Nier Catch-All

Finished the game few min ago... (all 4 endings) ...sigh, not a single happy ending.

That said, the game was awesome from start to finish and I was disappointed that it ended... so I started new play-through!

stevenmack wrote:
Nei wrote:
stevenmack wrote:

Well, that's endings "C" and "D" finished.
Which I guess means I'm pretty much done with the game - since ending "D" deletes all your save game data.

...um, WHAT!? :shock:

There's a story reason for it but, yeah, save data go bye bye

It asks you if your REALLY sure about five times amd you have to enter your character name again before it actually happens though, so there's no chance of it happening by accident.

That's fantastic. Good to know there's a story reason and it's a ballsy choice by the game designers. But after playing the game 4 times do you really need to keep the save data?

This is another one of the few games to make me wish I still owned my 360. I think I will buy myself one for Christmas and pick up this, Bayonetta, Brutal Legend and Dante's Inferno.

My copy is on its way! I'll post some thoughts when it arrives... eventually. Amazon has a listed ship date for my order of the 14th.

Edit: What with Super Mario Galaxy 2 and a one year old in the house and all, I didn't get a chance to play this much until last night.

I played the first hour and a half or so. I made it most of the way through the first temple area but stopped at the save point right in the middle.

The prologue was very interesting. It's set in a post-apocalyptic 2047 and introduces you to Nier and Yonah, his sick daughter, with little to no context for their situation. It reminded me a bit of Cormac McCarthy's The Road. After a rather long introduction to the combat mechanics and powers, the timeline takes a mind-boggling jump 1,312 years into the future and settles into a fairly standard Zelda sort of setup. The first hour or so of the game proper has been a bit slow, to be honest, but I'm being carried forward by the ideas presented in the prologue, the characters, and the knowledge that there are some really interesting gameplay ideas down the road.

My hope is that the temples become a bit more complex in their design, that combat becomes a bit more varied, and that I get a side-kick or two soon.

Grimoire Noir is a terrible name. I feel bad for the voice actors who had to say it over and over again; it's a real tongue-twister. I can understand why they might not have used Grimoire Schwarz ("schwarz" is German for "black" as "weiss" is German for "white") because of the Schwartz jokes that would inevitably ensue, but why didn't they just go with Grimoire Black? If they needed a foreign word, why not "nero" (Italian)?

A question for those of you who played this: I keep getting killed by the boar in the northern plains. Is this a quest that I should come back to later, or is there a secret to victory that I haven't figured out, yet?

ClockworkHouse wrote:

A question for those of you who played this: I keep getting killed by the boar in the northern plains. Is this a quest that I should come back to later, or is there a secret to victory that I haven't figured out, yet?

It possible to kill the Boar early on (as soon as you get the quest)... but it takes time. If you leave it for later, it would be a lot easier since you have better weapons and stats.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

A question for those of you who played this: I keep getting killed by the boar in the northern plains. Is this a quest that I should come back to later, or is there a secret to victory that I haven't figured out, yet?

You can fudge it by keeping a big rock between boar and yourself (it keeps charging, hitting the rock and stunning itself) then doing hit and run tactics on it but it'll take a while to whittle it down. As Nei says, you'd be as well waiting to do it later since it respawns anyway even if you kill it now.

I killed it as soon as i got the quest. The trick is to roll around him as he's charging up his charge and use the magic lance power on him since it slows down time as well as packing a bigger punch than your normal sword attack. Also I think the boars take more damage from behind.

I really need to get back to this game. I stalled out after going to the third location.

Duoae wrote:

I killed it as soon as i got the quest. The trick is to roll around him as he's charging up his charge and use the magic lance power on him since it slows down time as well as packing a bigger punch than your normal sword attack. Also I think the boars take more damage from behind.

I really need to get back to this game. I stalled out after going to the third location.

I'm right there with you. I think I was distracted by Alan Wake, or something along those lines.

I finished collecting all of the sealed verses last night which, based on a glance at the table of contents in a FAQ, puts me roughly half-way through the game.

I was surprised to realize last night that what was driving me to play this game are two things that I usually don't like in video games: the story, and the boss battles. In a lot of ways, this is a pretty mediocre game. The level designs are uninspired, the normal combat encounters aren't that interesting, and if this were the start of the twentieth century, people would be agitating against the inhumane conditions associated with playing through the sidequests.

