Age of Conan feature discussion

Fedaykin98 wrote:

...
There are also some fantastic drinking-inspired guild names like ... Crusaders of Drunken Might
...

I was in an EQ1 guild by that name in 2001.

/hijack off

Aang wrote:
Fedaykin98 wrote:

...
There are also some fantastic drinking-inspired guild names like ... Crusaders of Drunken Might
...

I was in an EQ1 guild by that name in 2001.

/hijack off

There is a WoW guild by that name on Blackhand, Alliance side. I wonder if those are your old buddies?

I think that WAR is going to be very well done, lots of polish and shine. I don't think that it's going to set any records or redefine the genre in the manner that WoW has. It's going to appeal to folks who enjoyed DAoC and to folks who have played a lot of Warhammer Fantasy, or WH Fantasy RP on the tabletop.

Warhammer is going to be polished, and it's not going to break apart the traditional MMO formula (this is very hard - just look at the upcoming failure that is Age of Conan ;)), however it is going to push the existing formula out in every direction. It may not be a revolution, but it will be an evolution.

I couldn't care less for RvR or PvP - that's not why I play MMORPGs. If I want to kill humans, I'll play UT2004,where skill and only skill matters - not some l33t k1dd1e's ability to twink out his character with ultra-rare equipment.

Assuming that Warhammer Online has the same level of polish as WoW (or at least, City of Heroes - that'd be enough for me), just the two of the improvements it has would likely make me switch:

1) The aforementioned smart quests
2) Enemies physical size SCALES according to their LEVEL. No more fighting a "level 42 grisly wolf" which looks exactly like the level 1 "timid and somewhat shy wolf" you whacked on in the starting area.

There are more of little gems like that peppered throughout the game, I am sure. I haven't been spending a lot of time watching developer videos, but I can sense the attitude and the energy that is coming from those guys, and they're clearly smart and passionate about what they do. This is the "by gamers, for gamers" spirit touted by Interplay a decade ago, right there.

I can tell this team isn't going to settle for broken combat mechanics or having every female character look like Francis McDormand and expect to ride it out just because their universe is based on a well-known license. No sir... they're aiming to charge the MMORPG arena like a Klingon Orc, and give the current-gen MMORPGs a piece of their mind.

Anyone have a link to video of the pets/necro? Ive seen written impressions but they are very brief and glossed over.

Ah weird I typed up a reply to this yesterday but I guess I managed to not send it and close the web browser at some point !

http://www.gamespot.com/video/927504...

Fang, The above is the link I meant to post yesterday. It is a gamespot interview of Jorgen with some game play footage of what looks to be a Guardian, Barbarian, and a Necromancer. You can see the tiny little scorpion pets when they fight.

Shihonage I am not really sure what Warhammer is doing to push the current style of game anywhere it hasn't been before? Mobs growing larger as they become higher level is pretty standard fare and the quest thing isn't really all that interesting or different.

Shihonage wrote:

I couldn't care less for RvR or PvP - that's not why I play MMORPGs. If I want to kill humans, I'll play UT2004,where skill and only skill matters - not some l33t k1dd1e's ability to twink out his character with ultra-rare equipment.

I completely agree. At least in the spirit of what you are saying. I don't think PvP in MMOs does much to show off how much "skill" (hand eye coordination) a player has. That is not why I want PvP in MMOs. I don't want to test my l33tness against other players in PvP combat. I want all of the crazy social interaction that goes along with having FFA PvP. I'd like the combat to be fun and somewhat engaging of course but it doesn't have to be some massive test of skill. My general description of MMO PvP as most games implement it is "Team Deathmatch for Retards". This is why I think RVR, battlegrounds, zoned pvp, etc are all pointless as anything more than a minor distraction or minigame. I don't get the FPS style thrill of killing someone in a WoW battleground. I do however get a similar feeling when encountering someone new in an FFA PvP world as there is that tense moment where I am wondering whether or not I am going to be attacked or if the interaction will be peaceful. That is what I like in MMO PvP that I have never felt in an FPS.

mven wrote:

Shihonage I am not really sure what Warhammer is doing to push the current style of game anywhere it hasn't been before? Mobs growing larger as they become higher level is pretty standard fare and the quest thing isn't really all that interesting or different.

