Battlestar Galactica - Final Season Catch-All (SPOILERS)

Morro wrote:

He was doing it because he was bitter and full of pain and hatred, and grew increasingly resentful of the Adama establishment. The political stuff was just a cover that I think he never truly swallowed, himself.

I agree that he would never have done it if it wasn't for his leg and Dee's suicide.

KaterinLHC wrote:
WineGlass wrote:

I'd also like to say that Roslyn's reaction and speech after Zarek told her that Adama was dead sits firmly somewhere in my personal top 10 moments in BSG.

It was nice, yes, but I think they've been overdoing the Adama-Roslin-shippy-squee-ain't-old-people-kissing-cute?-thing. I never liked them as a romantic item in the first place, but now it just seems like the writers are just squeezing as much as they can, sandwiching in some grand, sweeping test and/or declaration of their love every episode. It's getting stale. I preferred it when it was more subtle, and I wish they'd preserve the time spent on one Adama-Roslin kissy scene on, say, getting back to Baltar and his Head-Six, or what's going down with Tory over on the Cylon fleet, or what Cavil and co. are up to, or the Opera House visions, or Starbuck and Apollo, and so on.

I agree. I don't mind them finally giving in and letting those two actually express their emotion for each other, but I think now that it is out, it is being shown at every possible instance. Here are two peopel that have gone through so much together with this undertone of deep feelings and I don't think now that they have finally expressed them to each other, that they would start to show cracks in their armor and freak out in front of cylons.

A funny bit of horrible ad placement by Sci-Fi channel.

Note that it contains a spoiler for one of the latest two episodes. I forget which, so if you're not caught up don't watch it.

Otherwise, watch away

Thin_J wrote:

A funny bit of horrible ad placement by Sci-Fi channel.

Note that it contains a spoiler for one of the latest two episodes. I forget which, so if you're not caught up don't watch it.

Otherwise, watch away :P

Already did.

Bah!

I just caught up to the current episode of the show a couple days ago. Wasn't about to read 8 pages of comments about old episodes with mysteries we already have the answers to.

You couldn't just knock Laird out, because when he woke up, he'd go tell someone before the revolutionaries were ready. And you couldn't take him with you, because then you'd have an unpredictable Adama-loyalist to juggle along with all the other things going on.

Zarek could have easily let the guy live. He chose not to because he's a killer. There was no greater strategy or planning involved. He found himself in a tight, but completely predictable, situation. What's his first reaction? Kill. Every sucessive action requiring the slightest amount of forethought or diplomacy had an identical outcome.

One moment that really stood out for me was Gaeta's conversation with Baltar just prior to his execution. The way he sat there, talking about his life, making wry comments about how he designed buildings with lots of stairs in his architect phase. He just seemed so relieved that it was all over. Baltar's "I know you, Felix" line at the end kind of cheesed it up a bit, but otherwise it was a pretty poignant scene

That was good stuff. All my nerd rage at Gaeta is gone now.

Katerin's clear support of populist Zerek means I had better watch my back. She could have the Writer's Guild gunned down any moment!

The Writer's Guild is just a bunch of bickering bureaucrats anyway. We'd be better off without them!

IMAGE(http://rps.net/QS/Images/Smilies/scratchchin.gif)

Certis wrote:

Katerin's clear support of populist Zerek means I had better watch my back. She could have the Writer's Guild gunned down any moment!

Let me just say, in Katerin's revolution, I call not the rapist.

Don't worry, boogle. You can be the Gaeta to my Zarek. Just no funny business with the 8's.

It's not so much that I support Zarek's actions - as I said, he is way too quick to use violence and/or play the martyr. But I can see where he's coming from. I don't think he's motivated by evil intentions, and nor is he some power-hungry would-be tyrant. In many ways, Zarek's one of the most tragic figures on the show--a champion of the oppressed who dies a terrorist.

IMHO, the only story sadder is that of Roslin: a decent, principled person who grows too acclimated to power, and evolves into a tyrant. Over the last few seasons, she's really became a brutal, vicious leader--torturing Gaius, arguing against his right to due process, fixing elections, and so on. Maybe she always had the cruel streak in her--she did airlock Leoben after promising him amnesty--but it wasn't until the last season or two that she stopped trying to hide it.

