Windows Phone 7/8 Catch All

Kurrelgyre wrote:
farley3k wrote:

I finished the update and I guess I don't notice the difference. Obviously since the UI is the same it is more of an under the hood thing but I should go read up on what the features are I should be looking for.

What version number did you end at? It might not be the final Mango.

I am at OS version 7.10.7720.68 but above that is says lists "Software: Windows Phone 7.5" That is what is confusing me. Why would the OS version be different than the "software"?

farley3k wrote:
Kurrelgyre wrote:
farley3k wrote:

I finished the update and I guess I don't notice the difference. Obviously since the UI is the same it is more of an under the hood thing but I should go read up on what the features are I should be looking for.

What version number did you end at? It might not be the final Mango.

I am at OS version 7.10.7720.68 but above that is says lists "Software: Windows Phone 7.5" That is what is confusing me. Why would the OS version be different than the "software"?

This is called Microsoft logic.

Pocketnow has a great write-up of the features in Mango.

The iPhone 4S Is Microsoft’s Chance to Catch up to Apple  At least according to a Gizmodo article.

Right now, Microsoft's awesome Metro user experience is the only real alternative to Apple's dominance. Not in market share—yet—but in terms of technological superiority. FAF, if you will, the f*cking-Awesome Factor. To me, Windows Phone 7.5 feels like the only real challenger to Apple's iOS 5 superiority.

I do have to admit that 7.5 feels and looks really stinking cool compared to the increasingly dated looking iOS. Still, it's going to take more than an Awesome Factor to get people to take their eyes off the sheer popularity of Apple's product.

I'll be jumping ship to the HTC Trophy soon - waiting just a bit for the supposedly new phones to get announced (no idea, don't look at me like that). I've got a $30 New-Every-Two credit to burn as well, just trying to get a device for as cheap as possible as I'm tired of Android and hearing that Mango/7.5 has improved existing handsets instead of the standard feature of iOS auto-deprecating older models as new versions appear.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

I do have to admit that 7.5 feels and looks really stinking cool compared to the increasingly dated looking iOS. Still, it's going to take more than an Awesome Factor to get people to take their eyes off the sheer popularity of Apple's product.

I agree. I'm one of the very few Mac users (iPod, iPad, MacBook, and iMac) that went with a Windows Phone. I freaking love it, but my wife is far from sold.

I finally got Mango-ized last night. Lots to like. But I'm still not sure it breaks apple's stronghold. Right now, it would be cool to see if it can eclipse Android's mindshare. For me, my decision came down to Android vs. WP7, and WP7 won easily. It just doesn't seem like most phone purchasers actually weigh those differences.

Not sure Microsoft and Nokia can think fast and act fast enough to exploit this.. I would love to see this.. especially on the Tablet side.. I mean Windows 8 if it really builds from the ground up with Touch in mind as well as a version of Office built for touch/tablet would be awesome..

Sync it with Office 365 and I have a real productivity tool versus my email/browser/game tool my iPad is now.

Apple has generally not been the best interface nor had the most features. The zune and many other mp3 players were better designed (both hardware and os), had more features, and cost less. Unfortunately, they never beat the iPod in sales. I don't think WP7 has to steal iphone users. They just need to get people new to smartphones to choose WP7 and convert some android people.

I think the easiest place for them to gain market share is Android users. Android is not that easy for your average person to customize which is one of it's biggest draws. In it's stock setup it's dated and ugly (as is iOS). It's biggest draw IMO are the widgets. MS's live tiles are similar and offer nice functionality but are not as flexible from what I've seen.

MS and Nokia really need to get WP7 multiple phones out to Verizon, AT&T, and Sprint so that there are simply more phones out there. They also need to sell people on the phones. I think they have a terrible name and they really should have come up with something better. The iPhone, Android, the Droid. All are much better than windows phone 7. The Kin was a flop but at least the name was decent. Overall, I think they just need to hit the advertising hard, get more phones out (especially Nokia ones), and get some android users converted. I really don't think iPhone users will abandon the platform with enough numbers to increase market share quickly.