That actually wasn't stated well on his part, I think. WAR is going to have scaling player characters as well. Dwarves, for example will get older looking as you level up, with beards getting long and gray.

mven wrote:

Mobs growing larger as they become higher level is pretty standard fare

I haven't seen this in any MMORPG I've played. I don't think you understand quite what I meant. In WoW, for instance, a level 20 giant looks exactly the same as a level 40 giant. The only difference is the number above their head. This applies to every single monster model they reuse as you go up in levels.

and the quest thing isn't really all that interesting or different.

There isn't going to be a single feature that suddenly makes this game break the mold. There's going to be a slew of "little improvements" like these, and the sum of the parts is what will create the next-gen MMO.... IMO

After all.. what exactly do you expect from the MMO model ? There are a limited amount of ways in which it can function at all in the first place.

That is not why I want PvP in MMOs. I don't want to test my l33tness against other players in PvP combat. I want all of the crazy social interaction that goes along with having FFA PvP. I'd like the combat to be fun and somewhat engaging of course but it doesn't have to be some massive test of skill. My general description of MMO PvP as most games implement it is "Team Deathmatch for Retards". This is why I think RVR, battlegrounds, zoned pvp, etc are all pointless as anything more than a minor distraction or minigame. I don't get the FPS style thrill of killing someone in a WoW battleground. I do however get a similar feeling when encountering someone new in an FFA PvP world as there is that tense moment where I am wondering whether or not I am going to be attacked or if the interaction will be peaceful. That is what I like in MMO PvP that I have never felt in an FPS.

I completely agree. But this is a non-feature. All MMOs have PvP now. What I meant is I don't care for all the fancy shiny things they hang on top of it. RvR (and Battlegrounds for that matter) is a pointless waste of time as far as I am concerned, because that very moment you speak of - where you meet someone on the road, unsure of their intentions - is what happens in vanilla PvP, a random encounter during the regular game. It doesn't happen in battlegrounds-like scenario, because you're all there to kill each other.

shihonage wrote:

I haven't seen this in any MMORPG I've played. I don't think you understand quite what I meant. In WoW, for instance, a level 20 giant looks exactly the same as a level 40 giant. The only difference is the number above their head. This applies to every single monster model they reuse as you go up in levels.

Actually, it is standard fare in WoW. It's simply not consistent across mob types. Humanoid mobs, like giants and people and others of that nature stay constant in size; beast-type creeps grow dramatically. Reference a level 5 scorpid in Durotar verse a level 65 scorpid in Terrokar Forest; there's a world of difference there in size.

AnimeJ wrote:

Actually, it is standard fare in WoW. It's simply not consistent across mob types.

That's kind of an oxymoron.

Yes, in some cases in WoW a level 5 mob will be smaller than a level 65 mob of similar origin, but, as I understand Warhammer's approach is more sophisticated, and more consistent. In Warhammer a level 5 mob will be different in size from a level 15 - all the time.

In WoW this is accomplished through _sometimes_ using a different model for a similar "mob family" of a higher level. It is an exception that only makes the rule more obvious as you travel its virtual lands.

I want to thank everyone for contributing their thoughts about Conan features, as well as considering my question about guild names.

shihonage wrote:
AnimeJ wrote:

Actually, it is standard fare in WoW. It's simply not consistent across mob types.

That's kind of an oxymoron.

Yes, in some cases in WoW a level 5 mob will be smaller than a level 65 mob of similar origin, but, as I understand Warhammer's approach is more sophisticated, and more consistent. In Warhammer a level 5 mob will be different in size from a level 15 - all the time.

In WoW this is accomplished through _sometimes_ using a different model for a similar "mob family" of a higher level. It is an exception that only makes the rule more obvious as you travel its virtual lands.

The semantic difference you're calling an oxymoron is steeped in the lore of both games. In WoW, an orc is an orc. It doesn't matter if they're a fresh peon, or a battle hardened shaman; they're the same size. In Warhammer, seniority among orcs is based on who's bigger. As such, of course it will be consistent across mob types.