What really creeped me out about the whole "I'm coming for you all" speech is that she never even ASKED the Cylons if they'd be willing to attack Galactica (and thus declare war on the fleet they've tried so hard to ally themselves with). Judging by the way she screamed and railed at Tory, she just assumed that she could bully them into doing it. And then she had the audacity to declare war on Galactica without even asking the Cylons first. I'm really glad Roslin isn't a real politician in charge of my country. I hate to say it, but I think the fleet will be much better off when she's dead.

What was with the leg itching, up until the last moment?

RiverTam wrote:

What was with the leg itching, up until the last moment?

I took it to symbolize Gaeta's desire to be punished for his mistakes and sins (as to why he'd feel that way, watch the "Face of the Enemy" webisodes"). Once he finally realized he was getting it, the itch stopped.

KaterinLHC wrote:
RiverTam wrote:

What was with the leg itching, up until the last moment?

I took it to symbolize Gaeta's desire to be punished for his mistakes and sins (as to why he'd feel that way, watch the "Face of the Enemy" webisodes"). Once he finally realized he was getting it, the itch stopped.

That's a lot deeper than RDM was about it, if you listen to the podcast. I like your version, though.

The heroes (Adama, Rosalin) have become the tyrants, and the insurgents are my heroes.

Finally caught up in episodes. Good thing I stayed away too... whoo-ee, big things went down.

Was I the only one floored by that 'dream' sequence where Gaeta orders Adama shot? That stupid 'Next on Battlestar Galactica' montage pretty much ruined the surprise, but that scene has been stuck in my head for a week now. A crisp execution.

Also: what's up with Gaeta's gay lover? Did he die? Was he a casualty in the Raptor webisodes?

Image of the XO pulling out a pistol and shooting Adama in the head from across the CIC table still gives me chills.

Clemenstation wrote:

Also: what's up with Gaeta's gay lover? Did he die? Was he a casualty in the Raptor webisodes?

Hoshi? He was still in the CIC when Gaeta first started the insurrection. I'm not sure if we've seen him since then but I'd assume he's still alive.

NSMike wrote:
muttonchop wrote:

One moment that really stood out for me was Gaeta's conversation with Baltar just prior to his execution. The way he sat there, talking about his life, making wry comments about how he designed buildings with lots of stairs in his architect phase. He just seemed so relieved that it was all over. Baltar's "I know you, Felix" line at the end kind of cheesed it up a bit, but otherwise it was a pretty poignant scene.

I didn't get what the scene was about at first. When I did, even though I've never cared for Gaeta, it was a pretty heart-wrenching scene.

I was caught off guard a little, too. I remember thinking "some interesting Gaeta stuff -- where's it going?" And even a few lines into it, after Baltar talking, it didn't click that this was his "final visitation with a spiritual adviser" scene. Once I glommed onto that, I was super-tickled.

KaterinLHC wrote:

What really creeped me out about the whole "I'm coming for you all" speech is that she never even ASKED the Cylons if they'd be willing to attack Galactica (and thus declare war on the fleet they've tried so hard to ally themselves with). Judging by the way she screamed and railed at Tory, she just assumed that she could bully them into doing it. And then she had the audacity to declare war on Galactica without even asking the Cylons first. I'm really glad Roslin isn't a real politician in charge of my country. I hate to say it, but I think the fleet will be much better off when she's dead.

I think she didn't ask because she was in total seeing-red-freak-out-angry mode and just reacted and blurted it out without any thought whatsoever.

WineGlass wrote:

I think she didn't ask because she was in total seeing-red-freak-out-angry mode and just reacted and blurted it out without any thought whatsoever.

What's more surprising is that the Cylons actually went along with it. They were all in favor of running away a few minutes earlier.

I remember the good old days... Billy was still alive.

Grubber788 wrote:

I remember the good old days... Billy was still alive.

Ah Billy...I recently got the BSG boardgame and there is a picture of him on the gameboard. It hurts me to look at it...

What's more surprising is that the Cylons actually went along with it. They were all in favor of running away a few minutes earlier.

