Dungeon Siege 3... from Obsidian?

stevenmack wrote:

And to be honest I'm curious to see whether Obsidian can take an action-RPG story into more interesting places than usual (if anyone can do it it would be them). Should unlock tomorrow at some point in the UK, so we shall see...

Obsidian are known for their writing, and I don't think the demo really showed that off.

Scratched wrote:
stevenmack wrote:

And to be honest I'm curious to see whether Obsidian can take an action-RPG story into more interesting places than usual (if anyone can do it it would be them). Should unlock tomorrow at some point in the UK, so we shall see...

Obsidian are known for their writing, and I don't think the demo really showed that off.

I'd read in a couple of places that the story was supposed to be really good - but you're right, there was nothing in the demo that gave that impression. I'm willing to give Obsidian a chance to twist things up a bit story-wise though, that always seems to be where they shine.

stevenmack wrote:

I'm willing to give Obsidian a chance to twist things up a bit story-wise though, that always seems to be where they shine.

That's the same story with all their games. I just wish they'd collaborate with some other studios who are strong on making a quality game but weak on writing.

It got a pretty good review in Game Informer, if that's any comfort.

Scratched wrote:
stevenmack wrote:

I'm willing to give Obsidian a chance to twist things up a bit story-wise though, that always seems to be where they shine.

That's the same story with all their games. I just wish they'd collaborate with some other studios who are strong on making a quality game but weak on writing.

I suspect this is why the Bioware + Black Isle games were so good.

Oh yeah, I went there.

A modern Bioware + Obsidian would mean dealing with EA, and I'm not sure if EA would be a good thing for them, or any better than Sega was for Alpha Protocol or Lucas for KOTOR2. In fact, the GPG/Square partnership for DS3 seems to have been the best result for them, and then Bethesda/New Vegas (eventually).

Oh, I definitely agree with you Scratched. Where Bioware is now, especially with the success they've had, I doubt they'd be interested in partnering with Obsidian again like in the old days. I still wish they would; those were the best games to come from either dev house.

I preordered Dungeon Siege 3 a while ago, I knew I'd eventually want it anyway with Obsidian's writing and such, and liked the preorder bonus of getting DS1 & 2 (primarily for 2) in digital format so I don't need to use the discs. I'm still keeping the discs just in case, but I prefer digital distro for convenience.

Farscry wrote:

Oh, I definitely agree with you Scratched. Where Bioware is now, especially with the success they've had, I doubt they'd be interested in partnering with Obsidian again like in the old days. I still wish they would; those were the best games to come from either dev house.

I preordered Dungeon Siege 3 a while ago, I knew I'd eventually want it anyway with Obsidian's writing and such, and liked the preorder bonus of getting DS1 & 2 (primarily for 2) in digital format so I don't need to use the discs. I'm still keeping the discs just in case, but I prefer digital distro for convenience. ;)

I wish DS1 & 2 weren't available only as preorder bonuses. I wouldn't mind having digital copies as well.

stauf7 wrote:

I wish DS1 & 2 weren't available only as preorder bonuses. I wouldn't mind having digital copies as well.

If it's like Mafia they'll turn up at some point. However there may be licensing problems as those were published by MS initially, I'm not sure if there's some new deal for Square Eidos.

Scratched wrote:
stauf7 wrote:

I wish DS1 & 2 weren't available only as preorder bonuses. I wouldn't mind having digital copies as well.

If it's like Mafia they'll turn up at some point. However there may be licensing problems as those were published by MS initially, I'm not sure if there's some new deal for Square Eidos.

I just booted up the free version of DS1 you get for preordering and there's no mention of Microsoft anywhere, its Square all over the place. Also the multiplayer has been disabled so it's the single player campaign only (If memory serves that was originally going through whatever system MS was using before they abandoned the PC for the Xbox).

Eurogamer reviews Dungeon Siege III.

Verdict: Not Awful!

In fact, they seem to rather like it.

Yay!

Just played a little so far - mostly the area covered by the demo plus an extra side quest that wasn't available previously.

It's growing on me I think. The interface is still terrible and the loot is a bit meh, but it's remarkably polished for an Obsidian game and the combat seems to be flowing better for me second time through this as well. Good music too.

If you go into it thinking of this as a spiritual successor to the likes of Baldurs Gate : Dark Alliance or Marvel : UA, i don't think you'll be too disappointed.
(In fact, they should totally get Obsidian to make another Marvel Ultimate Alliance game - this engine looks like it would be a good fit).

Does the (PS3) demo have local multiplayer?

I'm only considering this game because my wife and I loved Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance back in the day, and we're looking to recapture some of that.

stevenmack wrote:

but it's remarkably polished for an Obsidian game

One thing that indicates to me is that non-Japanese Square Enix games are pretty good and given the support they need to be good. It's nice to see an Obsidian game where they weren't given a poor foundation or rushed to make their game.