As such, there's nothing oxymoronic about it at all. It's completely standard, where it's applicable. Double standards do not an oxymoron make.

Fedaykin98 wrote:

I want to thank everyone for contributing their thoughts about Conan features, as well as considering my question about guild names.

:razz:

Nuts to you! I won't stand for that kind of civility!

I think AoC might have the greatest MMO feature yet of a ERSB rating high enough parents don't let their kids play so I don't have to run into them online joking aside I'll follow the release of AoC and wait for player reviews to see if it delivers. My main hook I'm looking for is the combat system and the PvP. I'm all dragonslayered out. Some PvP and RvR that has some purpose and real effect on the game world while having a good combat system would sell me hard.

This is where I think Warhammer will fail also is in the combat system and PvP. So far their abilities per class sounded interesting but over the top at the same time. Who cares if your class was promised cool mechanics if they are just made trivial come release when the devs realize there's no way to properly make them work. The RvR also sounds like a huge flop. Sure the video explaining how you can work your way up to the capital city and sack it is a huge step up from WoW where BG's did nothing in the real world and advanced no storyline but its still a looping larger treadmill that will fail unless the BG's are a huge step up in game play but the only in game video we have seen of one was of the same generic hold the flag crap that's been outplayed since the first online FPS games.

edit: I'm much closer to what mven PvP's for. The only exciting PvP I ever experienced in WoW was the uncanned random encounters which usually happened when I was herbing for PvE. Somewhat randomly running into someone else who's about to pick a herb sapping them stealing it then killing them or getting killed was more entertainment then any of the BG's I ever played. This is where I think Warhammer will fail also as from their videos it seems PvP is a very canned experience. They do mention that the most effective way to level and advance through the game is being involved in each zones conflict but I'm not sold that it will offer dynamic PvP which can be some of the best gaming.

God, I just wish someone would bring back the Shadowbane Thief Class. There was absolutely nothing more exciting than picking pockets.

Conan Get what Conan Want!

Big Castle

AnimeJ wrote:

The semantic difference you're calling an oxymoron is steeped in the lore of both games. In WoW, an orc is an orc. It doesn't matter if they're a fresh peon, or a battle hardened shaman; they're the same size. In Warhammer, seniority among orcs is based on who's bigger. As such, of course it will be consistent across mob types.

As such, there's nothing oxymoronic about it at all. It's completely standard, where it's applicable. Double standards do not an oxymoron make.

The semantic differences ?

I'm really not sure what you're trying to prove here. The end fact remains the same - the overwhelming majority of monsters in WoW do not physically scale in size according to their level, simply because it's not an engine feature. In Warhammer, they will. That's a biggie - to me. Apparently not to you. End of [silly] discussion.

shihonage wrote:

I'm really not sure what you're trying to prove here. The end fact remains the same - the overwhelming majority of monsters in WoW do not physically scale in size according to their level, simply because it's not an engine feature. In Warhammer, they will. That's a biggie - to me. Apparently not to you. End of [silly] discussion.

I never said it wasn't a big deal to me; the Warhammer lore is the only thing drawing me into the game, and it's more than enough.

You are arguing semantics, in that there is no consistency in mob scaling. There is consistency, but only within mob type. Wanting it across everything is fine by me. I like the idea of it, especially since WAR will have it across mobs AND players. So, like I said; it's not everywhere, and this is the third time I've said that. It does happen, and your argument that it doesn't work like you want it to is pretty much bunk IMO.

AnimeJ wrote:

You are arguing semantics, in that there is no consistency in mob scaling. There is consistency, but only within mob type. Wanting it across everything is fine by me. I like the idea of it, especially since WAR will have it across mobs AND players. So, like I said; it's not everywhere, and this is the third time I've said that. It does happen, and your argument that it doesn't work like you want it to is pretty much bunk IMO.

[b]Previously on The AnimeJ Show:[/b]

shihonage: "Hey, WAR has this neat engine feature where enemies scale in size according to their level, unlike WoW, where they don't".
AnimeJ: "But you're wrong, in WoW they do scale in size according to their level. It's STANDARD FARE, except you rarely see it, because it's not standard fare !"
shihonage: "... what ?"
AnimeJ: "Your opinion is bunk ! Bunk bunk bunk !"

