Wireless router shopping: Cisco e4200 v Netgear WNDR4000. Go!

I've been using my Dlink DIR825 for several years and have been pretty happy. But the new step daughter is getting a new apartment and needs a router, so I've used the situation as an excuse to upgrade both my cable modem to DOCSIS 3.0 and my router.

I've come down to the Cisco e4200 and Netgear WNDR4000. I want simultaneous dual band, and these seem to be the best couple of routers around at the moment. I'd like the option to run media in the 5Ghz band if I want to to use Xboxes as TV extenders, which would require the ability to stream 1080i and possibly 1080p over wireless without drop outs and buffering. Right now, I run all extenders wired, but that might change down the road.

I'd also seriously looked at the Asus RT-N56U, but reading the forum at small net builder has scared me away due to the concern about incompatibility with Cisco VPN on wired connections. I work from home, so that's a critical issue I can't afford to deal with.

The Cisco and the Netgear seem to have similar hardware, with the Netgear CPU running faster. But I've never had good luck with Netgear network hardware. The concern I have the the e4200 is the drop off in speed with both radios running big bandwidth transfers, but in reality I'm not sure I'd ever notice that.

The main advantage for the Netgear is that it allows WDS repeating and bridging. Not something I worry about too much in this house, but if we move to a bigger place next year as planned, it might be nice to have...

Anybody have thoughts about either of these, or know of any other good dual band options?

Wifi Router Buying Flowchart:

STEP 1: Does it run DD-WRT out of the box?
if Yes - Buy
if No - proceed to Step 2

STEP 2: Can DD-WRT be installed on it, and am I technically savvy enough to do so?
if Yes - Buy
if No - find another model and start over on step 1

(Substitute Tomato or other open source firmware in place of DD-WRT if preferred)

I'm on a Linksys router running stock firmware for the first time in a while, and what do you know, dropped connections just like my own old Linksys routers pre-DD-WRT installation. I'm not putting up with stock firmwares ever again.

I think they are working on a port for the WNDR4000, and since the hardware is similar and I think Netgear released driver source code, it's probably possible on the e4200.

But I'm not buying a $150 router to immediately overwrite the firmware. I might do it later, but right now I know of no quality dual band routers that don't have issues with DD-WRT or Tomato. There's actually a port for my DIR-825, but the issues list did not sound like something I wanted to put up with.

*Legion* wrote:

Wifi Router Buying Flowchart:

STEP 1: Does it run DD-WRT out of the box?
if Yes - Buy
if No - proceed to Step 2

STEP 2: Can DD-WRT be installed on it, and am I technically savvy enough to do so?
if Yes - Buy
if No - find another model and start over on step 1

(Substitute Tomato or other open source firmware in place of DD-WRT if preferred)

I'm on a Linksys router running stock firmware for the first time in a while, and what do you know, dropped connections just like my own old Linksys routers pre-DD-WRT installation. I'm not putting up with stock firmwares ever again.

I existed on a wrt54gl forever on ddwrt, loved it. Then router lost the ability to issue ip addresses (weird power outage did it I think) and I picked up a wrt610n but didnt promptly install ddwrt. Now a year later its still running stock and I have no complaints, which surprises me. This is the most stable "stock" firmwared router I have ever used. I know I am missing out on a couple features like pumping xmit and a better fire wall, but so far in the small range I need it to cover in my apartment its been great.

Blotto The Clown wrote:

I existed on a wrt54gl forever on ddwrt, loved it. Then router lost the ability to issue ip addresses (weird power outage did it I think) and I picked up a wrt610n but didnt promptly install ddwrt. Now a year later its still running stock and I have no complaints, which surprises me. This is the most stable "stock" firmwared router I have ever used. I know I am missing out on a couple features like pumping xmit and a better fire wall, but so far in the small range I need it to cover in my apartment its been great.

