Too Human Catch-All

souldaddy wrote:

Too Human sold 168,000 copies in it's first month. That's $10 million in sales. Not bad, not great. I predict a strong drop off from here, this isn't a game that will steamroll its way through X-mas.

They have a chance to save themselves, though. If they "get it right" with the sequel and the reviews glow, and they let you carry over something in saved game data, then they might pick up a lot of people willing to grab the first at a "Greatest Hits" price. Put out some nifty DLC around that time to prevent too many used copies from sitting on the market...

souldaddy wrote:

Too Human sold 168,000 copies in it's first month

Hmm, that is almost double of ED sales. Which is good and sad thing at same time. That said, the future of Too Human is in Microsoft's hands.

I really hope Microsoft will green light the sequel.

souldaddy wrote:

Too Human sold 168,000 copies in it's first month. That's $10 million in sales. Not bad, not great. I predict a strong drop off from here, this isn't a game that will steamroll its way through X-mas.

Actually, as next-gen budgets go, that's pretty terrible and not nearly enough for the project to have made money, especially with the extra budget they would've needed to build their own engine. The typical thing that happens now though is that developers can leverage the technology they developed over several titles, making the future ones cost a lot less. Since they already have the engine for this game (though it needs a lot of work), making the next two games would be a lot easier and a lot cheaper. Given how attached SK is to this series being completed, I imagine they'll do whatever they can to see the next one get made. I really hope they can do it because for its faults, I still think this game is an underrated gem.

From what Dyack has hinted at from interviews, their relationship with Microsoft was kind of an EA Partners deal where SK pretty much funded the whole project (including those viral videos I found out), whereas Microsoft just provided some additional marketing and put the game on shelves. They also own the IP so if they can fund it, a sequel will be made, though they may have to find another publisher. I think this is the reason Dyack has been able to go off untethered as he has been. I'm still wondering if what he was doing was a whacked out attempt at guerrilla marketing seeing as how Microsoft never stopped him and he's gone almost completely dark since the first round of reviews came out.

P.S. souldaddy, we'll still co-op it up soon. I'm waiting for my 360 to get back. Should be early next week.

Kehama wrote:

I just got this from GameFly and played it for a few hours last night and got up to level 19 with my defender. Seeing as how I've done zero research on the game and the rental doesn't come with a manual I'm completely clueless on how most things in this game work. I've basically been flailing around just smashing everything that charged at me and equipping whatever has the highest number. Don't get me wrong, I've enjoyed flailing around, I just know there's gotta be more to it. And so far, yeah, I see the complaints about the story being convoluted but if you try really, really hard you can almost make it make sense. At one point I was kind of reminded of the first time I watched Blade Runner. That movie confused the heck out of me the first time around but on subsequent viewings I suddenly "got it". Maaaaaybe this game will have that feel for me or maybe the plot really is just a load of garbage. Only time will tell.

If you enter the Start menu during gameplay, it shows the Advanced combat moves you can do.

Aside from that, if you enter Aesir town and wander around the armory, etc, and examine the weapons and armor mounted on walls, compter screens, etc, it'll tellyou a LOT of useful tips, like how plasma weapons deal splash damage and can keep multiple enemies juggled in midair, or how 2handed weapons get bonuses to status procs.

For the people complaing about not knowing what runes do, either check the TH wiki (I've never visited it but i'm sure it's fine,) or go to gamefaqs for twenty seconds.

Yes, you can get the info on the web. However, it's a fundamental enough aspect of the game that you shouldn't *have* to. Also, a lot of that text is the same as in the game: Almost enough for you to know what it actually does, but not quite.

I just found my first red charm last night. Quest: Kill 10,000 undead. Wow. I wonder if that's an easy one, a hard one, or a middling one? (It takes three level 2 charms, so probably a hardish one.)

Hypatian wrote:

I just found my first red charm last night. Quest: Kill 10,000 undead. Wow. I wonder if that's an easy one, a hard one, or a middling one? (It takes three level 2 charms, so probably a hardish one.)

I think they all take 3 level 2 charms. Kill 10,000 undead is only hard depending on 2 things:
Do you like or hate the 4th level
Do you play insanely much?

I have a defender at 50 who's been through the game at least 2x (once single, once coop) and 2 others at 10 and I have ~14k kills total. So, 10k undead means you'll be playing the 4th level A LOT (I would guess about a dozen times). I have 1 red charm, it's goal is kill 16k of anything, I think it's currently at 2k...

