[WoW} Performing Off-spec Roles in Main Spec

Specifically, I'm thinking of DPSing as a Prot Paladin.
It seems like gear is only thing you can really do to help this, but I don't know anywhere to look for information on actually doing this.

For example - I recently got Hatestrike that I can swap out to boost DPS and other non-tanky stats, but where else does one look?
Do other classes ever try this, and is it even feasible? Naxx is a great raid, but sometimes, the OT is really an appendix.

So, what advice or resources do folks have for trying to gear for performing off-spec roles without respeccing?

There are occasionally fights where healing is less of a concern than positioning and DPS. I don't really gear for it, but for fights like Thaddius and Leotheb, I spend more time in melee for mana regen and dpsing via spells than I do healing. Thaddius tends to get occasionally spiky damage, the rest of the time HoT's and judgement of light are sufficient, and with the timer, I'm firing off my damaging spells every time they come off cooldown. I doubt I put out any kind of significant dps, but every little bit helps beat that hard enrage timer.

The only luck I've ever had performing an offspec role in main spec was tanking. Warrior tanking in Arms/Fury is less terrible than it used to be. Trash is a nightmare but that's about it. You can survive most bosses but it's no treat.

I don't recommend using a 2-hander as a Prot Pally under any circumstances...EVER! If you want to use one, respec.

You'll get more damage out of using a 1-hander and shield anyways since you'll still be able to use SHoR and HotR. With a 2-hander, all you're doing is judgement and autoattack.

Just turn off RF, and switch in all gear except weapon and shield if you're going to do that. Still keep your 69696 rotation, omit Holy Shield. Use Seal of Martyr or wisdom depending on how bad you are finding mana regen to be. Also, don't bother with Haste on "this" gear set, since it's not going to do you any good.

My recommendation though is that the pally tank should be the last one to do dps. We do the lowest dps when not tanking over a DK going dps, a druid going kitty or a warrior changing stances. Basically you shouldn't switch to dps in prot spec unless there is a big gear difference between you and the other tank, or you are running two pally tanks.

With the upcoming dual-spec thing in 3.1, that should fix you right up.

That said, it looks like ferals are still probably the best at swapping between tanking and DPS within a single spec. From light study of the talent trees, it doesn't look like they trade off a huge amount of DPS to tank well. And with that upcoming feral shield thing that procs on crit, bears should tank better in 'rogue' gear, giving them more ability to swap roles even in the same fight.

I haven't compared your gear at all, but when you're running with Kam, it might make sense for you to MT in single-tank fights, because I think Kam can do a fair bit of damage even as full prot.

Hybrids in general seem not to cross roles that well without a respec. As a balance drood, I'm not a great healer. My individual spells are strong, but I don't have as much regen as I should, and have no panic buttons. Either the HOTs work or they don't.... if I fall behind, I have few ways to catch up. And no Wild Growth is a big problem.

In TBC, I was an excellent healer when specced that way, so I don't think this is inexperience. It's just that the balance spec, despite all the spellpower, doesn't deal well with the actual damage patterns, which are very spiky.

I've actually off-tanked regular level 70 instances back in TBC as a holy pally. Worked pretty well, too; off-tanked where useful, and off-healed in other spots.

Farscry wrote:

I've actually off-tanked regular level 70 instances back in TBC as a holy pally. Worked pretty well, too; off-tanked where useful, and off-healed in other spots.

This is a big difference for sure. Holy and Ret can definitely offtank by just putting on the gear and taking the hits. Their threat generation is pretty sad, and they are taking more damage than as Prot, but it's definitely a possibility just to stand up there and yell "HIT ME" at the mobs. I'm pretty sure they could both do heroics even, but that's where it ends.

Speccing in Prot gives you a big boost to threat and aoe tanking. As well, the following mitigation:

14.5% more stamina
10% more armor, +600 more from imp devo
5% more dodge
5% more parry
30% more block (from constant HS)
30% more block value
~17% spell damage reduction
~11.5% physical damage reduction

While I'm sure threat isn't an issue for a Ret with RF up, the mitigation would definitely hit home considering you are taking full damage from around 30% of all attacks, and have a much lower health pool to soak those hits.

Basically if you have a decent Prot set, and have a good healer, you probably won't have issues in heroics, but would still bite the dust tanking anything in Naxx.

Regarding dual-spec, my hope was that I could ProtDPS just good enough to be useful on single-tank fights and use Dualspec for Holy.
I don't expect to do Ret level DPS, but I am hoping to be able to get enough AP to at least not be in the situation of needing to tell the raid to replace me because I am useless if I'm not tanking.
At least in fights like Helgan, I can stand and cleanse and throw FoL and actually contribute. Fights that actually need me to be a real healer, I only have, what, 1k +Heal? And none of the healer talents? Laughable.

Isn't this all going to be irrelevant really soon? Dual specs should kill this issue forever especially if there's only a 5 minute cooldown in between changes?

Bear wrote:

Isn't this all going to be irrelevant really soon? Dual specs should kill this issue forever especially if there's only a 5 minute cooldown in between changes?

Actually, as currently implemented on the PTR there is no cooldown; the only cost is a five second (out of combat) cast time and a 100% depletion of your mana bar.

Bear wrote:

Isn't this all going to be irrelevant really soon? Dual specs should kill this issue forever especially if there's only a 5 minute cooldown in between changes?

Duci's talking about a Triple Spec though, so that he can spec Prot and Holy and still do dps so he doesn't have to switch toons or actually go respec...lazy bugger

With dual-specs coming, I really want to get some ret gear together so I can go dps sometimes. Just for the variety of it!

Malor wrote:

I haven't compared your gear at all, but when you're running with Kam, it might make sense for you to MT in single-tank fights, because I think Kam can do a fair bit of damage even as full prot.

I can probably do decently, it's mainly the rage generation that gimps me. If there's raid-wide damage, I'll probably do okay. I haven't spent much time in zerker or battle stance since LK came out, since while soloing Revenge procs pretty much overwhelm any dps gain of switching stances as far as I could tell, but that depends on me getting swung at. I could certainly experiment some and see what I can do, but my lack of non-tanking weapons atm will probably hurt me somewhat. Need to do something about that at some point, but I guess that's the appeal; there's always something more to look at and do.