Splinter Cell: Conviction Catch-All

I'm disappointed by the loss of the social integration-as-stealth, but I liked what they did with the overlay. I hope that the firefight at the end isn't indicative of some sort of expectation on the part of the developers that this should be played as an action game. The weakest parts of the other Splinter Cell games were when they forced you into shooter situations.

The 'broken mirror for looking under doors' thing would never work of course but it did look cool.

Not sure if it's the best place to mention it, but it looks like Steam has a sale going on for the previous Splinter Cell titles if you're hankering to play or replay them. I'm downloading Double Agent now for $4.99.

I hope at some point Sam gets back into the government employ, as he seems to have better toys working for them.

kuddles wrote:

Am I the only one disappointed by this? The old version of Conviction looked really cool and fresh, like a mix between the Hitman games and a modern urban "Assassin's Creed". Three years later and we get just another generic action game. I liked the different look he had. Heaven forbid we control a character that isn't yet another Duke Nukem ripoff in our games.

To me the first version of Conviction felt like a Bourne inspired total re-imagining of a game that didn't need re-imagining. There were some interesting ideas but they took the game way from what it had been before (I don't think I've ever been convinced by crowd stealth, even in AC which I loved.) The new take is exactly what I wanted. A Bourne inspired refresh of the game that preserves the elements I loved in the rest of the series while doing enough to make it exciting and interesting.

Now that I've watched it, let's at least agree that whether we like the changes or not (and I'm among the large number of you who do) they deserve a lot of credit for taking risks and innovating. It's a risk-averse industry where playing it safe is usually rewarded, and I'll bet a lot of these ideas are quickly stolen by other games.

That said, I'm surprised they didn't go with a new I.P. or a more complete franchise reboot (perhaps a new main character?) to go with the new direction. Then again, maybe that's a way of limiting risk in the title?

Why does Sam look so young?

SwampYankee wrote:

I hope at some point Sam gets back into the government employ, as he seems to have better toys working for them.

The walkthrough linked from the OP ends with Sam being surrounded by what appear to be Third Echelon agents. I'd say the chances he stays independent the whole game are effectively 0.

This has me itching to start up what I didn't finish. Previous Splinter Cell games!

whispa wrote:

This has me itching to start up what I didn't finish. Previous Splinter Cell games!

Yeah, I have to finish Double Agent (Xbox version.)

Higgledy wrote:

Yeah, I have to finish Double Agent (Xbox version.)

Failing to find a dedicated thread, I'll ask here: I've heard that in some ways, the XBox Double Agent is better than the 360 Double Agent. I have both on my pile of shame. Advice? ("Both, in this order..." as well as "neither" are acceptable answers.)

I did enjoy Chaos Theory, the only other one I played; I particularly like that it encouraged you to try to get through without killing anybody. Interesting change of pace for someone who made a point of killing everybody I could in Beyond Good & Evil.

Xbox Double Agent: Better singleplayer (but not as good as Chaos Theory) and 2player coop. Poor Versus.

360 Double Agent: Poor Singleplayer, no coop, but good Versus.

Sam's age is a little odd. He looks younger now than he did in the flashbacks to before he had even retired.

So far, this has been one of the most impressive gameplay demos I've seen of the show.

The biggest change to me, the biggest re-invention, the biggest change is the speed of the game. So fast. Have a look, make a simple plan, execute, adjust. Not wait, observe, wait, act, wait, observe, wait, act, etc. until you reach the objective or have to try again.

It's exactly the sort of thing Clint Hocking talked about at the last GDC, isn't it?

Now I just hope it has a level design to match the Hitman games since IO seems to be finished with that series.

I'm kind of worried about the kill queue thing, because a lot of my favorite moments in the past games came from doing that sort of thing, but actually doing it. For example, in the last mission of Pandora Tomorrow when you have to grab the guy while he's on camera, I dropped down behind him, grabbed him and while holding him like a human shield got 6 headshots on his guards in the space of about a second. The room was clear and half the people in it hadn't even realized I was there yet. It felt so cool, and I don't think an automated process would have that kind of thrill to it.

