WAR: played other MMOs? What do you like the most about WAR?

I know someone will say that this maybe belongs in some other thread but this is a very specific question. I've played 4 MMOs in my life: SW Galaxies, World of Warcraft, Age of Conan and now Warhammer Online.

Of those I only played Warcraft seriously because it didn't make me feel like a weakling and was not of punishing difficulty. (I clearly remember in my only day playing Galaxies, being ganked by Frogs and dying. Me, a space adventurer, with a frickin' gun).

Conan wasn't so bad, it just felt tired. I liked the combat system but it couldn't hold my attention for very long. On a positive note, I loved looking at my character. Yep.

0 0 0

That being said, I am now addicted to Warhammer and I'd like to share with you what I like about it that feels different from other MMOs but I'd like to know what you like best as well.

The Public Quests: no more endless instances. Walk in and out of 'em, no strings attached. huzzah!

The Loot: At long last, when you partake in a quest, you are rewarded with loot that is tailored for you and you only.

The Map: A quick glance at the map and you know where you ought to go to complete your quests, the objectives are easy to find, the Tome is really helpful.

No dancing & partying: OK some may think the game is too serious but I actually like the fact that you can't do a bunch of dumb stuff. That way I'm sure I'll never see an orc dancing with 'em ugly stunty beardlings (that's how orcs call dwarves)

Influence: Helping in public quests raises your influence, which, if you work hard enough, assures you that you will get some very nice loot from the area's Rally Master. Said loot, as mentionned before, will be something you certainly can use.

XP in PVP!: Level up in PVP? nice!

Those are my favorites. what about you guys and why?

While I too am currently enamored with WAR. I would challenged the following

The Loot: At long last, when you partake in a quest, you are rewarded with loot that is tailored for you and you only.

While the name same Marauder on the gear. The stats do not always match.

WiredAsylum wrote:

While the name same Marauder on the gear. The stats do not always match.

what do you mean by that? the stats? do you mean you sometime get loot that is a bit outdated or do you mean that you can't use it?

or do you mean that as a marauder you are specialized in such a way that you would rather get, say, wounds instead of strength or something like that?

I'm a tank (black orc) and I usually don't pay much attention but it's true that If given the choice I will grab loot that gives toughness and wounds before strength and initiative but..

this has never really happened to me. Especially with the Rally Master loot. You always get a choice of 2 or 3 different items and there's always something that I can use.

interstate78 wrote:

XP in PVP!: Level up in PVP? nice!

This is why i'll stick around to the RvR end game and see how it turns out. What got me here was solid game play and even though they skimmed off some of the darker stuff, the volumes of lore that they've dumped into this game makes the GW fan in me giggle like a little girl.

BTW in SWG those weren't frogs. They were Worts

interstate78 wrote:

I'm a tank (black orc) and I usually don't pay much attention but it's true that If given the choice I will grab loot that gives toughness and wounds before strength and initiative but..

They have a wide variety of gear that supports different theory crafting ideas. Still as a Black Orc i'm sure you've noticed a large percentage of willpower gear? While being able to disrupt an attack is valuable many would argue it's not the primary focus. You're either going down the path of the full tank and picking up toughness and wounds or going for the most renown you can get and going the strength route. Willpower is 3rd or 4th hell sometimes 5th on a tanks list of stats. Yet there's a bunch of gear for a BO who's primary stat is Will

ranalin wrote:

They have a wide variety of gear that supports different theory crafting ideas. Still as a Black Orc i'm sure you've noticed a large percentage of willpower gear?

Nope, I haven't noticed. I didn't find pertinent to focus on Willpower. the payoff didn't seem as important as being able to resist and endure a lot of damage.

Other than the things you already mentioned, I like the badassitude. I really appreciate the fact that at only level 15, my Chosen looks amazingly tough and scary.

I also like the open group mechanic, letting people dynamically flow in and out of groups as the situation demands easily.

I've only been in a few small keep sieges, none very prolonged, but there's some real cool possibilities there.

interstate78 wrote:

The Public Quests: no more endless instances. Walk in and out of 'em, no strings attached. huzzah!

To me, PQ's are already starting to be a grind. Once you get to Tier 2, the PQ's get harder, and it seems that fewer folks are around willing to risk death to finish Stage 3. This is especially true for PQ's that aren't parked right next to a town.