Came back from the local Verizon store (not just a hole-in-the-wall one, a nice, new corporate style one) and they informed me that if I wanted the WinPhone7 they offered, they would have to order it in since it they didn't have any on-hand and admitted it didn't move very many units.

I get that, but a flagship-style store with only a live-test device? Yikes...

On a positive note, I will be getting an HTC Trophy. Certified pre-owned knocks it to $50 down from $150, and my new every two credit knocks another $30 off. A $20 smartphone upgrade? Yeah, I can totally dig that.

Edit: Trophy bought! Waiting on shipment now...

Anyone having problems with web browsing? Since Mango, it won't log me into forums anymore. And even after signing in, when I go to recent posts, it only puts me at the top of the page.

The zune and many other mp3 players were better designed (both hardware and os), had more features, and cost less.

But they absolutely always and forever will only work with Windows. Mac and Linux users are a small part of the overall desktop market, but they're a big hangout for early adopters; by locking the Zune so completely to Windows, Microsoft cut off a lot of the potential early positive buzz.

Plus, strongly pushing that 'Social!' thing, which was actually useless, adding DRM restrictions even to non-DRMed files, didn't help.

Jayhawker wrote:

Anyone having problems with web browsing? Since Mango, it won't log me into forums anymore. And even after signing in, when I go to recent posts, it only puts me at the top of the page.

I haven't had any problems logging into forums, but I have had a few other issues. The first, as you mentioned, is that the browser won't jump to any in-page anchors, like the #new used on GWJ to jump to the newest post on a page. The other is that I've had some weird time outs on pages. I'll click a link to go to a new page, and it'll take so long that it times out, but if I hit stop when it seems to be doing that and then click the link again, it'll load the page right away.

Got my Trophy and am loving Mango. Zune pass has made it an even better experience for a newbie

Malor wrote:

But they absolutely always and forever will only work with Windows. Mac and Linux users are a small part of the overall desktop market, but they're a big hangout for early adopters; by locking the Zune so completely to Windows, Microsoft cut off a lot of the potential early positive buzz.

Plus, strongly pushing that 'Social!' thing, which was actually useless, adding DRM restrictions even to non-DRMed files, didn't help.

They did add the Mac sync software around the Windows Phone release, so it wasn't technically "forever". Although the music service won't work through the connector service, which was a horrible/near fatal mistake for MS.

Yeah, but it was all encrypted and nasty and impossible to drive with anything except the Microsoft software, too, which locked the Linux market out completely. I'm sure this was deliberate on Microsoft's part to weaken Linux and strengthen Windows, but it also weakened the Zune. If they'd been careful to make it work in an open way with absolutely everything, they'd have probably had a hit on their hands. To all accounts, the hardware was awesome.

If it had been open, I'd have probably bought one, and if I liked it, I'd have sung its praises online. Get enough people doing that, and things sell.

Ok, so after 5 days of use, I'm smitten. The UI is great, the keyboard is spot-on (barring an easy apostrophe key), the integration with all the different social networks is nice, I think mobile outlook is amazing, and having a Zune pass will be something worth keeping.

There are a few small issues I have, mostly the apps that haven't been upgraded to support the better task switching that 7.5 allows. The keyboard in Mango bugs and auto-hides sometimes, and some of the load times for apps that I enjoy. Minor issues when looking at everything built-in and integrated.

Surprise feature I didn't expect: having zero issues viewing the screen in direct sunlight.

After 2 years on Android and having owned early and recent iOS devices, this is a breath of fresh air. This experience is similar to when I bought an iPad. I knew I would like it, I didn't expect to love it.

Malor wrote:

Yeah, but it was all encrypted and nasty and impossible to drive with anything except the Microsoft software, too, which locked the Linux market out completely. I'm sure this was deliberate on Microsoft's part to weaken Linux and strengthen Windows, but it also weakened the Zune. If they'd been careful to make it work in an open way with absolutely everything, they'd have probably had a hit on their hands. To all accounts, the hardware was awesome.