Shoal07 wrote:

I have 1 red charm, it's goal is kill 16k of anything, I think it's currently at 2k...

I have a level 3 charm that requires you to kill 12000 enemies.....in the air.

Seriously, how long would that take? Is there some way to launch and kill multiple guys in the air?

My defender is level 46 and working on that now—I've played through the full campaign once, through Grendel outside campaign a few times to fill in some charm stuff (and because it's quick fun compared to the rest), and I've just started Helheim on my second time through the campaign mode. I've... uh... been doing the part of Helheim up to the APCs breaching the gate over and over to fill my charm. I'm around 1,500 now, I think. One of the pre-req charms required 800 undead kills, and I think that took about two and a half reps.

On defenders: I really like the class—it's made it hard for me to go back to playing anything else. I always forget about that whole "Oh yeah, these things can knock me down" part, which makes dealing with things a lot harder with other classes. (On the other hand, it also makes it more obvious that the troll whacking the ground ahead of you with his hammer is doing a lot of damage when it knocks you down, compared to the defender where it's just "Hey, did my controller just vibrate? That kind of tickles." And then I'm like "Why am I at half health? Oh crap.")

I'm tempted to try a commando soon, though. Damn those guys can tear things up. I bet they have a heck of a time with negative polarities, though.

Dr._J wrote:
Shoal07 wrote:

I have 1 red charm, it's goal is kill 16k of anything, I think it's currently at 2k...

I have a level 3 charm that requires you to kill 12000 enemies.....in the air.

Seriously, how long would that take? Is there some way to launch and kill multiple guys in the air?

Yeah, 2h Hammers and a Commando (air combat specialist). Other than that, I'd go looking for another charm.

Dr._J wrote:

I have a level 3 charm that requires you to kill 12000 enemies.....in the air.

Seriously, how long would that take? Is there some way to launch and kill multiple guys in the air?

It depends on your class. With a defender, you can pretty much only get air kills by launching and then using an air finisher, or by launching and then drilling them with a gun (ballistic juggling). Defenders are very constrained in how much they can do in the air. Other classes can slide while in the air, which might make it easier. Also, if you can launch a bunch at once (with a hammer launch, say) and then use plasma, I think that you can keep a lot of them juggled at once. (I use pretty much only lasers, so I don't know about that.) Probably a commando with a plasma cannon and a hammer could do some serious damage that way.

Shoal07 wrote:

Yeah, 2h Hammers and a Commando (air combat specialist). Other than that, I'd go looking for another charm.

My Bio-E has a level 3 charm that requires you to break 300 barrels. That is the one I am working on.

I wonder sometimes did Silicon Knights actually sit down and review the time commitment some of these charms take.

The nastiest I've had so far was actually a level 1 charm to kill 300 enemies with the combo meter at 50+ hits. I thought killing 100 enemies with ballistics was going to be bad, too, but then I realized that lasers counted. (Ballistic? O_o)

After you get the ability to burn things in Cyberspace make sure you go to the world tree and explore the entire area. It takes about a half an hour, but it's worth it because you will pick up a lot of charms. I had the charm that required I kill 16k of any enemy, but was able to replace it with one with identical attributes, while only having to kill 8k enemies.

A good reason to go through the entire campaign occasionally, instead of targeting specific levels for rune fills, is that the world tree will reset and reload after each full playthrough.

coyo7e,
Is there one place I can go to learn what the orange mastery charms do? I mean great, I've got plus one to Brutality, is that better than plus one to Asgard's Fury, or Hero's Heart?

edit -Nevermind I just figured it out, and now I feel stupid that it took this long.

Dr._J wrote:
Shoal07 wrote:

I have 1 red charm, it's goal is kill 16k of anything, I think it's currently at 2k...

I have a level 3 charm that requires you to kill 12000 enemies.....in the air.

Seriously, how long would that take? Is there some way to launch and kill multiple guys in the air?

Not that difficult for a champion, you could just run the fourth level a bunch and use your battlecry a lot. Easy money.

Just got the Unstoppable: Ice Forest achievement. I had to go back and start a new character to do it. ^_^;;; (I might have been able to do it on my 50 defender, but I messed on one of the big polarity groups and slid into them when I meant to use a fierce hammer attack, and that was game over.)