My wrt54g rev 1.2 has been a hell of a router but I am going to be replacing it soon with a Belkin N750 probably. One of the features that is has that I am interested in is dual USB ports so you can use it as a print server and a NAS at the same time without a USB hub (which some routers support and some don't). Read a glowing review of it on Ars I think a month or so ago.

DD-WRT is that awesome? I've vaguely heard of the firmware that you can download and use to overwrite but it always seemed really scary (brick causing) thing. But since i'll be moving shortly seems like this thread is relevant to my interests.

Cayne wrote:

DD-WRT is that awesome? I've vaguely heard of the firmware that you can download and use to overwrite but it always seemed really scary (brick causing) thing. But since i'll be moving shortly seems like this thread is relevant to my interests.

The stock firmware on my wrt54g wasn't very good and I only used it for about two weeks before I went 3rd party. I ran WiFi Box for years until that project was pretty much dead and buried and then switched to DD-WRT.

I have heard some bad things about the more recent LinkSys firmware too. I have heard from a friend that their newer stuff kind of sucks with some settings that can only be accessed through the web interface and others that can only be accessed through a desktop app. And to make matter worse when you adjust settings in the desktop app it changed settings that could only be accessed through the web interface back to their defaults and vise versa. This was over a year ago so hopefully they fixed it or they got DD-WRT working on that router (not sure which model, think it was their first simultaneous dual-band model).

Just be sure to read and EXACTLY FOLLOW the directions for your router when installing it. It can be tedious for some routers with all the resetting and stuff you have to do but it is better than bricking your router.

Cayne wrote:

DD-WRT is that awesome? I've vaguely heard of the firmware that you can download and use to overwrite but it always seemed really scary (brick causing) thing...

My thoughts as well. I have a Netgear wifi router running stock firmware. Zero issues with our laptop, Roku and PS3. If one has a stable wifi zone going, are there any benefits to going open source on the firmware?

Heretk wrote:
Cayne wrote:

DD-WRT is that awesome? I've vaguely heard of the firmware that you can download and use to overwrite but it always seemed really scary (brick causing) thing...

My thoughts as well. I have a Netgear wifi router running stock firmware. Zero issues with our laptop, Roku and PS3. If one has a stable wifi zone going, are there any benefits to going open source on the firmware?

I would suggest checking out the feature list and seeing if there is any features you might like that your stock firmware is missing.

One of the features I needed that my stock firmware didn't have (though I think most of them have it now) is called Static Leases or Static DHCP. It lets you assign a static ip address based on a devices MAC address. Very useful when you need to port forward to a server on your network. And if you have no idea what any of this means then your stock firmware is probably good enough

Another nice feature that I have never seen in stock firmware is the ability to adjust your broadcast power levels. This can increase your signal strength to give you better downstream speed though I know some people worry it might shorten the life of your router as well.

Rykin wrote:

One of the features I needed that my stock firmware didn't have (though I think most of them have it now) is called Static Leases or Static DHCP. It lets you assign a static ip address based on a devices MAC address. Very useful when you need to port forward to a server on your network.

My Dlink DIR 825 had that, and it was very handy from an administration perspective.

Just be sure to read and EXACTLY FOLLOW the directions for your router when installing it. It can be tedious for some routers with all the resetting and stuff you have to do but it is better than bricking your router.

This is wise advice, because if you think that flashing process is a pain, just wait until you're trying to recover a bricked router. You can almost always do it, but it's often much more painful than the initial flashing process.

With the Buffalo WHRG125, it was actually the same either way -- the default firmware would only accept new firmware that was signed by Buffalo, so you had to throw the router into firmware recovery mode to get DD-WRT to load at all. So in that instance, you saved nothing, but it's usually easier than that.

Just an update, I went with the Netgear WNDR4000. Mainly because Amazon didn't have the Cisco in stock, and Netgear has WDS repeating/bridging in case I need more coverage when we move to a bigger house.

Hope I have better service than the last Netgear I had.

