30 Days - Homosexuality and Religion *Moved, but replies lost*

So, I watched this with my sister tonight, and I gotta say, some things surprised me.

First of all, I wasn't really sure what to expect of this show, but it was good to see two people who were relatively normal versions of their respective groups brought together. Instead of doing the sensationalist version that would have had a "F*g hater" living with well... someone like Carson from Queer Eye... they went for two relatively normal people...

I gotta say, a few things really kinda struck me weird.

First of all, that gay priest/minister/whatever... was kind of a pain in the arse. Admittedly, she had some good points... but, her lectures came off a little hypocritical. She could lecture him about not killing... but she's committing a sin according to the Bible too... it was like the blind leading the blind.

Second, what the hell was with that guy in the gay bar who comes up and just antagonized Ryan? God damn, could you be a more pissy gay? No wonder straight people might be afraid of gays when some of you act like that, ya retard. I can understand why some gays would be hostile... but you would think that some kind of logic would insue that by being hostile, you're not helping.

Third, the anti-gay protestors... wow. I could write a list several pages long on what was wrong with so many of them.

"I'm in love with a man.... and his name is Jesus Christ! And his blood is NOT HIV positive." (Wow, isn't that some kind of blasphemy to admit you had a homosexual relationship with Christ? I mean... really... that seems kinda weird to start off with something like that... and well of course he didn't have HIV... the virus didn't even come about till nearly 2,000 years after he was born... that WOULD have been a neat trick though.)

Even worse was the Civil Rights lawyer. Oh my god, this guy is spreading so much hate and malice into all of his grandkids... it was like seeing a baby at a KKK rally, it really just knocked the wind out of me. Between the signs like "AIDS CURES FAGS" or "FAGS DIE GOD LAUGHS", and just some of the things he was saying... it was just... damn. I mean, how far gone do you have to be to focus entirely on two passages where the bible says homosexuality is wrong while TOTALLY ignoring the entire book's message of loving each other?

I gotta say though, seeing Ryan go to both the gay version of the VFW and to the PFLAG meetings showed a lot of courage and open-mindedness on his part. As someone who supports equal rights for gays, I CAN see the possible problems of having an openly gay person in the Army. While they may be damn good soldiers, the negative effects they may have on other soldiers does sort of cause a problem too.

But, I was glad to see that eventually Ryan did come around to a more accepting attitude. I gotta say, that I was a bit surprised he did at that particular point, really... I mean, I was pretty twisted emotionally by the one guy's story about how he was out on the streets at age 12 because his religious mother kicked him out... but I suppose an emotional appeal from someone who wasn't gay was probably the easiest way for him to come around.

Damn, I gotta say, this show was pretty decent. I can't wait till next week. Heh, the idea of two gadget/electronic junkies living in the Apalachia is just too entertaining for words.

EDIT: As per Certis' request, I moved the topic... but made a copy leftover in Everything Else, and when trying to get rid of THAT, I destroyed both? I dunno... so now it's here... hopefully to stay?

EDIT: As per Certis' request, I moved the topic... but made a copy leftover in Everything Else, and when trying to get rid of THAT, I destroyed both? I dunno... so now it's here... hopefully to stay?

I didn't request that and users should not be able to move topics. Hmmmm.

we have a Certis impersonator on board! Take care of your shoeribbons!

Actually, Demos probably thought my telling people not to reply to Ulairi's off-topic post meant he should move this one to P&C. Which users can't do.

Tracking shows Demos deleted the old post, in which I gave him sh*t for referring to gay people as a species and his general peppy, off-color posts these days. He deleted the original post which in turn (due to a bug in the edit function which Pyro just fixed) deleted the entire thread.

Next time, leave the moving to mods. Thank you.

Actually he deleted the old post and copied the content over. He shouldn't have been able to delete the old post. And now he can't. *dusts hands*

Well I for one am glad we've all learned something here.

And now all those replies are out on their butts with no home to go to! For shame! Bad Demos!!! No blog posts for a week!

I mean, how far gone do you have to be to focus entirely on two passages where the bible says homosexuality is wrong while TOTALLY ignoring the entire book's message of loving each other?

The simple fact of the matter is that the book is far too large and the average human mind is far too small to hold it all together in one place and try to make sense of it. Not to mention how self-contradictory and convoluted the work is. Not to mention all the various changes and intentional mis translations there have been. Trying to hold it all in one place would cause your brain to explode. It's much easier for your general person to just take a few choices words or phrases to heart, not think to carefully about what the original intent may, or may not have been and think that they're securing themself in the afterlife by doing what they have been told is 'God's Work.'

Human nature is a remarkably obvious thing when you break it down into its base elements: horniness, greediness and stupidity. It's really just laziness of the mind. It takes too much time and energy to become informed and think for yourself.

