Darksiders Catch-all

SpacePPoliceman wrote:

I tried the demo, and I think these types of games just aren't for me. I find the "There's Always Another Absurdly Locked Door" mechanic very grueling, and coming off the God of War demo was like leaping from a Ferrari to land at the lever of a Handcar. Maybe I'll revisit it in the coming months, and see it in a better light, but I did a lot of audible groaning during the demo.

Well, after playing through 2/3 of the game and enjoying some of it, I have to say that in the end I just don't like these types of games. At least, not enough to finish them. I, personally, didn't find enough to keep me interested until the end, though I did end up watching the ending cinematic on youtube because I was mildly interested in that. Anyway, take that for what you will, but I won't be jumping into a Zelda-like game anytime soon. Unless it's a top down 2d version.

BishopRS wrote:

I tried the God of War 3 demo and just wasn't into it. Afterwards I played through the Darksiders demo then went out and bought it.

Yeah, I recently checked out that GoW3 demo (having no prior experience with the series) and it just didn't do anything for me. The combat seemed a little more fluid, but something about Darksiders strikes just the right tone for me.

Yeah. Somehow that didn't make GoW3 any more enjoyable for me *shrug*

AcidCat wrote:

Yeah, I recently checked out that GoW3 demo (having no prior experience with the series) and it just didn't do anything for me. The combat seemed a little more fluid.

Playing them both on back to back nights, I can say GoW3 combat is a sh*tload more fluid.

garion333 wrote:

Well, after playing through 2/3 of the game and enjoying some of it, I have to say that in the end I just don't like these types of games. At least, not enough to finish them. I, personally, didn't find enough to keep me interested until the end, though I did end up watching the ending cinematic on youtube because I was mildly interested in that. Anyway, take that for what you will, but I won't be jumping into a Zelda-like game anytime soon. Unless it's a top down 2d version. ;)

I found that happening to me back when I had a roommate with a Gamecube. Any time I tried one of the updated foundational Nintendo games--a Mario, a Zelda, or a Metroid--I give up after a few hours because I just didn't care anymore, there was nothing for me to hang onto.

THQ announces Darksiders for PC

Just got wind of this. Does anyone want to give this a go on PC? I was looking to get this for cheap on the 360 later on, but a PC version intrigues me.

This increases the chance that I'll get finish to the game. Though I don't know if I'm willing to replay half of the game again.

hmm....if I hadn't already played through the 360 version twice i'd probably give it a look, but I don't think I could stomach another run through it, as much as I liked it.

Unless....

Will it have achievements I wonder?...

So before I send this game back to my rental service in disgust, I need to ask for some advice about it because given its reviews and community opinion, I must be missing something to think it sucks this bad.

Things started out fairly well for me but as I got to the end of the first big dungeon...

Spoiler:

The one where you have to get the three swords.

...I started getting really frustrated. Between the camera which always insists on zooming in to far and which never lets you see what you need to, the lousy combo system that doesn't let you break out of combos once they've started but still leaves you vulnerable, the inability to dodge easily, a block button that might as well not exist for all the good it does and the arbitrary attacks from certain enemies and bosses, I don't get where the appeal is here. Currently, I'm on one of the first major bosses...

Spoiler:

Tiamat

I've tried at least a dozen times to win this fight and I keep dying, largely because of ground attacks I can't see coming because the damn camera won't keep the boss on screen. You also can't seem to damage it in its second form without getting up close but doing that also makes it start an attack that takes a lot of health and which you simply cannot dodge. I've gone so far as to check GameFAQs which says I should use Wrath attacks when it's down, except I don't have any wrath, it doesn't refill at the start of the fight and there's no way to recharge it during the fight. So essentially, if you don't have any Wrath when you start, you don't ever get to use it. I also don't have any healing items because I had to use my last one in another aggravating fight and it doesn't give you the opportunity to purchase more before having to fight the boss.

There must be something I'm missing or doing wrong here because I can't believe this game would be so well thought of if it was as broken and poorly designed as this sequence indicates. I'm really trying to give it the benefit of the doubt because it almost never happens that I find a game mechanically flawed that so many others enjoy. Is there some very obvious strategy I'm missing or something I should have done before that would make this easier? Yahtzee's review of this game also said that the "first major boss is by far the hardest in the game." Can anyone who has finished this agree that this is that boss?