I can't wait for next episode !

IMAGE(http://i19.tinypic.com/4ti8p6g.gif)

Haha you guys are getting a little to crazy for me. Most MMORPGs I have played reuse models all throughout your gaming experience. Typically most games reskin the models in different colors and increase their scale with their level and/or importance/lore. This is usually most obvious with animals. You can look at EQ or WoW or DAoC or LOTRO or any of those games and you will see that the lions, tigers, and bears (oh my?) typically start out the size of a small dog and end up way larger in their upper level counterparts. In WoW you can even see this in hunter pets. A cat you charm at level 10 will be huge by the time it is max level (which sucks imo as I like smaller pets).

If Warhammer is doing this with actual characters then that is pretty damned cool. The only other game I have seen with something similar is shadowbane and it only applied to strength I believe? Essentially if you pumped your characters strength extremely high they would actually increase in size. This is definitely something I think some games should look into though I would prefer it to have some scalability. I don't want to make a tiny character to find out later it ends up being gargantuan and something I don't want to play. I don't think this would influence me to play the game (though I will more likely than not play it regardless) but I agree that it's neat.

jowner, I don't think Warhammer's PvP will fail. I think it will be extremely popular (in terms of the game's population). A lot of people were really into DAoC's RVR and WoW's battlegrounds. This combines some of the best parts of both of these and I think a lot of people will be into it. It's simply not what I am into personally. I completely agree on hoping the M rating keeps the kiddos away at least some.

Anyway, switching back to AoC since that is what the topic is... How many of you are actually planning on playing it at this point? How many will choose a PvP server should one be available at release?

shihonage wrote:
AnimeJ wrote:

You are arguing semantics, in that there is no consistency in mob scaling. There is consistency, but only within mob type. Wanting it across everything is fine by me. I like the idea of it, especially since WAR will have it across mobs AND players. So, like I said; it's not everywhere, and this is the third time I've said that. It does happen, and your argument that it doesn't work like you want it to is pretty much bunk IMO.

[b]Previously on The AnimeJ Show:[/b]

shihonage: "Hey, WAR has this neat engine feature where enemies scale in size according to their level, unlike WoW, where they don't".
AnimeJ: "But you're wrong, in WoW they do scale in size according to their level. It's STANDARD FARE, except you rarely see it, because it's not standard fare !"
shihonage: "... what ?"
AnimeJ: "Your opinion is bunk ! Bunk bunk bunk !"

I can't wait for next episode !

IMAGE(http://i19.tinypic.com/4ti8p6g.gif)

Edit for accuracy:

Shihonage: In WAR, everything scales. It's the first game to ever do it because WoW doesn't
AnimeJ: That's not true. WoW has mob scaling, but only on certain types.
Shihonage: So WoW doesn't do it after all.
AnimeJ: That's not what I said. Read what I'm saying.
conversation repeats

That's what you're doing here. Read what I'm saying, and instead of picking and choosing what you want to hear, READ IT ALL. Good grief, man.

mven wrote:

Anyway, switching back to AoC since that is what the topic is... How many of you are actually planning on playing it at this point? How many will choose a PvP server should one be available at release?

If there's anything but a PvP realm for AoC, the game auto-fails in my book. I don't plan on playing though.

AnimeJ wrote:

That's what you're doing here. Read what I'm saying, and instead of picking and choosing what you want to hear, READ IT ALL. Good grief, man.

It would've been swell if you took this EXACT advice before you decided to start this debate over nothing.

Everything that I said remains true. In WoW, the overwhelming majority of mobs have no sort of a distinguishable difference in size and their level has no impact on it. I've slaughtered hundreds if not thousands of murlocs and wolves and all kinds of beasts who looked exactly the same as their lower-level bretheren.

WAR is going to have scaling as a global feature. It's going to be present everywhere. It's going to be COOL. It's not going to be like its done (or not done) in WoW. Such is the truth. (Okay, we'll have to find out exactly how COOL it is, but other than that...)

If you're in denial of reality, that is your prerogative. If you're not in denial of reality, but merely choose to argue meaningless semantics because of some chip on your shoulder, I really don't know what to tell you.