However, I'm interested enough in the characters to plow forward. Kainé is my favorite, but I find Nier and Yonah's relationship to be oddly affecting. I stopped doing any of the other sidequests, but I make a point of fetching the things Yonah asks for.

And the boss battles are nicely done. The cross-breeding of an action RPG and bullet-hell SHMUPs seemed like an odd idea at first, but I've really grown to love it. My favorites so far have been the bosses in the junkyard and in the sand temple; unsurprisingly, these are also the most SHMUP-y bosses.

Does the second romp through the temples take about as long as the first?

ClockworkHouse wrote:

And the boss battles are nicely done. The cross-breeding of an action RPG and bullet-hell SHMUPs seemed like an odd idea at first, but I've really grown to love it. My favorites so far have been the bosses in the junkyard and in the sand temple; unsurprisingly, these are also the most SHMUP-y bosses.

Does the second romp through the temples take about as long as the first?

Do you mean on a second playthrough? If so, it skips the first half of the game and starts at the mid-way point (you'll know it if you've hit it).

IF you mean just returning to them later in the game, I think if memory serves there are shortcuts for the most part (like the deactivated lifts in the junkyard are active so you can just jump straight down to the appropriate level). I don't think you ever have to return to the sand temple except for a side quest.

If you are digging the story, I highly recommend a second playthrough by the way. It completely skews the perspective of the second half of the game and some of the boss fights are damned near heartbreaking because of it.

Just beat it with ending A.

This game's greatest downfall are the side quests. They are MMO fodder, really. I wouldn't mind collecting goat hides if they weren't so much harder to find than the Sword of Kings in EarthBound. I recently blogged about how broken fishing and farming are, but I think what killed the completionist in me was having to collect 10 Pink Flower seeds and discovering on a FAQ what was required of me. Man, I got a job. Screw that crap.

As Clockwork says, the dungeons are uninspired, but fortunately they aren't all that long either. They are just long enough, and what really has me coming back is the combat. It's simple, yet incredibly fun. I can't really get into God of War, but I can get into this. I think there's something about charging up Dark Execution for a quick second, letting it impale a few baddies, then whacking at the next guy.

In fact, Dark Execution was the best damn ability if you had the opportunity to pull it off correctly.

I originally wasn't going to go for all the endings, but dammit stevenmack, you've enticed me. Do they all start at the halfway point?

Spoiler:

Also, I imagine by halfway point you mean the "five years later" segment, or after Kaine is unsealed.

I really need to get moving on my pile, but I might make some slow progress toward the other endings just to get some additional story out of it. Speaking of...

[spoiler]It originally made little to no sense, but I think I figured it out. I know some of you guys may be all "duh", but the way the story is told is a tad confusing.

So the very beginning of the game, you're playing a more modern Nier and his daughter Yonah. He's got two of them books. He's fighting off shades. Then it seems like he and his daughter are pretty much dragged to Hell or something. Then you're playing Nier a thousand years later and everything seems fine until halfway, when you see a Shade variant of Nier, and then the ending comes around and says crazy sh*t about shells and originals and crap.

So here's my theory. Nier and Yonah hadn't yet transferred their souls to become shades yet. They were still purely human. However, in order to keep his daughter alive, Nier made a pact with one of the books using its soul-stuff technology to kick ass. During this time, however, Yonah had basically used the book she had to have her soul transcend her body, which brings the "Shadowlord" into play later. Now that he's already given up his soul, we end up playing as Nier and Yonah's replicants who have gained sentience. Shadowlord, his soul still obsessed with saving his daughter, steals his daughter's replicant to inject the soul into. Unfortunately, because the replicant has sentience, Yonah's soul gradually rejects it in the final boss battle of the game.

Weird ass sh*t, but that's the only way it makes any sense to me.[/quote]

I really liked the game, and if it felt Japanese, it was in a good 90's way and not a recent "we just wanna remake Eva over and over" way.

I don't think I can hate Square Enix anymore. They're so big that they can even fund neat games like this, though they'll do sh*t to advertise it.

Oh, Emil's voice actor/actress was annoying as paper cuts to your balls.

I like it. I like it a lot. I highly recommend this game.