EDIT: Finally beat this boss by using a strategy that was probably not intended. If any of the next bosses are this arbitrary, I think that's when I'll drop this game.

Tiamat was annoying as hell, yes.

Parallax Abstraction wrote:

Stuff I told ya.

Told ya!

I as well am coming off of playing God of War and this game's combat just frustrate's the hell out of me. It's not that it's too difficult, it's that there's a delay to the movements and the combos are extremely boring and repetitive. I get what they are trying to do, but damn I wish they did it a lot better.

garion333 wrote:

Tiamat was annoying as hell, yes.

I loved Darksiders, but the tiamat fight was the low point of the entire game. I thought the game and the bosses were much improved from that point on

OK, that's what I was looking for. Despite Tiamat not being the first boss, I think that must be what Yahtzee was referring to in his review because the other "bosses" before her were incredibly easy. That's why I want to give it the benefit of the doubt and keep going. I can forgive one poorly designed boss encounter, especially from a rookie team. But yeah, the next boss that's this tough and that's it. I see greatness is in here, it's just covered by some jank you have to dig through first.

Kerplunk wrote:

THQ announces Darksiders for PC

Just got wind of this. Does anyone want to give this a go on PC? I was looking to get this for cheap on the 360 later on, but a PC version intrigues me.

I can get behind this on PC. Now I just need to hope for a port of Bayonetta.

Quick question. PS3 or 360?

Obviously 360 - (achievements!).

SallyNasty wrote:

Obviously 360 - (achievements!).

Well, the PS3 does have trophies, but I know, they're don't really count.

They patched out the screen tearing in the 360 version, yes? (Appears so.) That was the only real appreciable difference I recall between the games since there's no mp.

Just finished this one.

Overall I think it was a very good game. The combat mechanics in general were mediocre, as were the boss fights; my policy was to consult a walkthrough prior to each boss fight, which allowed me to beat them all with very little difficulty (even Tiamat). I thought the puzzling was very well done if a little arbitrary in spots. I found the game mechanic thievery to be rather adorable, especially:

Spoiler:

The portal gun.

The protagonist is a goofy non-character, which is par for the course, and the storyline is a little on the dumb and clunky side, but I do find the storyworld intriguing and I was always interested in how the plot would unfold. I'd definitely be up for a sequel.

$20 in GameStop credit was burning a hole in my pocket, so despite having plenty of games on my pile, I bought a copy of this game.

I'm playing through the Twilight Cathedral now, and that area is the first that merits the constant comparisons this game gets to the Zelda series. Up until now, there haven't been any of the out-sized boss fights and environmental puzzles that I associate with Zelda. I'm enjoying this so far, but I disagree with those who say that this is a better Zelda game than the last Zelda game. It takes that series' formula and moves it in a direction I'm not fond of: placing a greater emphasis on combat and finicky controls, and adding the now ubiquitous RPG leveling mechanic. I'm reminded of that trend of rewriting children's stories to make them darker so that, for example, Snow White is a vampire and Alice is insane; it doesn't take a lot of imagination to take someone else's work and dump a few buckets of blood on it. It will please a certain type of hardcore gamer who can't see the forest for the cel-shaded trees, but it does nothing for me.

I'll go against the prevailing opinion here and say that I actually liked the flying sequence leading up to the Twilight Cathedral. Perhaps it's because I've been jonesing for the new Sin and Punishment, but I thought that sequence was fun and wouldn't have minded that it be longer or harder, or at least I wouldn't mind if there were another couple down the line.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

I'm reminded of that trend of rewriting children's stories to make them darker so that, for example Snow White is a vampire and Alice is insane; it doesn't take a lot of imagination to take someone else's work and dump a few buckets of blood on it. It will please a certain type of hardcore gamer who can't see the forest for the cel-shaded trees, but it does nothing for me.

Just as long as you're aware that they were originally dark (in a different way) and then made all cutesy-wootsey before they've been re-made as dark. Seems there's a bit of a cycle going on....

