Sorbicol wrote:Paleocon wrote:Meh. I didn't find John Wick's world building terribly compelling.
It also seems to assume that about 98% of the human population on Earth are assassins.
You don't watch JW for the story, characters, world building, or the dialogue. At least I don't. It's not terribly well conceived or written, but the fight and art direction are pretty amazing. The costumes and weapons aren't so much props as they are costars.
The only reason JW exists as a franchise is because of the first 2/3rds of JW1, which doesn't have a whole lot of action but does have a lot of artful and persuasive characterization and story set up. Everything for the whole rest of the franchise after that 2/3rds point (where he kills the guy who killed his dog) is unsatisfying, misconceived comic book nerd fan service desperately cashing the checks written by the first hour of JW1.
Or at least, that's why I appreciated JW1 and have been turned off by everything I've seen from the rest of the franchise.
hehe yea that may be but the franchise became what it is because of the final 3rd.
Odenkirk’s Nobody is what John Wick would have been with a full length, compelling story.
Odenkirk’s Nobody is what John Wick would have been with a full length, compelling story.
Hard disagree. I believe the total inverse and I was thinking of Nobody when I wrote that previous post. I hated Nobody (I really wanted to like it) and thought it was a total waste of my time. The story in Nobody was nonsensical and the action weightless and inconsequential.
In my view, John Wick would have been a quickly forgotten, minimal impact movie like Nobody, if it weren't for Keanu's best--of-career and nearly silent performance in the first half of JW1 and artful, show-not-tell story establishment.
All the John Wick content after the first 2/3rds of JW1 feels to me more like Nobody than it does like that first part of JW1.
The story in JW1 is not complicated, but it is meaningful and the cinematography, direction, and performances sell the emotional stakes: JW has a dog. The dog is JW's only connection to his beloved dead wife. Bad guy kills dog. JW kills bad guy. Straight up perfect revenge story. By contrast, I honestly couldn't tell you what happened in JW2 or Nobody because it didn't make enough of an impression for me to remember.
I think there are certainly interesting story bits in JW2. He was forced by a blood oath in the wrong hands to kill someone powerful and respected that he didn't want to. Note that the blood oath was a cashed in chip for letting him live a normal life with his wife until she passed.
He tries to survive the consequences within the rules but only ends up having the world collapse around him.
So he stops abiding by the rules to the point of performing the world's ultimate sin.
I think you can't have interesting characters like Charon and Winston without the worldbuilding that the John Wick movies do. It's kind of like mid-tier soulslikes where they put in the hard combat but forget the expansive lore and level design that elevates the From games over everyone else. Similarly, the intricate rules and factions in John Wick are there to tell you why it's such a big deal when he kills someone in the Continental, or why it matters that Halle Berry's character decides to help him. It elevates the fight scenes because you have an emotional investment in why it's happening and the outcome you want. The fight choreography is undoubtedly amazing, but i'm invested in John getting free from this world, which heightens the whole experience. If I don't care about why they're fighting, it's just boring.
Boy, I did not intend to unravel a full-on discussion about JW but I'm not sad that it happened. I only wanted to
highlight how Wick does have world building, probably more than any action movie rightfully deserves, and it's provided more than an extra layer of depth to all 4 entries in the series. Meanwhile Ballerina, while also being a revenge story, sprinkled in their lore more as an afterthought almost (i.e. the villain's hotel, the quirky arms dealing couple). Personal flashbacks were instead emphasized to reinforce why the revenge needs to happen. They were somewhat effective? The villains were all remorseless cartoons and deserved a whupping, sure, but even as the ass kicking was going down, the emotional payoff wasn't nearly as impactful.
All of this to say not every action movie post-Wick needs heaps of lore or any lore for that matter. Gunpowder Milkshake took a stab at loring it up a la Wick a couple years ago and that film certainly didn't land for me. Sometimes you just need a Crank or a Dredd, and depending the budget, that's the most some filmmakers should be aiming for.
This has been a very confusing conversation for me as after reading this I was all excited that the John Wick spin-off movie Ballerina was apparently available on Netflix, but then I checked and this is a completely different Ballerina movie.
In case you didn't know, there is a JW spin-off movie coming out (now that I double checked) next year called Ballerina that takes place between JW3 and JW4 about said ballerina. I thought I had just missed it being released and it was finally dropping to streaming.
I'll still probably check out this Korean flick, but it's funny all this John Wick stuff came up around it.
Yeah, I was also was confused when that movie came out, but then in the movie details I saw a bunch of Korean names, which gave it away. I vaguely remembered that Ana de Armas is the protagonist on the John Wick spin-off.