The difficulty level of the Ice Forest definitely seems the highest of the four sections, which is a little odd. I suppose that it's not *so* bad if you're not going for Unstoppable, but it definitely feels like the mixes of trolls, svartalf leaders, and ranged-attacking svartalfs in general makes it a lot tougher than the later sections. The wraiths and floaters in Helheim are kind of icky (I got a frost floater the other day, and that was a bit rough), but in general the enemy groups feel a lot less painful.

I also tried a bio-engineer today. Wow, that's a bit rough. It did encourage me to change my play up a bit on other classes to mix more melee and ranged, but... I don't feel like the HP or regeneration really makes up for both offensive and defensive weakness at all. I may go back, since I've heard the class starts to come into its strength more around level 20, but... hrm. Not sure I really want to play the game in "hard mode".

Hypatian wrote:

I also tried a bio-engineer today. Wow, that's a bit rough. It did encourage me to change my play up a bit on other classes to mix more melee and ranged, but... I don't feel like the HP or regeneration really makes up for both offensive and defensive weakness at all. I may go back, since I've heard the class starts to come into its strength more around level 20, but... hrm. Not sure I really want to play the game in "hard mode".

I got my Bio-E up to level 50 and what you heard is indeed true. At the early levels, it is rough going. Once you hit the later levels though, it is a different game. Being able to throw out a heal (and a large one at that) while also curing damage over time status effects is a god send. At level 50 now (with some pretty sweet gear) I can easily hold my own with any of the other classes. Granted, the armor, ranged, and melee penalties really sting at times but the ability to self-regenerate and heal more than make up for it.

Just got the Unstoppable: Ice Forest achievement. I had to go back and start a new character to do it. ^_^;;; (I might have been able to do it on my 50 defender, but I messed on one of the big polarity groups and slid into them when I meant to use a fierce hammer attack, and that was game over.)

Which class did you use to complete the Ice Forest? It's the only "unstoppable" achievement that's giving me grief and I'm determined to get it but so far I've been defeated at every turn.

I used a defender, which is the class I prefer over-all. Damage output is a little weak, but still quite strong enough. Aerial combat is very very weak, but still useful with finishers. The largest advantage the defender has is: He cannot be knocked down. By anything. Good defensive gear and a good melee weapon are the most important things: Make sure to get all of the purple armor from the Hall of Heroes on your way through, and consider spending any excess bounty on a nice purple hammer. Hammer and shield is even better if you can find one.

The key insights that made for the clear for me are: Plasma rifles are very very helpful against trolls, and hammers are teh awesome. The AoE launch from hammers can be very very helpful to survive swarms of svartalfar.

Being able to take trolls out at range is super nice when you get the multiple-troll battles or a frost-polarity troll or the like that's very dangerous. (Or you're low on health.) Plasma is nicest for this because you'll damage the other parts of a troll while taking out their weapon arm, or the like. I originally used laser rifles for this, but found plasma to be nicer.

Hammers are good both for their AoE launch and their room-clearing fierce attack. The AoE launch can be a great way to reduce damage from large groups of tougher enemies (in this case, dark elves. Also useful on swarms of goblins if you're trying to get to the back to take out assault goblins.) The hammer fierce attack swings out in a circle, and can be very very effective at clearing out large swathes of enemies at a distance—great for dealing with incoming waves of enemies. Especially since anything it can't just kill and knock out of the way it will knock down.

Because of my experience with my higher level character on this level, I chose *not* to use the hammer fierce attack against positive polarities, instead I used my plasma rifle. It's far too easy to be a little off on the fierce movement and instead slide, charging the polarities. So... you end up charging in to kill one and start a chain reaction that ends up killing you (especially when the missiles from the assault goblins arrive while you're still reeling.) Better to clear them out from a distance.

Presumably you already know how to deal with the spiders once you have them alone. The hammer launch is also good here when they're not alone: Just spam it to keep melee opponents off of you while you finish off the spider, then clean up.

Finally, one specific note: The most dangerous area, by far, is the area in which you fight a swarm of dark elves along with three major enemies (usually one melee troll, one assault troll, and one spider.) There is a way to shortcut this fight dramatically, and I highly recommend doing so.

All good advice, ta.