I read this thread after a long session tonight and noticed how you guys are saying it's basically split in half.

Should I do all the side quests before I finish finding the sealed versus or can I return to those later?

Glad to see some others really liked this game. I finished it about a month ago, the first ending anyway. I started the second playthrough but I've been distracted by other games. I didn't know there were 4 endings to the game. Are the other 3 endings worth going for?

BNice wrote:

I read this thread after a long session tonight and noticed how you guys are saying it's basically split in half.

Should I do all the side quests before I finish finding the sealed versus or can I return to those later?

The side quests from the first half of the game aren't available once you've hit the middle point. If you can stomach doing them all (by the second half, you'll probably be tired of them) then I'd say collect all the sealed verses and then STOP doing the main quest. You have to talk to Popola or something before you trigger the mid-point.

Mr GT Chris wrote:

Glad to see some others really liked this game. I finished it about a month ago, the first ending anyway. I started the second playthrough but I've been distracted by other games. I didn't know there were 4 endings to the game. Are the other 3 endings worth going for?

It's hard to say, since it's more than just the endings. It is all the details they leak out afterwards that adds depth to the world, and even some of the characters. It also allows things to make a little more sense.

In the end, the "New Game +" that allows for multiple endings is really inventive, and I find myself yearning to play it more despite my pile.

This terrible fishing minigame is tempting me to throw this game away.

Blind_Evil wrote:

This terrible fishing minigame is tempting me to throw this game away.

Go to the other beach.

Clemenstation wrote:
Blind_Evil wrote:

This terrible fishing minigame is tempting me to throw this game away.

Go to the other beach.

Yeah, I skipped over to page 2 and got it done. Thanks!

I never did figure out how to catch fish. There's no achievement for this game I'm dreading more than having to catch one of every fish.

I'm very torn by this game. Good stretches of it are bland, but many of the combat sections are genius, blending genres in meaningful, intuitive ways. The stoytelling also seems very self-aware, almost a parody of RPGs, or games in general in spots. Weiss in particular is a nice tool the developers used to wink and nudge accordingly.

I like it more than I expected, but feel like some of that fat could've been trimmed to the game's benefit.

I picked this up off Goozex recently after seeing some Goodjers playing it on my TA.com feed.

Then conveniently, I sprained my ankle on Saturday, and spent the entirety of the rest of the weekend lying on the couch with my foot up playing it.

Thoroughly enjoying it. It's got some flaws, but it feels really fresh, like a step away from staple-JRPGs. Haven't been bitten by a game this hard in a long time.

Clemenstation wrote:
Blind_Evil wrote:

This terrible fishing minigame is tempting me to throw this game away.

Go to the other beach.

Which other beach? The one in Seafront by the path up to the lighthouse?

Jonman wrote:

I picked this up off Goozex recently after seeing some Goodjers playing it on my TA.com feed.

Then conveniently, I sprained my ankle on Saturday, and spent the entirety of the rest of the weekend lying on the couch with my foot up playing it.

Thoroughly enjoying it. It's got some flaws, but it feels really fresh, like a step away from staple-JRPGs. Haven't been bitten by a game this hard in a long time.

Clemenstation wrote:
Blind_Evil wrote:

This terrible fishing minigame is tempting me to throw this game away.

Go to the other beach.

Which other beach? The one in Seafront by the path up to the lighthouse?

That is the one! (for shaman fish)

It's not often I look back on a game from recent generations with such a feeling of...contentment. The game seriously does have its flaws, but from the opening to the conclusion there was so much heart and creativity to it. I ought to go back and get more endings...

Square's best (publishing) work in quite some time.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

I never did figure out how to catch fish. There's no achievement for this game I'm dreading more than having to catch one of every fish.

Every fish / piece of junk has a unique series of tugs on your line. For example, sharks = 2 small tugs, 1 big pull, whereas rusty bucket = 1 big pull. I'm making those up, as I really can't recall specifics, but you get what I mean. All you need to know is that you have to pull back (down) on the stick when the big tug comes along (visibly apparent). Once you have the fish on the line, just hold the stick in the opposite direction the fish is swimming in. You don't even really have to watch the screen -- just move the stick until you get the rumble feedback in your controller. If the fish moves, just move the stick until the rumble comes back.

