Car lovers?

MannishBoy wrote:

Rainy/snow flurry-ish night.

350Z, meet Bambi's mom. Bambi's mom, meet 350Z.

Could have been worse. Headlight, front bumper, fender.

So. $2800.

IMAGE(http://i458.photobucket.com/albums/qq310/andysonlinepics/Cars/Deer-w_zps98a7b873.jpg)

General Crespin wrote:
MannishBoy wrote:
General Crespin wrote:

edit: Can I get any fun OBD2 doohickeys that have a decent Android app?

I got a sub $15 bluetooth one off of Amazon. I use it with the Torque app.

Thanks. I can't find anything that cheap, maybe I'm missing it? Or is it gone?

I see several. For instance, this one.

MannishBoy wrote:
General Crespin wrote:
MannishBoy wrote:
General Crespin wrote:

edit: Can I get any fun OBD2 doohickeys that have a decent Android app?

I got a sub $15 bluetooth one off of Amazon. I use it with the Torque app.

Thanks. I can't find anything that cheap, maybe I'm missing it? Or is it gone?

I see several. For instance, this one.

That second one is the one I've got. Works great with Torque.

Dunno how I missed it. Thanks!

I saw a strange Subaru that I hadn't seen before and it turns out it's the BRZ. After some poking around, they're claiming it's a new sports car but there's no turbo option? I'm disappointed. What's with all of these new fake sports cars nowadays?

unless I'm wrong and someone here has actually driven one and can tell me they're great...

JillSammich wrote:

I saw a strange Subaru that I hadn't seen before and it turns out it's the BRZ. After some poking around, they're claiming it's a new sports car but there's no turbo option? I'm disappointed. What's with all of these new fake sports cars nowadays?

unless I'm wrong and someone here has actually driven one and can tell me they're great...

"Fake sports car"? Oh man. You are so wrong. My friend has the FR-S (Toyota/Scion version), and it's great. 200 hp boxer, RWD, 2800 lbs, drifts at the drop of a hat, for less than $27k.

There's no turbo because Toyobaru claim the engine bay is too low for the intercooler. At first it seems weird for a Subaru (even the BRZ STI won't have a turbo), but you don't miss it.

Full disclosure, I've only ridden in the FR-S and not driven it since I can't drive manual.

JillSammich wrote:

I saw a strange Subaru that I hadn't seen before and it turns out it's the BRZ. After some poking around, they're claiming it's a new sports car but there's no turbo option? I'm disappointed. What's with all of these new fake sports cars nowadays?

unless I'm wrong and someone here has actually driven one and can tell me they're great...

There are tons of sports cars with no turbos...

Gravey wrote:

"Fake sports car"? Oh man. You are so wrong. My friend has the FR-S (Toyota/Scion version), and it's great. 200 hp boxer, RWD, 2800 lbs, drifts at the drop of a hat, for less than $27k.

There's no turbo because Toyobaru claim the engine bay is too low for the intercooler. At first it seems weird for a Subaru (even the BRZ STI won't have a turbo), but you don't miss it.

Full disclosure, I've only ridden in the FR-S and not driven it since I can't drive manual. :oops:

200 still seems kinda low to me... I'm looking for something with at least 300 (flywheel). I mean, 200 at 2800 lbs is really nice, but man. I'm sure it's fun to drive, though. I just saw it, and had to look it up because for some reason they're not advertising them here. It's not every day I see something on the road before I see it in an ad and this took me by surprise.

I guess I kind of dislike the way they're touting the phrase "sports car" for sub compacts with a low power/weight ratio. To me, a sports car should be a powerful machine like a vette or even an STi. Not trying to offend anyone, that's just how I see sports cars. Hell, I don't even call MX-5's sports cars. That's a sporty 2 seater coupe Miata

Alright, it's a sport compact, not a performance car. But it's still a sports car. It has as much power as it needs, really, since its main purpose is to be fun (and affordable). So combine that with the low centre of gravity, narrow low-grip tires, and RWD, and it all comes together.

JillSammich wrote:

I guess I kind of dislike the way they're touting the phrase "sports car" for sub compacts with a low power/weight ratio. To me, a sports car should be a powerful machine like a vette or even an STi. Not trying to offend anyone, that's just how I see sports cars. Hell, I don't even call MX-5's sports cars. That's a sporty 2 seater coupe Miata :P

"Sports cars" haven't always been big powered cars. See all the British sports cars over the years (Triumph, MGs, ACs etc), the original Z's like the 240Z, etc. Then you go to German stuff like the Porche 356As.

You've got a very narrow view of the term IMO.

As I said, not trying to offend anyone. I'm just not really that interested in sub 300HP vehicles. Not to say that they're not fun. I had an Eagle Talon tsi that was a blast.

My opinion on the matter may be skewed due to the fact that the people around here that have those vehicles tend to drive them as if they're race cars. If you want to drive that way, go to a track. You're going to kill someone. Maybe that's unfair to the vehicle itself, but I can't help but associate those cars with the idiots that drive them that way.