They're all going to feel so silly when the get to the afterlife and Rowan Atkinson is there saying, "Yes, I'm sorry, but the Jews were right."

Human nature is a remarkably obvious thing when you break it down into its base elements: horniness, greediness and stupidity.

What about compassion and fear and tolerance and genius and obstinance and love and envy and generosity and all the other things that make up human nature? I think you're being a little unfair. We are not all fornicating, gold-mongering idiots. And it isn't just fornicating, gold-mongering idiots who believe in the truth of the bible. It's easy to point at someone whose opinion differs from yours and say "You believe that? You can't be serious. You must not be a rational human being." But they are rational beings, we all are, no matter how silly our desicions and odd our contradictions and convuluted our beliefs. I think that's the whole point of "30 Days". And that's why I like Mr. Spurlock's work.

(sigh) I wish I had seen last night's episode - I'll catch it on reruns. Was it as good as the Muslim one last week?

And yes, you will get to the afterlife and find out that the Jews were right all along, and all you pig-eaters will have to spend eternity in Spamalot Gardens, with bad Monty Python impersonators and consumers of pork. And we will laugh because we will have Jon Stewart and you will just have Bob Novak.

Well, as I posted to what Certis thought was an off-color remark (what exactly does that mean? I always forget.)...

I didn't mean to insinuate or suggest that gay people were some kind of different race or anything. I would imagine most people know by now that I support gay rights in just about every venue other than the military.

But, as I see it... they are still very much a repressed minority in the middle of the battle for their rights. What did that guy who started antagonizing Ryan really think being a jerk was going to do? You have someone with an open mind who's willing to take on the experience... where as we saw throughout the show, many would not have been... and that guy's *sshole-ish attitude certainly put Ryan off quite a bit. How would turning away a potential ally have helped? That is why that guy being a jerk really rubbed me the wrong way. I mean, when they had all the bikers and the protests in the Castro, all the gays and lesbians are looking around laughing... but someone walks in who will actually listen... and someone decides to get all territorial and... well... act almost like the protesting people outside... just in the opposite direction?

That said, I still really enjoyed the show... I missed the Muslim one last week though, sadly... though I saw a few seconds of it on the Daily Show, and that alone seemed pretty kewl. Can't wait for next week too.

As for what I did when it came to moving the post... well, I'll PM Pyro just in case.

KaterinLHC wrote:
Human nature is a remarkably obvious thing when you break it down into its base elements: horniness, greediness and stupidity.

What about compassion and fear and tolerance and genius and obstinance and love and envy and generosity and all the other things that make up human nature? I think you're being a little unfair. We are not all fornicating, gold-mongering idiots. And it isn't just fornicating, gold-mongering idiots who believe in the truth of the bible. It's easy to point at someone whose opinion differs from yours and say "You believe that? You can't be serious. You must not be a rational human being." But they are rational beings, we all are, no matter how silly our desicions and odd our contradictions and convuluted our beliefs.

Well, as are most of my rants, that was mostly satire and sarcasm. All humans have the capacity to do great things selflessly. However it seems that more and more, modern man only commits actions for selfish reasons, consciously or not.

I, personally, can't consider someone who accepts dogma of any kind and commits actions unthinkingly based on that to be 'rational.' A rational mind takes information, studies it and comes to a decision based on that consideration. Not enough people do that, especially when it comes to religious and political issues.

I think the Jews have the idea down a lot better. Rabbis are taught to study and question everything. All rabbis are teachers, and what good is a teacher that doesn't teach you to think for yourself? You ask ten rabbis the same question and get 100 different answers, because they've all been thinking and questioning everything they've known for 5700 years. It's even more remarkable because the bulk of their information has survived in its exact lettering for over 5000 years. And they /still/ haven't decided what to make of all of it. The only absolute in Judaism is 'There is one God, he is our Lord, he is one,' and that's up for interpretation as well in some circles.

Anywho, the real point is that, IMHO, people don't think for themselves enough and take the easy way out too often.

My other point is please take my posts with a grain of salt, because I'm not the best writer in the world and usually come out sounding more cynical than I really am.

Demosthenes wrote:

Well, as I posted to what Certis thought was an off-color remark (what exactly does that mean? I always forget.)...

Your recent remarks about devout Christians, I guess?

Actually, Demos probably thought my telling people not to reply to Ulairi's off-topic post meant he should move this one to P&C. Which users can't do.

I wasn't trying to make an off topic post, I was trying to make ap ost more about the show its self since the topic was better suitted for the P&C forum, while talking in general about the show is better for EE.

I wasn't trying to make an off topic post, I was trying to make ap ost more about the show its self since the topic was better suitted for the P&C forum, while talking in general about the show is better for EE.

And if the post was made in EE perhaps rather than dragging it into another P&C debate you could have come to P&C and made a new thread.

I'm confused... is Certis mad at me?