GWJ Conference Call Episode Sixteen

Conference Call

Crackdown, Splinter Cell: Double Agent, Fallout 3, Loads of News, Tons of Threads and more!

Where did Rob go? Why isn't Rob here? Rob? You said you had nowhere else to be last time, and now you're gone! Cory Banks is left fending for himself, stuck between the GWJ CEOs as they go over some big ticket news and tons of awesome threads.

Want to support the show? Hit the Digg link just above (it's fast and easy to register) or review us on iTunes! Read on for show notes.

To contact us, email [email protected]! Send us your thoughts on the show, pressing issues you want to talk about or whatever else is on your mind. You can even send a 30 second audio question or comment (MP3 format please) if you're so inclined.

The Links
Crackdown
Splinter Cell: Double Agent
Sam And Max
Ritual Interview
Age of Conan Delayed
Mmmm ... Microsoft Money
PAX is Bigger!

Threads of the Week:
Games You'd Like To See - dhelor
Gametap Gets Interstate 76 - Fanatka
Fallout Meets Xbox 360 - Kyreth

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Show credits

Music credits: 

Intro/Outro Music - Ian Dorsch, Willowtree Audioworks

"The Neverwhere" - Apoplexia (Benoit Casey) - 0:13:17
"Terra" - Chico Correa & Electronic Band - 0:30:34
"Impeller" - Ian Dorsch - 0:54:59

Comments

momgamer wrote:
Quintin, are you under a rock? Game companies, movie companies and etc do this ALL THE TIME. They want the cardboard cut out, not the substance.

Doesn't make it right, nor something to be encouraged.

I'm not encouraging it. I hate it. I wish what you said was true. I just handed 2000 words to Ellysium saying pretty much the same thing. But I'm saying it happens.

And in the case where there's so little mainstream investment in the soi disant story I'd much rather have the developer/director just throw caution to the wind and try something else than try to come up with a compromise between that new thing and keeping the guy writing Sinthia/Katrina slash-fic* happily fapping away.

Besides, what's the core of Fallout? The setting, the story and the cool weapons? Or the fact that you're suddenly able to see from more angles than over your character's shoulder?

That said, part of my aggressive indifference with this particular fanbase in general, and two people who are part of it that are absolutely rabid about any changes and rabid about making sure everyone in a 500 meter radius of their sphere of influence is aware of their outrage.

* Yes, I'm not kidding. And it's sooooo bad.

momgamer wrote:
Besides, what's the core of Fallout? The setting, the story and the cool weapons? Or the fact that you're suddenly able to see from more angles than over your character's shoulder?

Different for every person, which only exacerbates the problem. I'd welcome a 3D camera system. I recommend that whoever it was in the conference call (sorry, Certis' voice is the only one I can match to a name) who doesn't like the idea of a free camera should try out Silent Storm if they haven't already.

momgamer wrote:
Or the fact that you're suddenly able to see from more angles than over your character's shoulder?

Did you miss the Ultimas and Crusaders, or is this an issue of a movable camera?

Quintin_Stone wrote:
I recommend that whoever it was in the conference call (sorry, Certis' voice is the only one I can match to a name) who doesn't like the idea of a free camera should try out Silent Storm if they haven't already.

I hear you on that. I don't mind free moving cameras. I play way too many platformers not to be well aware of the Pitfalls. (bad joke, I know)

But that was my point. About all changing to the Oblivion engine would require to be changed is the free-range camera. Story, etc changes they decide to make along the way just because I can't comment on yet. But what you're seeing is people seeing that someone MIGHT someday want to change to this engine and having a cow just because of this technical change.

wordsmythe wrote:
momgamer wrote:
Or the fact that you're suddenly able to see from more angles than over your character's shoulder?

Did you miss the Ultimas and Crusaders, or is this an issue of a movable camera?

No, my point is entirely about those guys grognarding. See notes above for Quintin. I have no problem with the concept of adding one of the best next-gen engines to the Fallout story and characters. My problem is with some of the jerky fans.

To me successful changes all come down to staying true to the core of the game. If the game is all about BFG's, don't add a turgid story and five hours of cutscenes. If the game may as well be Japanese daytime television, don't turn it into a run-and-gun. If you've got a cute and fluffy platformer, don't turn it into Fallout.