JillSammich wrote:
Gravey wrote:

"Fake sports car"? Oh man. You are so wrong. My friend has the FR-S (Toyota/Scion version), and it's great. 200 hp boxer, RWD, 2800 lbs, drifts at the drop of a hat, for less than $27k.

There's no turbo because Toyobaru claim the engine bay is too low for the intercooler. At first it seems weird for a Subaru (even the BRZ STI won't have a turbo), but you don't miss it.

Full disclosure, I've only ridden in the FR-S and not driven it since I can't drive manual. :oops:

200 still seems kinda low to me... I'm looking for something with at least 300 (flywheel). I mean, 200 at 2800 lbs is really nice, but man. I'm sure it's fun to drive, though. I just saw it, and had to look it up because for some reason they're not advertising them here. It's not every day I see something on the road before I see it in an ad and this took me by surprise.

I guess I kind of dislike the way they're touting the phrase "sports car" for sub compacts with a low power/weight ratio. To me, a sports car should be a powerful machine like a vette or even an STi. Not trying to offend anyone, that's just how I see sports cars. Hell, I don't even call MX-5's sports cars. That's a sporty 2 seater coupe Miata :P

I guess it's what you are looking for in a sports car. It seems that what you define sports as power!!! [insert Jeremy Clarkson here]. Which is a lot of fun, but for a lot of people there's more to it. Power to weight is a better indicator than strait HP.

Handling matters a lot to me too. The FR-S/BRZ only weighing 2800 pounds means you can throw it around a bit too and recover quickly. A heavier car even with a good suspension set up will have a harder time being nimble.

What I think the FR-S/BRZ gets the right most is feel. The steering ratio is great and responsive. The car gives you great feedback. It'll reward you for driving correctly and let you know when you're out of line.

I would rather have those qualities in a car than strait hp. Like a Challenger.

And since you impugned upon the Miata.
The Miata is one of the most widely raced cars. It's cheap with good balance and it's light. Go out to an autocross event sometime. You can be racing a 300+hp beast, but there will be an old man in a Miata running faster than you

All that said, if they decided to add some hp to the FR-S/BRZ and maintained it's characteristics. I would be all for it. Maybe some wider/stickier tires. Prius tires....|shakes head|

All the better to go sideways, my dear.

JillSammich wrote:

As I said, not trying to offend anyone. I'm just not really that interested in sub 300HP vehicles. Not to say that they're not fun. I had an Eagle Talon tsi that was a blast.

My opinion on the matter may be skewed due to the fact that the people around here that have those vehicles tend to drive them as if they're race cars. If you want to drive that way, go to a track. You're going to kill someone. Maybe that's unfair to the vehicle itself, but I can't help but associate those cars with the idiots that drive them that way.

I'm not offended, your take is just not really historically what fits in the definition.

By your definition, an Arial Atom or a Caterham 7 wouldn't be a sports car, and those will probably outperform most of what you're talking about.

Well I stand corrected.

Also I never said these things aren't fun to drive. I never even said they wouldn't out-perform. I'm just arguing semantics.
I really would like to drive the BRZ. Slightly less so now that I know that it's the same as the Scion, but I would still like to take one for a spin. They sound fun.

(Also, I am speaking about modern production cars you can buy off a lot. It would be ridiculous of me to make the HP distinction to something as old as 1970 or something. Then, a '55 Corvette wouldn't even really be considered a sports car. Come on. :P)

HP = Top speed
Torque = How fast you get there.

Torque is where the fun is.

JillSammich wrote:

I really would like to drive the BRZ. Slightly less so now that I know that it's the same as the Scion

Now you've just gone from one type of crazy to another!

Just to assuage you, the GT86/BRZ/FR-S is a joint project between Toyota and Subaru. They're all mechanically identical. The Toyota GT86 is sold as a Scion in North America since Scion is Toyota's young-and-cheap marque here (the FR-S lacks the spoiler and some other bits that the GT86 and BRZ have to make it cheaper, but all the important parts are the same).

Edit: And FWIW, the BRZ is sold in way lower numbers. I think only 800 were initially sold in Canada, and on Top Gear a few weeks ago they talked about how for every 10 BRZs sold in the UK, 90 GT86s can be sold.

I would love a GT86. Here it's about the same price as a diesel Golf VII and way cheaper than any Golf sized hot hatch or MX5.

And a light weight, turbo-lag free, rear drive sports car is a return to golden age of sports cars from before they all got fat and bloated and needed to be over powered to compensate.

A friend of mine just bought a BRZ. It's a good-looking little thing. I've always love the fairlady bodystyle.

But I do love reminding him that my Cooper S is faster!

Lester_King wrote:

But I do love reminding him that my Cooper S is faster!

Except that's it's pulling from the wrong end

MannishBoy wrote:
Lester_King wrote:

But I do love reminding him that my Cooper S is faster!

