finger but ends up stopping, especially if you change directions on your motion. That is what opens him up.

Finished the 6th temple last night.

Spoiler:

Eh, might have been the worst of the 6.

Punctuated by a boss fight rehash, blech.

spider_j wrote:

I don't mind Fi so much, but the woman who sells potions is driving me mental. I know what a red potion does, and even if I didn't, I would after the first time she told me. Buying several before a dungeon is a painful experience. It really is time Zelda games let us skip text; this has been irritating me since OoT.

The bug and item collections are what kills me. If it's already in my book I don't need the popup explanation for what it is again. It only pops up once per session. But once per game would be enough. It has gotten to the point that if I'm going to come back to playing the game in an hour or two, I'd rather just pull up the Wii menu and leave it sitting there instead of using save & quit so I don't have to read all this stupid text over and over again.

Stele wrote:

The bug and item collections are what kills me. If it's already in my book I don't need the popup explanation for what it is again. It only pops up once per session. But once per game would be enough. It has gotten to the point that if I'm going to come back to playing the game in an hour or two, I'd rather just pull up the Wii menu and leave it sitting there instead of using save & quit so I don't have to read all this stupid text over and over again. :mad:

I probably should have done that myself. Game took over a minute to load from the disc last night, I think my drive is about to go to pot.

Stele wrote:

The bug and item collections are what kills me. If it's already in my book I don't need the popup explanation for what it is again. It only pops up once per session. But once per game would be enough. It has gotten to the point that if I'm going to come back to playing the game in an hour or two, I'd rather just pull up the Wii menu and leave it sitting there instead of using save & quit so I don't have to read all this stupid text over and over again. :mad:

It does the same thing for rupees. Do we really need the whole cutscene and fanfare for 20 rupees?

Copied from the deals thread just in case:

Amazon has the Skyward Sword with gold remote bundle back in stock, if anyone was looking for it. No special price, (still $70) but it was sold out for the them a month before launch.

It also seems price gouging on the bundle has really started with the next lowest seller on Amazon being $100, and there's 118 of 'em like that!

Got to the 4th temple last night. Didn't quite finish it, so no boss spoilers.

Spoiler:

I was a little worried hwen I had to go back into the 1st temple. I thought just repeating it was going to be the "4th temple" but I wasn't there long, and then the dragon took me behind the waterfall for a real temple. Whew.

Also, in that temple... I got a whip! :cool:

Spent some time practicing my entomology skills last night. I've gotten pretty good at catching the little bug(ger)s.

Making my way to the entrance to the third temple, I've only not caught two of the insects. Now, this is probably a silly question, but... The hell do I do with all these bugs? What are they used for? Does someone collect them? Are they just things I'm scooping up because I like scooping things?