If it had been open, I'd have probably bought one, and if I liked it, I'd have sung its praises online. Get enough people doing that, and things sell.

But for Linux, is Apple's stuff any better? I'm sure there are hacked ways to do things, but nothing Apple supported.

MS really wanted to do as much of Apple's business model as possible with the Zune. To the point of giving up a lot of their general advantages.

But for Linux, is Apple's stuff any better?

It was at first, and then got locked down later, but by then the market momentum was unstoppable.

And, yes, I think you're right about them trying to copy Apple exactly, instead of playing to their own strengths.

I dropped my LG Optimus 7 this weekend and cracked the display badly. Applied packing tape and the display is smooth and still functional, if difficult to read/view. My big dilemma is now whether I should buy the HTC Titan, an iPhone 4S, or wait for the Nokia Sun (assuming it has a front facing camera)...

One of the things I use my phone for most often is photos, so the idea of the 8MP camera is very appealing, and all three of the above seem to be best-in-class for that sort of thing. The Titan is probably larger than I would find comfortable - 4.7" is too much display for that kind of resolution, and I assume it also eats more battery...

But no telling if the Nokia will even be available on Vodafone Ireland...so I'm in a bit of a quandary. And sad that my phone is busted, as I wasn't planning on shelling out 200 Euro (or more) for a new device for at least another year...

Owning an EVO 4G with it's 4.3 inch screen, my mind is having a hard time thinking bigger is better. I might consider a 4.5" screen, but can't see a 4.7" feeling nice in the hand.

I think 4-4.3 is about perfect. My wife has a Nexus S, and I don't find it really lacks much for the extra .3" it gives up.

I still really like the look of Windows Phone a lot. I'd probably not jump to a Mango version, but we'll see what WP8 brings.

Has anybody with Mango used turn by turn navigation much? I cannot understand why you reportedly have to tell the phone to recalculate if you make a wrong turn, instead it doing it automatically for you. Is that as annoying as it sounds (coming from somebody used to Android)?

MannishBoy wrote:

Has anybody with Mango used turn by turn navigation much? I cannot understand why you reportedly have to tell the phone to recalculate if you make a wrong turn, instead it doing it automatically for you. Is that as annoying as it sounds (coming from somebody used to Android)?

We actually used it just the weekend. Had to do some driving and ran into a log jam on the interstate. Wife pulled out the phone, brought up maps and looked at realtime traffic on it - showed that we had a serious issue for the final 20-30 miles of our trip and used it it to find an alternate route. It would even use our UConnect bluetooth connection in the car to voice the navigation directions over the car's stereo.

Another cool feature that I didn't know about was the reading of incoming text messages in bluetooth mode. It kinda scared the crap out of me the first time, but was very handy. You can tell it to read or ignore the incoming message and announces who it is from. Also it reads stuff like "idk" as "I don't know".

Both of those features are ones that I have seen carries charge extra for and was nice to see them baked into the OS upgrade.

But that didn't really answer my question about how it works if you go off it's route. Android does the stuff you describe as well, and has for a long time.

My wife says that it updated the turns and such as we went off the initial route - I'm not sure, as I was driving. We're making another road trip tomorrow, and I'll see if we can't test it out.

For someone who has never used Android or iPhone - the features were a nice addition.

TexasRay wrote:

My wife says that it updated the turns and such as we went off the initial route - I'm not sure, as I was driving. We're making another road trip tomorrow, and I'll see if we can't test it out.

Cool, thanks. I know when Molly Wood was given the WP challenge, she had some complaints coming from Android. I thought the main one was that it wouldn't automatically recalculate, it just told you you were off course, then you had to tell it to recalculate.

For someone who has never used Android or iPhone - the features were a nice addition.

Oh, most definitely.