Let us know how it works out for you, particularly for the video streaming stuff. My net connection can now handle things like Netflix HD and I'd really like my wireless network to be able to keep up. That said... the cable company gave me the crappy lowest of the low model Netgear from that same model lineup you're looking at. The $40 one. I haven't tried it yet but I don't expect it to handle streaming well at all.

Tagged. This looks interesting.

Thin_J wrote:

Let us know how it works out for you, particularly for the video streaming stuff. My net connection can now handle things like Netflix HD and I'd really like my wireless network to be able to keep up. That said... the cable company gave me the crappy lowest of the low model Netgear from that same model lineup you're looking at. The $40 one. I haven't tried it yet but I don't expect it to handle streaming well at all.

Strangely, with the new 360S, I was able to run Windows Media Center HD TV streams in my bedroom on the second floor at the opposite end of the house from my current DIR-825 which is against the opposite wall downstairs on my desk. No buffering. Shocked me, actually, as I had attempted this before to bad, stuttery results. This on 2.4Ghz and not 5Ghz, as the built in wireless in the 360S's doesn't do 5Ghz.

Still getting set up to pull cable upstairs for most of my HD needs, but I was tempted to get one of the Cisco bridges for my step daughters room to try before I made the decision to finally break down and pull cable.

So far, I'm really not that happy with the Netgear WNDR4000. Wireless range on 2.4Ghz is worse than my old DIR-825. And streaming DVDs from my server over a gigabit connection keep stuttering and then freezing, which never happened before.

I also have had some freezing in BFBC2 at times, but it's not consistent Mumble seemed to sound fine while it was happening. So I'm not sure if that was related or not.

Apparently the latest firmware has a bunch of issues, so I think I'll roll back to the last one. But the first impression isn't great.

MannishBoy wrote:

So far, I'm really not that happy with the Netgear WNDR4000. Wireless range on 2.4Ghz is worse than my old DIR-825. And streaming DVDs from my server over a gigabit connection keep stuttering and then freezing, which never happened before.

I also have had some freezing in BFBC2 at times, but it's not consistent Mumble seemed to sound fine while it was happening. So I'm not sure if that was related or not.

Apparently the latest firmware has a bunch of issues, so I think I'll roll back to the last one. But the first impression isn't great.

Sounds like you should look into some third party firmware to me.

I think you can put DD-WRT on that unit. If you can, and if it'll fully work with all your features (I have some vague idea that N wireless may not work), do so.

Last time I looked it was pretty early on for the third party stuff. The WNDR3700 might be further along.

I did figure out part of the range problem. The guest network was on, which was limiting things.

Another thing I hate about the WNDR4000 is that I had to cut off DoS protection just to allow me to use a BFBC2 server browser. I'd get maybe 30 results and a bunch of non-responses, then if i refreshed, I'd get nothing for about a minute or two.

I didn't try setting QoS settings on those ports. Might have worked. But I'm returning the thing for all the wired inconsistencies. It's causing all kinds of problems on the Media Center extenders.

I've never had good luck with Netgear networking stuff. All the good reviews had me hopeful, though.

Going to try a Cisco e4200.

Got the e4200 in today, and my wife has been upstairs watching HD TV on the Xbox in Media Center extender mode while I streamed a DVD from the server, then played some BF:1943 on the Xbox. The terrible video glitches and freezing seems to be cured, so either I had a dud WNDR4000 or it was just crap on LAN side streaming.

And BFBC2 no longer requires me to turn down security settings to avoid having the router thinking a DDoS is hitting me and shutting down server responses.

So the WNDR4000 is definitely going back. Just hope I don't have to argue to avoid a restocking fee.

(I assume VPN will work when I log into work in the morning. After all, it's Cisco on both ends of that.)

Suchlike?

MannishBoy wrote:

Suchlike?

He doesn't have time for proper english. Too busy spouting merchandise code. For the prototypical dimension.

The mongoose walks alone.

Spoiler:

Spies are now using our boards to send coded messages.