If you're in denial of reality, that is your prerogative. If you're not in denial of reality, but merely choose to argue meaningless semantics because of some chip on your shoulder, I really don't know what to tell you.

I find this comment highly amusing, seeing as you came out with a false statement first(It's never been done), then spend nearly every other comment pitching straw men. Not to mention that you chose to pursue this above and beyond what it started out as. I've explained the reasoning for the lack of scaling across everything; you're choosing to ignore that to pursue your own meaningless argument.

If you guys can't discuss something without reverting to getting personal about HOW you debate than I'd rather you not bother. I'd hate to have to start deleting whole posts if they contain personal attacks again.

Here it comes...

Certis wrote:

If you guys can't discuss something without reverting to getting personal about HOW you debate than I'd rather you not bother. I'd hate to have to start deleting whole posts if they contain personal attacks again.

Let's just chalk all this up to rabid excitment over the new games coming out and our impotence at not being in beta, toiling our lives away at a character that will never see the 'gold' light of the release world and be consigned to a beta heaven/hell.

BlackSheep wrote:

Here it comes...

Certis wrote:

If you guys can't discuss something without reverting to getting personal about HOW you debate than I'd rather you not bother. I'd hate to have to start deleting whole posts if they contain personal attacks again.

Let's just chalk all this up to rabid excitment over the new games coming out and our impotence at not being in beta, toiling our lives away at a character that will never see the 'gold' light of the release world and be consigned to a beta heaven/hell.

That wasn't rabid excitement, that was a shouting match on an elemetary school playground.

So...no one wants to discuss my Grand Theory of Guild Naming? Seriously, I think it has practical application!

Fedaykin98 wrote:

So...no one wants to discuss my Grand Theory of Guild Naming? Seriously, I think it has practical application!

So what was this Grand Theory again? It got lost in all the crap.

Fedaykin98 wrote:
BlackSheep wrote:

Here it comes...

Certis wrote:

If you guys can't discuss something without reverting to getting personal about HOW you debate than I'd rather you not bother. I'd hate to have to start deleting whole posts if they contain personal attacks again.

Let's just chalk all this up to rabid excitment over the new games coming out and our impotence at not being in beta, toiling our lives away at a character that will never see the 'gold' light of the release world and be consigned to a beta heaven/hell.

That wasn't rabid excitement, that was a shouting match on an elemetary school playground.

So...no one wants to discuss my Grand Theory of Guild Naming? Seriously, I think it has practical application!

I kind of think that your GToGN can mine the resources located within your own post -- we could call the guild 'The Elementary School Playground'

Reposting my thoughts on guild names. This is not Conan-specific, but obviously it applies:

Is it too early to discuss guild names? It occurs to me that a guild name counts for a lot, and that one leaves the door open for any future eventualities by choosing a good guild name, because there are bound to be cool people in the world of AoC who have not yet heard of GWJ. Some of them will be idiots like myself who care about guild names (much like I foolishly care about the way my WoW characters look, and eschew armor that I deem unfashionable - which is hell on a Paladin, brother).

For instance, if I was looking for a WoW guild, I wouldn't join a guild with a mis-spelled name even if it was founded by Miss November. Similarly, I wouldn't join a guild with a totally lame name, or one that was a little TOO serious. I would consider a name that appealed to me from an RP perspective, like Servants of Anubis or something. I would definitely join a guild with a name that demonstrated a sense of fun/humor, like (real guild names here) Goonies Never Say Die or (best name ever) I Just Crit Myself. There are also some fantastic drinking-inspired guild names like Guardians of the Keg or Crusaders of Drunken Might, but I don't know if everyone is cool with that.

I know the LOTRO guild has a name that fits the lore and (once decoded) is also funny; I think that's probably a good idea. If we need to reference GWJ, I'd suggest something like Disciples of Stan or Guardians of the Weiner. I could totally be an Inebriated Pastafarian.

I kind of think that your GToGN can mine the resources located within your own post -- we could call the guild 'The Elementary School Playground'

ESP!

Though for the castle I really like Goodjerstan Keep.

fedaykin wrote:

I could totally be an Inebriated Pastafarian.

You should play Kingdom of Loathing.