ClockworkHouse wrote:

I'm playing through the Twilight Cathedral now, and that area is the first that merits the constant comparisons this game gets to the Zelda series. Up until now, there haven't been any of the out-sized boss fights and environmental puzzles that I associate with Zelda. I'm enjoying this so far, but I disagree with those who say that this is a better Zelda game than the last Zelda game. It takes that series' formula and moves it in a direction I'm not fond of: placing a greater emphasis on combat and finicky controls, and adding the now ubiquitous RPG leveling mechanic. I'm reminded of that trend of rewriting children's stories to make them darker so that, for example, Snow White is a vampire and Alice is insane; it doesn't take a lot of imagination to take someone else's work and dump a few buckets of blood on it. It will please a certain type of hardcore gamer who can't see the forest for the cel-shaded trees, but it does nothing for me.

I feel like what they may have lacked in imagination they made up for in proficiency. If making Zelda-esque games were easy, you'd see way more studios doing them. Being that this was also Vigil's first game makes it all the more impressive. And really, you're in the first dungeon. You may change your opinion about their design chops after the last one, as it is a doozy. If you're bothered by them taking "inspiration" from established games, though, I can say it only becomes more obvious as you move along. I don't see anything wrong with it, personally. If I were able to make whatever video game I liked you can bet you'd see a lot of Dragon Age in the design choices. But with more agency in the combat, like Mount and Blade. Hmm. Tangent.

I don't remember the controls being finicky at all, but I play a LOT of third person action games.

Regarding the comparison to Twilight Princess, I can say for certain Darksiders was more memorable. Maybe not better. Twilight Princess was too friggin' long to remember 75% of what happened.

Duoae wrote:

Just as long as you're aware that they were originally dark (in a different way) and then made all cutesy-wootsey before they've been re-made as dark. Seems there's a bit of a cycle going on....

I'll grant you that for Snow White and other fairy tales. I won't grant you that for Alice in Wonderland, Winnie the Pooh, Super Mario Bros., or any of the other "adult" versions of modern children's stories that regularly turn up in the post-a-picture thread.

Blind_Evil wrote:

I feel like what they may have lacked in imagination they made up for in proficiency. If making Zelda-esque games were easy, you'd see way more studios doing them. Being that this was also Vigil's first game makes it all the more impressive. And really, you're in the first dungeon. You may change your opinion about their design chops after the last one, as it is a doozy. If you're bothered by them taking "inspiration" from established games, though, I can say it only becomes more obvious as you move along. I don't see anything wrong with it, personally.

I don't think that they did a poor job in designing the game. On the contrary, I think this game shows that Vigil is an up-and-coming studio to keep an eye on. I'm impressed by their willingness to synthesize their influences into something new rather than being content to merely recreate them. It takes courage to attempt to combine God of War, The Legend of Zelda, Sin and Punishment, and Portal into a single, cohesive whole, and Vigil has successfully done just that. It reminds me of Nier in the way it doesn't back down from testing gaming's rigid definitions of genre. I'd like to see a new idea or two in there somewhere, as I did with Nier's melding of the third-person action game and bullet hell shooters, and I may yet, but I want to be clear that I think Darksiders is a solid game.

What I was responding to specifically is the idea raised on these boards and elsewhere on the internet that Darksiders is a "better" Zelda game because it's injected that formula with in vogue hardcore gaming elements like combo-based combat, upgrade and weapon shops, and gallons of blood and guts. I acknowledge that these things are appealing for some people, but they don't do anything at all for me personally. I drew a parallel to the trend of darkening childhood stories because there seems to be a similar reaction to those things: isn't it awesome how Alice is running around with a cleaver, and the Cheshire Cat is this mangy thing with a thirst for blood? No. I don't think that's cool; it's not my thing. Likewise, I'd rather have Link opening a door with a key than War stabbing something in the eye with a blade to reach the same ends.

The lack of gamepad support in the PC version killed me at first. The game is really starting slow for me.

Spoiler:

I want the portal-esque gun, but if I remember correctly from podcasts, you don't get it until the very end.

SuperDave wrote:

The lack of gamepad support in the PC version killed me at first. The game is really starting slow for me.

Spoiler:

I want the portal-esque gun, but if I remember correctly from podcasts, you don't get it until the very end.

That's the item from the last dungeon, and it's limited as far as where you can shoot it. Like certain spots in Portal.

Duoae wrote:
ClockworkHouse wrote:

I'm reminded of that trend of rewriting children's stories to make them darker so that, for example Snow White is a vampire and Alice is insane; it doesn't take a lot of imagination to take someone else's work and dump a few buckets of blood on it. It will please a certain type of hardcore gamer who can't see the forest for the cel-shaded trees, but it does nothing for me.