I like the Influence rewards, and I'm a bit of a completionist, so I've taken to plugging away at Stage 1 on PQ A until it caps, then running to PQ B. Rinse, repeat, back and forth until Inf meter full.

Two things I really, really like that will keep me in WAR for a while:

- Scenarios. What's not to like? Easy to get into, especially now that you can queue for all three. XP rewards. occasional loot, quest XP. My weekday play time is usually pretty limited. With 45 or so minutes I can do three scenarios and feel like I actually accomplished something. I can gripe about Empire's lack of a tank, but even when you lose, you get XP and renown.

- XP for RvR/PvP. Removes the level-up-my-toon vs. go-kick-ass decision. Now I can get some levelry with my kickery! Now if only more Order folks on Iron Rock were interested in Keep Taking, my joy would be complete.

interstate78 wrote:
WiredAsylum wrote:

While the name same Marauder on the gear. The stats do not always match.

what do you mean by that? the stats? do you mean you sometime get loot that is a bit outdated or do you mean that you can't use it?

or do you mean that as a marauder you are specialized in such a way that you would rather get, say, wounds instead of strength or something like that?

I'm a tank (black orc) and I usually don't pay much attention but it's true that If given the choice I will grab loot that gives toughness and wounds before strength and initiative but..

this has never really happened to me. Especially with the Rally Master loot. You always get a choice of 2 or 3 different items and there's always something that I can use.

At times the stats do not make much sense on some gear.

Partly my fault for specializing to an extreme, but finding gear that makes sense is tough. I have to mix some Renown gear and some PVE/PQ/Inf gear.

I'm a MMO whore and I've played pretty much every major one out there. What I really like about WAR can be summed up quite easily. The multitude of options you have to progress your character and each one of them rewarding you in some way. That's the selling point to me.

At this stage at least, it is very hard to get bored with all the different things I can do to level and get gear. Even though each one of the options, like PQs, Scenarios, Quests, RvR can feel like a grind if you just keep doing the same thing, the mix of all of them in small doses can be very rewarding and fun. That's what I have been doing and I'm having a blast!

QQ; I'm tempted to get this game, but I wanted to know,

is it a monthly rent like WoW or a one time payment like TF2 with unlimited access to unlimited servers?

I fear the first rather than the latter and I don't feel like spending an additional $10 ~ $20 on a game I won't have time to play for more than 2 nights a week (my TF2 addiction forbids it).

The game has a monthly fee. It costs $14.95/month.

well there goes that hobby.

interstate78 wrote:
Hobbes2099 wrote:

QQ; I'm tempted to get this game, but I wanted to know,

is it a monthly rent like WoW or a one time payment like TF2 with unlimited access to unlimited servers?

I fear the first rather than the latter and I don't feel like spending an additional $10 ~ $20 on a game I won't have time to play for more than 2 nights a week (my TF2 addiction forbids it).

You know, I really don't know how that's a problem with people. MMOs are huge, huge, huge games. I played 6 months of WoW and didn't even see all of it. Furthermore, I played only one class & race. Had I tried every class I probably could have played it all my life.

I always think of it this way: it's a game I play during the entire month, therefore, had I purchased a game at 15$ that lasted me a month, I would be happy.

The game comes with a free month. well worth a try. was planning on playing once or twice a week but I play every second night these days. Love it.

While I partly agree with you, there is the fact that there are still a lot of good games constantly coming out.

Now paying 15 bux a month for a game that you are not playing exclusively can bother people.

If an MMO was the only game you were going to play then yes it is worth it. But look at Tf2 I have been playing that for a year and only paid 50 bux once.

I am an MMO whore I play them all hell I am paying subscription fees to games I do not even have installed anymore.

But do not knock people for the subscription fee being a barrier to the genre.

interstate78 wrote:

Stuff

WiredAsylum wrote:

Stuff responding to stuff

Yeah it used to be a barrier for me and I thought it was stupid as hell to have to keep paying to play a game even after the initial purchase, but the way i justify it is that me playing an MMO has prevented me from purchasing a lot of other games (trust me it's a struggle) due to time contraints. In that regard I am not paying for multiple $60 games a month as they come out and in the end saves me money. I do usually pick them up later once they have fallen in price usually at around $20 it's a no brainer. My method works, it has been challenged a lot by the enabler crowd of goodjers, but my resolve usually pulls through.

