Malazan Book of The Fallen

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I did a resurrection here... but it didn't show up so I just started this thread.

Certis wrote:

Bantam (the UK/Canadian publisher) has released book seven in the Malazan Book Of The Fallen series. It's just as big and meaty as the previous books, I'm really looking forward to digging into it since I only just read Book 6 like seven months ago.

There's an interesting note inside, Ian C. Esslemont will be releasing Night of Knives, a book that takes place within the Malazan universe, but isn't written by Erikson himself. It comes out around July 22nd apparently.

In the tease it says: "Marks the first installment of the shared world that we had both envisioned" - Steven Erikson

Here's hoping it doesn't suck, I do like the world he's built so I don't mind another author dipping in.

Blotto The Clown wrote:

resurrection! (I searched 'Malazan Book of The Fallen' so if there is a more applicable thread I wasn't sure what to go after.)

Currently reading the most recent installment 'Dust of Dreams' and loving it. I really appreciate how he keeps up his pace of writing and still maintains quality. Something I found out about the series is that Steven Erikson based the world off a RP campaign he ran with his co-author Ian C. Esslemont (co-consultant?). Anyway, I would love to try this campaign setting.

A final tidbit of information about the author is that Steven Erikson is not his real name. rather Steve Rune Lundin started out his writing career on a different subject (archeology I think) and had lackluster success and moved over to his current fantasy series and his new name.

Esslemont is an English professor, if I understand it correctly, and he's dived into writing with a few spin-off books. Apparently he was more comfortable with plotting and the like. The world is really a remarkable setting, no matter what one thinks about the style of the books.

I love the books, even when I find them a bit too heavy on the bloat and light on the details. I ALMOST bought a tenth anniversary hardcover of Gardens of the Moon but I managed to resist ... for now.

well if you want diversity to your collector habits, there is the UK version of the books. Their covers are much less serious. If you are looking for hard cover collector items, there is also the short story series by Erikson set in the same universe that run a pretty penny each. If the form factor isn't an issue there is a single volume release of all of them.

If (like me) the optimistic pessimism of the bridge burners is your forte then The Black Company by Glen Cook might float your boat. Glen Cook's series is what Erikson drew a lot of inspiration from.

I bought Gardens but put it down. It's a very fresh new fantasy world (new to me), but boy, is it a ponderous read.

Fedaykin98 wrote:

I bought Gardens but put it down. It's a very fresh new fantasy world (new to me), but boy, is it a ponderous read.

It does get much better with the second, and subsequent books, as Erikson grows into his writing style.

Tanglebones wrote:
Fedaykin98 wrote:

I bought Gardens but put it down. It's a very fresh new fantasy world (new to me), but boy, is it a ponderous read.

It does get much better with the second, and subsequent books, as Erikson grows into his writing style.

And as you grow into his writing style and understanding of the world.

When I started reading Erikson last year it was a breath of fresh air for me in the fantasy genre. He's such a good writer.

garion333 wrote:
Tanglebones wrote:
Fedaykin98 wrote:

I bought Gardens but put it down. It's a very fresh new fantasy world (new to me), but boy, is it a ponderous read.

It does get much better with the second, and subsequent books, as Erikson grows into his writing style.

And as you grow into his writing style and understanding of the world.

When I started reading Erikson last year it was a breath of fresh air for me in the fantasy genre. He's such a good writer.

I am attempting these for the 3rd or fourth time now. I've never made it past book 3. His willingness to constantly introduce new stuff (and not explain ANYTHING) has always driven me nuts. I *think* that this time, I might actually move on to book4. We'll see.

Tyrian wrote:
garion333 wrote:
Tanglebones wrote:
Fedaykin98 wrote:

I bought Gardens but put it down. It's a very fresh new fantasy world (new to me), but boy, is it a ponderous read.

It does get much better with the second, and subsequent books, as Erikson grows into his writing style.

And as you grow into his writing style and understanding of the world.

When I started reading Erikson last year it was a breath of fresh air for me in the fantasy genre. He's such a good writer.

I am attempting these for the 3rd or fourth time now. I've never made it past book 3. His willingness to constantly introduce new stuff (and not explain ANYTHING) has always driven me nuts. I *think* that this time, I might actually move on to book4. We'll see.

I like the lack of explanations. I think it adds a more mystery to the fantasy, makes you think and scrutinize the writing more closely.
Also, Anomander Rake is a super badass.

NathanialG wrote:

I like the lack of explanations. I think it adds a more mystery to the fantasy, makes you think and scrutinize the writing more closely.

