The Dark Knight Rises Catch-All

If they go more into the future they could pull off a Red Robin story. Or I wouldn't mind seeing someone do Scarface. Scarface is crazy but not Joker crazy. I think it would be a good idea to avoid some the more insane characters just because it will be hard to top Ledger's Joker.

stevenmack wrote:

I would think Freeze or Ivy are a little too far into the fantasy side of things for Nolan.

That and he's pretty much professed to following the comics more than the cartoon, and as such the comics never really treated Mr. Freeze as a serious villain until the cartoon.

In fact, I've known many who feel the cartoon to be the definitive Batman, and considering additions like Harley Quinn and making Mr. Freeze a bad ass, I'd have to concur. Which is a damn shame because Mr. Freeze being a morally ambiguous character is perfect for the tone of Nolan's Batman. He's not a bad guy. He's not plain evil like The Joker. He's a vigilante going after a very different sort of criminal than Batman and is willing to break more rules to do it.

Hell, just the concept of vengeance is one that could tie Batman and Mr. Freeze together.

That, and really, am I ever going to see Patrick Stewart play Mr. Freeze before he dies? He's f*cking perfect.

If they bring Two Face back, I will be happy. I felt the concept of him dying at the end of Dark Knight was retarded, though it seemed to spark debate whether he really died or the city was just lying.

EDIT:

Baron Of Hell wrote:

Or I wouldn't mind seeing someone do Scarface. Scarface is crazy but not Joker crazy.

Yeah but the question now is, could Jeff Dunham do a Batman film?

Could we take such a villain seriously?

stevenmack wrote:

I would think Freeze or Ivy are a little too far into the fantasy side of things for Nolan.

Yeah -- both of the other movies are more on the "realistic" (for lack of a better term) side and if they're keeping that tone you can rule out Freeze/Ivy/Killer Croc/et cetera. Since Nolan toned down all the wilder things about the characters up until now I think that's a safe bet.

I always thought that Dark Knight should have ended with Two-Face alive and setting him up as the main villain for the third movie. That ending was way too rushed.

ccesarano wrote:

That, and really, am I ever going to see Patrick Stewart play Mr. Freeze before he dies? He's f*cking perfect.

I've wanted this for so long.

I never got the impression that Two Faced died. I always assumed it was a cover-up by Gordon.

Quintin_Stone wrote:

I never got the impression that Two Faced died. I always assumed it was a cover-up by Gordon.

My perception was similar. And I also think there's a whole lot more life left in Two Face to make a whole movie.

Add in a single minor villain, and I think you've got a film.

Catwoman.

But whatever they do, they have to tone down the batman-voice. As much as I loved last year's Halloween episode of Community, the Batman voice has got to go.

Bringing back Ghul wouldn't be bad. They clearly left his fate up in the air, as he meditated before his death. Something going on there. A lot more likely to have him back than Two-Face.

Veloxi wrote:
Stengah wrote:

They should give him a voice changer built into his cowl and just have Kevin Conroy do the voice.

Where do I sign this petition?

sign me up

Stengah wrote:
Minarchist wrote:

I vote for Poison Ivy. Not a great villain, but requires a curvaceous, red-headed actress...like maybe this person:

IMAGE(http://images.askmen.com/photos/christina-hendricks/84015.jpg)

Just sayin'.

I heartily approve of this suggestion
[size=8]Mainly just as an excuse to repost the image.[/size]

Thirded, for the same reason.

Stengah wrote:

They should give him a voice changer built into his cowl and just have Kevin Conroy do the voice.

If Conroy's unavailable, get this kid to do it.

I hope that they follow the final points of Dark Knight and really emphasize how Batman should be perceived as a villain by the people. I think there is so much potential for Catwoman to swoop in and play Devils Advocate with him, asking him why he fights so hard for people who now despise him. Batman should be extremely messed up after Dark Knight, loosing his childhood friend/love interest and the one person who he saw saving Gotham. I personally hope that if Two Face is alive, he makes only a small appearance in the film as the overall mastermind, controlling Catwoman, and the second villain indirectly. For the second villain, I hope for Killer Croc. I could see Batman going down a path of destruction paralleled by the giant behemoth of a crocodile monster. The only bad thing is that would get us into more of the physically deformed monster villains that are harder to pull off in Nolan's world.

Stele wrote:

Bringing back Ghul wouldn't be bad. They clearly left his fate up in the air, as he meditated before his death. Something going on there.

I wasn't under that impression at all, I thought he was just trying to be at peace in his final moments, not cast some sort of magic spell to save his life

Some of my favorite stories of Batman involve him being chased by the police, so I'm excited to see how they handle that in this new movie.