MannishBoy wrote:
TexasRay wrote:

My wife says that it updated the turns and such as we went off the initial route - I'm not sure, as I was driving. We're making another road trip tomorrow, and I'll see if we can't test it out.

Cool, thanks. I know when Molly Wood was given the WP challenge, she had some complaints coming from Android. I thought the main one was that it wouldn't automatically recalculate, it just told you you were off course, then you had to tell it to recalculate.

With 7.5 addressing so many issues, it's likely that this has been resolved. Personally, I'm just surprised that Bing maps isn't as terrible as I thought it was going to be.

trueheart78 wrote:

With 7.5 addressing so many issues, it's likely that this has been resolved. Personally, I'm just surprised that Bing maps isn't as terrible as I thought it was going to be.

It was 7.5 she was testing. I didn't think WP7 had turn by turn prior to 7.5, anyway.

EDIT Here's her rant about it:

Turn by turn: The pro part of the navigation on Mango is that it has turn-by-turn navigation...kind of. Also, the mapping is beautiful, and I love the very human-friendly directions, which include helpful little notes about traffic (moderate congestion, etc.), local landmarks ("You'll see a 7-Eleven on the right"), and also, as your near your destination, notes like, "The last intersection is Woodhaven and if you get to Potter you've gone too far." That's awesome. More awesome if you have a passenger in the car with you to read them, but still very helpful.

Here's what I don't understand, though. Why is the turn-by-turn navigation only audible when you tap the screen for directions!?

In one of the most bizarre interpretations of mapping I've ever seen, Mango offers spoken directions, but only user-initiated spoken directions. You can only get audible directions by reaching down and tapping the screen for the next move. Um. What? Worse, early screenshots of Mango seem to indicate that it would have standard spoken turn-by-turn directions, but...what happened!?

The way the audible turn-by-turn navigation experience has existed since the beginning of time is that you map a destination, then sit back and relax and wait for the nice map lady to tell you to turn a few hundred feet before the turn. Mango's navigation leaves you adrift, and caused me to literally miss turns as I waited for some kind of instruction, like I've been trained to do by navigation systems that work. Oh, and instead of a verbal alert that it's time to turn, you get a nice little chime after you correctly execute a turn (that you've memorized), and that, I guess, is supposed to compel you to feel around blindly for the phone and tap the screen for the next audible instruction.

Let me not mince words, here: I hate this. I'd rather just know that I'm going to get a written list of instructions, iOS style, that I have to look at it or memorize it--and then, to make matters even more baffling, sometimes the lady does announce the next turn or instruction, but I can't figure out why. Maybe the phone bumped the side of the cup-holder? Hate. Seriously hate.

Also, there's no rerouting on the fly, as there is with Android. If I make a wrong turn (which happened twice last night as I was navigating the foggy, confusing, overgrown El Cerrito, Calif., hills where the street signs are impossible to see and a little audible direction might help), the app informs me that I've gone a different way, and then asks me if I would like to tap to reroute. One of these days, "tap" will equal "smash." Let's move on.

If it's any way close to what she describes with the rerouting and the manual verbal turn stuff, that's a horrible step down from what Google's got.

But she is kind of rant-y. So I was just asking for feedback from you guys.

The Nokia line is being announced next week, and the leaked press for the 800 has me thinking that will probably be my next phone. How soon it will come to Ireland will decide whether I buy it unlocked from the UK or Italy, or wait until it is available here...

Yes.. I've held out until I see what Nokia delivers.. I might be switching to WM7.5 for good... too many people with iPhones these days.. its no longer "cool"

I am loving my phone but this morning I had an odd issue. It would just hang at the "HTC" logo on the white screen. I took the battery out numerous times and got the same results. Finally I found a way to reset the phone completely by holding the volume button in the middle and powering it on. Unfortunately I lost everything. Not a big deal to restore but it was rather annoying. I am quite a gentle phone user so it doesn't make me feel confident the phone will last for years like my iPhone did but I guess I am happy I was able to get it back up and running.