If you want to change technical details, I'm guardedly optimistic as long as I trust the developer and they're actual improvements (I'm talking to you, Kingdom Hearts II and some of the uses of the Reaction command).

In this case, the Oblivion engine is rock solid. Especially when it comes to free-range camera and manipulation of in-game objects. The only thing I've seen out there to match it is Tony Hawk Project 8. If we're going to bring this game screaming into the light of day this is probably the best way I can think of to do it.

My hope is that with such a solid engine they'll be able to spend more time on the story and fun little quirks that make it Fallout to me.

Momgamer, the devil's already got a THAC0 of like -15, he doesn't need your help.

wordsmythe wrote:
Momgamer, the devil's already got a THAC0 of like -15, he doesn't need your help.

Don't try to change me, babe.

PS: You're not a grodnard if you don't kriegspiel.

wordsmythe wrote:
PS: You're not a grodnard if you don't kriegspiel.

To quote the Oxford English Dictionary, 2nd ed:- Grognard: a soldier of Napoleon's Old Guard; a veteran soldier; grumbler (French).

Believe me, these guys are grumblers. And that is the context I was using. I use grognard to also imply the nuances of "hairy palmed basement dweller lording over his ranks of little lead men".

And on a related note, are you talking about chess Kreigspiel, or the wargame game used by the Prussian army?

I don't understand this whole resistance to Fallout 3. We have no idea what to expect, nothing has been announced. First person point of view does not guarantee failure any more than isometric squares guarantee success.

momgamer wrote:
And on a related note, are you talking about chess Kreigspiel, or the wargame game used by the Prussian army?

I'm talking about those hairy-palmed basement dwellers standing around between rounds talking about what each other did and what they could do -- and, of course, talking about how to modify the rules so that the game will be more realistic next time they play.

First person camera would be a big mistake. I think people are just bitter as the last time they strayed so far from the Fallout fold, we had the infamous Fallout:BoS.

wordsmythe wrote:
momgamer wrote:
And on a related note, are you talking about chess Kreigspiel, or the wargame game used by the Prussian army?

I'm talking about those hairy-palmed basement dwellers standing around between rounds talking about what each other did and what they could do -- and, of course, talking about how to modify the rules so that the game will be more realistic next time they play.

So we're on the same exact page pretty much. I just wanted to be sure there wasn't some other detailed nuance you were trying for, or you weren't a real grognard-in-geek's-clothing and trying to out me as such as well.

shuffling dice and oddly scaled map grid off under the desk....

fangblackbone wrote:
First person camera would be a big mistake. I think people are just bitter as the last time they strayed so far from the Fallout fold, we had the infamous Fallout:BoS.

And I think BoS kind of proves my point. That thing should have been forbidden by the Geneva Conventions. The story/environment were so badly hosed. The problems had nothing to do with the technical updates.

I do also want to point out to the non-Obliviates here that the camera system in the Oblivion Engine is free-ranging in exterior environments, and inside you have a choice of several modes. If it's implemented correctly, you don't have to stay in first-person if you don't like it.

momgamer wrote:
So we're on the same exact page pretty much. I just wanted to be sure there wasn't some other detailed nuance you were trying for, or you weren't a real grognard-in-geek's-clothing and trying to out me as such as well.

shuffling dice and oddly scaled map grid off under the desk....

I was raised with my dad hosting their mini conventions in my basement. I guess he was in the games club at Madison while Gygax was making his historically inaccurate games on the other side of the room. My father and friends sneered at Gary from behind their hex paper and pewter Napoleonics.

In fact, I used to make my candy money by painting Prussians.

...I quit because it was rather paltry pay. (Sorry, once I get started.... :oops:)

Awesome I had a thread talked about in the show! =D

souldaddy wrote:
I don't understand this whole resistance to Fallout 3. We have no idea what to expect, nothing has been announced. First person point of view does not guarantee failure any more than isometric squares guarantee success.

Personally I believe they can make a good game, I'm still worried because it is my all time favorite game (FO1&2) and since about ten years have past since Fallout 2 I would be nervous even if it was being made by the original crew.

anyways if you want to know a bit of the history of the game and why the angry fans feel they way they feel here is a good read.

http://www.nma-fallout.com/article.php?id=34542 ***warning they are really angy***

Oh and you got the name right on they first try =)