My take was that now the rebel cylon models are completely unsure of themselves. D'anna seemed like the strongest among them, but she's gone. Leoben's prophecies didn't pan out right. The Eights aren't on the same page at all anymore. Tory was happy to speak out because she resents Roslin, but she's unsure of her place in the cylon community. Everyone's terrified of Cavil, and so on... At this point, they're willing to go along with anyone who makes a convincing leader.

To me, Six, and to a lesser extent Eight, seem almost childlike. They envy humans for their emotions (especially love and the ability to reproduce). They feel like cylons are inherently flawed. This led them to hate humanity and try to eliminate them. But ultimately, humanity is like their parents, and children want to be like their parents and want approval from them. In this context I think it was understandable for them to fall in line behind a strong human authority figure.

Six in particular has been struggling with emotions. At first, she was completely sociopathic (snapping a baby's neck, etc). I think these provocative actions were an effort to somehow gain an understanding. Over time, this behavior has been tempered by her exposure to humans, especially her relationship with Baltar. But her fixation on powerful emotions I think explains why she was so moved by Roslin's display.

I think it's fairly reminiscent of the transformation of the replicant Roy Batty by the end of Blade Runner and I can't imagine that this was not an influence...

*blahblah blah NOT LISTENING.. or reading...*

I'm sitting down right now with a glass of wine and season 1 of BSG. I'm prolly not hoing to bed anytime soon! I need to play massive catch up, so I can save some $$ on DVDs and watch the rest on hulu.

Wtf @ star buck being a girl though? Will she grow on me? I'm kind of annoyed right now..

AustinLiz wrote:

*blahblah blah NOT LISTENING.. or reading...*

I'm sitting down right now with a glass of wine and season 1 of BSG. I'm prolly not hoing to bed anytime soon! I need to play massive catch up, so I can save some $$ on DVDs and watch the rest on hulu.

Wtf @ star buck being a girl though? Will she grow on me? I'm kind of annoyed right now..

Get out.
Get. Out.
For your own good.

(Of the thread, not the series!)

muttonchop wrote:
Clemenstation wrote:

Also: what's up with Gaeta's gay lover? Did he die? Was he a casualty in the Raptor webisodes?

Hoshi? He was still in the CIC when Gaeta first started the insurrection. I'm not sure if we've seen him since then but I'd assume he's still alive.

That whole part of the story really fell apart, then. No mourning scene or anything?

Clemenstation wrote:
muttonchop wrote:
Clemenstation wrote:

Also: what's up with Gaeta's gay lover? Did he die? Was he a casualty in the Raptor webisodes?

Hoshi? He was still in the CIC when Gaeta first started the insurrection. I'm not sure if we've seen him since then but I'd assume he's still alive.

That whole part of the story really fell apart, then. No mourning scene or anything?

The love story was only part of the webisodes, which came about long after shooting had wrapped on the series. RDM talks about it in the commentary for the first mutiny episode.

muttonchop wrote:
Clemenstation wrote:

Also: what's up with Gaeta's gay lover? Did he die? Was he a casualty in the Raptor webisodes?

Hoshi? He was still in the CIC when Gaeta first started the insurrection. I'm not sure if we've seen him since then but I'd assume he's still alive.

When Gaeta ordered the marines to take Adama and Tigh away for holding, the camera also showed them leading away Hoshi as well. We haven't seen him since. But I doubt Gaeta would have Hoshi killed, especially after how the webisodes ended. Felix probably ordered the marines to take Hoshi away for his own protection.

AustinLiz wrote:

*blahblah blah NOT LISTENING.. or reading...*

I'm sitting down right now with a glass of wine and season 1 of BSG. I'm prolly not hoing to bed anytime soon! I need to play massive catch up, so I can save some $$ on DVDs and watch the rest on hulu.

Wtf @ star buck being a girl though? Will she grow on me? I'm kind of annoyed right now..

Man, part of me wishes I could be in your shoes. Fresh to the series, watching it with a sparkle and wonder in my eyes.... with booze.

Don't forget to check out the initial BSG miniseries, too. It takes places before season 1, is like a TV movie, and basically sets the plate for the series.

I have a real love/hate thing going with this version of Starbuck. She's a real mess, and annoys the crap out of me at times, but overall, I do like her. Grow on you, she will.