Finally, one specific note: The most dangerous area, by far, is the area in which you fight a swarm of dark elves along with three major enemies (usually one melee troll, one assault troll, and one spider.) There is a way to shortcut this fight dramatically, and I highly recommend doing so.

If it's the bit I'm thinking of then yup that's extremely useful

I'm also assuming you need to do the level in one sitting for it to work for the achievement?

I seem to recall stopping half way through the world serpent level and not getting the award, even after not dying. Went back later and did it in one go and got the achievement.

Hmm. I definitely did it all in one sitting, because I wanted to stay "in the groove" and not come back to some big fight after being away from the game for a bit. So, I can't confirm one way or the other.

stevenmack wrote:

All good advice, ta.

Finally, one specific note: The most dangerous area, by far, is the area in which you fight a swarm of dark elves along with three major enemies (usually one melee troll, one assault troll, and one spider.) There is a way to shortcut this fight dramatically, and I highly recommend doing so.

If it's the bit I'm thinking of then yup that's extremely useful

I'm also assuming you need to do the level in one sitting for it to work for the achievement?

I seem to recall stopping half way through the world serpent level and not getting the award, even after not dying. Went back later and did it in one go and got the achievement.

That fight you're both trying to not spoil, never gave me much trouble.

It's the one where you jump onto the tiny platform, get attacked by two elves, then jump from that platform to the next platform which is covered in elves, two trolls who're already within debuff range when you land, and when you die you just respawn on the same spot you landed.

My best tip for doing Unstoppables, is to simply have Fenrir skill as soon as possible, and then do the level at the lowest level possible.

Hmm. Are you perhaps playing it through the teleport and not through the campaign mode? I wouldn't want to even try via the teleport, since the enemies get a lot tougher in terms of polarities. (And, of course, starting in the same spot and dying again isn't an issue, since you're going for Unstoppable--if you die you've already lost. ;>)

stevenmack wrote:

All good advice, ta.

Finally, one specific note: The most dangerous area, by far, is the area in which you fight a swarm of dark elves along with three major enemies (usually one melee troll, one assault troll, and one spider.) There is a way to shortcut this fight dramatically, and I highly recommend doing so.

If it's the bit I'm thinking of then yup that's extremely useful

I couldn't target all the things when i went through that part and ended up dying loads of times - was difficult to get them.. :/

Ok, quick question. I'm looking to pick up one more game (Outside of my pre-orders of RB2 bundle and FO3), and then laying off for awhile. Considering I thought the demo was a bunch of fun, and I'll likely be playing it a lot, should I pick it up?

Maybe? I don't have all the achievements, and at this point I think I've pretty much put the game down. I didn't ever play enough to get a full shiny fancy armor set or anything. I've only owned the game for a couple of weeks.

But I'm also pretty satisfied with my investment. I put a *lot* of hours into beating the game multiple times and reaching level 50 and playing with different stuff. I'd certainly enjoy occasionally pulling it out for an online co-op game with a friend. It cost less for me per hour of enjoyment than a movie-theatre movie or a DVD, and about the same as most console games.

So, that'd be a yes for me. I tend to play the hell out of interesting games like that. (Like, Hellgate. I play Fate a lot, and retards are the only reason I'm not a hopeless MMO addict.) So a game that I can play like that, with GWJers, win. Only thing is I do most of my console gaming after 11pm. (Work, people, TF2...)

But I'm also pretty satisfied with my investment. I put a *lot* of hours into beating the game multiple times and reaching level 50 and playing with different stuff. I'd certainly enjoy occasionally pulling it out for an online co-op game with a friend. It cost less for me per hour of enjoyment than a movie-theatre movie or a DVD, and about the same as most console games.

Totally agree - I've definately got my moneys worth out of it and it's the sort of thing thats easy to just drop back into, play for an hour or so and stop (unless your going for unstoppable achievements...grrr).

I wouldn't go into it expecting much more variety than you get from the demo though - it's basically all about the phat lewt collecting, and certainly not something you want to consider getting for it's story.

BTW, if anyone is in the UK and undecided about getting it - I noticed that GAME has dropped it to £20, which is nice.

Well, the story isn't bad at all...if you've read the Elder Edda.

That reminds me. I should try to hook up with people some time for some level 50 ass-kicking. My only co-op play so far was with a low-level character. I really want to do some on my main guy one of these days.