Except that's it's pulling from the wrong end ;)

IMAGE(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQXuTvF_PzKdD4qpuhjw6VgPNrYVL1ftfLDGXDVwQ2sHlwqva6M)

Lotus Elise

IMAGE(http://img.autobytel.com/2011/lotus/elise/3-550-elise-67724.jpg)

2,010 lbs with the SC model carrying 220 hp and 155 lb-ft of torque out of a 1.8 liter 4 banger that scoots from 0-60 mph in 4.9 seconds.

http://www.autobytel.com/sports-cars/car-buying-guides/8-of-the-best-lightweight-sports-cars-102722/3/

All this talk of the BRZ/FR-S and not a single nod to it's roots in the AE86?

Herp-a-derp, misread your link.

cartoonin99 wrote:

Lotus Elise

A car so nice I named my daughter after it. #NotReally #JustCoincidence #WifeNixed"Exige"

JillSammich wrote:
Gravey wrote:

"Fake sports car"? Oh man. You are so wrong. My friend has the FR-S (Toyota/Scion version), and it's great. 200 hp boxer, RWD, 2800 lbs, drifts at the drop of a hat, for less than $27k.

There's no turbo because Toyobaru claim the engine bay is too low for the intercooler. At first it seems weird for a Subaru (even the BRZ STI won't have a turbo), but you don't miss it.

Full disclosure, I've only ridden in the FR-S and not driven it since I can't drive manual. :oops:

200 still seems kinda low to me... I'm looking for something with at least 300 (flywheel). I mean, 200 at 2800 lbs is really nice, but man. I'm sure it's fun to drive, though. I just saw it, and had to look it up because for some reason they're not advertising them here. It's not every day I see something on the road before I see it in an ad and this took me by surprise.

I guess I kind of dislike the way they're touting the phrase "sports car" for sub compacts with a low power/weight ratio. To me, a sports car should be a powerful machine like a vette or even an STi. Not trying to offend anyone, that's just how I see sports cars. Hell, I don't even call MX-5's sports cars. That's a sporty 2 seater coupe Miata :P

The confusion here is that sports car != muscle car

Sports cars are about being nimble and quick. The Miata is the quintessential sports car, and the BRZ/GT-86/FRS fits the bill too. A turbo would move it more towards a muscle car. The entire philosophy of the BRZ/GT-86/FRS was to make it a great handling nimble sports car, not a 1/4 mile killing muscle car. A turbo would introduce lag, and upset the balance of the car. the last thing you want when you are carving a great corner is for the turbo to kick in.

ElectricPi wrote:

A turbo would introduce lag, and upset the balance of the car.

I don't know that I agree with that. There are ways with modern tech to mitigate things like that. Or there's always supercharging.

I'll agree that I'd probably consider one of these cars if it had a bit more HP. 250 HP would make me much more intrigued, for instance. But just because it doesn't fit my tastes as it is, doesn't mean that I don't see it as a budget sports car.

I got this cool Pioneer deck not too long ago, the AVH-p8400BH for my 2003 Infiniti G35

I figured I'd keep my car a few more years but I wanted modern commodities like Bluetooth and such and boy am I happy with my decision. I had to get a dash adapter and I had to pay for a few extra cables and installation but it was worth the price. Now I have hands free calling through my car's stereo, integrated Satellite radio, Music storage on SD, bluetooth audio, etc. all on a beautiful animated & motorized 7" touch screen.

MannishBoy wrote:
ElectricPi wrote:

A turbo would introduce lag, and upset the balance of the car.

I don't know that I agree with that. There are ways with modern tech to mitigate things like that. Or there's always supercharging.

I'll agree that I'd probably consider one of these cars if it had a bit more HP. 250 HP would make me much more intrigued, for instance. But just because it doesn't fit my tastes as it is, doesn't mean that I don't see it as a budget sports car.

supercharging would be very different from turbocharging. having driven a mazdaspeed miata on a closed course, I would say the turbo ruined tha car. The mazdaspeed miata was a few years ago, but it wasn't exactly a stone age early 80s turbo. That experience turned me off to the idea of light RWD cars with turbos. I still love turbos, but they need to be used on the right car.

i78: Awesome! I had the '04 coupe, and about my only complaint was the lack of technology. That sounds like exactly what it needed.

Such a great car. I miss it.

ElectricPi wrote:
MannishBoy wrote:
ElectricPi wrote:

A turbo would introduce lag, and upset the balance of the car.

I don't know that I agree with that. There are ways with modern tech to mitigate things like that. Or there's always supercharging.

I'll agree that I'd probably consider one of these cars if it had a bit more HP. 250 HP would make me much more intrigued, for instance. But just because it doesn't fit my tastes as it is, doesn't mean that I don't see it as a budget sports car.

supercharging would be very different from turbocharging. having driven a mazdaspeed miata on a closed course, I would say the turbo ruined tha car. The mazdaspeed miata was a few years ago, but it wasn't exactly a stone age early 80s turbo. That experience turned me off to the idea of light RWD cars with turbos. I still love turbos, but they need to be used on the right car.

I think the newer turbos are a different beast. I have a twin-scroll turbo in my car (Cooper S Roadster), and there's no perceptible turbo-lag and a stunning amount of torque. I know it's FWD instead of RWD, but the turbo is a definite plus in my opinion.