Just as long as you're aware that they were originally dark (in a different way) and then made all cutesy-wootsey before they've been re-made as dark. Seems there's a bit of a cycle going on....

Yeah look up the story of the Tin Man from the Wizard of Oz.

Ok here I did it for you.

ClockworkHouse wrote:

What I was responding to specifically is the idea raised on these boards and elsewhere on the internet that Darksiders is a "better" Zelda game because it's injected that formula with in vogue hardcore gaming elements like combo-based combat, upgrade and weapon shops, and gallons of blood and guts. I acknowledge that these things are appealing for some people, but they don't do anything at all for me personally.

I'm late to the party with Darksiders too, as I picked it up during the GameFly $14 sale. I've been plowing through it over the past week and at 20+ hours, I'm finally reaching the end game.

As someone who has played every Zelda title (sans the DS titles), I can confidently say that it's the best "3D Zelda" that I've ever played. Darksiders doesn't beat the nostalgia and charm of the SNES classic, Link to the Past, but I think it's easily more satisfying than Ocarina of Time, Wind Waker and Twilight Princess.

OoT can be an unfair comparison because the tech and mechanics are a bit antiquated all these years later, but I do think Darksiders out-Zelda'ed Zelda in comparison to its 3D contemporaries Wind Waker and Twilight Princess.

While I do think it's a tad insulting to insinuate that the main draw in comparisons between the two is blood lust (it's not for me), I do think that fleshed-out mechanics like weapon upgrades and combo-combat do speak to genuine evolutionary design aesthetics that have left the Zelda series far behind. When you add to that production standards like voice acting and smart cinematography, it's hard for me personally to make an argument for Zelda being as relevant in comparison.

The current mainline Zelda series just feels incredibly static to me because it has failed to evolve enough to keep me invested. It's not that Darksiders is "teh maturz" with it's blood and guts, it's that the core gameplay and design mechanics reflect more complex and evolved systems that appear to be void in modern Zelda games.

On the flip side, Darksiders certainly did ape a lot of games. Zelda, God of War and Portal being just a few. Personally I think the game feels more like Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver than anything else. Regardless, I'm mystified that Vigil Games was able to produce at this level their first time out. Nothing personal against Zelda, but I know that I'm way more excited about Darksiders 2 than Skyward Sword.

Aaron D. wrote:

Nothing personal against Zelda, but I know that I'm way more excited about Darksiders 2 than Skyward Sword.

I'm concerned about how long it'll be until we see Darksiders again. I'm not sure how big a studio Vigil is, but they're working on the Warhammer 40k MMO IIRC. MMOs are time-consuming stuff.

But yeah, the ending made me want a sequel really, really badly.

SuperDave wrote:

The lack of gamepad support in the PC version killed me at first. The game is really starting slow for me.

Spoiler:

I want the portal-esque gun, but if I remember correctly from podcasts, you don't get it until the very end.

I'm glad I passed on the higher Rez PC version then and got it for cheap on the 360. Nothing annoys me more than console ports without gamepad support ( hi Bioshock 2)

I had no idea what the game was about going in, but I was pleasantly surprised as I got through it. Zero expectations to crush perhaps, but I found it to be entertaining enough to draw me to the very end.

Spoiler:

The only downer to the game that I found was the lack of replayability; fine for a single player story usually, but they added all these little touches where you're supposed to want to go back and 'find stuff' in levels you've already passed - except that in order to be able to get them you needed to be at the very end of the game (ie, using the portal gun). It annoyed me that I had an un-upgradeable sword at that point, so I couldn't use the legendary artifacts :(

Overall the experience was rather enjoyable. It really made me feel like I was a total badass walking around whomping on everything in sight.

I'm enjoying the game way more now that I've cleared the first dungeon. The PC controls are still a bit iffy, but I'm getting used to them.

Arthur Gies's comments about the combat are very accurate in my opinion. The weapons don't chain well at all, to the point where switching weapons I've found, resets your combo multiplyer. It doesn't do crowd control nearly as well as other games too. I found the location where you get the last crystal sword before the first dungeon boss, was a chore because I was getting blindsided by unseen enemies and I would continually miss ones with a non-lock on charge attack.

The game is still worth playing IMO, though you just need to give it an hour or so.

There's no gamepad support? That's crazy. Also it says controller enabled on Steam. What a bunch of liars.