Yoreel wrote:

I hope that they follow the final points of Dark Knight and really emphasize how Batman should be perceived as a villain by the people. I think there is so much potential for Catwoman to swoop in and play Devils Advocate with him, asking him why he fights so hard for people who now despise him. Batman should be extremely messed up after Dark Knight, loosing his childhood friend/love interest and the one person who he saw saving Gotham. I personally hope that if Two Face is alive, he makes only a small appearance in the film as the overall mastermind, controlling Catwoman, and the second villain indirectly. For the second villain, I hope for Killer Croc. I could see Batman going down a path of destruction paralleled by the giant behemoth of a crocodile monster. The only bad thing is that would get us into more of the physically deformed monster villains that are harder to pull off in Nolan's world.

Didn't they already go this route with the whole 'tortured hero' in the Spiderman films? We don't want a repeat of emo dancing and flippity floppity walking.... I don't think Batman can pull it off....

I think it'd be more interesting for a 'realistic' Batman to not have a super villain to fight. That's the biggest weakness of bringing Batman to a more realistic showing in film because super villains don't exist and their antics wouldn't make sense. More likely, it'd be a cabal of underworld gangs that set out to take down Batman - I've forgotten the plot of Dark Knight, but wasn't the Joker funded by these sorts of people? Why not have them launch an army against the city and Batman having to take them down with the aid of the police force?

Yonder wrote:
Stele wrote:

Bringing back Ghul wouldn't be bad. They clearly left his fate up in the air, as he meditated before his death. Something going on there.

I wasn't under that impression at all, I thought he was just trying to be at peace in his final moments, not cast some sort of magic spell to save his life

Huh. Well I totally went the other way, guess it's not clear. Thought there was more ambiguity than with Two Face. But I guess if they're sticking with more realism then Ghul won't be back either. I don't know enough of his comic back story or with Talia mentioned before, to know what the hell they could do with it though.

Duoae wrote:
Yoreel wrote:

I hope that they follow the final points of Dark Knight and really emphasize how Batman should be perceived as a villain by the people. I think there is so much potential for Catwoman to swoop in and play Devils Advocate with him, asking him why he fights so hard for people who now despise him. Batman should be extremely messed up after Dark Knight, loosing his childhood friend/love interest and the one person who he saw saving Gotham. I personally hope that if Two Face is alive, he makes only a small appearance in the film as the overall mastermind, controlling Catwoman, and the second villain indirectly. For the second villain, I hope for Killer Croc. I could see Batman going down a path of destruction paralleled by the giant behemoth of a crocodile monster. The only bad thing is that would get us into more of the physically deformed monster villains that are harder to pull off in Nolan's world.

Didn't they already go this route with the whole 'tortured hero' in the Spiderman films? We don't want a repeat of emo dancing and flippity floppity walking.... I don't think Batman can pull it off....

The tortured hero route wouldn't be that exciting (just comes of as whiny), but if they make him a fallen hero (does something despicable and out of character) then it could work. I want to see him break his own rules. I can see Catwoman as the architect of both his downfall AND resurrection. How often do we get a movie where the hero and the villian love each other.

heavyfeul wrote:

How often do we get a movie where the hero and the villian love each other.

House and Cuddy?

Oh wait, that's a tv show.

Stele wrote:

But whatever they do, they have to tone down the batman-voice. As much as I loved last year's Halloween episode of Community, the Batman voice has got to go. ;)

Community wrote:

"Batman?"
"Yeah?"
"Are you staying for the party?"
"If I stay, there can be no party."

I'd love to see more Two-Face, especially since we won't get the Joker :(. The Joker's line about Harvey being his "ace in the hole" seems to set Two-Face up for a good run in the third film, assuming the Harvey Dent memorial service is a cover.

I'm putting my money on another two-fer in the villain department. I think Selina Kyle/Catwoman is a good choice for many of the reasons already stated, and also because she could be an interesting "rebound" from Rachael. For the second villain, if it's not Two-Face (he could be dead, but maybe not), I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that it may be:

Penguin.

Now, now, stop laughing and hear me out for a second. In a broad sense, Chester Cobblepot/Penguin is Bruce Wayne/Batman gone wrong: both are extremely intelligent, driven billionaires who use gadgets and unusual personae to press an agenda that each is very passionate about.

Set aside the traditional goofball "waugh waugh waugh, I have an umbrella that can do 100 things" portrayal of Penguin and imagine a Gotham city where Batman is still up to his old tricks, but is limited more than ever given that he's now GPD's public enemy number 1. As a result, he's spending more time than ever as Bruce Wayne and struggling to make his peace with this change (riffing on the "Bruce Wayne is the mask" theme from the first movie). In the midst of this, both Catwoman and Chester Cobblepot show up in Bruce's personal life, the former as a potential love interest/fellow stalker-of-things-in-the-night and the latter as a member of the billionaire peerage--perhaps a competitor to Wayne Enterprises--but who is also secretly an accomplished thief and robber baron. Bruce gets along well with both of them, and given his alienation from society, latches on to them in a way that starts to lead him down darker roads. With Catwoman, this could take the form of the seductiveness of "if everyone treats you as a criminal anyway, you might as well cross the line sometimes." With Cobblepot, this may be something that occurs primarily in personal life, such as having to engage in corrupt business practices to keep Wayne Enterprises afloat. At some point in the story, Bruce/Batman hits bottom, so to speak--maybe when he finds out that his two "friends" have dual identities and nefarious agendas of their own--and realizes that he's become what he hates in both his personal life and his crime fighter life. His, "rise," then, would be how he pulls himself back from this precipice and regains his ethical/moral center.