Hobbes2099 wrote:

QQ; I'm tempted to get this game, but I wanted to know,

is it a monthly rent like WoW or a one time payment like TF2 with unlimited access to unlimited servers?

I fear the first rather than the latter and I don't feel like spending an additional $10 ~ $20 on a game I won't have time to play for more than 2 nights a week (my TF2 addiction forbids it).

You know, I really don't know how that's a problem with people. MMOs are huge, huge, huge games. I played 6 months of WoW and didn't even see all of it. Furthermore, I played only one class & race. Had I tried every class I probably could have played it all my life.

I always think of it this way: it's a game I play during the entire month, therefore, had I purchased a game at 15$ that lasted me a month, I would be happy. If anything, MMOs will save you money. back when I played WoW, I bought much less games. go figure.

The game comes with a free month. well worth a try. was planning on playing once or twice a week but I play every second night these days. Love it.

CrashedHardrive wrote:
interstate78 wrote:

Stuff

WiredAsylum wrote:

Stuff responding to stuff

In that regard I am not paying for multiple $60 games a month as they come out and in the end saves me money. I do usually pick them up later once they have fallen in price usually at around $20 it's a no brainer.

Wisdomer words of ... wisdom! were never uttered!

WiredAsylum wrote:

Now paying 15 bux a month for a game that you are not playing exclusively can bother people.

that's pretty much it, I fear that I would play a lot more during the month than the planned (and enjoyable) 2 or 3 times a week (from an hour+ to three hours+) BECAUSE I need to justify the $15.00 every month.

I hate grinding in games and would start to see WAR or any other subscription based game the same way.

Hobbes2099 wrote:
WiredAsylum wrote:

Now paying 15 bux a month for a game that you are not playing exclusively can bother people.

that's pretty much it, I fear that I would play a lot more during the month than the planned (and enjoyable) 2 or 3 times a week (from an hour+ to three hours+) BECAUSE I need to justify the $15.00 every month.

I hate grinding in games and would start to see WAR or any other subscription based game the same way.

Let's say you play WAR 3 times a week for 2 hours. That's 6 hours a week or 24 hours a month. That makes the WAR $14.95/month turn into $.62/hour. That's really not too bad.

Do you find yourself feeling the need to watch more TV because you pay for cable every month?

This is the gwj enabler spell critting before our eyes.

Some one roll a fort save.

Disclaimer: This is a comparison to no one game in particular, but the genre in whole.

I've played City of Heroes/Villains, Warcraft, Lord of the Rings, Age of Conan and Hellgate. Not a huge pedigree unlike some of you guys, but I have enough of a taste of the genre. I avoided the genre like syphilis until the Goodger collective broke my will and I made my first super hero. I enjoyed all of them, well, except Hellgate. But every one of them brought something new or cool to the table, so to write any off with dismissal wouldn't be fair.

WAR seems to be the product of a bunch of MMO nerds sitting around a table, drinking beers together, and discussing their likes and dislikes. Someone pulls out a notepad, and goes "You know what I really hate about MMOs..." and they all start furiously scribbling down notes.

Philosophy

This is a big one. In the other games, the journey is what gets in the way to you having fun. You are weak. You suck. You are a sitting duck, and everyone's bigger, badder and cooler looking than you. Instead of enjoying your new world at your own pace, you want to get to your maximum level so you can start having fun. You want to get to max level so you can be viable in PvP. To be invited to raids. To be respected amongst your peers. All your guildies are 10 levels above you and no one wants to do anything with you because you will hold them back. This creates a philosophy of needing to acquire as much XP as possible before you log off at night so you are that much closer to where the fun begins.

With WAR, even if you are level one, you can jump into PvP immediately with your friends and not feel completely useless. There are four tiers to go by this methodology, which means plenty more options to quest with friends and guildies. You may not have all your cool abilities yet, but your health and toughness receive a boost so you aren't completely one-shotted out of the gates.

Variety

Questing can get old. We all have to collect the 10 rat tails, but now, we have a bit of a twist on the archaic questing model. Some quests, while cleverly written, are often ignored because they either boil down to delivering a letter to someone, or returning with 10 tails. This is mind-numbing when you have to do a few hundred of them before you reach max level.

With WAR, there are options. Sick of the 10 rat tails? Join this open world Public Quest, which is basically an ad-hoc raid without the Female Doggoy drama queens denying you access because you lack one talent point into a certain spec. Don't want to do those anymore? Jump into some hot scenario action and slay some other players. Oh, don't want to do that anymore? How about you defend your pride and take back that dock near your camp that has been claimed by the bad guys. Oh yeah, you get XP and level up from all of it.

