Them Young'Uns, and Violence

So apparently, this is a "thing" now.

This sort of behavior's been documents in St. Paul, New Jersey, Chicago, and another in Chicago.

Alright, first off, let's name the elephant in the room first. In much of the video of said "flash mobs", the vast majority of the participants appear to be black. There, it's said, let's move on.

In the case of the YouTube videos, I only came across it because the mob decided to break the leg of an editor at a website I read frequently.

Frankly, the entire thing strikes a chord with me, somewhere between rage and utter, utter dismay. Largely for the same reason, namely that someone, anyone would have the mentality to say "Hey! Let's go out for no reason other than the intent of causing damage and harm to people!"

I'll be plain. I don't think it's in any way wrong to admit, upfront, that these mobs seem to be made up of one particular race. What's wrong, clearly, is to ascribe that behavior to the larger community, but for us to reach this point here, it seems to me that it's the culmination of failures upon failures, by government and by community.

I was chatting with a friend earlier who said that these kind of things do happen more often than people think, but that the alarm only gets raised when they move into more affluent parts of a city/town and cause destruction there. Which I agree with, but does not, and cannot excuse the kind of callous inhumanity it would take to start assaulting people on the street for no crime greater than them being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

It is, simply, just dismaying, and I can't think of a particularly good response for it other than dull-eyed shock and disappointment. Perhaps this is all a long-winded way of saying "kids these days".

EDIT: I do, however, suddenly understand exactly what feelings and frustrations drove Bill Cosby to make his semi-legendary "Pound Cake Speech" however.

EDIT EDIT: For those of you interested in what "sh*tty parenting" sounds like, the soundbite at 1:50 in this video is a good indication.

As I said, i'm not sure why this particular story strikes me so, and what could/would/should be done.

I'm not sure the fact that they're black is particularly important, in the sense that I don't think it should change how we react to it. Obviously, this is dangerous and needs to stop, but that's true no matter what color they are.

I will say, though, that gangs of nihilistic black people roaming the streets and breaking things just for the fun of breaking things is going to scare the crap out of people that are even marginally racist, and will probably cause overreaction by law enforcement. Society-wide, the justice system is extremely racist, and giving them an excuse to beat up black people isn't the smartest idea I've ever seen.

And, geeze, it's not even for a reason. In the 60s, at least they were being disobedient and disruptive to work toward a higher goal. This is just random violence for no good reason, and it's likely to result in vicious, awful crackdowns.

I could also be overreacting, but race aside, this scares me too. That's a social breakdown on a scale I'm having trouble imagining. Their lives must be f*cked up if this is entertainment. I could see a small group of disaffected teenagers, but this is different.

Malor wrote:

And, geeze, it's not even for a reason. In the 60s, at least they were being disobedient and disruptive to work toward a higher goal. This is just random violence for no good reason, and it's likely to result in vicious, awful crackdowns.

I could also be overreacting, but race aside, this scares me too. That's a social breakdown on a scale I'm having trouble imagining. Their lives must be f*cked up if this is entertainment. I could see a small group of disaffected teenagers, but this is different.

That's my takeaway too. To me, this just speaks of an astonishing social breakdown.

It happened last weekend in Seattle, but it was mostly white. Probably due to the demographics of the regions.

http://www.king5.com/news/Mob-damage...
http://www.komonews.com/news/local/1...

What a strange concept. This is happening nationwide?

I read a few of the articles and there's absolutely no theme or central focus. Some of them seem to be strangely well coordinated robberies. Some seem to have a point or a message. And some just seem to want to break things.

And for the ones that are robberies -- even those don't make sense. a cell phone and a scooter don't really split well 15-20 ways. These guys aren't exactly robbing a Vegas casino. The payoff isn't worth the effort.

Prederick wrote:

What's wrong, clearly, is to ascribe that behavior to the larger community, but for us to reach this point here, it seems to me that it's the culmination of failures upon failures, by government and by community.

This is one of the aspects of youtube that's damaging to black Americans. Much of white America has little social interaction with black people, and so when they see the latest viral video of some asshole doing something criminal/vicious/violent, they assume that everyone in the community acts like this. It's a video service inadvertently suited to perpetuate damaging stereotypes.

I'm with Edwin on this. I think it's a matter of demographics: if there are lots of angry white teenagers in the area the mob will be largely white and if there are lots of angry black teenagers in the area the mob will be largely black.