The more of those fishing missions you do, the bigger and better fish you can reasonably catch. You know that review where the dude freaked out over the fishing mission, fishing in the wrong spot? Yeah, he was trying to catch a shark, which is like a level 6 or 7 fish. No wonder it took half an hour.

I really should go back and finish this. I got stuck in trying to get words or phrases or something, and never picked it up.

There are quite a few sidequests that resolve with interesting implications for the world, or Nier's past. One in particular sends you back to the ruined building you start the game in (Yonah's cookie spot), which I thought was cool. Not all of them are WoW-style fetch quests (although there are plenty of those, too).

One sidequest series you should absolutely do in part 1 is the farming / planting. I think it starts with you getting seeds for someone in the village. Anyway, this opens up more planting spots near your house, which is useful if you're doing the wheat/rice thing for money or flower-farming for the achievement later.

Edit: I'm pretty sure if you missed this quest, you can get the extra planting plots in part 2 anyway, by purchasing a book or something from the same village lady who gives you the seed retrieval mission.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

I never did figure out how to catch fish. There's no achievement for this game I'm dreading more than having to catch one of every fish.

It is worth stressing that the fishing in this game is a bit... crap, and it doesn't do enough to guide you as to where and how. This would be less of a problem were it not essential for story progression at one point.

Heaven help you if you're suckered enough into achievement/trophy land to try and do something like catch them all. Heck...

Spoiler:

... it wouldn't surprise me if there was an achievement for deleting your completed save data at the end of the game.

Happy to see this thread get bumped, though. Nier really has been an unexpected standout for this console cycle and, if nothing else, there's always that soundtrack to lose yourself in during the moments of down time.

Pretendbeard wrote:

Heaven help you if you're suckered enough into achievement/trophy land to try and do something like catch them all. Heck...

Spoiler:

... it wouldn't surprise me if there was an achievement for deleting your completed save data at the end of the game.

There's an achievement for seeing each ending and the only way to get ending D is to do the above...so technically there *IS*

Also you're right...the fishing is totally carp.

I see what you did there, steven.

Re: fishing: It's actually really easy (shhh! don't tell anyone!). Well, if you do some experimenting. The way the game explains it makes it damn near impossible. As with many things in this game, the mechanics are designed well but poorly or improperly explained.

Minarchist's Guide to NIER Fishing:

  • Only use the LS. Never, ever hit the A button (why do they tell you to do that? I have no idea). If you just hit down on the LS when you see the rod bend, you'll hook the fish. The only button that should ever be pressed is B, to cast.
  • For the majority of the game, pay no attention to where the fish is. Only watch where Nier is, and move your stick accordingly.
  • The directions other than straight down are not left and right, as explained in the game. They are left-down and right-down (which makes logical sense).
  • The health bar is king. Watch it, learn it, love it. You'll notice that when you're pointing the stick correctly, it turns darker and goes down, but when you're off it's bright yellow and doesn't move. This is the only time you can actually lose the fish (unless you've pressed A...). What is never explained, though, is that there are variations within that. For battles that last more than 1-2 seconds, you'll notice slight adjustments can make the health bar decrease more quickly or slowly. There's actually a sweet spot within each direction that drains the fish's health faster. Experiment with it early on, because it becomes important later.
  • If you catch something early on that seems like you can't budge the health bar, or it's really slow, just let it go. It will only end in heartache.
  • Move your camera a bit to the side when you cast, so you can more easily see the pixel-thin rod. Remember to move it back behind you, though, when you actually fight the fish (assuming it'll be big enough to warrant it).
  • You're looking for the big dip, not the little ones. As Clem says, each fish has a specific pattern, so once you catch one you'll know what to look for. Or, just look at this totally awesome guide (note: I do not vouch for the accuracy of this information, I only know that it exists).
  • For the really big suckers, the ones in the desert, you have to be more on your game. Still watch where Nier is, but also watch the fish's movement. For one, you have to be prepared because they dart around a lot, but two the sweet spot (and even the general damage spot) is really small and constantly moves. Honestly, I probably watched the health bar more than anything else when I was reeling these guys in. Keep it moving! And you should have no problem. If you feel really lucky, hit A when they're down to less than 10% health. (I never did this, and they never took my bait, but it is an option.)