So while doing any one of those things over and over will cause your toes to curl after the 4th straight hour, you at least have several options which keep it nice and fresh.

Public Quests

While most games in the genre tend to promote soloing, WAR wants you to play with others. Now, you don't have to - but it makes it way less frustrating than in the other games. Instead of having to wait because some jerk-off came up behind you and tagged the mob (and stole your kill), now you can play nicely with that jerk-off, because he needs you around for the second and third phases. He wants the loot, so he's going to try to be nicer than his typical douche-baggery in other games. Of course, you will still run into the guy fresh out of the other games with the "tag it first" mentality - but that quickly subsides when he realizes it's not a competition, but a group effort that will ultimately reward him.

And the best part? You don't have to send random whispers and ask for invites into groups. Grouping is designed to promote the hop in, hop out mentality. See some people in a public quest? Join up soldier.

This creates less of a "Me Me Me" attitude across the board. While not completely perfect, as you may still have to deal with the internet's finest, it's not just a step, but a massive jump in the right direction.

PvP

After coming from a frustrating experience playing Arena (glorified, heavily unbalanced duels) and the same four Battleground maps (for four years!) where people would rather get a sandwich and AFK instead of fighting, the Scenarios in WAR are a huge shot of adrenaline into the system. There are unbalances and tweaking that are being worked on, but for the most part, it's been a wonderful experience. And the best part is, even if you are a dirty, stinking loser, you still get a bunch (not as much) of experience and renown (for PvP gear) so you always feel you are getting ahead.

So instead of having to AFK through your 20th Battleground for the day, because you just need enough to get that damn piece of gear, the more you participate, the better off for you. This keeps everyone playing, thus enriching the experience, instead of hiding off in some cave and sulking if you are losing.

Patches

These guys are addressing player feedback and taking it seriously. They aren't dropping priority on game breaking bugs to go and fix the sparkle effect on dropped loot (I'm looking at you Conan). They seem to be tapped into the community, and are doing their damnedest to address these things when they come up. Now, time will tell how long they can keep it up, but I'm sure they want the mega-bucks of repeat subscriptions, and saw where Conan completely dropped the ball.

Summary

I know there's a lot more I'm missing, but for me, those things strike out the most. And it is by no means perfect, there are still a bunch of bugs, some things are janky, but these are mostly minor quibbles and scuff marks on a very solid platform right out the gates. It's exciting to imagine what this game will look like with one year of polish, let alone four. Who knows? They might just do it.

Hobbes: If you're interested jump in and buy it. Play the game for a month and THEN decide to continue or not. See if the money is worth it. You'll never know unless you try. I've found that it is, yet I use to think it was a waste.

Basically what you're paying for is maintenance and use of Mythic's servers. When you play TF2 you're play on a computer that some guy in a basement set up to allow you to connect to and play on. He has done this out of the kindness of his heart and the cash from his pocket. Those TF2 servers hold about 24-36 people at a time and this isn't a very heavy load.

Mythic's servers are huge and support hundreds and thousands of people on them. You also are paying for the maintenance that comes with the server, and the people who keep peace on the servers (the GMs). They are also responsible to make sure that your characters are constantly the same and there no matter what happens. Your PC crashes: everything's OK. Some ass-hat figures out how to hack the server: you're OK and Mythic will work hard to restore things to you.

You see, you're missing the benefits that you get from paying someone for maintaining your character and the servers that you play on. Also, it helps you cut down on buying new games because MMOs are SO HUGE that you get the content of many other games packed into one.

Anyways, if you're interested give it a shot, seriously. The worst thing that happens is that you stop playing after a month.

interstate78 wrote:

The Loot: At long last, when you partake in a quest, you are rewarded with loot that is tailored for you and you only.

FYI: This is not the case for lairs. A group I was in that defeated a lair boss got two item drops and NO ONE in the group could use either of them.

Wow Swat!

(what he said)

Swat, you're a natural born sales man.

I'll get it and nag the hell out of everybody so they explain how this game works (never played an MMORPG)!

Hobbes2099 wrote:

Swat, you're a natural born sales man.

I'll get it and nag the hell out of everybody so they explain how this game works (never played an MMORPG)!

Nah.