I dunno. There were a lot of moments in the... 2nd? book that had them just saying the names of places and tribes and such... and it just seemed like you were supposed to know what the hell was going on. It's a jarring writing style. Deep and intertwined, sure... but it shouldn't take 3 books to explain the basics of how sorcery works, and why people can do some of the things they do.

NathanialG wrote:

Also, Anomander Rake is a super badass.

Yeah. He is... Even more impressive is the fact that he would only rank 7th in the Segulah hierarchy.

Tyrian, it's not until four or six books in that the series begins to coalesce. All those stories do actually intersect and are necessary to understand the end-game (so far as it's been presented.)

I've always like the "jump in and live it" style of fantasy where you figure out the world as you go, because it makes you think about every little thing. That can get tiresome, but when you figure something out, it's a very rewarding experience, because it was not handed to you in a clear expository paragraph.

Robear wrote:

Tyrian, it's not until four or six books in that the series begins to coalesce. All those stories do actually intersect and are necessary to understand the end-game (so far as it's been presented.)

I've always like the "jump in and live it" style of fantasy where you figure out the world as you go, because it makes you think about every little thing. That can get tiresome, but when you figure something out, it's a very rewarding experience, because it was not handed to you in a clear expository paragraph. :-)

I think it's just that it's so aggressive and zoomed out that it's hard to see the big picture. You can see that books 2 and 3 are taking place simultaneously (or just a bit offset). I just didn't like how many freaking races there were. And apostrophes. Apostrophes for names EVERYWHERE!

Still, I'm doing better keeping up with it this time. Maybe I wasn't smrt enough to follow stuff the last time I read them.

Tyrian wrote:
NathanialG wrote:

I like the lack of explanations. I think it adds a more mystery to the fantasy, makes you think and scrutinize the writing more closely.

I dunno. There were a lot of moments in the... 2nd? book that had them just saying the names of places and tribes and such... and it just seemed like you were supposed to know what the hell was going on. It's a jarring writing style. Deep and intertwined, sure... but it shouldn't take 3 books to explain the basics of how sorcery works, and why people can do some of the things they do.

NathanialG wrote:

Also, Anomander Rake is a super badass.

Yeah. He is... Even more impressive is the fact that he would only rank 7th in the Segulah hierarchy.

I think thats just as far as he got. He never fought 6 through 1.

NathanialG wrote:
Tyrian wrote:

Yeah. He is... Even more impressive is the fact that he would only rank 7th in the Seguleh hierarchy.

I think thats just as far as he got. He never fought 6 through 1.

Yeah, he was only on the island for a couple of hours. Still, I've always had the impression that Rake was talented, but moreso just powerful. However, I'm only partway through book3. So there may be stuff that comes later that shows how skilled Rake is.

Tyrian wrote:
Robear wrote:

Tyrian, it's not until four or six books in that the series begins to coalesce. All those stories do actually intersect and are necessary to understand the end-game (so far as it's been presented.)

I've always like the "jump in and live it" style of fantasy where you figure out the world as you go, because it makes you think about every little thing. That can get tiresome, but when you figure something out, it's a very rewarding experience, because it was not handed to you in a clear expository paragraph. :-)

I think it's just that it's so aggressive and zoomed out that it's hard to see the big picture. You can see that books 2 and 3 are taking place simultaneously (or just a bit offset). I just didn't like how many freaking races there were. And apostrophes. Apostrophes for names EVERYWHERE!

Still, I'm doing better keeping up with it this time. Maybe I wasn't smrt enough to follow stuff the last time I read them.

I'm with you. I never made it past Book 3 primarily because I hated how he introduced so much stuff and never explained anything. I also have a pretty bad literary memory so when these characters pop back up I never remember who they are.

Enablers... just bought the first 3 off amazon. I better NOT be disappointed or I'm blaming YOU! Yes YOU!

PAR

I read them after the first 8 books of the main series, but the Korbel Broach and Bauchelain novellas might be a better introduction to the series - far fewer characters, less grand themes, and lots of funny.

Although I am on the most recent book, I have forgotten most of the history and plot from the proceeding books. I think after I finish this I will reread the entire series in chronological order (someone on the malazan forum took the time to break down all the stories into a timeline). I do wish there was audio books of the series, I don't have the time to devote to reading and keep up with my work. I need to merge the two!

I absolutely LOVE these novels, my second favorite after Martin. I really appreciate the incredibly fresh and creative take on epic fantasy, and kind of ruins plots like that of Dragon Age that rely heavily on genre tropes. I desperately want to play a Malazan RPG.