AndrewA wrote:

Does the (PS3) demo have local multiplayer?

I'm only considering this game because my wife and I loved Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance back in the day, and we're looking to recapture some of that.

Pretty sure all versions have couch co-op, but you might want to check that they aren't doing some weird "only the main player gets XP" thing first...I have it in the back of my mind something like that was mentioned in the past but I could be getting mixed up with some other game.

stevenmack wrote:

but you might want to check that they aren't doing some weird "only the main player gets XP" thing first...I have it in the back of my mind something like that was mentioned in the past but I could be getting mixed up with some other game.

I think if you're playing online, the character progress for all characters is saved on the host's machine, so if you want to continue that character you've got to continue with the same players.

polq37 wrote:

Eurogamer reviews Dungeon Siege III.

Verdict: Not Awful!

In fact, they seem to rather like it.

Yay!

Yeah, noticed that. Might pick this up later when it's at decent price, and on the 360 rather than the PC for ease of the control scheme.

davet010 wrote:
polq37 wrote:

Eurogamer reviews Dungeon Siege III.

Verdict: Not Awful!

In fact, they seem to rather like it.

Yay!

Yeah, noticed that. Might pick this up later when it's at decent price, and on the 360 rather than the PC for ease of the control scheme.

360 pad works fine on the PC as well (it's how I'm playing it)

also I notice that they've now added a Deluxe Edition to steam which is basically the pre-order package (DS3 plus single player versions of DS1 and 2).
Looks like the only way you can grab the earlier games on steam at the moment.

Ah, now that is a good thought, Steven....

One thing I'm quite suprised about is the number of choices you get to make - for example the demo ends with a request to clear a haunted manor.. (formerly owned by the legion you belong to) of it's current occupants for a witch so she can explore it's secrets. Once it's cleared you can choose to a) hand it over , b) hand it over with the caveat that the legion will be back to reclaim it once the current crisis is over or c) refuse. Not sure if these choices lead to significant differences down the road but it's more than you would normally expect from an action RPG.

There's also an influence system with the NPC's that follow you which increases if you make suitable choices in dialogue, etc (and there's a LOT of dialogue) - not sure what that affects at the moment either.

**

Also the more I play the more I like it - the combat feels really good once you unlock more abilities and it does a good job of forcing you to mix it up a bit and switching between stances, instead of just spamming the attack button all the time.

And the story is pretty good. Nothing very original so far but it's got it's hooks into me, and I like how they've fleshed out the back story to the Legion and 'The Farmer' - something that was always very basic in the first game if memory serves.

I just wish they'd stop saying Jayne Kassyndrrrrrrrrr every three seconds

* * * * * * * *

aaaaaand finished

Got to admit - I really enjoyed that despite the initial impressions I got from the demo.

Random thoughts...

Obsidian outdid themselves with the game engine, It's one HELL of a polished game. From starting up on desktop to actually being in the game is a matter of seconds. No long load times (at startup AND throughout the game), no screens and screens of logos to click through and it's the first game I've played on my PC in a while that drops cleanly back out to windows just as quickly. Quite remarkable. Framerate is pretty damned good throughout as well, even when there's TONS of stuff exploding on screen at once

It maybe sacrifices on graphics quality a little to achieve this (especially the character art) but you're playing most of it from a distance overhead so you don't really notice most of the time.

It's also REMARKABLY glitch free. I saw no texture pop-in, nobody got stuck on geometry or running into walls all the time, plus the AI characters are superb at reviving you if you get ko'd. I think at worst I saw a couple of enemies spawn in from nowhere in a couple of places, but other than that I can hardly believe this was an Obsidian game

Story wise it's extremely solid - though not exactly original it's VERY well told with a lot of sympathetic characters and some suprisingly tough choices to make. A couple stopped me in my tracks for a good few minutes trying to decide what to do. It was certainly interesting enough to make me run through it in more or less one marthon session anyway

I played as the Archon and there was a lot of very specific dialoge aimed at her throughout - will be interesting to play through again with a different class to see how certain scenes play out.

Best of all, the game ends with the typical Obsidian "Fallout style" ending where it looks back on your decisions throughout the game and how it affects the various groups and towns you encounter, which is VERY welcome indeed.

They end the story properly as well, by actually FINISHING the story being told. Story threads get resolved properly and cleanly but leaving just a handful open to give them interesting places to take the story forward in any DLC / sequels.

For the record I think I was around 13 hours when I finished, with all side quests. Felt like the perfect length as well - didn't outstay it's welcome.

Unfortunately the Steam achievements seem to be broke for some reason maybe they don't activate until the game's out in the US as well or something. Oh well, I'll probably play through it again at some point anyway with a different character choice.