The moment we're talking about mobs, we're talking about a mob mentality. I'm sure that some, maybe most of the participants wouldn't ever throw a punch at their victim without another 20 guys backing them up. Some of them might not even have any idea who their victim is but hey, their buddy sent them a text to meet up and their buddy is the kind of psycho who would assemble a flash mob.

I see this as a manifestation of our FUD culture. These kids are angry but they aren't entirely sure why. They're given reasons - terrorism, unemployment, a scary Muslim in the White House, Sarah Palin - but none of them really seem to fit.

Our entire country is a bad parent.

It's crap like this that gets Korean shop owners like myself running to the gun store. Looks like time to stock up on ammunition.

It reminds me a bit of the Vancouver riot after the Stanley Cup. I read articles by older sportswriters saying how shocked and dismayed they were, not just by rioters, but by the young people who acted as if the violence was entertaining, taking photos in front of burning police cars. I think a lot of young people are tired of the status quo, angry at the invisible forces keeping them down, and a bit bored to boot. I'm not sure there's a solution to it, so I expect to see more of this in the future.

There was a string of these back in 2004 or so in Obama's old neighborhood (Kenwood, just north of the University of Chicago). I don't know what's bringing it back or why it moved into the touristy parts of town, but for some reason it seems ... almost better now? Like it could potentially be vaguely punk or anarchist, instead of just the local school kids out on lunch back in '04. It's totally no excusable; it just feels a bit more Fight Clubby than before.

I think part of what's terrifying about it is that it's not an opponent that you could hope to fight or outrun. It's a surprise mob surrounding you.

This type of behavior is intolerable and inexcusable and it doesn't matter what the race or demographics. The best thing that could have happened at the end of that video would be 30 police officers in riot gear beating the sh*t out of everyone involved. Perhaps that would make them rethink their actions.

Frankly, about 30% of today's youth would benefit greatly from a nightstick upside the head.

Is this similar to what was going on in the UK a few years back, but on a larger scale? I remember them having a large problem with kids recording themselves randomly punching/smacking tourists/strangers and running away.

Man.... this is sickening.... I can't even imagine how scary it would be to be trapped in that situation. Mob mentality is such anathema to me as i'm such a control freak i can't imagine ever "dulling my mind" to just go with the group. I've just never thought like that.... I also never understood people's desire to destroy things. I remember one time when i had to dispose of some desks from our faculty with a co-worker of mine and he ripped into those desks with a vengeance whilst i was carefully dismantling them. He stopped and looked at me with a confused grin on his face and asked why i wasn't enjoying it like he was....

I wonder if we are going to see more and more of this in the coming years. There are a lot of people who (probably justly) feel like they are getting an ever-worse deal from society at large. People who couldn't make ends meet even before the recession, people who have to work retail jobs they hate, and spoiled, self-important people raised by the boomer generation (or their offspring). It isn't necessarily justified, but there is a lot of frustration with life out there, and this feels like it might be a manifestation of that. Or it could be packs of teenagers (who are, on average, really terrible people in the best of times) with too much social media and not enough useful parents.

As someone who actually owns and operates a business in the ghetto, l can attest to seeing both outstanding people and rampant asshattery. This sort of thing doesn't really surprise me much. It just looks like every Friday night with a couple more motivated asses.

They've officially gone too far. A flash mob in Philly attacked an editor at The Onion over the weekend, breaking her leg.

Fire hoses might work too. It might invoke some not so proud moments of US history, but, I think they'd be pretty effective considering without something to fight for, it will be easy to call the mob's bluff.

Bear wrote:

This type of behavior is intolerable and inexcusable and it doesn't matter what the race or demographics. The best thing that could have happened at the end of that video would be 30 police officers in riot gear beating the sh*t out of everyone involved. Perhaps that would make them rethink their actions.

Frankly, about 30% of today's youth would benefit greatly from a nightstick upside the head.

I always get annoyed at comments like this. Really? 30% of the kids you know would be better off after a beating? In what way?

fangblackbone wrote:

Fire hoses might work too.

There's all kinds of things that might help....if you knew where the mob was going to hit. But generally, you don't. Thanks to the glory of SM, these things can organize on literally a moment's notice, almost anywhere.

Iran, Syria and the like dealt with the problem by simply switching off the wireless networks. It works, but probably not feasible here.

This is a bunch of undisciplined kids who think they can get away with anything.

And guess what--they're right. They CAN get away with anything. The effing mayor of effing Philadelphia was telling the press to back off in that video and that nothing really happened. WTF?