That's just the positive stuff. I can get into the negative aspects too, but they are mostly minor annoyances (interface lag, global cool down) and some medium quibbles (morale not working correctly, population imbalance, server queues, same loot models for twenty plus levels, etc).

I still believe Blizzard does a knockout job with their PvE, Lore and Dungeons - my PvE recommendations (despite the awesomeness of PQ's and well written quests in WAR) still go to Warcraft. But I wouldn't be suprised if a lot of MMO's going forward adopt a lot of what WAR has brought to the table. Public Quests and Goblins in the next-next Warcraft expansion, you heard it hear first folks

Good luck on this being an entry MMO. It might be a bit confusing and jarring at first to get into it, but yeah, feel free to nag us!

let's see...

Everquest, Dark Age of Camelot, Planetside, Anarchy Online, Star Wars Galaxies, Everquest 2, WoW (briefly, like sub level 10 brief), Vanguard Beta, Age of Conan, and now WAR. I think that's all of them. I know it's been over a decade, with some small breaks and a big break in the middle.

I like WAR because it is DAOC, but better, with some new features, and it's full of people again. DAOC 2.0 FTW!

Swat wrote:

These guys are addressing player feedback and taking it seriously. They aren't dropping priority on game breaking bugs to go and fix the sparkle effect on dropped loot (I'm looking at you Conan). They seem to be tapped into the community, and are doing their damnedest to address these things when they come up. Now, time will tell how long they can keep it up, but I'm sure they want the mega-bucks of repeat subscriptions, and saw where Conan completely dropped the ball.

I played DAoC for several years, and Mythic always did a good job with patches and feedback. When EQ was king, DAoC did quite well for itself, and even though WoW will probably stay king for a while, I think WAR will be quite successful.

Shoal07 wrote:

I like WAR because it is DAOC, but better, with some new features, and it's full of people again. DAOC 2.0 FTW!

Seconded. I miss soloing Umbral Hulks in Darkness Falls with my pally. And duoing the Princes with another pally. So many diamond seals....

I've played: EQ, COH, L2, WoW, and now WAR. Not many, I realize - although I've enjoyed all of them to some degree...except for maybe the "impossible to solo or group" design EQ had back in its first 4-5 years.

I think Swat covered WAR far better than I ever could, although I'll add that I get the impression that the devs really did their homework in designing this game, and I'll give them a boatload of kudos for not trying to cram in features they felt weren't ready while still having a solid enough game for release (which somehow plays on my 5 year old Neolithic PC) - not as easy as I used to think it was.

My complaints with WAR are small, and from what I've seen of the first patch it shows the devs' commitment to addressing pretty much all of them. On top of that, if I didn't know better I'd swear you'll be seeing some influence of WAR on WOW very soon.....for better or for worse.

A lot of stuff I like has already been mentioned, but I thought I'd chime in with a couple more:
Tome of Knowledge: I smile every time I encounter something new and hear the little "ching!" tome unlock sound. I love that if you find a bat wing and give it to the right NPC you'll unlock a new title and gain some xp. I haven't even read any of the tome's lore entries yet but it excites me to know that I have such a wealth of information right at my fingertips, and that more information is continually becoming available as I explore the world.

Atmosphere: I don't have an extensive MMO background, having only played CoH, WoW, AoC and now WAR. However, out of those four I think WAR has done the best job of making every zone feel like it has its own unique and interesting story, and that it is an important part of the overall conflict between Order and Destruction. A lot of WoW's zones had a pretty rich back story, but didn't really feel like they contributed anything to the overall story. Most of AoC's zones had a pretty solid theme, unfortunately for most of those zones the theme was "Vanir/Picts/Hyperboreans are attacking." Admittedly, I have only seen a small fraction of WAR's world at this point, but I like what I've seen so far.

Shoal07 wrote:

let's see...

Everquest, Dark Age of Camelot, Planetside, Anarchy Online, Star Wars Galaxies, Everquest 2, WoW (briefly, like sub level 10 brief), Vanguard Beta, Age of Conan, and now WAR. I think that's all of them. I know it's been over a decade, with some small breaks and a big break in the middle.

I like WAR because it is DAOC, but better, with some new features, and it's full of people again. DAOC 2.0 FTW!

Man, I could have written this. I never played Vanguard but that is the only difference.

Edit: Oh and I made it to level 10 in WoW, so ha!

Excellent write-up, Swat.