Tyrian wrote:

I think it's just that it's so aggressive and zoomed out that it's hard to see the big picture.

This is exactly my problem. The first book is written as if you know tons of things that you can't possibly. It wouldn't break my suspension of disbelief to have more explanation, and I know this for certain because this is the only book that I've ever read like this.

Still, the world is interesting enough that I recently gave it another shot. But I had a SERIOUS WTF moment when:

Spoiler:

One of the main characters arrives at a bar, and notices the doorman has been murdered. He runs into the bar and yells "The doorman's been murdered! MURDERED!" Then he sits down and has a drink with some folks like nothing ever happened.

It kind of instantly made the author seem like a total rookie, regardless of the interesting world and high-falutin writing style.

I've got all of the books except for Gardens of the Moon (I read a library copy). Is there a big difference between the 10th Anniversary UK edition and the US edition?

Tanglebones wrote:

I've got all of the books except for Gardens of the Moon (I read a library copy). Is there a big difference between the 10th Anniversary UK edition and the US edition?

The UK edition has lots of colour. The centre pages are different as well.

One thing that has always bothered me with the series were the maps lacking detail. I want more maps with more detail, dammit.

This is probably my favorite fantasy series (A Song of Ice and Fire held that spot for a while but lack of progress has dimmed my enthusiasm for it slightly). I've got Dust of Dreams sitting on the bookshelf waiting to be read as soon as I finish my current book (the last book of the First Law trilogy by Abercrombie). But accessibility is certainly not its main virtue. Gardens of the Moon is probably the worst for this, whether that is because of the writing getting a bit better, or just familiarity increasing with each book I can't tell. I have seen the suggestion that if you find Gardens of the Moon too impenetrable, you could just start with the second book, and not really miss out on too much (or go back and read Gardens after you are a little more familiar with things).

I think the uniqueness of the world is one of the main attractions. You just get such a sense of history of the world, and of civilizations built in layers on the ruins of previous civilizations, it comes as no shock when you find out the author is an archaeologist.

I haven't read the Esslemont books yet, the previously mentioned Night of Knives and also Return of the Crimson Guard, has anybody else tried those?

I haven't read the Esslemont books yet, the previously mentioned Night of Knives and also Return of the Crimson Guard, has anybody else tried those?

They were good. Not written as well, although Crimson Guard showed a lot of improvement. They're much more contained stories and provide some good detail on certain characters and parts of the world. I enjoyed them!

garion333 wrote:

One thing that has always bothered me with the series were the maps lacking detail. I want more maps with more detail, dammit. ;)

I think that Erikson is scheduled to write a Malazan atlas after The Crippled God.

Pacman wrote:

I haven't read the Esslemont books yet, the previously mentioned Night of Knives and also Return of the Crimson Guard, has anybody else tried those?

I've read Night of Knives. It's not bad; smaller scale than Erikson's, but very much of the same world.

There's a book about the Crimson Guard?!?! I LOVE Tomax and Xamot!

I've been reading the books over the last year or so. I'm mid-way through Dust of Dreams right now and I've really enjoyed the whole series.

But, I think the books are a classic example of an author losing control of his story (or, perhaps in this case, tearing off the steering wheel and throwing it out the window). I'm convinced that he's just writing down whatever seems cool to him at the time and he just can't resist moving on to the next nifty storyline. The events of the very first book have very little bearing on what comes later and the characters who have survived from the beginning haven't developed, they've been remade to serve a whole new narrative arch. When Erikson does tie up loose ends, the resolutions seem perfunctory and forced.

As the books progress, he does develop a little more plot discipline. But, if you're the kind of reader who NEEDS George R.R. Martin's hyper-rigorous, chessmaster story development, you may have some problems with the series.

I hear so many good things about this series, but the trend of over long, waffling fantasy series has put me off the whole genre, and I would hate to read all the books in a series then end up waiting a year or more for the follow up.

Authors need to rediscover disciplined writing and the strength of the trilogy.

Fedaykin98 wrote:

There's a book about the Crimson Guard?!?! I LOVE Tomax and Xamot! ;)

Oh lord.

Tanglebones wrote:
garion333 wrote:

One thing that has always bothered me with the series were the maps lacking detail. I want more maps with more detail, dammit. ;)

I think that Erikson is scheduled to write a Malazan atlas after The Crippled God.

Thank god.

It's worth mentioning that Erikson had outlined a ten book series from the start and has been following an impressively stringent release schedule for them. He's going to wrap up the final book by next year and then he'll be done. Impressive.

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