Switchbreak wrote:

and I don't think an automated process would have that kind of thrill to it.

Not quite automated, you still gotta spot them and decide which one the mark. And one of the demo videos, I think from the playthrough on the microsoft conference, the player couldn't get one in his sights on time and almost had his character killed during their first public presentation.

In fact, if you put the two recordings, the one at Ubi's presentation and the one at microsoft next to one another, and consider that this is a demo (scripted) at a presentation (even more scripted) it's quite surprising that the game still managed to play so diffirently.

More details on the kill queue. First you have to charge it, by taking someone down using stealth. Then, depending on the weapon you have, it will allow you a certain # of tagged kills in the kill queue. The pistol shown in the demo has two, it seems that other weapons will allow more or less kills. (I could imagine kicking down a door with an SMG would allow for more than the 2 the pistol does.) You don't always have the ability to just tag and kill people.

I think the whole game is looking great so far. It moves fluidly, looks great, seems like the action sequences are very fast and furious, and the story unfolds in a very cool way during character control. I'd previously been burnt out by the same-basic-game sequel syndrome with Splinter Cell, but this one just went to a definite buy. (Assuming it lives up to the demo, gameplay wise..)

I only played parts of the 1st and 2nd Splinter Cell games, and they never really 'clicked' with me. Reading some of the reactions here and recollections on 'Chaos Theory', I'm considering checking that one out. I'm a huge Thief fan, and I just didn't get much out of the first 2 Splinter Cell games in comparison. Are the chances good that I might enjoy 'Chaos Theory' more than the first two?

'Conviction', on the other hand, looks really interesting to me. It's definitely on my radar now, whereas it wasn't before.

dhaelis wrote:

I only played parts of the 1st and 2nd Splinter Cell games, and they never really 'clicked' with me. Reading some of the reactions here and recollections on 'Chaos Theory', I'm considering checking that one out. I'm a huge Thief fan, and I just didn't get much out of the first 2 Splinter Cell games in comparison. Are the chances good that I might enjoy 'Chaos Theory' more than the first two?

'Conviction', on the other hand, looks really interesting to me. It's definitely on my radar now, whereas it wasn't before.

You quite possibly might enjoy Chaos Theory very much, it's easily the best of the Splinter Cell games to date. The funny thing is, most of the changes are nuanced and tiny adjustments but their impact seems to affect the enjoyment of the game so much more than that. The level design is also arguably much improved with more variety on how to tackle objectives (the bank mission is easily my favorite of the bunch.) I'd definitely track down a copy and give it a go, it can't be much more than $10 at this point.

One thing's for sure, all these experiments to do away with the HUD are fascinating. Games can't ignore the 4th wall but gotta learn to use it. And some ways some games nowadays are experimenting to use it is stuff that film could learn from. I mean, films either ignore the existance of the 4th wall or break it. They can show that a character is thinking or feeling but the only way film seems willing to show what he's thinking about is through voice-over or flashback cuts. Ignore it or break it, games are doing all sorts of things to figure out how to use it.

Quintin_Stone wrote:

Why does Sam look so young?

SwampYankee wrote:

I hope at some point Sam gets back into the government employ, as he seems to have better toys working for them.

The walkthrough linked from the OP ends with Sam being surrounded by what appear to be Third Echelon agents. I'd say the chances he stays independent the whole game are effectively 0.

No question. The demo ends with 'The Panther' getting captured. Guess what'll happen...?

Third Echelon: Hi, Sam. We need your help.
Sam: No.
Third Echelon: We can help you find your daughter's killer if you help us.
Sam: I'll help you.
Third Echelon: Okay, well, we'll give you small bits of interesting, but not too interesting, information. You use that information to find your guy and then when you run into a dead end, we'll give you another piece.
Sam: Great.
Third Echelon: Here's your old suit.
Sam: This thing fits a little more snug than it used to.
Third Echelon: That's funny. You're probably older and a bit fatter than you used to be.
Sam: I hope regular Splinter Cell players will get that joke...
Third Echelon: So do we.

dhaelis wrote:

Are the chances good that I might enjoy 'Chaos Theory' more than the first two?