I wouldn't bet money on it, but I think this could be an interesting idea.

By that logic, it could also be Hush.

Rat Boy wrote:

By that logic, it could also be Hush.

God, I wish.

Rat Boy wrote:

By that logic, it could also be Hush.

Good point, but I think Hush may be too obscure for Nolan, who seems to want to re-imagine more "mainstream" characters.

Polliwog wrote:

I'd love to see more Two-Face, especially since we won't get the Joker :(.

Did you see Inception? Joseph Gordon-Levitt looks like Heath Ledger's clone.

ClockworkHouse wrote:
Polliwog wrote:

I'd love to see more Two-Face, especially since we won't get the Joker :(.

Did you see Inception? Joseph Gordon-Levitt looks like Heath Ledger's clone.

A copyCat Joker! Genius!

DrSugardaddy wrote:

the latter as a member of the billionaire peerage--perhaps a competitor to Wayne Enterprises

Overall I think that you've outlined an interesting movie, but I wonder if the above part would come off as too similar to Iron Man 2.

Personally I'm hoping for Catwoman or Talia al'Ghul and the Penguin, with perhaps a dash of Bane. Either way I think Nolan will do a good job in making a finish for this trilogy of awesomeness.

heavyfeul wrote:
Duoae wrote:
Yoreel wrote:

I hope that they follow the final points of Dark Knight and really emphasize how Batman should be perceived as a villain by the people. I think there is so much potential for Catwoman to swoop in and play Devils Advocate with him, asking him why he fights so hard for people who now despise him. Batman should be extremely messed up after Dark Knight, loosing his childhood friend/love interest and the one person who he saw saving Gotham. I personally hope that if Two Face is alive, he makes only a small appearance in the film as the overall mastermind, controlling Catwoman, and the second villain indirectly. For the second villain, I hope for Killer Croc. I could see Batman going down a path of destruction paralleled by the giant behemoth of a crocodile monster. The only bad thing is that would get us into more of the physically deformed monster villains that are harder to pull off in Nolan's world.

Didn't they already go this route with the whole 'tortured hero' in the Spiderman films? We don't want a repeat of emo dancing and flippity floppity walking.... I don't think Batman can pull it off....

The tortured hero route wouldn't be that exciting (just comes of as whiny), but if they make him a fallen hero (does something despicable and out of character) then it could work. I want to see him break his own rules. I can see Catwoman as the architect of both his downfall AND resurrection. How often do we get a movie where the hero and the villian love each other.

Fallen hero would be a better way of saying it. I don't want to see him go all mopey and emo over Gotham city, but more just seeing him deal with the fallout of what has happened at the end of Dark Knight. You bring in Catwoman/Selina Kyle and you have him dealing with finding someone who could understand his dual personality, but who is not 100% up to snuff on the Bat's moral code. Also, you deal with him not wanting to bring another person into his life emotionally.

I would say the above nothing of Catwoman and the Penguin by DrSugarDaddy is fantastic except that it is too close to Batman Returns for me. Sure you wouldn't have the Tim Burton craziness, or Danny Devito eating scenery but it is pretty close to old Copperpot getting back at the ritchies that flushed him into the sewers.

Minarchist wrote:

I vote for Poison Ivy. Not a great villain, but requires a curvaceous, red-headed actress...like maybe this person:

IMAGE(http://images.askmen.com/photos/christina-hendricks/84015.jpg)

Just sayin'.

She can be my Catwoman allright.

I like the thought of a more refined Penguin as the primary. Given the Bat's newfound infamy, a villain perceived by the public to be a good guy/upstanding citizen would be perfect, especially if he can foil and publicize at least one of Batman's attempts to expose or capture him. Maybe furthering the conflict is the villain threatening Bruce Wayne/his business interests directly and attempting to go after him directly.

Another thought is using one of the Hugo Strange variations or a Bane/Croc as the hench-villain to the main baddie, since that seems to be the running theme Nolan is using (Scarecrow working for the League, Two-Face being the Joker's pawn). I've yet to see a Catwoman implementation that I've really enjoyed, so I hope that isn't the choice.

Kraint wrote:

I've yet to see a Catwoman implementation that I've really enjoyed, so I hope that isn't the choice.

If Halle Berry did Catwoman again but this time showed her tits, she might win another Oscar.

Stele wrote:

Catwoman.

But whatever they do, they have to tone down the batman-voice. As much as I loved last year's Halloween episode of Community, the Batman voice has got to go. ;)

I disagree. first, it doesn't really bother me at all. But second, I was just reading a comic the other day in which Alfred was telling Bruce that he starting to use the raspy Batman voice as Bruce more and more. The fake rasp is part of the character.

I'm not sure why it is so irritating to some people. It's not like he's doing a Jar Jar or anything.