Nothing is going to happen until people start dying in the street. Business owners in those neighborhoods need to start adopting Untouchables-style justice: they send one of us to the hospital, we send one of them to the morgue.

If someone isn't going to act like a human being, they don't deserve to be treated like one.

BadKen wrote:

This is a bunch of undisciplined kids who think they can get away with anything.

And guess what--they're right. They CAN get away with anything. The effing mayor of effing Philadelphia was telling the press to back off in that video and that nothing really happened.

That part really raised my eyebrows. I can understand saying that you don't want this to turn into some media panic, but don't pretend NOTHING HAPPENED.

Something is clearly wrong with them and it's their fault. We need to protect ourselves from them even if that involves violent and potentially fatal responses. That's perfectly fair. They deserve it for what they did.

NathanialG wrote:
Bear wrote:

This type of behavior is intolerable and inexcusable and it doesn't matter what the race or demographics. The best thing that could have happened at the end of that video would be 30 police officers in riot gear beating the sh*t out of everyone involved. Perhaps that would make them rethink their actions.

Frankly, about 30% of today's youth would benefit greatly from a nightstick upside the head.

I always get annoyed at comments like this. Really? 30% of the kids you know would be better off after a beating? In what way?

Who isn't better when they're bleeding from their head?

BadKen wrote:

This is a bunch of undisciplined kids who think they can get away with anything.

And guess what--they're right. They CAN get away with anything. The effing mayor of effing Philadelphia was telling the press to back off in that video and that nothing really happened. WTF?

Nothing is going to happen until people start dying in the street. Business owners in those neighborhoods need to start adopting Untouchables-style justice: they send one of us to the hospital, we send one of them to the morgue.

If someone isn't going to act like a human being, they don't deserve to be treated like one.

Ah, the famous he hit me first defense, favored by children everywhere.

LobsterMobster wrote:

I see this as a manifestation of our FUD culture. These kids are angry but they aren't entirely sure why. They're given reasons - terrorism, unemployment, a scary Muslim in the White House, Sarah Palin - but none of them really seem to fit.

Our entire country is a bad parent.

I agree with this. I lump this in with the shooting in Arizona. We have a nation of unemployed, poor, angry youth bathing in a culture of rage and cynicism and negativity. That's not cause and effect, however, I don't think society is doing kids any favors right now.

DSGamer wrote:
LobsterMobster wrote:

I see this as a manifestation of our FUD culture. These kids are angry but they aren't entirely sure why. They're given reasons - terrorism, unemployment, a scary Muslim in the White House, Sarah Palin - but none of them really seem to fit.

Our entire country is a bad parent.

I agree with this. I lump this in with the shooting in Arizona. We have a nation of unemployed, poor, angry youth bathing in a culture of rage and cynicism and negativity. That's not cause and effect, however, I don't think society is doing kids any favors right now.

A single tear runs down my sweaty cheek for our poor entitled youth. Seriously though if this ever occurs at my place of business, they better hold on tight because it is definitely going to be an e ticket ride.

DSGamer wrote:

We have a nation of unemployed, poor, angry youth bathing in a culture of rage and cynicism and negativity

And E Hunnie said I'd never need these flannel shirts again!

Paleocon:

While I definitely endorse adequate and commensurate self-defense, I think that we shouldn't classify these people as "others," whether the "other" label is "black," "white," "young," "poor," or "wearing white socks." These violent flash mobbers are our children, and if our children are doing these terrible things, then we have failed them, and in the long run, it's better to fix the problem from a standpoint of root cause analysis, rather than stand around pointing fingers and gun barrels.

I'm sorry, but when a gang of people is running around the street smashing things and cracking skulls, that is not the time to bring out flowers and talk about our feelings. I can't even comprehend the state of mind that causes someone to think breaking another person's bones is hilarious entertainment.

There's a word for people like that. They're called sociopaths.

BadKen:

Implementing root cause analytical process isn't about flowers and feelings. It's about dispassionately getting to the key factors that led to the event, and then using the results to tackle the problem from the source.

Refusing to comprehend the situation of people doesn't lead to effective solutions. It just leads to mass murder and genocide. Granted, the latter activities are also effective solutions, but I was assuming that we would rather want to avoid having to use those.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0076240/

Queen Elizabeth I travels to late twentieth-century Britain to discover a tawdry and depressing landscape where life mostly seems aimless and is anyway held cheap. Three post-punk girls while away their vacuous existence as best they can, from time-to-time straying into murder to relieve the boredom