Anybody watched the new Scott Pilgrim series on Netflix?
100% on RT based on 16 reviews.
With the movie actors reprising their roles, I'm really looking forward to it. Couple things ahead of it in my queue though. I'm still catching up on horror stuff post-Halloween!
Oh I should. It looks very good.
It's on my weekend to-do list.
That thing has been one of my comfort movies for a decade now.
That thing has been one of my comfort movies for a decade now.
Same here. I think reading/watching High Fidelity in 2008 beat it to the punch in the "I'm a near-incel manboy focusing too much on my obsessions and too little on becoming a responsible adult" revelation it could have provided, but it still hits the same trigger point of being relatable while also being fantastical.
As an Ontario native, it was also nice to watch a movie filmed in Toronto that actually took place in Toronto for a change.
Anybody watched the new Scott Pilgrim series on Netflix?
I didn't even realize it was out yet. I have one more episode of The Bear to finish this weekend, then I'll move on to this.
BadKen wrote:Anybody watched the new Scott Pilgrim series on Netflix?
I didn't even realize it was out yet. I have one more episode of The Bear to finish this weekend, then I'll move on to this.
The last episodes of The Bear were my favourite TV moments this year. Enjoy.
I watched the first Scott Pilgrim episode... It’s a bit strange to have a comic being adapted into a movie with actors first and then into an anime. It can’t be the first, so I can’t yet pinpoint what is bothering me about this in particular. It looks good though… But it’s been a while since I watched the movie, and at least the first episode does not bring anything new to the table. I feel the dialogues are slightly better, but that is it.
I've seen about 3 episodes of Scott Pilgrim Takes Off so far and it is absolutely fantastic. I was initially hesitant, but between the animation and the choices made for the adaptation by Bryan Lee O'Malley & BenDavid Grabinski, I've been completely sold. The Netflix anime bounty overfloweth this harvest season.
I'm really enjoying Scott Pilgrim Takes Off. We have 3 episodes left, but I like the way the story has gone so far. The first episode is hard to get into because it moves just as quick as the movie, and it all does have that feel of deja vu. But overall after that the series picks up. There's some good jabs at the movie, and hearing the whole cast come back is also a joy.
Fell asleep during the first episode
We watched the first episode and we were all disappointed and weirded out. I will probably watch it all.
We are two episodes into Series 3 of Lupin and it remains a very enjoyable caper. Omar Sy is fantastic as the lead and I think they have done an excellent job of bringing the soul of the Lupin stories into the modern age.
I'm really enjoying Scott Pilgrim Takes Off. We have 3 episodes left, but I like the way the story has gone so far. The first episode is hard to get into because it moves just as quick as the movie, and it all does have that feel of deja vu. But overall after that the series picks up. There's some good jabs at the movie, and hearing the whole cast come back is also a joy.
My wife watched 1 and said she was out, so I watched another and I'm still in.
I'm not as bothered by changes from the movie dialog or story as I am by the new songs. When they didn't play Garbage Truck at the Rockit I was very disturbed. 
Maybe the new stuff will grow on me. Definitely interesting getting a peek into the League in this version.
For those who enjoyed Money Heist (Casa de Papel), a prequel entitled Berlin is due to release next month.
Anyone watch the Matt Rife special? I went from being super excited to seeing him next year to "maybe I can sell the tickets and make a ton of money". I'll still go if I can't sell them but that comedy special did him absolutely no favors.
Anyone watch the Matt Rife special? I went from being super excited to seeing him next year to "maybe I can sell the tickets and make a ton of money". I'll still go if I can't sell them but that comedy special did him absolutely no favors.
I’ve seen him popping up on the socials and find him kinda ick and lacking charisma.
It was pretty meh
My wife & I watch Nyad. It falls into that category of decent movies made better by being based on a true story. They did a really good job of meshing original footage with new. The only nit I have is that
they made no mention in the afterword of the fact that her accomplishment is no longer recognized
Anyone watch the Matt Rife special? I went from being super excited to seeing him next year to "maybe I can sell the tickets and make a ton of money". I'll still go if I can't sell them but that comedy special did him absolutely no favors.
I made it maybe five minutes before I bailed. I don't think he's all that funny, and his brand of humor is not for me.
New Mike Birbiglia standup is stellar.
I made the mistake of starting Band of Brothers again. I originally watched that via Netflix DVD rental and would smoke Lucky Strikes in between episodes.
Such a compelling show. Hard to put down.
I've never watched it before but I'm tempted to now because I've been listening to the Dead Eyes podcast (which is a deep dive by comedian Connor Ratliff on why Tom Hanks fired him from a bit part in Band of Brothers).
Pages