In the end, I'm glad I took a gamble on it.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/20...

PC control fixes are coming

Eurogamer: You weren't worried about a backlash from the series' core PC fanbase?

Nathaniel Chapman: Honestly, we were less worried about that aspect of it. Actually this is one thing I would have liked to have spent more time on, and we are actually spending time on now. Basically, I think as long as PC gamers have a good way to control the combat they will enjoy it. One review - I can't remember which - said if you play with a game pad the combat is great, so right now we're working on improving the PC controls through an update.

I think if there are PC gamers who are having a negative reaction it's less about what the combat is, it's more how the combat controls.

I kind of get it that some might be irked with the control scheme, but it's actually fine (mouse and keyboard). It just takes some time getting used to, but it works and I'm not doing unnecessary commands to get stuff done. If anything, I'd make the mouse movement "click-to-go" instead of "click-and-hold".

But I totally get how a gamepad would make for a better experience. So much, that I'm finally getting one. Work has been hell lately, and I really need to start using an interface different from a mouse and keyboard. 12 hours/day is way too much for my wrists.

In a personal way, I'm glad DS3 encourages gamepad.

I agree with the other comments throughout the thread: this isn't Dungeon Siege III, this is BG: Dark Alliance III. Fortunately, I'm actually happier with that.

The more important question is, is it a good version of BG:DA III?

I'm all on board if it's a DA clone, but reviews so far have been middling.

Is it because it doesn't follow the previous Dungeon Siege formula (never played the series) or because it's a average hack & slash loot grinder?

Hearing that the online co-op is Fable 2 style, where you play as more a henchman unless you're the host as opposed to your own character. If so, that dissuades me from buying it ever, rather than waiting a few months.

I might take a look if it shows up in the Redbox.

Aaron D. wrote:

The more important question is, is it a good version of BG:DA III?

I'm all on board if it's a DA clone, but reviews so far have been middling.

Is it because it doesn't follow the previous Dungeon Siege formula (never played the series) or because it's a average hack & slash loot grinder?

Never played BG:DA, but played the previous DS's. It doesn't follow the formula, save for how you explore the world and how it is constructed. That doesn't bother me, since I found the previous DS games leaning a bit much on the auto-pilot for my taste. As far as an hack n' slash game, it's pretty sweet. Best to check the demo.

Blind_Evil wrote:

Hearing that the online co-op is Fable 2 style, where you play as more a henchman unless you're the host as opposed to your own character. If so, that dissuades me from buying it ever, rather than waiting a few months.

I might take a look if it shows up in the Redbox.

Coop is like Fable 2, unfortunately.

Strictly as single player, so far it's very promising as a BG:DA3, but I'm not far enough in to render any kind of real opinion on it.

I really like Marvel: Ultimate Alliance / BG:DA, but I miss the Dungeon Siege 1&2 gameplay. I liked the autopilot. I liked vaguely controlling a party of semi-autonomous little robots.

This whole thing makes me wonder about lost gameplay styles. Most everybody agrees that Dungeon Keeper 2 was a great game, but no first-rate successor has ever been made. Almost nobody is seriously working in that style. Battlezone 1&2 featured really interesting first person RTS mechanics. There was a small wave of similar games around the time they came out, but again, no one seems to be developing games using those ideas anymore.

Just finished full coop run. 11 hours total.

The Good:
+ Obsidians engine is very solid, looks good and runs flawlessly.
+ Game seems very polished, we encountered almost no jank or bugs of any kind, nice to see that Obsidian can in fact ship a finished product.
+ Combat is fun, has a nice feel to it.
+ Story is pretty good for this type of game and there are quite a few choices to make that can affect it.
+ When in coop if you go into your menu the AI takes over your character and will auto follow and fight for the other playwe until you're done. No sitting around waiting for someone to check out their new stuff.

The Bad:
- Not enough useful abilities, by the end I was only using 3 of the 9 abilities I had, the others didn't really serve any purpose. This was also true of my coop partner.
- In some of the more cramped areas the camera could be annoying. Also having both characters locked to the same camera made some fights more annoying then they needed to be with ranged enemies outside of your camera range.
- Scads and scads of useless loot. We were playing the same 2 characters the whole time yet we got countless epic items from bosses for characters that weren't even in our game. Since there is no persistence to the multiplayer like say Diablo, these items didn't even have value as trade or alt fodder.

All in all I enjoyed it. Felt basically like Baldur's Gate Dark Alliance 3, which given that it's the same team that made BGDA2 is expected. As long as you know what you're getting into in terms of the multiplayer, this is a solid purchase. Seems like it has decent replay value as well with the 4 characters being quite different and the various branching choices you can make in the story.

Who did you and your partner play as?