It is my favorite game of all time. No joke. It still plays and looks like a current gen game.

dhaelis wrote:

Are the chances good that I might enjoy 'Chaos Theory' more than the first two?

Chaos Theory is a masterwork. I cannot speak highly enough of that game. They fixed everything that was wrong with Splinter Cell.

Man now I want to replay CT.

Looks like an awesome blend of all Ubi's properties -- SC, Prince of Persia, Assassin's Creed...

I'm thinking about picking up CT again. I never finished it on the xbox but I was wondering which version would be better. The original Xbox version played on the 360 or the PC version?

Reshogg wrote:

I'm thinking about picking up CT again. I never finished it on the xbox but I was wondering which version would be better. The original Xbox version played on the 360 or the PC version?

The PC version is pretty good, but it has some DRM issues. To work on a 64-bit system at all you need to use a crack on it to remove the DRM. It's available off Direct2Drive though, so it's convenient.

I've never been a fan of Splinter Cell or stealth games in general, but I'm really excited for this game now. The trailer looked really cool, they storytelling seems to be really well done and interesting. It's still a stealth game, but it seems like it's less hardcore about that now, so I'm hoping that I'll be able to get into this game. Going into E3 I had no interest at all in this game, but now I'm thinking that I'll almost certainly pick it up and give it a shot.

The latest episode of CO-OP has a feature on Splinter Cell. It's pretty much the same film but the main guy explains that the 'insta-kills' are earned by doing special moves to take out guards.

Switchbreak wrote:
Reshogg wrote:

I'm thinking about picking up CT again. I never finished it on the xbox but I was wondering which version would be better. The original Xbox version played on the 360 or the PC version?

The PC version is pretty good, but it has some DRM issues. To work on a 64-bit system at all you need to use a crack on it to remove the DRM. It's available off Direct2Drive though, so it's convenient.

That must be on just some versions. I picked up a 4.99 budget-bin version (no manual, no case, nothing but a CD sleeve and installation instructions) and it they don't appear to have bothered adding any DRM to it at all. I'm running it on Vista 64-bit without issue.

Higgledy wrote:

The latest episode of CO-OP has a feature on Splinter Cell. It's pretty much the same film but the main guy explains that the 'insta-kills' are earned by doing special moves to take out guards.

A good reminder in that episode where a dev guy points out that using projections is totally in theme with the series. The engine for light and dark and especially the shadows and all that was the main selling point when the series started.

Chtulie wrote:
Higgledy wrote:

The latest episode of CO-OP has a feature on Splinter Cell. It's pretty much the same film but the main guy explains that the 'insta-kills' are earned by doing special moves to take out guards.

A good reminder in that episode where a dev guy points out that using projections is totally in theme with the series. The engine for light and dark and especially the shadows and all that was the main selling point when the series started.

Definitely. It brought back memories of silently creeping into the CIA only to completely blow it in order to see if the projector in the meeting was really "projecting." It totally was, and I totally ruined that guy's powerpoint presentation.

Playing Double Agent (original xbox version) at the moment and I'm so glad I 'deliberately' let the game slip to the bottom of my pile. It's satisfying my sudden hankering for a Splinter cell game. It's obvious though that the game needed a radical change. The stealth mechanics suddenly seem quite stale. They're still fun but not as fresh and exciting as they were in the first few games I played.

Sinatar wrote:
dhaelis wrote:

Are the chances good that I might enjoy 'Chaos Theory' more than the first two?

Chaos Theory is a masterwork. I cannot speak highly enough of that game. They fixed everything that was wrong with Splinter Cell.

Man now I want to replay CT.

Agreed I love CT, it's an great game.